Best Rain gear

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  • driveandputtmachinedriveandputtmachine 4 wedges or 2 iron? That is the question! Members Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Based on reviews here and at the other site I just ordered the Proquip PX5 Stormforce jacket and pants for my Scotland trip this coming July. I am a fairweather golfer currently because I am not a member of a course and there are too many nice days to want to play while it's super cold or rainy.



    I plan on joining a course this year and with a trip to Scotland my time is limited on how many rounds I can play and it could possibly rain every day that I am there so I needed to be prepared.
    Driver - Ping 400 MAX on Tour 65 
    Fairway - Cobra F9 on UST Axivcore Black
    Others - Srixon 785 5 Wood on UST Axivcore Black or TM UDI 2 iron on Nippon 130 or Ping G400 17* 
    Irons - (4-A) Taylormade 790's on KBS Tour
    Wedges - Cleveland Rotex 3.0 55*, Rotex 4.0 60* on KBS tour
    Putter - Mannkrafted MA/66 or Taylormade Spider
    Ball - TM TP5x or Srixon Z Star XV
  • ChxDigLongBallChxDigLongBall MSMembers Posts: 497 ✭✭✭✭
    Epic Flash Sub Zero 9* - Fuji Atmos Tour Spec Black 60X
    Sub Zero 13.5* - Project X Evenflow Black 6.5
    Apex 19 2h- Project X Evenflow Black 6.5
    Apex Black 19 - 4-6 - DG AMT White  X100
    Apex Pro Black 19 - 7-PW - DG AMT White X100
    Mac Daddy 4 Black- 50, 54, 60- DG Onyx TI S400
    Odyssey O-Works Jailbird Mini Red
    Odyssey Stroke Lab Jailbird in testing
    Taylor Made TP5
  • UhitUhit Members Posts: 861


    Based on reviews here and at the other site I just ordered the Proquip PX5 Stormforce jacket and pants for my Scotland trip this coming July. I am a fairweather golfer currently because I am not a member of a course and there are too many nice days to want to play while it's super cold or rainy.



    I plan on joining a course this year and with a trip to Scotland my time is limited on how many rounds I can play and it could possibly rain every day that I am there so I needed to be prepared.




    You may also want / need, the PQ bucket hat:



    http://proquipgolf.com/product/ultralite-waterproof-bucket-hat/
  • driveandputtmachinedriveandputtmachine 4 wedges or 2 iron? That is the question! Members Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.
    Driver - Ping 400 MAX on Tour 65 
    Fairway - Cobra F9 on UST Axivcore Black
    Others - Srixon 785 5 Wood on UST Axivcore Black or TM UDI 2 iron on Nippon 130 or Ping G400 17* 
    Irons - (4-A) Taylormade 790's on KBS Tour
    Wedges - Cleveland Rotex 3.0 55*, Rotex 4.0 60* on KBS tour
    Putter - Mannkrafted MA/66 or Taylormade Spider
    Ball - TM TP5x or Srixon Z Star XV
  • AquilaAquila "Deceptively simple and endlessly complicated..." Members Posts: 131 ✭✭✭
    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.
    golfsupport.com. Try discount code AW001. Best prices I found.
    Driver: Cobra King LTD Pro 8.5* / MCA Diamana D+ Limited Edition 70X
    Fairway: Titleist 917 F2 14.25* / MCA Diamana D+ Limited Edition 80S
    Utility/DI: Srixon Z U85 19* / Nippon Modus3 120S
    Irons: Mizuno JPX919 Hot Metal 4-6 & Forged 7-GW / Nippon Modus3 120S
    Wedges: Cleveland RTX-3 54* & 58* / Nippon Modus3 120S
    Putter: Ping Anser 3 / SuperStroke Flatso 1.0
    Ball: Srixon Z-Star XV
  • 4puttJohnny4puttJohnny Members Posts: 472 ✭✭✭✭


    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.




    haha. You made the same mistake I made. European calendar is read differently. That means they expect it by January 5th.
  • driveandputtmachinedriveandputtmachine 4 wedges or 2 iron? That is the question! Members Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭✭✭✭



    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.




    haha. You made the same mistake I made. European calendar is read differently. That means they expect it by January 5th.

    Aquila wrote:

    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.
    golfsupport.com. Try discount code AW001. Best prices I found.




    Ordered from Golf Support with the coupon code. 4putt.....you are correct I read it as a US date instead of the European date. Just received an email stating that it was on it's way.
    Driver - Ping 400 MAX on Tour 65 
    Fairway - Cobra F9 on UST Axivcore Black
    Others - Srixon 785 5 Wood on UST Axivcore Black or TM UDI 2 iron on Nippon 130 or Ping G400 17* 
    Irons - (4-A) Taylormade 790's on KBS Tour
    Wedges - Cleveland Rotex 3.0 55*, Rotex 4.0 60* on KBS tour
    Putter - Mannkrafted MA/66 or Taylormade Spider
    Ball - TM TP5x or Srixon Z Star XV
  • 4puttJohnny4puttJohnny Members Posts: 472 ✭✭✭✭




    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.




    haha. You made the same mistake I made. European calendar is read differently. That means they expect it by January 5th.

    Aquila wrote:

    You guys with the proquip PX5.....where did you order. The first order I p-laced they are saying 5/1/2018 before they receive it. Granted I am not traveling until July, but that seems like an awful long time to wait.
    golfsupport.com. Try discount code AW001. Best prices I found.




    Ordered from Golf Support with the coupon code. 4putt.....you are correct I read it as a US date instead of the European date. Just received an email stating that it was on it's way.




