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Putting Aimpoint Express

Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
Ever go a few years where your putting is dire for no apparent reason? I've been on SAM Puttlab and it says my stroke is excellent yet I havent broken under 30 putts in a long long time. I frequently have 33 putts or on a horrendous day 36 or 37. I usually have 2 3 putts a round.

I feel like I dont hit it on line consistently enough and also feel like my speed is always a bit off. I dont even bother practising it anymore. Anytime I have asked a pro to look at my stroke they say "looks good to me bud". Then I procede to have another 35 putts next round haha. I used to be a good putter in my 20's but its gone south for whatever reason.



Anyway I am a skeptic but willing to try something different to sort this. Can anyone tell me about aimpoint express? I have toutubed it but they arent giving away any info bar you feel the slope with your feet. That sounds a bit wishy washy. Feel is subjective and how you feel slope can change day to day I am thinking. There is a guy who teaches this but charges 100 bucks+ to get a lesson in it which is a bit much.



Can any player revommend it and tell me exactly how it has helped and more info on how it works?
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  • jut111jut111 Members Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    I highly recommend it. But I'm not going to give it away. I'd suggest ponying up to learn from a certified instructor. Or go the DVD route, which I haven't seen so can't offer an opinion on.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How much did it improve your putting?
  • jut111jut111 Members Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Can't put a number on it as I don't keep detailed stats (I should probably start). What it did do was free me up to trust and not second guess my line and let me focus solely on speed over the ball. It tremendously helped my lag putting, I used to be that guy who would play 2 feet of break - the wrong way. That never happens now. Lags are nearly almost always on a decent line and then it's just speed control.
  • SadTromboneSadTrombone . Members Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    I use the regular aimpoint method with the book and such and I find it to be fantastic. I'm anxiously looking for someone to show me express. Haven't done it yet, but I can't imagine it's bad in any way. Definitely do it.
  • Dan DrakeDan Drake Members Posts: 2,017 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    A.P.E. is wonderful.



    I have gone to using it full time this year. That, along with simplifying my routine and using the 5footer have drastically improved my putting. My strokes gained putting has -4.58 to -1.21 in 2016.



    The simple routine offers clarity.

    The practice with the 5footer trains alignment and instills confidence over "testers."

    A.P.E. makes lag putting extremely simple. It is effective everywhere, but, for me, it makes the most (and it's huge) difference as you get farther from the hole, where most of us severely under read putts and then have to force a speed/face correction mid-stroke to fix our read. All that is gone with A.P.E.
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  • jpbouffardjpbouffard BigLex Members Posts: 41




    Anyway I am a skeptic but willing to try something different to sort this. Can anyone tell me about aimpoint express? I have toutubed it but they arent giving away any info bar you feel the slope with your feet. That sounds a bit wishy washy. Feel is subjective and how you feel slope can change day to day I am thinking. There is a guy who teaches this but charges 100 bucks+ to get a lesson in it which is a bit much.



    Can any player revommend it and tell me exactly how it has helped and more info on how it works?




    AimPoint teaches you to read greens with your body's sense of balance and equilibrium rather than your vision. It simplifies the aiming process as well.



    It works extremely well for me. Like anything, you have to practice it and work at it....it is simple to learn, but the better you do it - meaning the more refined and accurate you are with judging slope and assessing green speed - the better results you will have.



    For me, what I've found is that in using aimpoint, I get the direction of the break correct virtually 100% of the time...compared to visual reading, where I would say maybe 10-15% of putts would break the opposite way that I read them.



    It isn't magic....the same challenges of putting still apply. But IMO it is a much better and much simpler method of reading greens than looking at the green.
  • QManyQMany #TheWRX ClubWRX Posts: 9,129 ClubWRX
    edited May 31, 2016 #8
    Aaron Wise (Oregon) just won the NCAA Championship using Aimpoint Express. image/rtfm.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rtfm:' />
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  • leekgolfleekgolf Members Posts: 1,171 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    jpbouffard wrote:



    Anyway I am a skeptic but willing to try something different to sort this. Can anyone tell me about aimpoint express? I have toutubed it but they arent giving away any info bar you feel the slope with your feet. That sounds a bit wishy washy. Feel is subjective and how you feel slope can change day to day I am thinking. There is a guy who teaches this but charges 100 bucks+ to get a lesson in it which is a bit much.



