Am I being unreasonable

So I'm looking into joining a private club. There is a cart lease that is about 1k per year. I walk most of the time using a clicgear but with certain friends or my fiancé I will ride.

This club will not allow the use of personal push carts and the use of their push carts is not included with the cart lease. If I pay for the cart lease, I have to pay for locker/handicap/etc but if I don't they will comp me those costs and the push cart lease.

Basically, I want the cart lease for use with occasional guests and my fiancé but would mostly use the course's push carts. I'm a bit perturbed about a few things:

1) no outside push carts so my 8.0 gets benched

2) I can't substitute a push cart for an electric cart

Has anyone heard of this before? Any advice for how to deal with this? It's a borderline deal breaker for me.

Thanks

I don't have any private club experience other than being a guest, but I don't think you're being unreasonable. Private clubs are costly, if a club couldn't give me everything I wanted I would take my money to another club that could....

They won't let you pay for a riding cart per round? I've never heard of this. Cart lease sounds like a ripoff.

If i was a diehard walker who always pushed and invested in a quality expensive cart im immediately crossing out any club that wont let me usemy own equipment. Youre not asking to take out modified craftsman mower.


I get and appreciate the fact that some clubs are exclusive and want to project an image and make demands of atire, where one changes their shoes etc. But this seems like a pure money grab under tge guise of continuity. Tell them to sit on their cart fees and come slum with me at muni's and other Daily fee joints. Change your shoes wherever youd like.

[quote name='ZBigStick' timestamp='1442370546' post='12320036']They won't let you pay for a riding cart per round? I've never heard of this. Cart lease sounds like a ripoff.[/quote]

I can forgo the cart lease and pay each time I want to use it. I'm just a bit worried this will make my fiancé less likely to play since it would cost extra money.

What's the per-round cart fee per person if you pay as you go? And how often do you anticipate her playing? If the answer to the first is $25 or less and the second is 20 times per year or less, I'd just pay as I go with the power carts.

One club I belonged to decided to raise the dues and bake in the cart fees, so that everyone has unlimited "free" cart use. I still walked every time anyway. Personally in the OP's case I'd look for a more walker-friendly club.

[quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442399569' post='12320950']
[quote name='ZBigStick' timestamp='1442370546' post='12320036']They won't let you pay for a riding cart per round? I've never heard of this. Cart lease sounds like a ripoff.[/quote]

I can forgo the cart lease and pay each time I want to use it. I'm just a bit worried this will make my fiancé less likely to play since it would cost extra money.
[/quote]

It's costing you "extra" money either way. Either through a $1,000 charge for an annual cart lease, or whatever the cost is on a per-round basis.

as was mentioned earlier just look for a more walker friendly club...

that does seem stupid. sounds like you will pay the 1k in order to use the push cart, the electric cart occasionally and have them waive the locker fee. i think you are totally being reasonable.

im a walker too and id just move on to another club.

This may not be perfect, but ask if you were to purchase a new 8.0 through the club, would they allow you to use that and keep it at the club for you. That way they can make something on it and you can still walk. They should have a per-round cart fee, so when you want to ride, even if it's as steep as $45 or so, you won't approach the $1k for the whole shebang. (There are some places that have different tax rates for different portions of things on the course. The resort area near me has different rates for greens fees and the cart fee. On a $125 round, the greens fees may be 70, while the cart is 55. Why so steep? The greens fees are taxed at the "amusement tax" rate, which is triple what the service rate is; which the cart falls under. The $1k the club is charging could be a work around for some of this.)

If they bulk on either of these, or say no, look for another club.

Well I guess my vintage Bag Boy cart is out!!!...lol


Paul

Thanks guys. The club is not an upper tier club or anything so I'm not sure where they are coming from here.

The course is pretty great and they seem to have a decent group of members but the range is only about 185 yards due to a dam at the back of the range (they open up the range to the 18th fairway on weekend mornings and have the staff pick up balls). The location of the course is good for me and other than the cart issues the pricing is where I need it to be. Just not sure how to reconcile the cart vs push cart issue.

Also, it seems like a lot of people think this club isn't a very friendly club for walkers; I'd hate to join planing to walk and be the only one on the course not using a cart.

Ps - why does everyone think walking is slower than riding? I play so much faster than the rest of my group when I walk and they ride. I sure hope pace of play isn't the motivating factor here bc that just doesn't make sense to me.

Because walking is slower than riding at most courses when carts are allowed off the path. The reason most people aren't much faster with a cart than walking is because they won't get out of the cart to walk 30 feet to their ball. Instead they sit in the cart wait for their partner to hit then drive the other ball and hit. I have yet to come across a "walker" that walks faster than a cart can go in mph

I walk, and use a push cart. I ride when it is too hot. I belong to a semi private club that gives me the option to do either. We ruled out one private club that did not allow push carts. The rules at the club the op is considering would be a deal breaker for me.

Start on the per "round basis" and if you spend more than $1K the first year switch to the "lease".

[quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442368443' post='12319832'] So I'm looking into joining a private club. There is a cart lease that is about 1k per year. I walk most of the time using a clicgear but with certain friends or my fiancé I will ride. This club will not allow the use of personal push carts and the use of their push carts is not included with the cart lease. If I pay for the cart lease, I have to pay for locker/handicap/etc but if I don't they will comp me those costs and the push cart lease. Basically, I want the cart lease for use with occasional guests and my fiancé but would mostly use the course's push carts. I'm a bit perturbed about a few things: 1) no outside push carts so my 8.0 gets benched 2) I can't substitute a push cart for an electric cart Has anyone heard of this before? Any advice for how to deal with this? It's a borderline deal breaker for me. Thanks [/quote]

If you get the cart lease, do you still have to pay an additional fee to use their push cart for when you walk?

[quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442404982' post='12321154']
Thanks guys. The club is not an upper tier club or anything so I'm not sure where they are coming from here.

The course is pretty great and they seem to have a decent group of members but the range is only about 185 yards due to a dam at the back of the range (they open up the range to the 18th fairway on weekend mornings and have the staff pick up balls). The location of the course is good for me and other than the cart issues the pricing is where I need it to be. Just not sure how to reconcile the cart vs push cart issue.

Also, it seems like a lot of people think this club isn't a very friendly club for walkers; I'd hate to join planing to walk and be the only one on the course not using a cart.

Ps - why does everyone think walking is slower than riding? I play so much faster than the rest of my group when I walk and they ride. I sure hope pace of play isn't the motivating factor here bc that just doesn't make sense to me.
[/quote]

I was a member of a club for a long time that didn't allow push carts at all, of any kind. If you walked, you carried your bag (or had a caddy). And I've seen other clubs that way. Basically the members think push/pull carts don't have a certain cache and look bad. Makes absolutely no sense but that's what the members think. No accounting for tastes in my opinion. But most people rode carts, very very few walkers so it wasn't that much of an impact.

Do you know if a lot of people walk at your proposed club or do they mostly ride? That can make a big difference in your playing.experiences. Being the only walker in the club can be frustrating.

And as to the last point, I've found that walking can be faster or it can be slower than a cart. Depends upon the two players entirely. For years I walked at this club until I couldn't walk any more physically and was one of the fastest players at the club. but I have played with other walkers that are slower than molasses. But I've seen the same with cart players as well. its really an individual things.

[quote name='The Pearl' timestamp='1442419715' post='12322162'][quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442368443' post='12319832'] So I'm looking into joining a private club. There is a cart lease that is about 1k per year. I walk most of the time using a clicgear but with certain friends or my fiancé I will ride. This club will not allow the use of personal push carts and the use of their push carts is not included with the cart lease. If I pay for the cart lease, I have to pay for locker/handicap/etc but if I don't they will comp me those costs and the push cart lease. Basically, I want the cart lease for use with occasional guests and my fiancé but would mostly use the course's push carts. I'm a bit perturbed about a few things: 1) no outside push carts so my 8.0 gets benched 2) I can't substitute a push cart for an electric cart Has anyone heard of this before? Any advice for how to deal with this? It's a borderline deal breaker for me. Thanks [/quote]

If you get the cart lease, do you still have to pay an additional fee to use their push cart for when you walk?[/quote]

Yes. That's the part that really bugs me. If I get the cart lease but want to use a push cart instead of riding I'd have to pay to rent the push cart.

[sub]Yup. Frustrating, certainly. But Its a way for the club (club pro usually) to make more money. The question you have to figure out is how often you'll ride versus walking. Will you ride about 50 rounds per year (assuming normal $20 cart fee) or thereabouts. Question: If your finance goes with you is that a separate cart fee or can it be combined on yours. Some clubs have separate for each person. [/sub]

[quote name='ZBigStick' timestamp='1442370546' post='12320036']
They won't let you pay for a riding cart per round? I've never heard of this. Cart lease sounds like a ripoff.
[/quote]I've never heard of a cart least either. At the club I worked at growing up, there was a per-use charge for a golf cart, but walking was no additional cost.

[quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442423258' post='12322506']
[quote name='The Pearl' timestamp='1442419715' post='12322162'][quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442368443' post='12319832'] So I'm looking into joining a private club. There is a cart lease that is about 1k per year. I walk most of the time using a clicgear but with certain friends or my fiancé I will ride. This club will not allow the use of personal push carts and the use of their push carts is not included with the cart lease. If I pay for the cart lease, I have to pay for locker/handicap/etc but if I don't they will comp me those costs and the push cart lease. Basically, I want the cart lease for use with occasional guests and my fiancé but would mostly use the course's push carts. I'm a bit perturbed about a few things: 1) no outside push carts so my 8.0 gets benched 2) I can't substitute a push cart for an electric cart Has anyone heard of this before? Any advice for how to deal with this? It's a borderline deal breaker for me. Thanks [/quote]

If you get the cart lease, do you still have to pay an additional fee to use their push cart for when you walk?[/quote]

Yes. That's the part that really bugs me. If I get the cart lease but want to use a push cart instead of riding I'd have to pay to rent the push cart.
[/quote]

That's the part that really seems like a money grab, that you have to make an either/or decision for the entire year on riding vs push cart.