    You probably already know this, but just in case you don't -- remember that European garments zip opposite of the US, so the zipper on your Px5 jacket will be on opposite side where you are accustomed from US jackets.
  • tmartin89tmartin89 Members Posts: 139 ✭✭
    Galvin Green all the way.
    As you walk down the fairway of life you must smell the roses, for you only get to play one round.
  • chbrakechbrake Clint ClubWRX Posts: 87 ClubWRX
    Guys!!! Thank you for all of your answers on this. I delved deep and went all in. Found a guy on the BST who was selling an Under Armour rain suit NWT for $260, so I debated over it for a day or two and went for it. Got it in the mail the other day and it fits great but I haven't played in it yet. Also, I went ahead and got a Proquip set because yall sang such high praises. So, in the next couple of months I may have to put one of them back up on the BST.

    Anyway, thanks again for all the tech support and help, its great using a collective brain to make an informed decision.



    Thanks again,

    Clint
  • portlandportland Members Posts: 1,056 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Can anyone comment on the fit of the proquip px5? Order same size as FJ (small for me) or Nike (medium for me) ?
    Taylormade M1 10.5*
    Callaway GBB Epic 15*
    Callaway XR 19*
    Taylormade p790 5-P,A
    Titleist Vokey SM6 54*, 58*, 60*
    Titleist Scotty Cameron Golo 3
    Srixon Z Star
  • drscott266drscott266 Members Posts: 381 ✭✭✭✭
    KJUS is by far the most technically advanced with the materials they're using and fits. It is a bit pricey but worth it if you can find a deal. Speaking of deals function18.com is running a huge sale on Galvin Green. Passing this along. I've bought from US re sellers before but these prices are absurdly low and don't think anyone can come close! They even include free shipping an no tax!



    https://www.function18.com/on-sale/shopby/brand-galvin_green.html?dir=desc&order=date_created




    This. I tried everything and have never once strayed from Kjus once trying it. I bought a ton of their other stuff now too, I like the gear that much. Fit, stretch and comfort are all equally important and Kjus has it all. And it keep you bone dry too.
  • 4puttJohnny4puttJohnny Members Posts: 472 ✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 7, 2018 #44
    portland wrote:


    Can anyone comment on the fit of the proquip px5? Order same size as FJ (small for me) or Nike (medium for me) ?








    I'm 5-7, 155, and wear Medium in Under Armour, C&B, Nike, Peter Millar, Fairway & Greene, etc. The only brand I have to go down to Small is Footjoy. With Galvin Green, I have to go up to Large in some of their stuff, just because I don't like the fully form fitting Euro fit in some garments that is typical of their style (not a knock against the company, just my personal preference).



    With the PX5, the Medium jacket was the best fit, although I do use the pull cords to make it tighter on me. The sleeves were just too short on the Small and it felt to "binding". I have a 40 chest, which is what they recommend for the medium. The fabric is exceptional for stretching and, like I said, the pull cords will let you make it tighter all the way around, not just at the bottom of the jacket like some versions. I also knew that I would mainly be wearing mine during the winter, so I would also have on an added layer of a sweater underneath, so I didn't want to go Small. If you just want to use your's during the summer when you'll only have a small polo underneath, that might affect your decision.



    As far as the pants, I was greedy and purchased both a Small and Medium. The Medium has been perfect during winter golf so far. I wear UA base layer, then UA Coldgear pants, then the rain paints and I've been toasty down to one tournament that I played when it was 32 degrees, cloudy with 25 mph winds out of the north. The Small are perfect if I solely want to wear the base layer and then the rain paints on top. I actually purchased the Small in thoughts of the summer when I would typically just have a relatively thin pair of shorts on and it starts raining.



    I would describe the overall fit of the PX5 as similar to an Under Armour fit. In my mind, Footjoy stuff is usually a little baggy. Galvin Green is pretty form fitting. And then Under Armour is kind of "middle of the road" -- not baggy, but not form fitting. That's just my experience. Others may disagree. There's a guy named chris975d (?) from Atlanta who posts on here frequently and he's a tremendous resource on all different OEM sizes, styles, etc....... You may want to PM him.
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX

    portland wrote:


    Can anyone comment on the fit of the proquip px5? Order same size as FJ (small for me) or Nike (medium for me) ?








    I'm 5-7, 155, and wear Medium in Under Armour, C&B, Nike, Peter Millar, Fairway & Greene, etc. The only brand I have to go down to Small is Footjoy. With Galvin Green, I have to go up to Large in some of their stuff, just because I don't like the fully form fitting Euro fit in some garments that is typical of their style (not a knock against the company, just my personal preference).



    With the PX5, the Medium jacket was the best fit, although I do use the pull cords to make it tighter on me. The sleeves were just too short on the Small and it felt to "binding". I have a 40 chest, which is what they recommend for the medium. The fabric is exceptional for stretching and, like I said, the pull cords will let you make it tighter all the way around, not just at the bottom of the jacket like some versions. I also knew that I would mainly be wearing mine during the winter, so I would also have on an added layer of a sweater underneath, so I didn't want to go Small. If you just want to use your's during the summer when you'll only have a small polo underneath, that might affect your decision.



    As far as the pants, I was greedy and purchased both a Small and Medium. The Medium has been perfect during winter golf so far. I wear UA base layer, then UA Coldgear pants, then the rain paints and I've been toasty down to one tournament that I played when it was 32 degrees, cloudy with 25 mph winds out of the north. The Small are perfect if I solely want to wear the base layer and then the rain paints on top. I actually purchased the Small in thoughts of the summer when I would typically just have a relatively thin pair of shorts on and it starts raining.