    Can any player revommend it and tell me exactly how it has helped and more info on how it works?




    AimPoint teaches you to read greens with your body's sense of balance and equilibrium rather than your vision. It simplifies the aiming process as well.



    It works extremely well for me. Like anything, you have to practice it and work at it....it is simple to learn, but the better you do it - meaning the more refined and accurate you are with judging slope and assessing green speed - the better results you will have.



    For me, what I've found is that in using aimpoint, I get the direction of the break correct virtually 100% of the time...compared to visual reading, where I would say maybe 10-15% of putts would break the opposite way that I read them.



    It isn't magic....the same challenges of putting still apply. But IMO it is a much better and much simpler method of reading greens than looking at the green.




    How long did it take you to begin to feel breaks/slopes correctly? I bought the DVD and began practicing this morning. My sense of balance and equilibrium needs improvement image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
  • MadGolfer76MadGolfer76 Admiration is the state furthest from understanding. Members Posts: 20,139 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    The more I read about this, the more I think this works best for folks who have trouble with visualization.
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  • wpvincewpvince Members Posts: 136 ✭✭
    I met the guy who invented it. Really nice guy and I incorporate it into my game but I don't use it all the way
  • sheppick.dansheppick.dan Members Posts: 99 ✭✭✭
    I have been researching it and am going to give it a go. My speed on the greens is good and I have great feel but I usually under read a green for the most part. That is the week point of my game.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ok so I finally got round to getting a coaching session in this. The only problem is I am good at guessing the slope but I find with the finger system for me gives me an incorrect aimpoint which plays too much break.



    As far as I am aware I am doing it correctly. Can anyone help me out? You can PM me to avoid making info public.
  • GungHoGolfGungHoGolf SkyTrak Afficionado Austin, TXMembers Posts: 900 ✭✭✭✭✭


    Ok so I finally got round to getting a coaching session in this. The only problem is I am good at guessing the slope but I find with the finger system for me gives me an incorrect aimpoint which plays too much break.



    As far as I am aware I am doing it correctly. Can anyone help me out? You can PM me to avoid making info public.




    Are you holding your fingers up at full arm's length with no elbow bend? Are your arms unusually short or your fingers unusually thick? Do you play on super slow greens?



    Those are the only factors I can think of to cause what you're describing, assuming you're getting the true percent (not degrees!) slope and measuring from center cup (not edge of cup).
  • GungHoGolfGungHoGolf SkyTrak Afficionado Austin, TXMembers Posts: 900 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ps. It could also be that you're subconsciously putting the ball not towards the aimpoint, but higher than the aimpoint in order to hit the aimpoint. Like to your brain, the aimpoint becomes the target. This is easy to do, since the ball never comes close to reaching the aimpoint when rolling on the correct line.



    I played a scramble the other day and I swear this dude was basically doubling whatever amount of break I recommended he use. For example, I'd do the Aimpoint thing on a 20 footer and come up with, say, 12 inches of break. I'd watch him line up and stroke and he'd use around 2 feet as his start line, missing around 12 inches high of course.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    DeadStick wrote:



    Ok so I finally got round to getting a coaching session in this. The only problem is I am good at guessing the slope but I find with the finger system for me gives me an incorrect aimpoint which plays too much break.



    As far as I am aware I am doing it correctly. Can anyone help me out? You can PM me to avoid making info public.




    Are you holding your fingers up at full arm's length with no elbow bend? Are your arms unusually short or your fingers unusually thick? Do you play on super slow greens?



    Those are the only factors I can think of to cause what you're describing, assuming you're getting the true percent (not degrees!) slope and measuring from center cup (not edge of cup).




    I will try again making sure my arm is 100% straight. Maybe I was bending my arm and didn't notice. I will report back. My fingers are normal as is my arm length I think. The greens are a little slow but not super slow by any means.



    Oh one more thing. I have read that you stand 3ft back for putts over 10ft. But someone else told me its 1ft back. Whats your take?
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    DeadStick wrote:


    ps. It could also be that you're subconsciously putting the ball not towards the aimpoint, but higher than the aimpoint in order to hit the aimpoint. Like to your brain, the aimpoint becomes the target. This is easy to do, since the ball never comes close to reaching the aimpoint when rolling on the correct line.



