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Top-Flite Gamer

jwfgolfprojwfgolfpro jwfgolfproAdvanced Members Posts: 1,320 ✭✭
edited October 2007 in Golf Balls
Picture
Word file but it works.



Post edited by Unknown User on
Taylormade M3 10.5
Taylormade M3 3-HL Fairway
Taylormade M3 5 Fairway
Taylormade M3 #4 GAPR
P790 Irons 5-AW
Milled Grind 54* and 60* Ceasarized
Spider Limited Edition
TP5 Ball

Comments

  • hank_612hank_612 Members Posts: 48
    I'd hit it
  • RacineBoxerRacineBoxer Advanced Members Posts: 801 ✭✭
    anyone know when this bad boy hits the shelves?
  • gticlaygticlay gticlay Advanced Members Posts: 986
    If that ball can spin as much as the TF Exception Spin ball did, I'll bag it in a second. I LOVE beating people with a chitty ball.





    Don't tell anyone but my PB 75 was shot with a Laddie Xtreme that I found on the course the round before image/laugh.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' /> As if I need a ProV1 to shoot low - I can't even beat my PB with them.
  • jwfgolfprojwfgolfpro jwfgolfpro Advanced Members Posts: 1,320 ✭✭
    January



    Dozen for $24.99
    Taylormade M3 10.5
    Taylormade M3 3-HL Fairway
    Taylormade M3 5 Fairway
    Taylormade M3 #4 GAPR
    P790 Irons 5-AW
    Milled Grind 54* and 60* Ceasarized
    Spider Limited Edition
    TP5 Ball
  • Mward2002Mward2002 Advanced Members Posts: 1,080
    A three piece ball that can spin from Top Flite?



    Looks like a solid competitor for the NXT Tour model in terms of price. If it's long and spins a lot, it could give the Pro V1 a run for its money at half the price.
  • divot46divot46 Advanced Members Posts: 679
    Don't tell anyone but my PB 75 was shot with a Laddie Xtreme that I found on the course the round before image/laugh.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' /> As if I need a ProV1 to shoot low - I can't even beat my PB with them.

    [/quote]







    Laddie Extreme is a great ball! And you can't beat $10/doz.
  • pmcg no.6pmcg no.6 Members Posts: 235
    I'm all over this bad boy and the Wilson Staff Zip when it comes out.
  • wjdpar1wjdpar1 Advanced Members Posts: 400 ✭✭
    Thanks for the Pic! I'm a D2 fan and will try these. My Prov's are gathering dust in the closet.


  • MiloshMilosh Advanced Members Posts: 306
    25 bucks for rock-flites?
  • jwfgolfprojwfgolfpro jwfgolfpro Advanced Members Posts: 1,320 ✭✭
    Rock Flite is dead baby.

    These are like no other Top-Flite you have ever played.

    I promise. image/good.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />
    Taylormade M3 10.5
    Taylormade M3 3-HL Fairway
    Taylormade M3 5 Fairway
    Taylormade M3 #4 GAPR
    P790 Irons 5-AW
    Milled Grind 54* and 60* Ceasarized
    Spider Limited Edition
    TP5 Ball
  • BEND OF THE RIVER GCBEND OF THE RIVER GC Charter Members Posts: 6,559
    This is easier to see:
    TM M1 Kurokage shaft
    TM RBZ 3 wood stock Ozik shaft
    TM R11 4 wood Fujikura Rombax 6X07
    TM RBZ with Oban Revenge shaft
    Ping G irons 4-UW
    Nike VR 56*
    Nike VR 60*
    Black Lab oil can 350g custom grind by Geo
    Ping 4 Under carry bag
  • thenewbiethenewbie Chimpanzee that monkey news! Advanced Members Posts: 1,549
    very interested in trying these. . .I've been switching between pinnacle exceptions and srixon AD333's (can't get srixons anywhere here for some reason, but I LOVE the exception, softer and spinnier than new NXT for me), and this one looks right up that alley.
  • jirizarryjirizarry Lefty Boomers Posts: 286
    thenewbie wrote on Oct 12 2007, 09:14 PM:
    very interested in trying these. . .I've been switching between pinnacle exceptions and srixon AD333's (can't get srixons anywhere here for some reason, but I LOVE the exception, softer and spinnier than new NXT for me), and this one looks right up that alley.