    I would describe the overall fit of the PX5 as similar to an Under Armour fit. In my mind, Footjoy stuff is usually a little baggy. Galvin Green is pretty form fitting. And then Under Armour is kind of "middle of the road" -- not baggy, but not form fitting. That's just my experience. Others may disagree. There's a guy named chris975d (?) from Atlanta who posts on here frequently and he's a tremendous resource on all different OEM sizes, styles, etc....... You may want to PM him.




    Hey 4putt, thanks for the kind words. I'll echo pretty much everything you said here. I am a rain and winter gear ho, and I've owned and tried just about everything. Your words on fits of the different manufacturers is spot on to what I've seen. Euro cut is usually a bit smaller and more "athletic" fit/cut. FootJoy, over here at least, is very baggy and loose. Ironically, if you order Euro FJ, it's all athletic cut and pretty much perfect, as long as you size up...it's cut very small compared to our FJ over here.



    I'll confirm that in my experience, ProQuip fit is similar to Under Armour. I wear the same size in each. I own the PX5 pants, and I really like them. I use them as a cold weather layer over my golf pants at work (I work in golf, and am outside a lot helping my staff) as it sounds you do. And they have a good amount of stretch, great feeling material, and are just comfy.
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • aiyyeraiyyer Members Posts: 1,577 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    I have a Goretex Paclite from Cabela's that does the job the one of two times I'm stranded in bad weather. I don't mind the hood either!

    Mizuno also has a non/ goretex lineup that seems pretty good.

    The link below has a pretty good explanation of waterproof ratings:

    https://www.evo.com/guides/outerwear-waterproof-ratings-and-breathability

  • portlandportland Members Posts: 1,056 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    portland wrote:


    Can anyone comment on the fit of the proquip px5? Order same size as FJ (small for me) or Nike (medium for me) ?








    I'm 5-7, 155, and wear Medium in Under Armour, C&B, Nike, Peter Millar, Fairway & Greene, etc. The only brand I have to go down to Small is Footjoy. With Galvin Green, I have to go up to Large in some of their stuff, just because I don't like the fully form fitting Euro fit in some garments that is typical of their style (not a knock against the company, just my personal preference).



    With the PX5, the Medium jacket was the best fit, although I do use the pull cords to make it tighter on me. The sleeves were just too short on the Small and it felt to "binding". I have a 40 chest, which is what they recommend for the medium. The fabric is exceptional for stretching and, like I said, the pull cords will let you make it tighter all the way around, not just at the bottom of the jacket like some versions. I also knew that I would mainly be wearing mine during the winter, so I would also have on an added layer of a sweater underneath, so I didn't want to go Small. If you just want to use your's during the summer when you'll only have a small polo underneath, that might affect your decision.



    As far as the pants, I was greedy and purchased both a Small and Medium. The Medium has been perfect during winter golf so far. I wear UA base layer, then UA Coldgear pants, then the rain paints and I've been toasty down to one tournament that I played when it was 32 degrees, cloudy with 25 mph winds out of the north. The Small are perfect if I solely want to wear the base layer and then the rain paints on top. I actually purchased the Small in thoughts of the summer when I would typically just have a relatively thin pair of shorts on and it starts raining.



    I would describe the overall fit of the PX5 as similar to an Under Armour fit. In my mind, Footjoy stuff is usually a little baggy. Galvin Green is pretty form fitting. And then Under Armour is kind of "middle of the road" -- not baggy, but not form fitting. That's just my experience. Others may disagree. There's a guy named chris975d (?) from Atlanta who posts on here frequently and he's a tremendous resource on all different OEM sizes, styles, etc....... You may want to PM him.






    Exactly the reply I was looking for. I am the same h/w so Medium it is - jacket and pants.



    Thank you! I have a Bandon trip coming up in April and want to prepare ahead of time.



    Taylormade M1 10.5*
    Callaway GBB Epic 15*
    Callaway XR 19*
    Taylormade p790 5-P,A
    Titleist Vokey SM6 54*, 58*, 60*
    Titleist Scotty Cameron Golo 3
    Srixon Z Star
  • dparkdpark Members Posts: 2,543 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.
    Old stuff:
    1962 Tommy Armour AT2W Driver   1953 Macgregor M65W EOM 3 wood   1978 H&B PowerBilt Citation 4 wood
    1984 Ben Hogan Apex PC 2-E   1968 Wilson Dual Wedge
    1964 Acushnet O-SET M6S Bullseye Putter
    New stuff
    Cobra ZL 10.5 driver   Adams 5050 16 fairway wood   Adams A2P 20* hybrid
    Titleist 716 MB irons 4-PW    Callaway Mack Daddy wedges 52, 56, 60
    Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum Napa
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    With 25+ years in the golf business and wearing rain gear for work pretty extensively, I'd have to refute that to some extent. When it comes to the waterproof membranes that actually make up the "waterproofing" part of these garments, if designed to the same specs (people need to check that before buying rain gear), most all membranes perform as well as GoreTex, and some have been proven to be "better" at things such as breathability, strecth, etc. Even the outdoor industry shows us this (mountain climbing, hiking, etc), as they use this stuff way harder than we do in golf, and more and more non-GoreTex pieces make it to the top of recommended lists with each year. Even the one of the top performing and highly regarded manufacturers of rain gear in golf, Kjus, doesn't use GoreTex material in their gear.



    In talking to people in the textile/clothing manufacturing industry, as I do almost daily, at least weekly, many will even tell you they feel GoreTex material (the actual waterproof membrane, not the fabric attached to the outside (and sometimes inside) is actually falling behind in advancements to some of the other membranes on the market. Mainly because many people (in the industry) say Gore is "resting on their laurels", so to speak.



