Why swinging over the top is good and how is shallows the swing.

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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Can anyone name a good player that has a very vertical backswing AND steepens it on the way down? Cuz I cant think of one.
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:


    Can anyone name a good player that has a very vertical backswing AND steepens it on the way down? Cuz I cant think of one.




    Not any I can think of, in matt kuchar practice swinging left drill I think he does but doesn't in real swing.



    All tour pros I've seen they get on plane from whatever backswing position they prefer. Am's I've seen many take it back steep and come down steep with EE.
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  • ALIFALIF Arizona 2755WRX Points: 325Members Posts: 2,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:


    Can anyone name a good player that has a very vertical backswing AND steepens it on the way down? Cuz I cant think of one.




    Furyk??
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    chiva wrote:

    lv_2_hack wrote:


    Can anyone name a good player that has a very vertical backswing AND steepens it on the way down? Cuz I cant think of one.




    Furyk??




    Nope...



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  • ALIFALIF Arizona 2755WRX Points: 325Members Posts: 2,755 Titanium Tees
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    Uncle! Who is it?
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.
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  • ALIFALIF Arizona 2755WRX Points: 325Members Posts: 2,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    Ok good. I was thinking that there was some secret swing key I didn't know about. I couldn't think of anyone who was vertical and then steepened. Furyk was just a straw grasp. Gosh, if someone did that they would fall over and land on the ball with their nose.
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    You can, I can easily do it unless I purposely shallow the shaft, I can also go back flat and steepin onto plane. It's prefereable to go back steeper because it makes the club lighter, I'm just saying it's not automatic that the club will shallow. All pros don't take it back steep to shallow, some back it back on same plane etc



    Jim furyk goes back extremely steep and EE sometimes to help him shallow
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Best I can come up with is Craig Perry.
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  • HsteadHstead  6336WRX Points: 177Members Posts: 6,336 Titanium Tees
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    I looked at Eamon Darcy but even he shallows and gets it on plane.
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:

    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    You can, I can easily do it unless I purposely shallow the shaft, I can also go back flat and steepin onto plane. It's prefereable to go back steeper because it makes the club lighter, I'm just saying it's not automatic that the club will shallow. All pros don't take it back steep to shallow, some back it back on same plane etc



    Jim furyk goes back extremely steep and EE sometimes to help him shallow




    Please show me a vid of Furyk losing tush line. He's lays it down about as good as anyone does.
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    And also show me a vid of a good player who plays golf from a vertical backswing and steepens it on the way down.

    I'm not doubting that you can't do it and make contact, I'm saying you can't break an egg with that move.
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  • ALIFALIF Arizona 2755WRX Points: 325Members Posts: 2,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:


    And also show me a vid of a good player who plays golf from a vertical backswing and steepens it on the way down.

    I'm not doubting that you can't do it and make contact, I'm saying you can't break an egg with that move.




    You might break a leg though!!!
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:

    Redjeep83 wrote:

    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    You can, I can easily do it unless I purposely shallow the shaft, I can also go back flat and steepin onto plane. It's prefereable to go back steeper because it makes the club lighter, I'm just saying it's not automatic that the club will shallow. All pros don't take it back steep to shallow, some back it back on same plane etc



    Jim furyk goes back extremely steep and EE sometimes to help him shallow




    Please show me a vid of Furyk losing tush line. He's lays it down about as good as anyone does.




    here you go, first one that came up of jim swing in google.

    Posted:
  • PutterKilledTheDreamPutterKilledTheDream San Diego 3336WRX Points: 127Members Posts: 3,336 Titanium Tees
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    All I can visualize is Lumberjack Bill splitting wet oak with his axe..., vertical to more vertical.
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:

    lv_2_hack wrote:

    Redjeep83 wrote:

    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    You can, I can easily do it unless I purposely shallow the shaft, I can also go back flat and steepin onto plane. It's prefereable to go back steeper because it makes the club lighter, I'm just saying it's not automatic that the club will shallow. All pros don't take it back steep to shallow, some back it back on same plane etc



    Jim furyk goes back extremely steep and EE sometimes to help him shallow




    Please show me a vid of Furyk losing tush line. He's lays it down about as good as anyone does.




    here you go, first one that came up of jim swing in google.