    Check out this link in ebay:





    http://stores.ebay.com/Lost-Golf-Balls_W0Q...sQ3amesstQQtZkm



    their AAAA balls are as good as new and for a fraction of the price. I just got 72 AD333 for $48.00 plus $11.00 S&H. I've bought from yhem a few times and they always deliver. image/good.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />



    J.R.
  • thenewbiethenewbie Chimpanzee that monkey news! Advanced Members Posts: 1,549
    jirizarry wrote on Oct 12 2007, 09:48 PM:
    thenewbie wrote on Oct 12 2007, 09:14 PM:
    very interested in trying these. . .I've been switching between pinnacle exceptions and srixon AD333's (can't get srixons anywhere here for some reason, but I LOVE the exception, softer and spinnier than new NXT for me), and this one looks right up that alley.








    Check out this link in ebay:





    http://stores.ebay.com/Lost-Golf-Balls_W0Q...sQ3amesstQQtZkm



    their AAAA balls are as good as new and for a fraction of the price. I just got 72 AD333 for $48.00 plus $11.00 S&H. I've bought from yhem a few times and they always deliver. image/good.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />



    J.R.






    THANKS! definetly going to check that out.
  • chop180chop180 Members Posts: 367
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.
  • TM golf guyTM golf guy Advanced Members Posts: 9,985
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.
  • RacineBoxerRacineBoxer Advanced Members Posts: 801 ✭✭
    taylormade golf guy 182 wrote on Oct 13 2007, 12:37 AM:
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.




    **** you guys ruined my top flite gamer obsession of the past couple weeks. But your right about the price.



    I'm going to give it try though when it comes out. I want to like this ball, and I admit it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />
  • turnbowmturnbowm Advanced Members Posts: 810
    taylormade golf guy 182 wrote on Oct 13 2007, 12:37 AM:
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.




    Yep, a Top-Flite ball with a street price of more than $20/box will be a tough sell!
  • rick101554rick101554 Members Posts: 67
    turnbowm wrote on Oct 13 2007, 01:19 PM:
    taylormade golf guy 182 wrote on Oct 13 2007, 12:37 AM:
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.




    Yep, a Top-Flite ball with a street price of more than $20/box will be a tough sell!


    I don't really care what the brand name on the ball is--if they perform like or better than balls in the price category, I'll at least try them. I think the TF brand has lost much of it's stigma because of the Callaway ownership and Callaway has engineered and manufactured some great balls--as well as the success of TF's D2 line, which is a very good 2 piece ball, at a great price. This isn't your father's TF, and if the Gamer performs well for it's price, I don't care what brand it is. Like the Callaway brand and it's products or not, Callaway is masterful at marketing, and if the balls are good, I'll bet they sell well, and will be talked up on this site. From what I've read, the ball will sell well below the MSRP of $24.99, likely at $19.99. Even if the price is $24.99, if you like the ball better than a Bridgestone E5 or E6(also $24.99), would you buy the Bridgestone's merely because of it's name, and because it isn't a TF? I'll buy the TF!!
  • omeletpantsomeletpants Advanced Members Posts: 443
    rick101554 wrote on Oct 14 2007, 12:20 PM:
    turnbowm wrote on Oct 13 2007, 01:19 PM:
    taylormade golf guy 182 wrote on Oct 13 2007, 12:37 AM:
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.




    Yep, a Top-Flite ball with a street price of more than $20/box will be a tough sell!


    I don't really care what the brand name on the ball is--if they perform like or better than balls in the price category, I'll at least try them. I think the TF brand has lost much of it's stigma because of the Callaway ownership and Callaway has engineered and manufactured some great balls--as well as the success of TF's D2 line, which is a very good 2 piece ball, at a great price. This isn't your father's TF, and if the Gamer performs well for it's price, I don't care what brand it is. Like the Callaway brand and it's products or not, Callaway is masterful at marketing, and if the balls are good, I'll bet they sell well, and will be talked up on this site. From what I've read, the ball will sell well below the MSRP of $24.99, likely at $19.99. Even if the price is $24.99, if you like the ball better than a Bridgestone E5 or E6(also $24.99), would you buy the Bridgestone's merely because of it's name, and because it isn't a TF? I'll buy the TF!!




    You don't care but many do which is why they would never play a Top Flite
  • MilwaukeekidMilwaukeekid Members Posts: 30
    I'll ask the same question someone had earlier. When are these supposed to hit market? I have not been able to get any info on these anywhere else.