    Where GoreTex does shine isn't in the membrane I feel, it's actually in their requirements for a manufacturer to be able to even use GoreTex in their products. Gore (the company itself) has a very stringent set of rules you have to follow to be able to license and use GoreTex. They (Gore) has to have final say so in the design, they have to do all of the testing, the garments have to be made in Gore approved facilities that have been trained and set up to Gore standards. The manufacturer has to use Gore seam sealing tape, etc. They also require the manufacturer to give a lifetime warranty on the garment for water intrusion. They can do this because Gore has actually more or less helped design and build every GoreTex containing garment on the market. I've posted these bullet by bullet directly from Gore in another post on here somewhere.



    So kind of what Gore has done is create a standard for a GoreTex containing garment. They've created and control the consistency, because they don't trust the manufacturers to do that. So if you know nothing of waterproofing and membrane technology, you know that if you get a "GoreTex" garment, you'll stay dry.



    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    So I think some of the confusion and people saying "GoreTex is better" as if it's an absolute truth comes from the fact that they aren't comparing apples to apples. If you are looking at a 20,000mm or greater waterproof rating garment using a good membrane, with seam sealing, waterproof zippers, made by a quality manufacturer, you will get the same, if not better performance in things like breathability/temp regulation, stretch (this is important in golf and high movement activities) than a GoreTex containing piece. But if you buy a garment with only a 10,000mm rating, shodding seam sealing if any at all, and get wet (which at 10,000mm ratiing, trust me, if you're in a heavy rain for a while, you WILL get wet), then you'll think...GoreTex is the best.



    Summary, for those who don't want to read my rambling: GoreTex CAN be worth the money, if you know nothing of this technology and/or don't care to know. W. L. Gore (company) creates and controls the standard of GoreTex using garments, therefore you know the baseline level of performance you're getting with it. But, you are paying primarily for all this licensing and control W.L. Gore insists upon, and not as much on technological advancement of the membrane itself.

    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.



    **I do own and use waterproof garments containing GoreTex and most other membranes, so I'm not favoring any one over the other in real world use. Designed to the same waterproofing specs, they are all equal in my experience in actually keeping me dry. Where they differ is in how hot/clammy/sweaty I get underneath them, how much they stretch and move with me, etc.
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • I_HATE_SNOWI_HATE_SNOW Members Posts: 3,346 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    chris975d wrote:

    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    With 25+ years in the golf business and wearing rain gear for work pretty extensively, I'd have to refute that to some extent. When it comes to the waterproof membranes that actually make up the "waterproofing" part of these garments, if designed to the same specs (people need to check that before buying rain gear), most all membranes perform as well as GoreTex, and some have been proven to be "better" at things such as breathability, strecth, etc. Even the outdoor industry shows us this (mountain climbing, hiking, etc), as they use this stuff way harder than we do in golf, and more and more non-GoreTex pieces make it to the top of recommended lists with each year. Even the one of the top performing and highly regarded manufacturers of rain gear in golf, Kjus, doesn't use GoreTex material in their gear.



    In talking to people in the textile/clothing manufacturing industry, as I do almost daily, at least weekly, many will even tell you they feel GoreTex material (the actual waterproof membrane, not the fabric attached to the outside (and sometimes inside) is actually falling behind in advancements to some of the other membranes on the market. Mainly because many people (in the industry) say Gore is "resting on their laurels", so to speak.



    Where GoreTex does shine isn't in the membrane I feel, it's actually in their requirements for a manufacturer to be able to even use GoreTex in their products. Gore (the company itself) has a very stringent set of rules you have to follow to be able to license and use GoreTex. They (Gore) has to have final say so in the design, they have to do all of the testing, the garments have to be made in Gore approved facilities that have been trained and set up to Gore standards. The manufacturer has to use Gore seam sealing tape, etc. They also require the manufacturer to give a lifetime warranty on the garment for water intrusion. They can do this because Gore has actually more or less helped design and build every GoreTex containing garment on the market. I've posted these bullet by bullet directly from Gore in another post on here somewhere.



    So kind of what Gore has done is create a standard for a GoreTex containing garment. They've created and control the consistency, because they don't trust the manufacturers to do that. So if you know nothing of waterproofing and membrane technology, you know that if you get a "GoreTex" garment, you'll stay dry.



    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    So I think some of the confusion and people saying "GoreTex is better" as if it's an absolute truth comes from the fact that they aren't comparing apples to apples. If you are looking at a 20,000mm or greater waterproof rating garment using a good membrane, with seam sealing, waterproof zippers, made by a quality manufacturer, you will get the same, if not better performance in things like breathability/temp regulation, stretch (this is important in golf and high movement activities) than a GoreTex containing piece. But if you buy a garment with only a 10,000mm rating, shodding seam sealing if any at all, and get wet (which at 10,000mm ratiing, trust me, if you're in a heavy rain for a while, you WILL get wet), then you'll think...GoreTex is the best.



    Summary, for those who don't want to read my rambling: GoreTex CAN be worth the money, if you know nothing of this technology and/or don't care to know. W. L. Gore (company) creates and controls the standard of GoreTex using garments, therefore you know the baseline level of performance you're getting with it. But, you are paying primarily for all this licensing and control W.L. Gore insists upon, and not as much on technological advancement of the membrane itself.

    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.



    **I do own and use waterproof garments containing GoreTex and most other membranes, so I'm not favoring any one over the other in real world use. Designed to the same waterproofing specs, they are all equal in my experience in actually keeping me dry. Where they differ is in how hot/clammy/sweaty I get underneath them, how much they stretch and move with me, etc.