    I played a scramble the other day and I swear this dude was basically doubling whatever amount of break I recommended he use. For example, I'd do the Aimpoint thing on a 20 footer and come up with, say, 12 inches of break. I'd watch him line up and stroke and he'd use around 2 feet as his start line, missing around 12 inches high of course.




    It's possible but I don't think it's my problem although I would need someone to check me to make sure.
  • GungHoGolfGungHoGolf SkyTrak Afficionado Austin, TXMembers Posts: 900 ✭✭✭✭✭

    DeadStick wrote:



    Ok so I finally got round to getting a coaching session in this. The only problem is I am good at guessing the slope but I find with the finger system for me gives me an incorrect aimpoint which plays too much break.



    As far as I am aware I am doing it correctly. Can anyone help me out? You can PM me to avoid making info public.




    Are you holding your fingers up at full arm's length with no elbow bend? Are your arms unusually short or your fingers unusually thick? Do you play on super slow greens?



    Those are the only factors I can think of to cause what you're describing, assuming you're getting the true percent (not degrees!) slope and measuring from center cup (not edge of cup).




    I will try again making sure my arm is 100% straight. Maybe I was bending my arm and didn't notice. I will report back. My fingers are normal as is my arm length I think. The greens are a little slow but not super slow by any means.



    Oh one more thing. I have read that you stand 3ft back for putts over 10ft. But someone else told me its 1ft back. Whats your take?




    I am self-taught and never stand back away from the ball. I always measure standing right behind the ball. The only adjustments I make are elbow bend for faster greens or downhill puts, and switch to inches outside cup (1 inch per percent slope) around 5 ft or closer.
  • GungHoGolfGungHoGolf SkyTrak Afficionado Austin, TXMembers Posts: 900 ✭✭✭✭✭

    DeadStick wrote:


    ps. It could also be that you're subconsciously putting the ball not towards the aimpoint, but higher than the aimpoint in order to hit the aimpoint. Like to your brain, the aimpoint becomes the target. This is easy to do, since the ball never comes close to reaching the aimpoint when rolling on the correct line.



    I played a scramble the other day and I swear this dude was basically doubling whatever amount of break I recommended he use. For example, I'd do the Aimpoint thing on a 20 footer and come up with, say, 12 inches of break. I'd watch him line up and stroke and he'd use around 2 feet as his start line, missing around 12 inches high of course.




    It's possible but I don't think it's my problem although I would need someone to check me to make sure.




    You can set up a breaking putt with an alignment stick to check this yourself. It's a very easy mistake to make, especially if you don't use and trust a line drawn on the ball.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I started to get a feel of where to aim on my own too after a while without using my fingers.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.
  • SchneeSchnee SOTABM NortheastClubWRX Posts: 5,521 ClubWRX
    You may be standing too far away from the ball on 6+ foot putts.
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  • GungHoGolfGungHoGolf SkyTrak Afficionado Austin, TXMembers Posts: 900 ✭✭✭✭✭


    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.




    You're confirming the 2% slope with a digital level or clinometer app? And positive you're starting the putt on the right line, ideally with two aligment sticks as train tracks?



    There have been a lot of APE threads here with success stories, and I don't recall hearing about this over read problem before.
  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    DeadStick wrote:



    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.




    You're confirming the 2% slope with a digital level or clinometer app? And positive you're starting the putt on the right line, ideally with two aligment sticks as train tracks?



    There have been a lot of APE threads here with success stories, and I don't recall hearing about this over read problem before.




    Yes. I am starting it on line. I am using an app with a clinometer on my phone. Maybe it needs recalibrating but I checked it against the ones the aimpoint guys sell and it was the same reading.



    That is now the only thing I think could be throwing me off. I am doing the finger thing level with the ball, with me straddling the ball. Toes level with it. then move back for outside 10ft.
  • SchneeSchnee SOTABM NortheastClubWRX Posts: 5,521 ClubWRX

    DeadStick wrote:



    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.




    You're confirming the 2% slope with a digital level or clinometer app? And positive you're starting the putt on the right line, ideally with two aligment sticks as train tracks?