    The D2 are getting some great reviews by independent testers like Advanced Golf Solutions and Calgolftech.com. I guess the secret is in their ability to have a good/shallower angle of descent compared to most other balls. This gives them quite a bit of extra distance compared to other balls that tend to drop out of the sky once their spin rate starts to degrade.



    thanks
  • MB1981MB1981 Banned Posts: 97
    Nice! I'm all about low cost quality equipment!
  • mcbush25mcbush25 Members Posts: 2,040
    I can't wait to give these a go. I love the D2 Feel ball so this can only get better for me.
  • phil75070phil75070 Advanced Members Posts: 1,888 ✭✭
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I'm with you! The beauty of t he D2s is the incredible price/performance ratio. Yes, the D2 Feel could use a little more spin but if the Gamer sells at retail then that is basically double the price!Too many other balls to choose from that perform at that price point.
  • Big_Guy_Who_GolfsBig_Guy_Who_Golfs Advanced Members Posts: 381
    Finally broke down and purchased a box of the D2 Feel balls at Sports Authority here in Chicago on Saturday. They had them on sale for 11.97 for a pack of 15 and I couldn't pass that up as an opportunity to experiment with a new ball on the cheap. I took them out to the course Sunday (temperature was a high of 55 degrees with light to moderate wind).



    Wow - I was skeptical at first, but these balls won me over big time...



    Driver Performance - Above average distance off the driver. As long as the Bridgestone E6 I normally play and just as straight. I could definitely hear and feel the ball come off the club face. It felt much firmer than the soft cover/low compression balls I normally play, but not so much that I would avoid it in the future.



    Iron Performance - This is where the ball really shined for me. At least a 5-10 yards longer and the ball really held it's flight in the wind. I was really watching closely how it held the greens and I have to say I was pleasantly surprised. It didn't spin like a premium ball, but it took one hop and stopped most of the time.



    Short Game - I really struggled with this aspect of the product. This is definitely the softest ball Top Flight has ever made, but it is still firmer than I would like off the putter. I rolled quite a few putts past the hole until I got used to the ball and still struggled with my feel quite a bit.



    Durability - I didn't cut or scuff a single ball in play. They are insanely durable.



    Overall, I liked the ball enough to keep buying them. Even at full retail, this ball has a ridiculous cost to value ratio. I would imagine the ball would perform even better in warmer weather. And if the gamer is softer with a higher spin rate, then saddle up boys and girls because it will be hard to beat it even at the higher price point.
  • brl11brl11 Jr. Boomers Posts: 455
    You can't knock it until you've tried it...i will give them a go..
  • nutternutter Advanced Members Posts: 399
    i'll definitely try it when it hits the shelf. all the D2 balls are great (they all seem the same to me no matter which i've tried)
  • tdsgolftdsgolf Members Posts: 5
    Sweet, Top Flite is finally re-introducing the Strata line under the TF name! I loved TF Stratas and was disappointed when Callaway shut down the line limiting TF to 2 piece balls. The D2 Feels are the real deal for a 2 piece, but it is nice to see the company that started the multipiece ball craze in the mid 1990's re-introduce a muliti layer ball again.



    It will be interesting to see if the dimple in dimple technology works as well in the 3 piece ball as it does in the D2 line of balls. I can not wait to try one out when they are released.
  • SakmanSakman @ryansako Marshals Posts: 6,291 mod
    I've had a chance to play both the TF 'Gamer' and 'Freak'. Believe it or not, both a are decent ball for the price. For those who were a fan of the D2's, be sure to check these out.
  • bulletbobbulletbob Advanced Members Posts: 198
    Sakman,



    Can you be more specific about the performance, and what you liked, about each of the new TF balls? I've played both the Feel and Distance balls. Though I like both I now play the Maxfli Tour Fire. Hopefully the weather here in NJ holds out long enough for me to try TF's new offerings.
  • Bob DoleBob Dole Members Posts: 114
    I know a lot of folks are balking at the $24 msrp but if they sell them in a 15 pack, as with most other TF balls, then that price doesn't seem so bad.
  • biga9999biga9999 Members Posts: 46
    Could somebody answer a question for me? (since the gamer is not out yet I know it could be hard)



    Could someone rank the three D2 models and the Gamer on spin? (low to high)



    I would assume the D2 straight has the least amount of spin, but I wanted to get some confirmation? I need as low a spin ball as I can. Last LM fitting all #s were pretty good, but spin was over 5000 rpm.