    Thank you for the info and the time it took to post it.
  • dparkdpark Members Posts: 2,543 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    chris975d wrote:
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.




    Great post. Thanks for sharing.



    Question for you if you can answer it, based on your paraphrased reply above.



    Can you name some companies that have product readily available in the US that have raingear that performs better than gore-Tex?



    I make an annual trip to Bandon and fully expect to get dumped on at least one day when I am there and if there is something better than goretex, I want to try it!

    Old stuff:
    1962 Tommy Armour AT2W Driver   1953 Macgregor M65W EOM 3 wood   1978 H&B PowerBilt Citation 4 wood
    1984 Ben Hogan Apex PC 2-E   1968 Wilson Dual Wedge
    1964 Acushnet O-SET M6S Bullseye Putter
    New stuff
    Cobra ZL 10.5 driver   Adams 5050 16 fairway wood   Adams A2P 20* hybrid
    Titleist 716 MB irons 4-PW    Callaway Mack Daddy wedges 52, 56, 60
    Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum Napa
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX
    edited Jan 8, 2018 #52
    dpark wrote:

    chris975d wrote:
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.




    Great post. Thanks for sharing.



    Question for you if you can answer it, based on your paraphrased reply above.



    Can you name some companies that have product readily available in the US that have raingear that performs better than gore-Tex?



    I make an annual trip to Bandon and fully expect to get dumped on at least one day when I am there and if there is something better than goretex, I want to try it!




    The "readily available in the US" may be the trickiest part of that. And again, when I say "better than GoreTex", I'm not talking in terms of waterproofing. Again, my experience is that if the membrane is rated to that of GoreTex (at least 20,000mm), with seam sealing and good waterproof zipper/or storm flap, you'll stay just as dry as with GoreTex. The qualities I'm referring to are more along the lines of stretch, softer feeling fabrics, breathability, etc. If you're primary factor is staying dry, if you already have GoreTex, you won't stay "more dry" with anything else.



    But, ProQuip, the PX5 jacket and pants specifically, to me feel and move much better than GoreTex material. And ProQuip thinks so highly of it that they back it with a lifetime guarantee. And I'm pretty sure that membrane holds the highest rating possible for waterproof membranes (I could be wrong here, working off 1-2 year old info from memory). **One thing to note with ProQuip, it's much cheaper to order from a Euro dealer than it is to buy Stateside.



    Under Armour's membrane used on their non-GoreTex Storm 3 line (they have GoreTex Paclite and non-GoreTex pants and jackets that look very similiar) is much lighter and more stretchy than the comparable GoreTex product, Paclite. It's a very thin, waterproof only shell, meaning it can be worn year round, like GoreTex Paclite...it has no liner to keep you warm. Just make sure you get the 20,000mm rated one, as they have some older ones still in circulation that were rated less than this.



    Mizuno's highest rated waterproof gear (20,000mm+) is very good, and I've used it a lot. I believe it's similar, if not the same, as the highly rated Derzimax fabric.



    PING is making some amazing stuff now that they have moved everything in house (previously they partnered with Columbia to make PING branded apparel). The Zero Gravity full zip jacket and pants made with Pertex Shield is a favorite of mine. Pertex gets used a lot in outdoor (climbing, hiking, etc) gear. So light, thin and stretchy. It's here: http://www.ping-shop...jacket-black-s.

    Just be careful with sizing, as their outerwear is still based off Euro styling, and is a full size smaller than US sizing.



    I own all of the above I've mentioned, and will soon try Kjus with all the glowing reports I hear from people (who I trust) who've used it. It's just hard to get over here it seems.



    There's a lot of good stuff out there. I even pull some items over from the outdoor/ski/climbing world into golf, as there are a ton of super rain garments over in that hobby. Kuhl, Outdoor Research, Arc'teryx, Columbia OutDry tech (really neat tech here, the exterior of the jacket IS the membrane...no bonded face fabric that needs DWR to repel water), etc. Lots of thin, packable, super waterproof garments from that world.



    Again, I also use GoreTex. Most that know me on GolfWRX know I'm a total Galvin Green 'ho, and they are exclusively GoreTex. I like them more for the styling and fit, as opposed to the membrane they are using. I also know from experience that if they used other membranes, they could get things that stretch and move more, too. GoreTex stretch just doesn't stretch as much as other stretchable membranes. And my emergency rain jacket and pants (a set in each vehicle, at the front door at home, and office at the course, and my gear bag) is a black Under Armour GoreTex Paclite jacket/pant set. So I do use GoreTex, I just know they aren't the only game in town. But they are a sure bet to staying dry, if you don't know anything else.
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • cristphotocristphoto Members Posts: 3,394 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    I might be wrong here but to my knowledge Goretex made rain gear is the only gear that carries a lifetime warranty to keep you dry. I know when I worked in a pro shop after I retired I purchased a few Dryjoy rain jackets (Dryjoys best models at the time). After a couple years of use they have turned in windbreakers. I'm an avid golfer and remember once when it started to rain I was with my buddies and all four of us had rain gear. Only one guy had Goretex. The three without the Goretex all voted to come in after nine holes because we were wet. Our fourth came in too. When we took our jackets off only one player had a dry shirt. That day I learned a good lesson. In 2018 there are a couple alternatives to Goretex. I think the patent has now opened to allow others to use the process under other names (but again I may be wrong here). I know I have a Sunice rain jacket made from eVent which is basically Goretex in concept. I use it on hot summer days as it does keep me cooler that the Goretex gear and seems to provide the same protection. However it only carries a three year warranty which makes me wonder. I have a 25 year old McGregor Goretex jacket that I bring when our league plays on rainy days that I loan to people without proper gear. They stay dry too.
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX
    cristphoto wrote:
    I might be wrong here but to my knowledge Goretex made rain gear is the only gear that carries a lifetime warranty to keep you dry. I know when I worked in a pro shop after I retired I purchased a few Dryjoy rain jackets (Dryjoys best models at the time). After a couple years of use they have turned in windbreakers. I'm an avid golfer and remember once when it started to rain I was with my buddies and all four of us had rain gear. Only one guy had Goretex. The three without the Goretex all voted to come in after nine holes because we were wet. Our fourth came in too. When we took our jackets off only one player had a dry shirt. That day I learned a good lesson. In 2018 there are a couple alternatives to Goretex. I think the patent has now opened to allow others to use the process under other names (but again I may be wrong here). I know I have a Sunice rain jacket made from eVent which is basically Goretex in concept. I use it on hot summer days as it does keep me cooler that the Goretex gear and seems to provide the same protection. However it only carries a three year warranty which makes me wonder. I have a 25 year old McGregor Goretex jacket that I bring when our league plays on rainy days that I loan to people without proper gear. They stay dry too.




