higher loft driver

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  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    So I'm sitting here making chess moves online, worrying about my swing and can I duplicate yesterday's results...
  • pinestreetgolfpinestreetgolf Members Posts: 3,416 ✭✭
    edited Jan 11, 2019 9:34am #93


    I wonder if im still hinging when im pausing. I think I am. It feels like im pausing, but im keeping everything relatively still while I get the additional hinging accomplished. Fascinating, as spock would say.

    SO, the additional hinging helps with the additional ydg I was getting...and by "pausing" the rest of the body (as much as possible) im able to sync things up properly...it def felt like my left hip started the swing, with everything else following and flowing freely, which must be adding swing speed to the mix...plus I still look about a half inch in front of the ball to prevent chunking.

    No wonder I was hitting so well, lol. When I watch tonite I'll be checking the hinging. Plus I wanna see what shirt hidecki is wearing.

    For me, hitting at 4 oclock is a swing cue. Pausing at the top (while wrists still hinge, of course) is another I'll incorporate. Thanks for pointing that out. Not that I can actually freeze for a split second. I'd probably fall over. But it FEELS like a pause, and that made the def yesterday.

    Can't wait to get on the course today!




    A good thought to duplicate Hideki's move is to think the club head gets closer to your head to start the downswing via the wrists. this also prevents hitting it fat, as the angle down in steeper.



    https://www.youtube....h?v=ZJtmocfjeT4



    pause at five seconds. note his huge body turn but his relatively little hinging of the wrists. His wrists are going to hinge as he begins his downswing NOT on his backswing. You really see it at twenty-two seconds. His body is opening and downswing is starting like crazy, but the wrists hinge the head of the club the other way - toward his head. This is lag - the wrists are lagging the body. He's not pausing or trying to hold an angle. He's literally just changing the direction of the clubhead a split second *after* he changes the direction of the body.



    This is what you think of as a "pause at the top" because that's how it feels - that the body is going first while the club pauses. But that isn't whats happening. Whats happening is the club head is lagging - its still going one direction for a split second as teh body is down swing-ing. If the club is literally dead still you'll hit it two inches fat. It has to go the opposite way of the body for a split second to start the downswing and - this is a huge key - the clubhead gets closer to your head via the *wrists* NOT the elbows going closer to teh body so - for a split second - the clubhead is still traveling "back" (hinging) but teh body is going forward.



    also note Brooks' is not hinging quickly. he needs room to go. when his body starts forward, his wrists are at 90* and get to like 120*. if he was already maxed out in wrist hinge when his body started down he couldn't hit it anywhere.



    YMMV, IMO, etc etc its the secret to crushing a golf ball.
    Nike SQ Lucky 13* w/ Aldila Tour Green 75 X-Flex, 43.5"
    Ping G30 Hybrids 2 17*,  3 19*, 4 22* TFC 419 Stiff
    Pinhawk SL 5-SW +3 Up Apollo Stiff 115
    PM Grind 64*
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    kinda struggled this morning due to the cold and a breeze. plus i was experimenting with the 13. a birdie and bogie on the front, tho, but goofed up the back at 5-over for 77. really took note of the diff between the 13 and 16. my dispersion with the 13 was ok, but i felt uncomfortable not knowing where it was gonna go. gonna be sticking with the 16, since it goes pretty close to the 13 if i tee it down a bit. plus i feel like i know where the ball's gonna go, for sure. did notice at the pause that my wrists were still hinging a bit, but beyond that i'm not sure what i was doing, lol. brought the club back at a decent rate of speed (not too fast), paused at the top, gathered myself in that split second, then made an athletic move to the ball, which had xlnt results. for some reason on the back i decided to swing too hard and hit some low liners that cost me a coupla strokes, and i had a delicate chip that didnt even get on the green, after chipping everything to a foot on the front. it was all one-putts on the front except one hole. kinda got screwed on a 2nd shot on a par 5 when the ball bounced left, in front of a tree, but on top of a collection of nuts. the lw went underneath the ball as the nuts gave way and the ball traveled half the distance i needed.

