Top Courses that disappointed

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  • jaw1978jaw1978 Members Posts: 83
    He is arguing that the greens should go back to late 1930s maintanance standards in any "restoration" but won't answer any questions about it or engage in discussions about the rest of the course, should it be maintained to a similar late 30s standard? Can new tees be built in a restoration? Do bunkers need to be put back in the exact spot as original or do we account for longer driving distances now? I honestly don't think he believes what he is saying, I think he is just trolling us.




    Actually, I have issues with calling it a restoration. I have no problem with changing courses. I don't attach much value to restoring courses to their original form. I'm not an "older is better" guy. Improvements are good. Just don't call it a restoration.



    In the case of PH #2, I played it before the Crenshaw changes. It was beautiful. Now I think it's looks ugly. I prefer the version before Crenshaw changed it. But it has never been one of my favorite courses and I still think it is highly over rated.




    We are so far down the rabbit hole.



    Call it a restoration. Call it a renovation. ****, call it a desecration - let’s just move on.
  • bobloblaw1978bobloblaw1978 Members Posts: 10
    CDM wrote:


    Chambers Bay....




    Really? One of my favorite rounds of all time. Had great caddies, course was playing hard and fast like a true links course. Never had so much.


    Argonne69 wrote:


    I have to agree with Harding Park. For the locals paying resident rates it's not a bad course. However, playing $170 to walk as a non-resident was a big letdown. Other that the last 3 or 4 holes, very little was memorable. Yes, it was in good shape, as it should for $150+. However, it just didn't do it for me. I thought Presidio for nearly half the rate was more interesting.




    yeah, I was stoked for Harding but it's just ok. It's a course over-rated due to it's location and it's history. Imagine if it was private, it'd be a top 30 course for no real reason.


    carrera wrote:



    I will also say Pasatiempo was disappointing and very overrated. Very pretty though. I am sure I will be in the minority there!




    I would never imagined that Pasatiempo would get listed in a thread like this. Yes, I would agree with the third sentence above! No offense, of course.




    For the price, Pasatiempo is a major letdown. The range is awful, one of the worst. The first hole would be beautiful, but the range net on the left kind of ruins it. (Just get rid of the range, it's worthless anyway.) The bunkering and greens are really good from a design standpoint, but they don't have either the money or enough water to keep the course in great shape.
  • maga_golfermaga_golfer Members Posts: 366 ✭✭




    For the price, Pasatiempo is a major letdown. The range is awful, one of the worst. The first hole would be beautiful, but the range net on the left kind of ruins it. (Just get rid of the range, it's worthless anyway.) The bunkering and greens are really good from a design standpoint, but they don't have either the money or enough water to keep the course in great shape.




    Just curious, when was the last time you played Pasatiempo? Granted, the amount of love it gets here and elsewhere, I can see it being a letdown as often it gets pumped up. I also was able to play it walking for around $100 or so on a slow afternoon and pretty much no one was on the golf course. However, the conditioning was fantastic since they completed their 30-year deal on receiving recycled water which started last summer, I believe. I could see the conditioning being not great if you played before then, but since then, apparently the water has not been an issue with that deal they now have.
  • Jackhammer993Jackhammer993 Members Posts: 855 ✭✭
    Also surprised about Pasatiempo, one of my all time favorites. I also like Spyglass and Pebble for what it’s worth. Probably my biggest dissapointment was Old Head in Ireland. I understand it is not rated as a great course but the pictures made me think otherwise. When I played it twice in one day I could understand why it was not regarded highly but my pictures look great. That course just doesn’t come together for me.
  • lchanglchang Members Posts: 543 ✭✭



    Argonne69 wrote:


    I have to agree with Harding Park. For the locals paying resident rates it's not a bad course. However, playing $170 to walk as a non-resident was a big letdown. Other that the last 3 or 4 holes, very little was memorable. Yes, it was in good shape, as it should for $150+. However, it just didn't do it for me. I thought Presidio for nearly half the rate was more interesting.




    yeah, I was stoked for Harding but it's just ok. It's a course over-rated due to it's location and it's history. Imagine if it was private, it'd be a top 30 course for no real reason.