    ProQuip guarantees their PX5 gear to be waterproof for life as well.



    https://proquipgolfusa.com/products/px5-stormforce-jacket



    Lots of earlier FootJoy raingear was DWR only, meaning that there was no waterproof membrane in the garment. It was an applied coating to the exterior of the jacket/pants. If it wears off, then water can get through those older garments. I can tell you that the newer, membrane containing stuff (Hydrolite, the newest Tour LTS, and DryJoys Select-the most expensive FJ product) are all very good.



    I can also tell you one thing I've learned from being in some of those outdoor rain gear groups I follow...often times people confuse water entry with failure of the DWR coating on the outside of the garment...even GoreTex garments have this. It's what allows the garment to breath. Water has to bead up and stay off the outer fabric for water vapor inside the jacket (generated by the heat of our bodies) to move through the jacket and cool us off. If the DWR coating wears off (and it does with normal use), the the face fabric (outer cloth portion) gets soaked (this is referred to as "wetting out"), and that clogs the pores in the jacket that allow heat/water vapor off our bodies to get out. Then that water vapor collects/condenses as water inside the jacket and soaks you. This will even happen to GoreTex if the DWR on the outside gets worn off/fails. I've had it happen with older rain gear. The membrane was fine, and as soon as I restored the DWR coating and got water beading on the surface again, the inside started being dry again.
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • dparkdpark Members Posts: 2,543 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    chris975d wrote:

    dpark wrote:

    chris975d wrote:
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.




    Great post. Thanks for sharing.



    Question for you if you can answer it, based on your paraphrased reply above.



    Can you name some companies that have product readily available in the US that have raingear that performs better than gore-Tex?



    I make an annual trip to Bandon and fully expect to get dumped on at least one day when I am there and if there is something better than goretex, I want to try it!




    But, ProQuip, the PX5 jacket and pants specifically, to me feel and move much better than GoreTex material. And ProQuip thinks so highly of it that they back it with a lifetime guarantee. And I'm pretty sure that membrane holds the highest rating possible for waterproof membranes (I could be wrong here, working off 1-2 year old info from memory). **One thing to note with ProQuip, it's much cheaper to order from a Euro dealer than it is to buy Stateside.



    Mizuno's highest rated waterproof gear (20,000mm+) is very good, and I've used it a lot. I believe it's similar, if not the same, as the highly rated Derzimax fabric.



    PING is making some amazing stuff now that they have moved everything in house (previously they partnered with Columbia to make PING branded apparel). The Zero Gravity full zip jacket and pants made with Pertex Shield is a favorite of mine. Pertex gets used a lot in outdoor (climbing, hiking, etc) gear. So light, thin and stretchy. It's here: http://www.ping-shop...jacket-black-s.



    There's a lot of good stuff out there. I even pull some items over from the outdoor/ski/climbing world into golf, as there are a ton of super rain garments over in that hobby. Kuhl, Outdoor Research, Arc'teryx, Columbia OutDry tech (really neat tech here, the exterior of the jacket IS the membrane...no bonded face fabric that needs DWR to repel water), etc. Lots of thin, packable, super waterproof garments from that world.




    Thanks for the reply! I had not heard of ProQuip, need to check them out. Sizing will certainly be a problem if they aren't readily available stateside.



    My club in Portland is one of the few CCs in the US that carry Galvin Green. I love the styling but I am a "tweener" when it comes to their sizing. Large is too tight, XL is too big. So I have been sticking with the "non-trim" cut Sunice GoreTex in size large. Fits great and is bombproof. My Sunice shell is now 10 years old and still going strong. Wash it every year with Nik-**** (can't remember the full name) and coat it with another Nik product (again can't remember the name) and it is as good as new.



    I also have a Columbia OutDry hoodie jacket and while it is very waterproof, it is very "clammy" inside. It does not breath well IMHO. Basically a lightweight rubber jacket to me. I keep it for a rain jacket (awesome) when going out in the rain, but would not use it for any other physical activity.
    Old stuff:
    1962 Tommy Armour AT2W Driver   1953 Macgregor M65W EOM 3 wood   1978 H&B PowerBilt Citation 4 wood
    1984 Ben Hogan Apex PC 2-E   1968 Wilson Dual Wedge
    1964 Acushnet O-SET M6S Bullseye Putter
    New stuff
    Cobra ZL 10.5 driver   Adams 5050 16 fairway wood   Adams A2P 20* hybrid
    Titleist 716 MB irons 4-PW    Callaway Mack Daddy wedges 52, 56, 60
    Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum Napa
  • aiyyeraiyyer Members Posts: 1,577 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    chris975d wrote:
    dpark wrote:

    chris975d wrote:
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    That being said, if you do know about this stuff, there are several manufacturers out there using membranes that exceed the specs of GoreTex, with better breathability, stretch, heat retention (if you want it for cold weather use), body temperature regulation, etc. Things like the Japanese Derzimax material, eVent, Pertex, and others all give comparable "waterproofing" to the GoreTex material.. once you hit 20,000mm or greater of waterproof rating, you're not going to get wet in any conditions golfers would be in, at least not from the membrane itself.