    so, the higher-lofted driver won out against the high lofted driver today. just gotta remember to swing at 70%.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    i cant swing real hard anymore. around 80mph. been working on hitting the sweet spot on the drivers. been playing with the 16, trying to groove a swing. then several rounds with the 12, including one of my best driving rounds in years. (choked all the way down to the end of the grip. really helped with that sweet spot thing)

    today i put the 9 rapture in the bag! choked all the way down on an already shortened shaft. it worked! using same stance, focus, swing speed as in the higher lofts. did hook one, but safe. did block one, but safe. hope i can keep it up. did use the 16 on 3 holes. even choked all the way down on the 16!

    try choking all the way down and see if it helps you! image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    Pulled the 9. Too tempting to swing too hard and bomb (lol) it 235yds. Shoulder is killing me this morning.
  • LONGBALL777LONGBALL777 Members Posts: 112 ✭✭
    I have a similar swing speed. The Sasquatch sweet 16 is absolute money, but I also just picked up a Callaway Big Berths Fusion at 10.5*, BUT the Heavy Version (12 gram weight and shorter shaft).I got it after reading a thread on it here. It is an absolute killer. I carry both and use the Nike like a 4 wood off the tee, the Rally as my driver. Try it, if you can.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    I have a ping k15 in 10.5. I'm too wild with it. But I should give it another try the way I'm swinging. It's actually the swing I had back in the day, but much shorter. Closed stance. Trying to hit ball at 5 oclock for inside out swing. Face is square to slightly open. You should see it! What a mess! Lol



    My other clubs are more square stance. Putter is open and wide stance.



    Choking that 9° led me to a 75 thursday, but the shoulder was throbbing from swinging so relatively hard,forcing me to rest til I hit the range today.



    First swing with the 16° was a nice, high, soaring, slight draw. I think with my closed stance it might be slightly delofting my drivers. Whatever, I hit the 16° so well the guy next to me asked to hit it. Same result for him. I told him it's a magic wand.



    If I was smart, I would use the 16 exclusively. It pretty goes as far as the 12, especially teed down a bit. But if the 9 behaves...hmm...very surprising...



    We'll see. Hitting Bluebonnet hills tomorrow. If I was smart...



  • LONGBALL777LONGBALL777 Members Posts: 112 ✭✭
    The Sweet 16 is a great club. But, remember, it's not just the loft that makes it great. It's also the shorter shats. BB Fusion has the same length shaft. You can get them on Cally Preowner for about $125 on sale until Tuesday. Get the 10.5 Heavy, and never look back.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    The shorter shaft on the 16 (and lucky 13) led me to choke to the bottom of the grip with the 12 rapture for accuracy, but the 16 is close enough to the 12, and far more accurate. Was playing with a buddy and called the shot 4 times. Slightly left on one, due to houses on right. Called a fade on #18 and it went straight, lol...
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    It's all about confidence...do I know, within reason, where the ball is gonna go? Can I risk the 9° on this fairway with houses right and water left? Or do I take the 16° and put it right down the middle, but a bit shorter?

    That's what's great about my monday thru Wednesday practice rounds. I can drop as many balls as I want to try to figure things out. To sharpen skills. To be consistent. So I know what to do next time.

    I'm feeling so confident I decided to put the 7i in the bag, lol.



    I have never liked the way callaway drivers set up, but I'll check it out!
  • pinestreetgolfpinestreetgolf Members Posts: 3,416 ✭✭
    edited Jan 28, 2019 9:10am #102


    It's all about confidence...