    I agree about Harding (though I'm local so less over-priced). But I'm not sure I'd agree it would be top 30 if it were private. Are the course-raters that bad, you think?
  • az2auaz2au Members Posts: 1,795 ✭✭
    lchang wrote:




    Argonne69 wrote:


    I have to agree with Harding Park. For the locals paying resident rates it's not a bad course. However, playing $170 to walk as a non-resident was a big letdown. Other that the last 3 or 4 holes, very little was memorable. Yes, it was in good shape, as it should for $150+. However, it just didn't do it for me. I thought Presidio for nearly half the rate was more interesting.




    yeah, I was stoked for Harding but it's just ok. It's a course over-rated due to it's location and it's history. Imagine if it was private, it'd be a top 30 course for no real reason.






    I agree about Harding (though I'm local so less over-priced). But I'm not sure I'd agree it would be top 30 if it were private. Are the course-raters that bad, you think?


    No. I’m a panelist for one of the magazines and I can assure that I couldn’t possibly care less about whether a course is private or not. The other ones I know feel the same. I’m sure there are some that take that into account but they’re not good if they let it influence the ranking. FWIW, I rarely use my card to get on private courses. I have plenty of access and instead try to target public courses that need rankings.
  • Travis DuckroTravis Duckro Members Posts: 291 ✭✭
    TPC Scottsdale, both courses. I love the WMO and attend every year, but playing that course is very underwhelming.
  • Bluefan75Bluefan75 Members Posts: 3,872 ✭✭


    TPC Scottsdale, both courses. I love the WMO and attend every year, but playing that course is very underwhelming.




    You list the Champions course as a top course? Considering the unposted walking rate is really good, and nobody seems to ever talk about it, I'd hardly say it even fits in with this thread.
  • Argonne69Argonne69 Members Posts: 20,361 ✭✭
    edited Aug 19, 2018 #280
    CDM wrote:


    Chambers Bay....




    Wow. I played it last Sunday and it moved to #2 on my favorites list. Great views. Tough driving holes. Tough bunkers. Tough greens. A serious test of golf, and a wonderful overall experience. At no point did I every feel bored.



    20180812_122522s.jpg



    20180812_155727s.jpg
  • jjthomp2jjthomp2 Members Posts: 148 ✭✭


    Kapalua...much prefer the Wailea courses over this one.



    Valhalla...if it didn't have the PGA's name on it now, it would be a high priced private course, nothing more. Way too pretentious these days, as well. There are half a dozen or more

    better courses in KY for a helluva lot less bank.







    And on a different note....here are some courses that should be ranked much higher in their respective state, imo....



    Long Bay in Myrtle Beach

    Kelly Plantation in Destin




    I'd love to know what 6 courses you're able to put ahead of Valhalla in KY... I can see 2 courses possibly being ahead of it but if you're strictly talking in the State of KY there is not 6 courses better than it
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  • CDMCDM Members Posts: 1,732 ✭✭
    edited Aug 21, 2018 #282
    Argonne69 wrote:

    CDM wrote:


    Chambers Bay....




    Wow. I played it last Sunday and it moved to #2 on my favorites list. Great views. Tough driving holes. Tough bunkers. Tough greens. A serious test of golf, and a wonderful overall experience. At no point did I every feel bored.



    20180812_122522s.jpg



    20180812_155727s.jpg




    I played it when it first opened with family. So some time ago but maybe it’s grown in, better somehow? I recall its good course but is it worth price they are now charging? Also is it really a US Open course??? To me no but that is the beauty of golf... what each person likes may not be the same as others.



    Edit: nice photos though
  • duffer987duffer987 Don't feed the Choo. Canadian in CaliforniaMembers Posts: 9,015 ✭✭
    CDM wrote:

    Argonne69 wrote:

    CDM wrote:


    Chambers Bay....




    Wow. I played it last Sunday and it moved to #2 on my favorites list. Great views. Tough driving holes. Tough bunkers. Tough greens. A serious test of golf, and a wonderful overall experience. At no point did I every feel bored.






    I played it when it first opened with family. So some time ago but maybe it's grown in, better somehow? I recall its good course but is it worth price they are now charging? Also is it really a US Open course??? To me no but that is the beauty of golf... what each person likes may not be the same as others.



    Edit: nice photos though




    I guess if you have a predetermined notion of what a championship course should be and are playing it expecting to find those characteristics, you could be disappointed? I can see being disappointed in it for this, that, or the other reason, just not in relation to the US Open.

    TBH, I think it's an pretty easy driving course, but it's "championship" nature does perk up on the approach shots.
  • CDMCDM Members Posts: 1,732 ✭✭
    edited Aug 22, 2018 #284
    duffer987 wrote:

    CDM wrote:

    Argonne69 wrote:

    CDM wrote:


    Chambers Bay....