    However, if you know what you're looking at and/or for, you CAN buy products that perform equal to or even better than GoreTex garments.




    Great post. Thanks for sharing.



    Question for you if you can answer it, based on your paraphrased reply above.



    Can you name some companies that have product readily available in the US that have raingear that performs better than gore-Tex?



    I make an annual trip to Bandon and fully expect to get dumped on at least one day when I am there and if there is something better than goretex, I want to try it!




    The "readily available in the US" may be the trickiest part of that. And again, when I say "better than GoreTex", I'm not talking in terms of waterproofing. Again, my experience is that if the membrane is rated to that of GoreTex (at least 20,000mm), with seam sealing and good waterproof zipper/or storm flap, you'll stay just as dry as with GoreTex. The qualities I'm referring to are more along the lines of stretch, softer feeling fabrics, breathability, etc. If you're primary factor is staying dry, if you already have GoreTex, you won't stay "more dry" with anything else.



    But, ProQuip, the PX5 jacket and pants specifically, to me feel and move much better than GoreTex material. And ProQuip thinks so highly of it that they back it with a lifetime guarantee. And I'm pretty sure that membrane holds the highest rating possible for waterproof membranes (I could be wrong here, working off 1-2 year old info from memory). **One thing to note with ProQuip, it's much cheaper to order from a Euro dealer than it is to buy Stateside.



    Under Armour's membrane used on their non-GoreTex Storm 3 line (they have GoreTex Paclite and non-GoreTex pants and jackets that look very similiar) is much lighter and more stretchy than the comparable GoreTex product, Paclite. It's a very thin, waterproof only shell, meaning it can be worn year round, like GoreTex Paclite...it has no liner to keep you warm. Just make sure you get the 20,000mm rated one, as they have some older ones still in circulation that were rated less than this.



    Mizuno's highest rated waterproof gear (20,000mm+) is very good, and I've used it a lot. I believe it's similar, if not the same, as the highly rated Derzimax fabric.



    PING is making some amazing stuff now that they have moved everything in house (previously they partnered with Columbia to make PING branded apparel). The Zero Gravity full zip jacket and pants made with Pertex Shield is a favorite of mine. Pertex gets used a lot in outdoor (climbing, hiking, etc) gear. So light, thin and stretchy. It's here: [url="http://www.ping-shop.com/product/zero-gravity-mens-tour-jacket-black-s"]http://www.ping-shop...jacket-black-s.[/url]

    Just be careful with sizing, as their outerwear is still based off Euro styling, and is a full size smaller than US sizing.



    I own all of the above I've mentioned, and will soon try Kjus with all the glowing reports I hear from people (who I trust) who've used it. It's just hard to get over here it seems.



    There's a lot of good stuff out there. I even pull some items over from the outdoor/ski/climbing world into golf, as there are a ton of super rain garments over in that hobby. Kuhl, Outdoor Research, Arc'teryx, Columbia OutDry tech (really neat tech here, the exterior of the jacket IS the membrane...no bonded face fabric that needs DWR to repel water), etc. Lots of thin, packable, super waterproof garments from that world.



    Again, I also use GoreTex. Most that know me on GolfWRX know I'm a total Galvin Green 'ho, and they are exclusively GoreTex. I like them more for the styling and fit, as opposed to the membrane they are using. I also know from experience that if they used other membranes, they could get things that stretch and move more, too. GoreTex stretch just doesn't stretch as much as other stretchable membranes. And my emergency rain jacket and pants (a set in each vehicle, at the front door at home, and office at the course, and my gear bag) is a black Under Armour GoreTex Paclite jacket/pant set. So I do use GoreTex, I just know they aren't the only game in town. But they are a sure bet to staying dry, if you don't know anything else.


    Chris,

    Seriously great posts in succession and thanks.

    You cut through a lot of cliches in those two posts!
  • simonndsimonnd Members Posts: 36 ✭✭
    Another Galvin Green fan here. It's very comfy.
  • 4puttJohnny4puttJohnny Members Posts: 472 ✭✭✭✭
    portland wrote:


    portland wrote:


    Can anyone comment on the fit of the proquip px5? Order same size as FJ (small for me) or Nike (medium for me) ?








    I'm 5-7, 155, and wear Medium in Under Armour, C&B, Nike, Peter Millar, Fairway & Greene, etc. The only brand I have to go down to Small is Footjoy. With Galvin Green, I have to go up to Large in some of their stuff, just because I don't like the fully form fitting Euro fit in some garments that is typical of their style (not a knock against the company, just my personal preference).



    With the PX5, the Medium jacket was the best fit, although I do use the pull cords to make it tighter on me. The sleeves were just too short on the Small and it felt to "binding". I have a 40 chest, which is what they recommend for the medium. The fabric is exceptional for stretching and, like I said, the pull cords will let you make it tighter all the way around, not just at the bottom of the jacket like some versions. I also knew that I would mainly be wearing mine during the winter, so I would also have on an added layer of a sweater underneath, so I didn't want to go Small. If you just want to use your's during the summer when you'll only have a small polo underneath, that might affect your decision.