    You have a typo in your post. You wrote "confidence" but what you meant was "the ability to replicate mechanics at speed".
    Nike SQ Lucky 13* w/ Aldila Tour Green 75 X-Flex, 43.5"
    Ping G30 Hybrids 2 17*,  3 19*, 4 22* TFC 419 Stiff
    Pinhawk SL 5-SW +3 Up Apollo Stiff 115
    PM Grind 64*
  • vanillafunk616vanillafunk616 Members Posts: 552 ✭✭
    I think there's a mental block because people associate low loft with skill and swing speed. Really it's just optimizing launch conditions. I've seen Stewart Cink with a 12 degree m2. DJ played his m1 at 11 and change. I don't think anyone questioned his manhood.
  • b.mattayb.mattay New WRX'er Members Posts: 486 ✭✭
    I find that I hit a driver farthest at about 10.5 degrees of loft. I swing about 120mph and have an angle of attack that is 0 to +1. I think lots of people could benefit from a higher lofted driver. However, I tend to play my driver at about 8 degrees, which loses me approximately 15 yards. I like the lower ball flight for playing in 35mph+ winds.
    2017 Taylormade M1 (9.5, Wishon Black 85X)

    2017 Taylormade M1 (17, Wishon Black 85X)

    14th Club???

    714 AP2 (4-9, X100)

    SM6 (46.08F, 50.12F, 55.15F, 60.12V, S400)

    Some ugly, beat up putter
  • uggenjigmey407uggenjigmey407 Members Posts: 83 ✭✭


    Been using a ping k15 10.5 in an attempt to gain more ydg...something just wasnt happening at the rate I thought it could...put the rapture 12* in play yesterday and today...picked up 30 to 40yds (gps)...nice high draw...amazing! Let two guys use it yesterday and they crushed it (one guy had a g20 9*) for some reason I have always driven best with a 12... also, today, #9, 96 out...ball went in the hole! Thrilling! Anyway, it's nice to pick up the ydg off the tee after experimenting...put me in much better position on most holes...give it a try!




    Very interesting. I am looking for new driver. I always went lower lofted driver. I will try higher loft this time.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    7i gotta go, lol.did a lot of experimenting today.

    consistent: 16* driver. 22* 7wd. 24* m2. 31*hy.

    inconsistent: 9* driver. 19* 5wd. 7i.



    i had no range warmup, which is not unusual, but did chip and putt. then, on first tee, for some idiotic reason, took the 9* and tried to blast it. (oh, i've finally got it together now, so i can blast away,lol) unfortunately, it sets the table for failure as the round progresses. i start blasting at everything, and make a mess...

    normally, i start out swinging easy, focusing on getting the ball in the fairway, and making solid contact, which usually leads to success. then, as the round progresses, i gradually build some speed/power/confidence/self belief into the swing as i get adapted to whatever ungodly swing i have that day. but not today. came out blazing and screwed a lot of shots up. it was pathetic.



    so, tomorrow i'm gonna start nice and easy, and build on the swing i have tomorrow, and not swing out my butt. at least til the back 9.



    i did hit some incredible shots. 4 times i was about 30yds out and hit a sw to a coupla feet. i birdied a par 3 with a 4ft putt. hit some great shots with the 22*. but by swinging too hard from the first, it really took me out of any tempo, which i didnt put together til the last few holes.



    always learning something...
  • GolfiNutGolfiNut GolfiNut Members Posts: 244
    Z1ggy16 wrote:


    Golf is not a one size fits all and blanket advice like this isn't really good to give to uneducated golfers, or at least people who havent spent a decent amount of time on trackman being fit.



    I would suspect OP and his pals have fairly neutral to maybe even negative AoAs, possibly lower-ish swing speeds, such that 12* drivers are actually increasing their distance. If I ramped up to 12* my drives would probably be 150+ft in the air and I'd likely lose 40-50 yards total distance because I have a very high launch angle and AoA. I need very low static loft and lower-ish spin. Lucky for me I actually know this about my swing.
    Same here...I play Rogue Draw @ 8 degrees and still launch it higher than I would like. You have to find the setup that matches your swing and higher lofts will do more harm than good for some. The good news is you will know it immediately if it is not for you because the ball will go up...but not away
  • Agreed on the AoA. I tend to hit neutral to down on bad swings, and find that a driver lofted up to 11.5 or 12.5 works the best for me.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    If you're a +2, this thread ain't for you, lol...



    We caught a single yesterday as we did a little hopscotching around some unbelievably slllllllloooooooowwwww groups. Had a 10.5 he crushed once, but mostly sprayed, getting in LOTS of trouble. After I hit the 16° in the fairway with some distance, and he hit his way left, I handed him the 16°...he hit it right next to my ball, lol....