    There have been a lot of APE threads here with success stories, and I don't recall hearing about this over read problem before.




    Yes. I am starting it on line. I am using an app with a clinometer on my phone. Maybe it needs recalibrating but I checked it against the ones the aimpoint guys sell and it was the same reading.



    That is now the only thing I think could be throwing me off. I am doing the finger thing level with the ball, with me straddling the ball. Toes level with it. then move back for outside 10ft.




    I was taught that 6 feet was the dividing line for straddling or standing behind.
    "Grasshopper breaks wing
    soars with Master's healing words.
    Winter grounds him"

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  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Schnee wrote:


    DeadStick wrote:



    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.




    You're confirming the 2% slope with a digital level or clinometer app? And positive you're starting the putt on the right line, ideally with two aligment sticks as train tracks?



    There have been a lot of APE threads here with success stories, and I don't recall hearing about this over read problem before.




    Yes. I am starting it on line. I am using an app with a clinometer on my phone. Maybe it needs recalibrating but I checked it against the ones the aimpoint guys sell and it was the same reading.



    That is now the only thing I think could be throwing me off. I am doing the finger thing level with the ball, with me straddling the ball. Toes level with it. then move back for outside 10ft.




    I was taught that 6 feet was the dividing line for straddling or standing behind.




    Really? I was told 10ft. Anyone know what is 100% correct?
  • ShipwreckShipwreck Members Posts: 3,932 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    Ok so I finally got round to getting a coaching session in this. The only problem is I am good at guessing the slope but I find with the finger system for me gives me an incorrect aimpoint which plays too much break.



    As far as I am aware I am doing it correctly. Can anyone help me out? You can PM me to avoid making info public.




    When you miss the putt, how far past the hole is the ball rolling? Anything longer than 18 inches means you are giving it too much power and need to work on that.



    When I practice my Aimpoint Express, to get calibrated with the level, I mark the aimpoint with a tee and go from there. If I am missing on the low side, I need to give it more break (fingers closer) and high side is less break (fingers further away). It takes some real practice to get a feel for how greens are rolling and where you should be. By the 3rd or 4th hole, if I hadn't practiced too much pre-round, I have made the necessary adjustments in my arm bend to compensate for the green speed.

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  • Trap JuniorTrap Junior Members Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I aim for 1 ft past
  • ShipwreckShipwreck Members Posts: 3,932 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭


    I aim for 1 ft past




    Do you have a digital level or something to give you an actual %? How far back are you stepping from your ball? I know that APE gives us some pretty strict guidelines but I have deviated on a few things, depending on the greens that I am playing. How much practice are you putting into it on a daily/weekly basis?

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  • SchneeSchnee SOTABM NortheastClubWRX Posts: 5,521 ClubWRX

    Schnee wrote:


    DeadStick wrote:



    Just back. Tried it with ramrod straight arm but the problem remains. a 2% slope with my two fingers gives me an overread.




    You're confirming the 2% slope with a digital level or clinometer app? And positive you're starting the putt on the right line, ideally with two aligment sticks as train tracks?



    There have been a lot of APE threads here with success stories, and I don't recall hearing about this over read problem before.




    Yes. I am starting it on line. I am using an app with a clinometer on my phone. Maybe it needs recalibrating but I checked it against the ones the aimpoint guys sell and it was the same reading.



    That is now the only thing I think could be throwing me off. I am doing the finger thing level with the ball, with me straddling the ball. Toes level with it. then move back for outside 10ft.




    I was taught that 6 feet was the dividing line for straddling or standing behind.




    Really? I was told 10ft. Anyone know what is 100% correct?




    Let me check my notes.
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    soars with Master's healing words.
    Winter grounds him"

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  • SchneeSchnee SOTABM NortheastClubWRX Posts: 5,521 ClubWRX
    My notes from aim point say putts 3-6 feet and 6+
    "Grasshopper breaks wing
    soars with Master's healing words.
    Winter grounds him"

    -Hawkeye77

    Becky Johnson Award Nominee 2016


    Taylormade M6 10.5* Graphite Design AD DI 
    Taylormade SLDR Mini 14* Diamana Limited Edition 80g
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    Vokey SM7 50.12F, 54.14F Stealth S200
    [Vokey SM7 58.V Oil Can S200
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