    As far as the pants, I was greedy and purchased both a Small and Medium. The Medium has been perfect during winter golf so far. I wear UA base layer, then UA Coldgear pants, then the rain paints and I've been toasty down to one tournament that I played when it was 32 degrees, cloudy with 25 mph winds out of the north. The Small are perfect if I solely want to wear the base layer and then the rain paints on top. I actually purchased the Small in thoughts of the summer when I would typically just have a relatively thin pair of shorts on and it starts raining.



    I would describe the overall fit of the PX5 as similar to an Under Armour fit. In my mind, Footjoy stuff is usually a little baggy. Galvin Green is pretty form fitting. And then Under Armour is kind of "middle of the road" -- not baggy, but not form fitting. That's just my experience. Others may disagree. There's a guy named chris975d (?) from Atlanta who posts on here frequently and he's a tremendous resource on all different OEM sizes, styles, etc....... You may want to PM him.






    Exactly the reply I was looking for. I am the same h/w so Medium it is - jacket and pants.



    Thank you! I have a Bandon trip coming up in April and want to prepare ahead of time.




    When you get the jacket....if it feels a little larger than you were expecting at first.......remember to use the velcro straps, just above both pockets to pull the sides in. Then use the pull cords on both ends of the jacket bottom to tighten further and you can make it fit as tight or as loose as you like.
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX
    dpark wrote:






    Thanks for the reply! I had not heard of ProQuip, need to check them out. Sizing will certainly be a problem if they aren't readily available stateside.



    My club in Portland is one of the few CCs in the US that carry Galvin Green. I love the styling but I am a "tweener" when it comes to their sizing. Large is too tight, XL is too big. So I have been sticking with the "non-trim" cut Sunice GoreTex in size large. Fits great and is bombproof. My Sunice shell is now 10 years old and still going strong. Wash it every year with Nik-**** (can't remember the full name) and coat it with another Nik product (again can't remember the name) and it is as good as new.



    I also have a Columbia OutDry hoodie jacket and while it is very waterproof, it is very "clammy" inside. It does not breath well IMHO. Basically a lightweight rubber jacket to me. I keep it for a rain jacket (awesome) when going out in the rain, but would not use it for any other physical activity.




    Ah...yeah, I could see that with some of the OutDry pieces. The one I have is the reversible one, that has one side as the OutDry membrane, the other as a fabric bonded to the membrane. So you have the option of wearing it with the rubbery OutDry surface on the inside (which makes it look like a traditional jacket), or on the outside. I wear it in the latter fashion, with the fabric side inward, against my skin, to prevent that clammy feeling. Basically like wearing GoreTex Paclite or any other 2-layer waterproof jacket inside-out (it's just that the OutDry is designed to be worn as such).
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • chris975dchris975d GeorgiaClubWRX Posts: 1,933 ClubWRX
    Wanted to update this thread (for those that are nerdy about this stuff like I am) with a link to an article I've been searching for for quite some time. Gives kind of a peak into the inside of the waterproof garment industry. Very interesting reading.



    https://www.outsideonline.com/1898541/insane-membrane
    TaylorMade 9* M5 w/GD AD-IZ 6
    TaylorMade M5 3-wood
    TaylorMade M5 5-wood
    Srixon H85 4
    Srixon 5-PW, AW Z585 w/Project X LZ 6.0
    Cleveland RTX4 54*, 58*
    TaylorMade Spider X Copper
  • Sean2Sean2 #TheWRX (Callaway Trip) Members Posts: 30,826 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    dpark wrote:

    cristphoto wrote:


    You're right that the Dryjoy Tour XP rain gear doesn't work that well. I remember last year I went to play golf in a league with my buddies. I set my Titleist bag loaded with all Titleist clubs down and went in the pro shop wearing my Icon Blacks. It started to drizzle so I went out to my bag and got my ZR jacket and ZR rain hat. Just so happened the Titleist rep was in the shop. He asked me why I didn't have the Dryjoy rain gear to go with everything else. I told him point blank I only wear gear that works and that means Goretex. Since there were a few others in the shop he defended his product saying it was just as good as Goretex. I've played golf for over 50 years and in that time I've learned what works and what doesn't. Finally he took my name and address and sent me a Dryjoy Tour XP suit for free. It was a nice gesture but compared to my Zero Restriction gear it's thicker, heavier, noisier, less flexible, less adjustable, and is less rainproof. No contest.




    It amazes me how many top-tier golf companies are still selling rain gear that does not use Gore-Tex and charging big bucks because of their name.



    There is just no comparison between rain gear this uses Gore-Tex and those that use something else. Gore-Tex beats every other product (DryJoys, Storm-Fit etc.) hands down. They can use whatever "statistics" or "test results" they want to claim how their products are "just as good" as Gore-Tex, but the reality is, they are not. Not in the real world anyways.



    If you are just playing in a light drizzle, pretty much anything will work, but if you are going to go Scotland or Bandon Dunes or any bucket list destination where real rain is a strong possibility, to go there with anything other than Gore-Tex rain gear is asking for a miserable round of golf if the weather goes south.




    I am quite puzzled by that as well. The 2-year water proofing guarantee is a bit of a joke. Probably at the end of the 2 year period the DWR "wears out". Sure you can spray some back onto the garment, but the garment was never water proof to begin with. And, the price they charge for these "water proof" garments is kinda silly.
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway Rogue[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway GBB Epic 16º/20º/24º[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway Steelhead XR 25º[/font]
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    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway MD3/MD-PM 54º/58º[/font]
    [font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Callaway "O" Works #7[/font]

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