    Can I hit the 9° farther than the 16°? Yeah, when everything goes just right. But when it doesn't, I'm in a lot more trouble. Like, extra strokes kinda trouble. And with so many variables, like weather, or whether I'm swinging too hard, or what's going on in the emptiness between the ears, I need a club/loft/whatever that will keep me in the round. I hate adding up both sides and the first number is an 8. The game is way more fun when I play as well as possible (duh).

    If going higher loft helps somebody here, it's mission accomplished. Lord knows I've benefited a ton from spending time on this site.
  • Millhill88Millhill88 Members Posts: 479 ✭✭
    As many have stated on this site, Everyone's swing is different. Personally I can't hit high launch shafts worth a darn. I prefer the "Rebar" feel of a low torque - low launching shaft. But, I crank my 9.5 head up to 11 degrees to achieve the higher launch with lower spin. My AOA is steeper than some, so this works best for me.



    While it has been proven that a higher launch with lower spin results in longer drives, the AOA is a contributing factor.
    Driver: Srixon Z585
    4 Wood: Titleist TS2
    Hybrid: Titleist 816 H1
    Irons: Srixon Z585, 5-AW
    Wedges: Cleveland RTX4 @ 50, 54 & 60
    Putter: Cleveland Huntington Beach 11
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    i swing a low torque/launching shaft and it just doesnt feel like it's loading to me. but you should see my swing! not pretty.
  • pinestreetgolfpinestreetgolf Members Posts: 3,416 ✭✭
    edited Jan 29, 2019 2:59pm #112


    If you're a +2, this thread ain't for you, lol...



    We caught a single yesterday as we did a little hopscotching around some unbelievably slllllllloooooooowwwww groups. Had a 10.5 he crushed once, but mostly sprayed, getting in LOTS of trouble. After I hit the 16° in the fairway with some distance, and he hit his way left, I handed him the 16°...he hit it right next to my ball, lol....

    Can I hit the 9° farther than the 16°? Yeah, when everything goes just right. But when it doesn't, I'm in a lot more trouble. Like, extra strokes kinda trouble. And with so many variables, like weather, or whether I'm swinging too hard, or what's going on in the emptiness between the ears, I need a club/loft/whatever that will keep me in the round. I hate adding up both sides and the first number is an 8. The game is way more fun when I play as well as possible (duh).

    If going higher loft helps somebody here, it's mission accomplished. Lord knows I've benefited a ton from spending time on this site.




    I don't understand the way you think. Of course 16* is going to be better than 9* in terms of hitting it in "the fairway". It has seven degrees more loft and way more backspin. You bemoan all the trouble you get into with the 9* but you're not measuring how many more birdie opportunities you have when you hit it 25 yards farther.



    If you only think about the downside of course 16 will outperform 9. If your goal is the lowest score on average (accepting looking silly sometimes) you have to factor in the times the 9 gives you a better birdie look. You're not doing or measuring that. You're just counting the misses and saying "yep, more misses with the 9, I'll play the 16". It doesn't work like that. If you don't count upside, you may as well hit PW off every tee. You'll hit every fairway.



    Its like the old basketball thing what's the best turnovers per game you can have? Most people who don't understand the game say zero, but that isn't right, because you could only have zero turnovers if you're not attacking or trying to score. Same with golf.



    This entire thread is just you telling everyone 16* drivers go straighter and shorter than 9* drivers. Yep, that's true. That says nothing about which you should play though.
    Nike SQ Lucky 13* w/ Aldila Tour Green 75 X-Flex, 43.5"
    Ping G30 Hybrids 2 17*,  3 19*, 4 22* TFC 419 Stiff
    Pinhawk SL 5-SW +3 Up Apollo Stiff 115
    PM Grind 64*
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    "always find and use what works for you! by all means, use a lower loft if that works, especially if you tried a higher loft. you just never know what'll work for YOU!