    Go find that vid and watch it. He loses tush line in the backswing due to arm swing being so goofy/vertical. Not due to EE'ing on the downswing.
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    I did lv, I know Jim's swing, lol. I talked with instructors about it, I didnt know he EE until I asked them who does on tour. He EE a bit on backswing and a little bit more on downswing when he shallows shaft, then turns really hard and left hip gets closer to tush line later in swing.
    Posted:
  • Andrew McGee IIAndrew McGee II Division II baby : PGM Student  19WRX Points: 0Handicap: +1Members Posts: 19
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    Easy way to play just work on range of motion in forearms. Dan Iteach is spot on
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:


    I did lv, I know Jim's swing, lol. I talked with instructors about it, I didnt know he EE until I asked them who does on tour. He EE a bit on backswing and a little bit more on downswing when he shallows shaft, then turns really hard and left hip gets closer to tush line later in swing.




    Sorry Mate. He's not a goat humper. EE is not defined in the backswing, it's defined as losing spine/coming out of posture in the downswing.



    Furyk loses tush line in the backswing because his left arm works straight up (almost away from him) from p2-p3.5 (club parallel to ground to almost top of backswing). It's almost impossible for him not to lose some of his tush line with his arm swing the way it is. He comes off of tush line about 2-3 inches in the backswing and then almost returns back to original tush line at impact. No one in the history of goat violators has ever had their hips as open as Furyk does or maintained spine angle like Furyk does at impact.



    Now back to my original gripe with your statement. You said "It's not always the case that you will shallow from steep even if you are a decent player." My definition of 'decent' is scratch or better. I'm still waiting to see a swing of someone decent that doesn't shallow from a steep backswing position or p5ish position.



    I agree you can't fix all OTTer's by just getting their backswings more vertical, but for a very large group of them, it'll help.
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  • TB07TB07  6110WRX Points: 148Members Posts: 6,110 Titanium Tees
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    lv_2_hack wrote:

    chiva wrote:


    Uncle! Who is it?




    Haha. I don't know. Someone above stated that good players could still steepen from a vertical backswing. I'm waiting to see one.




    Nope. Seen good players with steepish (relative) downswings but none that steepen more from a vertical backswing.
    Posted:
  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    lv, he EE a tiny bit on backswing, starting downswing and shallowing of shaft he EE a little bit more by the time he gets to impact he is so open that his left hip has gotten back to the tush line. Point is, he does EE a little when he tries to shallow.

    end of backswing

    Posted:
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    btw, are there any players on tour that go from a flat shaft at top of swing to steeper on plane?
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  • TB07TB07  6110WRX Points: 148Members Posts: 6,110 Titanium Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:


    btw, are there any players on tour that go from a flat shaft at top of swing to steeper on plane?




    Yes
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  • dpb5031dpb5031 Jupiter, FL 5791WRX Points: 1,329Members Posts: 5,791 Titanium Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:


    btw, are there any players on tour that go from a flat shaft at top of swing to steeper on plane?




    Jimenez?
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    Redjeep83 wrote:


    lv, he EE a tiny bit on backswing, starting downswing and shallowing of shaft he EE a little bit more by the time he gets to impact he is so open that his left hip has gotten back to the tush line. Point is, he does EE a little when he tries to shallow.

    end of backswing





    You said decent player. Maybe we have different definitions of 'decent player.'



    Regards to Fuyrk, I still think you are looking at this all wrong. He doesn't EE from p5 to impact. He loses tush line from p3-p4.5. This is all due to the goofy arm swing. He's not a goat humper. Not even close....



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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    Not sure how else to show you that he EE more when he starts to shallow on downswing, pictures I posted prove it. He does get his left hip back on tush line by impact from turning and opening really hard.
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  • lv_2_hacklv_2_hack Texas 2341WRX Points: 113Members Posts: 2,341 Platinum Tees
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    This is goat humping.... Furyk is still a PETA member.



    Posted:
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    Ok so you definition of early extension is only at impact? If so, yes he turns his left hip, opens a ton and gets left hip back on tush line. To say there is no EE in the start of downswing is just false
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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5755WRX Points: 472Members Posts: 5,755 Titanium Tees
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    Btw, your right it is caused by his vertical backswing, all EE is caused by something
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  • FatReedFatReed FatReed  601WRX Points: 1Unregistered Posts: 601 Bunkers
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    lv_2_hack wrote:


    This is goat humping.... Furyk is still a PETA member.







    Iv, I love that bottom pic . . . the right lower extremity alignment is worth a thousand words.



    I posted a thread not too long ago about how many people who shank with abbreviated swings (9/3-type pitch shots) early extend. That right foot coming of the ground and associated movement of the right hip out toward the ball drives the hands/club head 'out' . . . shanks just waiting to happen. Anyway, my suggestion in the prior thread was to concentrate on keeping that right foot planted as an exercise to address shanks that occur with abbreviated swings. In truth, my thread and suggestion were relegated to the likes of a Carey post, nonetheless, I stand by my thoughts.



    Great pics Iv.
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