    Wow. I played it last Sunday and it moved to #2 on my favorites list. Great views. Tough driving holes. Tough bunkers. Tough greens. A serious test of golf, and a wonderful overall experience. At no point did I every feel bored.






    I played it when it first opened with family. So some time ago but maybe it's grown in, better somehow? I recall its good course but is it worth price they are now charging? Also is it really a US Open course??? To me no but that is the beauty of golf... what each person likes may not be the same as others.



    Edit: nice photos though




    I guess if you have a predetermined notion of what a championship course should be and are playing it expecting to find those characteristics, you could be disappointed? I can see being disappointed in it for this, that, or the other reason, just not in relation to the US Open.

    TBH, I think it's an pretty easy driving course, but it's "championship" nature does perk up on the approach shots.




    Hahaha I agree I thought it was an easy driving course from tee. I did not like the greens at all but part of that could of been the fescue and one of the few times I had played on it.



    As to the US Open I only note it as they (course) hyped it up like crazy when we where there and the US Am. US Am I could see as even my home track held the US Public Links which all top Am”s played in... just did not perceive it as a course for an open after playing it. Sadly I think some pros felt the same LOL
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • msd71msd71 Members Posts: 711 ✭✭
    edited Sep 18, 2018 #285

    CDM wrote:


    Played Dormie Club about 2 weeks ago and they are turning it around. I thought it was really good.



    The two caddies in our group said they have not see the course in such great condition for a LONG time. Conditions where excellent. Rumor also is they are blowing up Hole 10 which they should as I thought that hole did not fit.




    Great news about the 10th hole, easily the worst hole on the course and maybe in the whole C&C portfolio.




    I played Dormie years ago and remember the 10th as a very long par 5. What is the problem with the design?
  • davep043davep043 Members Posts: 3,090 ✭✭
    msd71 wrote:

    CDM wrote:



    Ballyneal-good, but not great course. Most likely a victim of too much Doak hype.



    Double Eagle-living off of exclusivity, nice place and course, but no business on a Top 100 list.



    Philly Cricket-Wissahickon Nice enough, but on my Philly trip it was easily #5 of 5 courses played.



    Dormie Club-what a mess, hopefully the new owners get it where it could/should be.



    Old MacDonald-too wide?




    Played Dormie Club about 2 weeks ago and they are turning it around. I thought it was really good.



    The two caddies in our group said they have not see the course in such great condition for a LONG time. Conditions where excellent. Rumor also is they are blowing up Hole 10 which they should as I thought that hole did not fit.






    I played Dormie years ago and remember the 10th as a very long par 5. What is the problem with the design?


    The 10th is (or at least was when I played) a very long par-5. I think what C&C did with their design was to make a few "half-stroke par" holes, and to me 10 is one of them, almost a par 5-1/2. I've read criticisms of that approach, where the people thought a specific was too long for a par 4, too short par 5, just what the **** is it?? To me, its just a golf hole, it takes however many strokes it takes, and I do my best to ignore the label of a stated par.
  • teejaywhyteejaywhy Official GolfWRX Curmudgeon Members Posts: 7,167 ✭✭
    davep043 wrote:

    msd71 wrote:

    CDM wrote:



    Ballyneal-good, but not great course. Most likely a victim of too much Doak hype.



    Double Eagle-living off of exclusivity, nice place and course, but no business on a Top 100 list.



    Philly Cricket-Wissahickon Nice enough, but on my Philly trip it was easily #5 of 5 courses played.



    Dormie Club-what a mess, hopefully the new owners get it where it could/should be.



    Old MacDonald-too wide?




    Played Dormie Club about 2 weeks ago and they are turning it around. I thought it was really good.



    The two caddies in our group said they have not see the course in such great condition for a LONG time. Conditions where excellent. Rumor also is they are blowing up Hole 10 which they should as I thought that hole did not fit.






    I played Dormie years ago and remember the 10th as a very long par 5. What is the problem with the design?


    The 10th is (or at least was when I played) a very long par-5. I think what C&C did with their design was to make a few "half-stroke par" holes, and to me 10 is one of them, almost a par 5-1/2. I've read criticisms of that approach, where the people thought a specific was too long for a par 4, too short par 5, just what the **** is it?? To me, its just a golf hole, it takes however many strokes it takes, and I do my best to ignore the label of a stated par.




    I love the concept of half par holes. I like that it creates doubt in the minds of the mentally weak.



    Not sure how I feel about a 5-1/2 though.



