If anyone thinks the persimmon driver and blades are not playable as the new golf clubs, think again

wkuo3wkuo3 RELEASEMembers Posts: 3,954 ✭✭
It affirmed many of us whom knew this already but, it's amazing D.J. could "carry " these distance off the old golf club.

Love it when he said that he could have hit it a bit harder but was afraid of breaking the persimmon......



https://golfweek.com/2018/08/29/dustin-johnson-hits-jack-nicklaus-old-persimmon-driver-1-iron/
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Comments

  • wkuo3wkuo3 RELEASE Members Posts: 3,954 ✭✭
    please delete one of the two duplicated posts.
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    edited Aug 30, 2018 #3
    Im guessing your title is joking around a bit to stir some responses. Unless someone wishes to play classic golf clubs at a HUGE distance and accuracy sacrifice, your post actually helps illustrate how crazy it would be to play old equipment.



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks “equivalent” clubs 290 and 232 respectively.



    That’s Approximately 40 yards more carry for each club with the modern equipment.



    To me it clearly illustrates the incredible advances in equipment in the last 40-50 years and why 7000 yard courses are pitch and putts anymore.





    Edit....yes, throw in the solid core ball as well.
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • Dr. BlockDr. Block Members Posts: 610 ✭✭
    edited Aug 30, 2018 #4


    Im guessing your title is joking around a bit to stir some responses. Unless someone wishes to play classic golf clubs at a HUGE distance and accuracy sacrifice, your post actually helps illustrate how crazy it would be to play old equipment.



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks “equivalent” clubs 290 and 232 respectively.



    That’s Approximately 40 yards more carry for each club with the modern equipment.



    To me it clearly illustrates the incredible advances in equipment in the last 40-50 years and why 7000 yard courses are pitch and putts anymore.





    Edit....yes, throw in the solid core ball as well.




    Distance loss, yes. Accuracy loss, no. There’s a considerable increase in miss correcting gear effect spin on a persimmon driver vs these low spin bomb factory modern heads. My experience and opinion is they are much more accurate, and that’s why I play them.
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    Dr. Block wrote:



    Im guessing your title is joking around a bit to stir some responses. Unless someone wishes to play classic golf clubs at a HUGE distance and accuracy sacrifice, your post actually helps illustrate how crazy it would be to play old equipment.



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks “equivalent” clubs 290 and 232 respectively.



    That’s Approximately 40 yards more carry for each club with the modern equipment.



    To me it clearly illustrates the incredible advances in equipment in the last 40-50 years and why 7000 yard courses are pitch and putts anymore.





    Edit....yes, throw in the solid core ball as well.




    Distance loss, yes. Accuracy loss, no. There’s a considerable increase in miss correcting gear effect spin on a persimmon driver vs these low spin bomb factory modern heads. My experience and opinion is they are much more accurate, and that’s why I play them.




    Hummm. Ok. i guess we need to agree to disagree. I’m not sure if I could disagree more.



    A tiny persimmon Head is “more accurate” on average than a G400 max?
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • sdandreasdandrea Steve Members Posts: 2,397 ✭✭
    I'm betting this thread could cause me to OD on popcorn.......

    Cobra Max 10.5*
    Cobra Baffler 5w 19*
    Cobra Baffler 5H
    PING G400 6-UW
    PING Eye 2 Gorge 56*
    Odyssey V-Line


  • Dr. BlockDr. Block Members Posts: 610 ✭✭
    edited Aug 30, 2018 #7

    Dr. Block wrote:



    Im guessing your title is joking around a bit to stir some responses. Unless someone wishes to play classic golf clubs at a HUGE distance and accuracy sacrifice, your post actually helps illustrate how crazy it would be to play old equipment.



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks “equivalent” clubs 290 and 232 respectively.



    That’s Approximately 40 yards more carry for each club with the modern equipment.



    To me it clearly illustrates the incredible advances in equipment in the last 40-50 years and why 7000 yard courses are pitch and putts anymore.





    Edit....yes, throw in the solid core ball as well.




    Distance loss, yes. Accuracy loss, no. There’s a considerable increase in miss correcting gear effect spin on a persimmon driver vs these low spin bomb factory modern heads. My experience and opinion is they are much more accurate, and that’s why I play them.




    Hummm. Ok. i guess we need to agree to disagree. I’m not sure if I could disagree more.



    A tiny persimmon Head is “more accurate” on average than a G400 max?