    Thanks,



    Alden
  • klpraklpra Advanced Members Posts: 641
    omeletpants wrote on Oct 14 2007, 02:24 PM:
    rick101554 wrote on Oct 14 2007, 12:20 PM:
    turnbowm wrote on Oct 13 2007, 01:19 PM:
    taylormade golf guy 182 wrote on Oct 13 2007, 12:37 AM:
    chop180 wrote on Oct 12 2007, 11:59 PM:
    I'm not paying 25 bucks for top flights,..........can't do it. I'll spend 5 more for b330's/TM Reds.........to many balls in the 25-30 range......and yes I do like the D2's but for 15 for 15, not 25 for 12 for top flights. If they would just keep it below the 20 dollar break point I would go for them.




    I agree with you, and I think that the market will too. The D2 is a good ball for sure, and this new one probably will be too. I just don't see that many people spending that much for a Top-Flite. No matter how good it may be.




    Yep, a Top-Flite ball with a street price of more than $20/box will be a tough sell!


    I don't really care what the brand name on the ball is--if they perform like or better than balls in the price category, I'll at least try them. I think the TF brand has lost much of it's stigma because of the Callaway ownership and Callaway has engineered and manufactured some great balls--as well as the success of TF's D2 line, which is a very good 2 piece ball, at a great price. This isn't your father's TF, and if the Gamer performs well for it's price, I don't care what brand it is. Like the Callaway brand and it's products or not, Callaway is masterful at marketing, and if the balls are good, I'll bet they sell well, and will be talked up on this site. From what I've read, the ball will sell well below the MSRP of $24.99, likely at $19.99. Even if the price is $24.99, if you like the ball better than a Bridgestone E5 or E6(also $24.99), would you buy the Bridgestone's merely because of it's name, and because it isn't a TF? I'll buy the TF!!




    You don't care but many do which is why they would never play a Top Flite




    That makes a lot of sense! image/cheesy.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':russian_roulette:' />
  • jwfgolfprojwfgolfpro jwfgolfpro Advanced Members Posts: 1,320 ✭✭
    Didnt get to hit as many as I would have liked but I compared it to the

    D2 Feel and Hx Tour 56.



    Hit a few full 7 irons into a green with no wind.



    HX Tour 56 ball went 2 feet past ball mark and came back about a foot.

    D2 Feel ball went about 5 yards past and then stopped.

    Gamer ball went about 3 feet past ball mark and backed up a few inches.



    Hit some little pitches off a tight lie.

    HX Tour 56 had the normal forward bounce, check and then trickle.

    D2 Feel had a longer forward bounce with less check.

    Gamer had the normal forward bounce and about 75% of the check that the HX 56 had.



    This might not make sense to some folks but the Gamer in my opinion is about twice a good in the spin catagory than the D2 Feel.



    I currently play the D2 Feel and as soon as I get my stock of the Gamer it will be my ball.



    The Gamer will be released inn january 2008.



    JWF
    Taylormade M3 10.5
    Taylormade M3 3-HL Fairway
    Taylormade M3 5 Fairway
    Taylormade M3 #4 GAPR
    P790 Irons 5-AW
    Milled Grind 54* and 60* Ceasarized
    Spider Limited Edition
    TP5 Ball
  • rbmercerrbmercer rbmercer Advanced Members Posts: 645
    I've been a Pro V1/Pro V1X guy for years, but bought some D2 distance after watching my buddy continually get it to perform......I spent the last month of golf season hitting them and HONESTLY i loved them and won't be buying the Pro V's any more....
  • Sean2Sean2 #TheWRX (Callaway Trip) Members Posts: 30,826 ✭✭
    From GolfBallTest.org:



    Top-Flite Gamer™ Golf Balls - Top-Flite takes the benefits of its proprietary Dimple in Dimple™ aerodynamics and puts it on a 3-piece performance golf ball that’s long, soft and generates more short-game spin for total tee-to-green control. The thin soft ionomer cover over a firm boundary layer and a highly resilient rubber core gives golfers a ball that performs like no other in the Top-Flite lineup. ($19.99 per dozen)