Although the tax description may be correct it sure sounds to me like a bit of a bait and switch where they have a low 'unlimited' rate on the golf but get you cart fees.

I don't think you're being unreasonable, but of course you have to weigh this against your other options.

Is this an equity membership where a board of members determine policy (and you might be able to influence or at least understand why it's the way it is) or is this a course owned by someone else that just happens to be selling memberships and it's their way or highway?

[quote name='Zaddn' timestamp='1442404982' post='12321154']

Also, it seems like a lot of people think this club isn't a very friendly club for walkers; I'd hate to join planing to walk and be the only one on the course not using a cart.

[/quote]

I can tell you that at the very walkable club I referenced in a prior post, when they switched from per-round cart fees to mandatory unlimited cart fees rolled into the dues, even though walking was still free and allowed anytime, the percentage of rounds walked probably went from 50% down to way less than 10%. Wasn't uncommon to be out on a busy weekend morning and only see one or two other walkers around anymore. The cart fee arrangement absolutely will affect the walking culture of a club. Only the true diehard walkers still walk at that club. The old guys who played and rode every day were excited because they were saving money.

Where is this club in terms of number of members vs desired number of members? Are there any other prospective members in the same boat? If you show you're willing to walk away, will they care?

Something doesn't add up frankly. Either it's dumb management putting down an attempt at a cash grab, or its incredibly stupid management that can't see the forest for the trees.

And I have to ask, but are your potential guests incapable of walking? The only time a cart has ever come up with any of my guests was when it was north of 90*. Granted, that's a self-selected sample, but (and your fiance throws a monkey wrench in this plan), I wouldn't make decisions based on guests. I bought a book of guest passes, which met my minimum for the year, with the idea I'd bring people out and recoup most of that money. Nope. Took a bath on it.

No private golf club I've heard of permits golfer-owned push carts onto the course. And many clubs have an annual "cart plan" which amounts to the same thing as the "cart lease" the OP referred to. Most private clubs near me have push carts available for rental by the round; $8-$10 a round seems to be the norm.

As for walker-friendly policies, that's very important to me. Our club permits walking any time (with no trail fee) except 8 am-1 pm Fri, Sat & Sun. That works fine for me.

[quote name='Bluefan75' timestamp='1442430977' post='12323164']Where is this club in terms of number of members vs desired number of members? Are there any other prospective members in the same boat? If you show you're willing to walk away, will they care?

Something doesn't add up frankly. Either it's dumb management putting down an attempt at a cash grab, or its incredibly stupid management that can't see the forest for the trees.

And I have to ask, but are your potential guests incapable of walking? The only time a cart has ever come up with any of my guests was when it was north of 90*. Granted, that's a self-selected sample, but (and your fiance throws a monkey wrench in this plan), I wouldn't make decisions based on guests. I bought a book of guest passes, which met my minimum for the year, with the idea I'd bring people out and recoup most of that money. Nope. Took a bath on it.[/quote]

Most of my friends can walk but my dad is about 70 and my main golfing buddy is over 350 lbs so we couldn't do 18. The course is pretty hilly so 18 holes for anyone would be a bit of a physical activity.

[quote name='MaxBuck' timestamp='1442433266' post='12323356']
No private golf club I've heard of permits golfer-owned push carts onto the course. And many clubs have an annual "cart plan" which amounts to the same thing as the "cart lease" the OP referred to. Most private clubs near me have push carts available for rental by the round; $8-$10 a round seems to be the norm.
[/quote]

Our course allows you to push your own cart - they'll even store them in the bag room.

[quote name='raynorfan1' timestamp='1442668299' post='12334862'][quote name='MaxBuck' timestamp='1442433266' post='12323356']
No private golf club I've heard of permits golfer-owned push carts onto the course. And many clubs have an annual "cart plan" which amounts to the same thing as the "cart lease" the OP referred to. Most private clubs near me have push carts available for rental by the round; $8-$10 a round seems to be the norm.
[/quote]

Our course allows you to push your own cart - they'll even store them in the bag room.[/quote]


That would be the ideal situation. I would still do the cart lease and I would have use of my cart. The club would maximize the money I am paying.

I'm heading to the course today with my fiancé to check it out some more and plan on discussing policies with the pro shop as the membership director got a bit turned around (ie: she told me walking was restricted in certain groups but that walking and push carts aren't the same, etc).

honestly sounds like too many silly rules with this club. i know u really wanna join it but wtf. they need to loosen up

So I played the course today. Awesome course with tons of variety that used every club in my bag. Quite a bit of large hills so walking 18 would be pretty difficult. I'm thinking cart is the way to go so it all works out.

Thanks for the input. If anyone is ever in Akron Ohio let me know!

Wait, you were thinking of joining a course having never played it???