    Absolutely. Google gear effect. Taylormade is trying to bring it back to modern heads with twist face. It improves accuracy on misses. Persimmons provide it in spades



    As for the pure strikes, with a persimmon the ball will fly lower with more spin which will keep it from bounding too far when it lands, and in general keep it more on line. You’re also talking about a 43.5 inch steel shaft - also more accurate.



    I think you’re confusing accuracy with forgiveness
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    For the sake of our discussion, I will say that if you took a traditional persimmon head of your choosing from the 60’s or early 70’s, and a ping G400 Max head and configured them with the same shaft, at the same length, using the same grip, at the same lie angle, and the same swingweight, the G400 Max setup would be FAR more accurate in a real world testing by actual golfers.



    If we did this experiment with identical equipment other than the heads, using randomly selected golfers of various abilities, the G400 max set up would be far more accurate if one were to look at the average deviation from centerline over the course of say 30 drives per golfer.



    I wouldn’t even think about talking about this without talking about identical shaft setups. Anyone that knows me from the boards knows that I preach shorter shafts than industry standard all the time. I think the 45+ inch “standard” driver shaft is the single worst thing to happen to recreational golfers in the History of equipment evolution. Calling 45.5” or 45.75” “standard length” is darn near criminal.



    I’ve been using a 43.5” shaft in my drivers since 1995. Hot melt and lead tape always have a place on the shelf in my shop.
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    Follow up post. Modern drivers certainly still have gear effect.



    A toe hit produces hook spin and heel hit produces fade spin. Taylormade didn’t reinvent the wheel.
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • NRJyzrNRJyzr Allez Allez Allez Minnesota, USAMembers Posts: 6,371 ✭✭
    edited Aug 30, 2018 #10


    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks "equivalent" clubs 290 and 232 respectively.






    He may sometimes carry his modern driver 320+, but I rather doubt it's consistently so, since his distance average is 314.



    Worth pointing out again he claimed to not go full bore on the persimmon. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
    The Ever Changing Bag!

    Driver: Cobra King LTD, ProtoPype 80x or RIP 80x, 43.5" -or- SuperDeep 9.5*, ProtoPype 80x or NV85x, 43.5"
    3w: Cobra King LTD, Motore F1 85 X, 42.5"
    2h:  TM Stage 2 Tour, Nv105 stiff -or- 1 iron: Maxfli Revolution, DGS400
    2-PW, Golden Ram Tour Grind, Dynamic S
    SW: Ram Tour Grind Feel Matched 58*, DGS
    Putter: Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34.5", PP58 midsize grip
    (Cleveland Huntington Beach #1 35" -or- Mizuno TPM-2, 35" as backups)
    Balls: in no particular order... Wilson Staff FG Tour, Duo Urethane, or 50 Elite, Srixon ZStar/ZStar XV, Snell MTB Black... will trot out Maxfli HT-100 or Elite 90 from time to time
    Shoes by True Linkswear
  • LeoLeo99LeoLeo99 Members Posts: 4,105 ✭✭
    So, go play persimmon and blades if you want to. No need to argue they are just as good. Go play.
  • Dr. BlockDr. Block Members Posts: 610 ✭✭
    edited Aug 30, 2018 #12


    For the sake of our discussion, I will say that if you took a traditional persimmon head of your choosing from the 60’s or early 70’s, and a ping G400 Max head and configured them with the same shaft, at the same length, using the same grip, at the same lie angle, and the same swingweight, the G400 Max setup would be FAR more accurate in a real world testing by actual golfers.



    If we did this experiment with identical equipment other than the heads, using randomly selected golfers of various abilities, the G400 max set up would be far more accurate if one were to look at the average deviation from centerline over the course of say 30 drives per golfer.



    I wouldn’t even think about talking about this without talking about identical shaft setups. Anyone that knows me from the boards knows that I preach shorter shafts than industry standard all the time. I think the 45+ inch “standard” driver shaft is the single worst thing to happen to recreational golfers in the History of equipment evolution. Calling 45.5” or 45.75” “standard length” is darn near criminal.



    I’ve been using a 43.5” shaft in my drivers since 1995. Hot melt and lead tape always have a place on the shelf in my shop.




    I can agree with your narrative of taking a wide array of golfers, especially ones who rely on the forgiveness of modern equipment to get usable shots at all. But is it really accuracy, or is it forgiveness?