    good luck to all!" (earlier post in this thread)



    that's what this thread is all about. and i enjoy writing about my experiences with other, lower lofts, trying to improve. i reread the entire thread (started a year ago!) last night, and it looks like the vast majority are finding better play with higher lofts. that's what's working for them. it's working for me, obviously, or i wouldn't have started the thread. heck, i even noticed you're bagging the lucky 13! if it works for you, great! if an 8* works for you, great! whatever works for you! that's what the thread is about. but it also suggests a higher loft might be what works best.



    twice i've purchased drivers based on monitors, and twice returned them cuz once i get em on the course, under pressure, they don't perform as well as what i have in the bag, or closet, or garage, or wherever. my swing must change on the course.



    i definitely should just stick with the 16, but part of the fun is trying new/other/different ideas in the attempt to improve. of course i understand the risk/reward of a lower loft. and the more i actually experiment, the more i realize the higher loft prevents me from having a blowup hole. and i haven't noticed a difference in birdies, either. i'm trying to par every hole. usually a birdie or two will magically appear each round. and several bogies will appear due to a lack of magic. as long as i have a 7 as the first number in my score, i'm usually happy. especially with my swing.



    play well! do what works for you!
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    from an article on this site today:



    "Is there any advantage to being short, but accurate off the tee?


    When a long ball hitter misses the green in regulation, they are more likely to have a longer and more difficult scrambling opportunity. This is because of the times that the bomber misses the fairway by a wide margin and ends up in the trees and has to punch out or they end up in a penalty area.


    This is why I advise Tour players that analytics if golf is not a rigid ‘one size fits all’ system. Not only should a golfer accurately determine their strengths and weaknesses and figure out how to utilize them to play the best golf possible, but distance plays a major role in what areas of the game a player needs to focus on. Brian Gay should not try to play Bubba Watson’s game and Bubba Watson should not try to play Jordan Spieth’s game all because their differing lengths off the tee creates different advantages they must exploit and different weaknesses that they must account for.


    longer hitters have an advantage on the greens because they are more likely to have short length birdie putts on average than shorter hitters. But shorter hitters have an advantage when the green in regulation is missed.


    Thus, shorter hitters need to be more skilled putters to compete with the longer hitters. And longer hitters need to be more skilled with their abilities around the greens in order to convert those up-and-downs like the shorter, but more accurate golfer."


    the ss chart in the article indicates i should be a 16hcap. i guess all that practice chipping and putting is paying off. if only i knew that 20 years ago...
  • LONGBALL777LONGBALL777 Members Posts: 112 ✭✭
    Remember,there's a LOT of loft choices between 9* and 16*. Maybe you should try an 11 or 12* driver.



    Also, where is that swing speed/ handicap chart you mentioned. Can you post a link?
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    As expressed in this thread, I swing a 10.5 & 12 as well, with varying degrees of success.
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    great article. these numbers are for the vast majority of the golfing population.
  • BMCBMC Members Posts: 3,555 ✭✭
    So, based on that chart, LPGA players are 9 handicaps. Typical B.S. statistic mumbo jumbo.
    PING Rapture V1 Driver 9*
    Cobra Baffler Pro 18* & 23* hybrids
    Titleist 755 irons
    Vokey Wedges 46/54/58
    Odyssey #1WS
  • just plain billjust plain bill Unregistered Posts: 1,488
    edited Jan 30, 2019 5:44pm #120
    the article states that a very small population of golfers will not fit into these numbers. that would be pros, who have the 2nd and 3rd shots into the green and have the short game.



    i should be a 16.
  • lenman73lenman73 Members Posts: 808 ✭✭
    With the adjustable drivers I have, lofting up has been one disaster after another everytime its tried. The ball goes more up than out. I think I can hit a three wood off the tee better than a higher lofted driver because I can and do tee it lower. I play my drivers at 10.5 across the boards with all brands and still have no problem with elevation. Maybe it's a mental thing but I like 10.5, not 10 or 11.5. But everyone is different so my OCD about needing a 10.5 means nothing for others and that's cool. But on every hole possible, the club that will get me down it the farthest without a serious risk is coming out.
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