    Worth a try, I'd say.
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway Rogue[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway GBB Epic 16º/20º/24º[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway Steelhead XR 25º[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway Apex CF16 6-AW [/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway MD3/MD-PM 54º/58º[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway "O" Works #7[/font]
  • Ace In The HoleAce In The Hole What blocks growth is ignorance. Advanced Members Posts: 1,562
    edited December 2007
    Just you wait come the new year I bet you will be able to buy HX TOUR 56 for $25-$35 a Doz. I'd spen the extra $5-$10 buck and play the HX
  • PapitwinkiPapitwinki Members Posts: 130
    $24.99 ? Pay an extra $5.00 and play the Wilson TX4 instead, a first class, 4 piece with urethane cover, premium ball that can compete against the very best.
  • dethmandethman Advanced Members Posts: 394
    biga9999 wrote on Dec 7 2007, 08:43 AM:
    Could somebody answer a question for me? (since the gamer is not out yet I know it could be hard)



    Could someone rank the three D2 models and the Gamer on spin? (low to high)



    I would assume the D2 straight has the least amount of spin, but I wanted to get some confirmation? I need as low a spin ball as I can. Last LM fitting all #s were pretty good, but spin was over 5000 rpm.



    Thanks,



    Alden




    if your spin is over 5000rpm the ball is not going to make the difference. you are going to have to look at your swing and what faults are causing spin that high.
    M1
    M2 3HL
    X2Hot 19 Hybrid
    Apex CF16 4-W
    SM5 54, 60
    Golo 3
  • biga9999biga9999 Members Posts: 46
    edited December 2007
    You are right. I hit down on the ball at a very steep angle. I am trying a few things to correct that, but I would think playing a low spin ball would help as well.



    I still hit it 250 on average, but would like to get a little more roll. Right now it lands and stops.
  • rick101554rick101554 Members Posts: 67
    As a TX4 fan, I'm wondering if you know whether it's true that the new TX4 Pro is simply the improved version of the TX4. I love the improved TX4--great ball for the money, and I'm curious if the Pro is even better yet. I wrote and called Wilson, who doesn't have the best customer service, and I've gotten no answer.
  • PapitwinkiPapitwinki Members Posts: 130
    The Tx4 Pro is just the Tx4 "improved" in a new packaging.

    I know that from the local Wilson Staff representative.
  • rick101554rick101554 Members Posts: 67
    Wilson, IMO, is being very misleading by giving the ball a different name--that certainly gives me the impression that it is a different ball. Not a perfect comparison, but how many times have you seen products labelled, "same product, different look" or something like that.



    I e-mailed 2 questions to Wilson. They answered one, but not the other, which was about the difference between the TX4 and the TX4 Pro. I can understand why.
  • KonkliferKonklifer Thinkin' of a master plan... Advanced Members Posts: 7,608 ✭✭
    rick101554 wrote on Dec 10 2007, 02:39 PM:
    Wilson, IMO, is being very misleading by giving the ball a different name--that certainly gives me the impression that it is a different ball. Not a perfect comparison, but how many times have you seen products labelled, "same product, different look" or something like that.



    I e-mailed 2 questions to Wilson. They answered one, but not the other, which was about the difference between the TX4 and the TX4 Pro. I can understand why.




    It is misleading but at least the price is the same. $30/dozen for a 4-piece urethane covered ball? Tough to beat that deal. I've played it and it's great. My ball & glove contract with Wilson Staff will continue (Pro Soft glove is the best there is).
    PING G400 Max 10°
    PING G400 16.5°
    PING G400 hybrid 19°
    PING i25 hybrid 22°
    Callaway XHP 5-AW
    PING Glide 2.0 Stealth, 54° SS, 58° ES
    Kevin Burns 9306
    Snell MTB Red Optic Yellow
  • buggymanbuggyman Advanced Members Posts: 509
    My playing partner (+2 hcp) played a round with this ball a couple weeks ago and he really liked it. Believe it or not his normally plays Pinnical (spelling???). I for the life of me can't understand why so many people pay $45 dollars for 12 balls just to go through 5-6 a round loosing them and shooting 95. Years ago when I played allot I would play anything I found. Guys would make fun of me for playing Pinnicals or TF. My favorite ball was the TF exceptional spins. I loved those. Guys would rag me and then I would go out and shoot a 68. (I played to a +2 HCP). Then they would shut up. My point is you can get used to the way any ball performs. I just try Taylor Made Reds from the D2 feel. I liked the D2 but hit it higher then I wanted. However I will probably go back to them, and will try the gamer.
  • dirtdirt Members Posts: 84
    You are right on the money!
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