  • DoubleorQuitsDoubleorQuits Members Posts: 376 ✭✭
    msd71 wrote:


    CDM wrote:


    Played Dormie Club about 2 weeks ago and they are turning it around. I thought it was really good.



    The two caddies in our group said they have not see the course in such great condition for a LONG time. Conditions where excellent. Rumor also is they are blowing up Hole 10 which they should as I thought that hole did not fit.




    Great news about the 10th hole, easily the worst hole on the course and maybe in the whole C&C portfolio.




    I played Dormie years ago and remember the 10th as a very long par 5. What is the problem with the design?




    First off it is located in a bog, so it (on my plays) is slow and soft. I don't have the scorecard now, but it is like 570 from the from tees and 650 or so from the tips, good luck, seniors and juniors. This is just a connector hole, with no real strategy or interest.
  • davep043davep043 Members Posts: 3,090 ✭✭

    msd71 wrote:


    CDM wrote:


    Played Dormie Club about 2 weeks ago and they are turning it around. I thought it was really good.



    The two caddies in our group said they have not see the course in such great condition for a LONG time. Conditions where excellent. Rumor also is they are blowing up Hole 10 which they should as I thought that hole did not fit.




    Great news about the 10th hole, easily the worst hole on the course and maybe in the whole C&C portfolio.




    I played Dormie years ago and remember the 10th as a very long par 5. What is the problem with the design?




    First off it is located in a bog, so it (on my plays) is slow and soft. I don't have the scorecard now, but it is like 570 from the from tees and 650 or so from the tips, good luck, seniors and juniors. This is just a connector hole, with no real strategy or interest.


    Its definitely a long one, with wetlands along both sides. The first part of the fairway is pretty wide, but there are two little bunkers in the middle of the fairway about 160 yards from the green. You have to make a choice on your second shot to play over, short, or squeeze a shot to either side of those bunkers. If you play short and safe, the third shot to a green with trouble on both sides is significantly more difficult than if you play the riskier second shot to get closer to the green. To me that's a fairly strategic hole, even though its long and pretty level.
  • Nvd13Nvd13 Members Posts: 138 ✭✭
  • socalsocal Members Posts: 36
    vaca22 wrote:


    The 1 or 2 people that I've met that told me they played Pebble said it was junk; hacked up, crowded, and expensive.




    Agreed. Was disssapointing to say the least. Views are obviously good but if you put that course anywhere else it’s mediocre at best.
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  • krtgolfingkrtgolfing Members Posts: 1,042 ✭✭
    socal wrote:

    vaca22 wrote:


    The 1 or 2 people that I've met that told me they played Pebble said it was junk; hacked up, crowded, and expensive.




    Agreed. Was disssapointing to say the least. Views are obviously good but if you put that course anywhere else it's mediocre at best.




    I guess neither of you have played it then. It is the number one public course in America for a reason. It is very expensive and crowded. I played it in September and it was in near perfect shape. Best course I have played by far.
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  • SuperbritSuperbrit Members Posts: 464 ✭✭
    The New Course at St Andrews, heard so many people say how good it is and its probably better then the The Old Course.



    Well its not, its not a bad course by any means, its just not as good as i was hoping, or expecting.

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  • Roadking2003Roadking2003 AustinMembers Posts: 5,301 ✭✭
    socal wrote:

    vaca22 wrote:


    The 1 or 2 people that I've met that told me they played Pebble said it was junk; hacked up, crowded, and expensive.




    Agreed. Was disssapointing to say the least. Views are obviously good but if you put that course anywhere else it's mediocre at best.




    That's like saying "Sophia Loren wouldn't be beautiful without her legs".



    But you can't move the course. The views are part of the course. Just like lots of other courses with views. Views are part of EVERY course.



    And I would debate that it would be mediocre without the views. I agree with Jack. If I had only one more round of golf to play in my life, it would be Pebble.
  • socalsocal Members Posts: 36
    krtgolfing wrote:

    socal wrote:

    vaca22 wrote:


    The 1 or 2 people that I've met that told me they played Pebble said it was junk; hacked up, crowded, and expensive.








    Agreed. Was disssapointing to say the least. Views are obviously good but if you put that course anywhere else it's mediocre at best.




    I guess neither of you have played it then. It is the number one public course in America for a reason. It is very expensive and crowded. I played it in September and it was in near perfect shape. Best course I have played by far.




    I certainy have played it and in my opinion it’s overrated. To each is own.
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