    My arguement is purely about the gear effect. It’s far greater with persimmon, that really can’t be argued. If you are a low single digit golfer, and you take the time to become competent with persimmon, you will hit it straighter. I know, I’ve seen me do it.
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    NRJyzr wrote:



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks "equivalent" clubs 290 and 232 respectively.






    He may sometimes carry his modern driver 320+, but I rather doubt it's consistently so, since his distance average is 314.



    Worth pointing out again he claimed to not go full bore on the persimmon. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />




    Maybe splitting hairs a bit here.



    Correct. He certainly doesn’t carry his driver 320+ every time. He does if he WANTS to. He carries it 312 on average to be exact. Track man verified. I saw it in an article about how he used track man over a couple of years to dial in his wedge distances so darn well and the info was reprinted here on WRX last year.



    http://www.golfwrx.com/441424/his-2-iron-goes-how-far-dustin-johnsons-distance-chart-is-impressive/



    One thing to note. The average that is used for tour statistical purposes is not the same number you will get as measuring a few dozen drives on a driving range in a relaxed setting with no fairway to worry about hitting. If DJ made any serious effort to do so, he would routinely fly his driver 320+
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • SwingingkSwingingk ClubWRX Posts: 585 ClubWRX
    That's a super neat video and thanks for sharing it.  I love watching modern pros hit the elder gear.  He certainly bombs that 1 iron!   Very, very cool.



    In my opinion....  I don't think there's much doubt that metal headed drivers combined with modern graphite shafts  make the ball go farther and straighter than it used to with wood and steel.  The real question might be "is it a significant amount?" or "has there been a significant improvement in people's games because of it?".   They are arguable questions and I think it would depend on what equipment you were comparing and who was doing the comparison.  Still, I'm pretty sure the answer would be "yes".   In this case we have a very long driving pro in his prime doing the comparison.  I would agree that for Dustin the difference would probably be significant - maybe even HUGE - and would definitely affect his earnings and his career.  For the regular Joe I would say that the difference would be rather less.  In my case I hit my favorite persimmon driver about 240 max, and my modern driver about 260.  That's quite a few yards left on the fairway but it doesn't ruin my game.  Control is about the same when I'm swinging well but the modern driver definitely helps me when I'm "off" as it were.  Why do I bother?  Cuz it's fun!  Would I use persimmons vs titanium in a tournament?  Nope. 



    I would guess that the biggest factor in the distance lost in this comparison would be the shafts.  If one were to fit DJ's shafts into the older heads and set them up with his specs I'd think the 40 yard driver difference might turn into 20 or 30.  Let him practice with those for a week and take away the "I don't want to bust up Jack's historic club!" factor and I'll bet the distance loss would be more like 20 yards or maybe less, with the driver anyway. Maybe.



    As for the irons I don't think the vintage 1 iron to modern driving iron is a good comparison.  Modern 3 iron to vintage 1 or 2 iron might be closer. 



    I'm no expert or pro but I've played a lot of different blades and I do not see a significant improvement in quality blade iron heads from at least the period of this 1 iron up to my latest irons, Wilson Fg-59's.  Maybe sole and leading edge grinds.  I believe that if you were to set up Jacks irons with DJ's shafts and setup specs I doubt it would make much difference to his game.  He might want to keep his current driver though... 



    Fun topic and provocative title!





  • 8442584425 Members Posts: 299 ✭✭
    I am actually not that impressed by those distances. Yes, they are long but I remember from my junior days (early 90ies where some still played persimmon and the rest had those first generation TM tour preferred drivers, which provided no distance gain over the persimmon drivers), several guys (16-18 yo) that would hit the same distances. So if Dustin had played the PGA tour around that time he would of course been long (like Davis Love III and John Daly), but he wouldn't have demolished the competition. Which his current drives would suggest. One of the big differences is of course that in the 90ies you would see people like Davis Love III or John Daly sometimes hit 300+ drives and be miles longer than the rest of the field, but nowadays you see people hit the green of 400yard par-4s.
  • birly-shirlybirly-shirly Members Posts: 3,247 ✭✭
    "Playable", "accurate" and "forgiving" aren't necessarily the same thing. So I agree that a classic set of blades and persimmons can be as playable as a modern set. Equally, if your focus is maxing out ballspeed and mitigating the effects of missing the centre of the face, then I see the advantages of modern gear.



    Hard to know what to make of a couple of isolated swings from DJ. Old driver + modern ball goes a lot farther than Jack hit it. The 1 iron, not so much. I doubt DJ generates more power than Jack did in his prime.
  • mocokidmocokid Members Posts: 1,783 ✭✭
    When dusty hit Jack's one iron, driver, did he use balata or modern ball? In one article, I think here on WRX, they compared Jack's and dustin's distances, but jack's was 40 years ago with balata, correct?
  • xgolfxxgolfx Members Posts: 1,074 ✭✭
    Jack carries a money clip which he won for hitting a 340 drive at the PGA driving contest WITH PERSIMMON AND BALATA. When he played in the ‘67

    Western Open at Beverly Cc in Chicago,, I had delivered phone messages to him on the driving range. After the third one, I asked him to “Really let one out with his driver”.He hit it out of the range onto the 18th fairway. It was well over 300 yards . George Bayer, Mike Souchak, and other long hitters couldn’t come within 30 yards of that balata ball.



    In my opinion, Dustin was trying not to heel Jack’s driver and shatter it. Also, he was not accustomed to swinging a much heavier club and had to adjust his timing. Not only would the loft and length of Nicklaus driver be weaker, but also, the weight would be heavier than Johnson uses.



    CHARLEY PENNA
  • dlygrissedlygrisse Members Posts: 13,231 ✭✭

    Dr. Block wrote:



    Im guessing your title is joking around a bit to stir some responses. Unless someone wishes to play classic golf clubs at a HUGE distance and accuracy sacrifice, your post actually helps illustrate how crazy it would be to play old equipment.



    DJ carries his modern driver 320-330 and his driving iron 270+.



    He carried Jacks “equivalent” clubs 290 and 232 respectively.



    That’s Approximately 40 yards more carry for each club with the modern equipment.



    To me it clearly illustrates the incredible advances in equipment in the last 40-50 years and why 7000 yard courses are pitch and putts anymore.





    Edit....yes, throw in the solid core ball as well.




    Distance loss, yes. Accuracy loss, no. There’s a considerable increase in miss correcting gear effect spin on a persimmon driver vs these low spin bomb factory modern heads. My experience and opinion is they are much more accurate, and that’s why I play them.




    Hummm. Ok. i guess we need to agree to disagree. I’m not sure if I could disagree more.



    A tiny persimmon Head is “more accurate” on average than a G400 max?




    IMHO, you could work the ball more with the older equipment, but you could also really lose control of the ball as well. I don't see near as many shots spinning two fairways over as I used to, straight pushes and pulls now. I do think if you are consitent at hitting the sweet spot the old blades were very accurate. It was like the ball was on s string for a great ball striker.



    I still have visions in my brain of when I started playing golf in the 1980's of people hitting massive hooks and slices, and balls ballooning, with the persimmon and balata balls.

    Ping G400
    Callaway Epic Flash 3w, HW
    Ping G 4-U
    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 54* SS, 58
    Odyssey Pro #1 black
    Jones Utility
    ECCO Biom Hybrid 3
  • xgolfxxgolfx Members Posts: 1,074 ✭✭
    Balls fly different today. In the persimmon era, a ball would rise to it’s apogee and fall straight down. I caught practice shots with a first baseman’s mit . Today ,the balls fly in a more elliptical pattern. I presume one difference is the number and shape of the dimples.



    CHARLEY PENNA
  • jslane57jslane57 Members Posts: 3,929 ✭✭
    I appreciate the premise of this thread. But come on man. There is a photo that I can't find at the moment from a year ago where DJ hit is driver so far off the toe of the club (in one of his victories last year) that the club was like totally flexed sideways after impact, and yet he found the fairway. With a persimmon driver he would have literally whiffed the ball with that swing...
  • NRJyzrNRJyzr Allez Allez Allez Minnesota, USAMembers Posts: 6,371 ✭✭
    xgolfx wrote:


    Balls fly different today. In the persimmon era, a ball would rise to it’s apogee and fall straight down. I caught practice shots with a first baseman’s mit . Today ,the balls fly in a more elliptical pattern. I presume one difference is the number and shape of the dimples.



    CHARLEY PENNA




    It's largely spin rates. I can replicate that with certain Ti drivers I own, but others will give the elliptical flight you describe. Those drivers are the lower spin models, of course. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
    The Ever Changing Bag!

    Driver: Cobra King LTD, ProtoPype 80x or RIP 80x, 43.5" -or- SuperDeep 9.5*, ProtoPype 80x or NV85x, 43.5"
    3w: Cobra King LTD, Motore F1 85 X, 42.5"
    2h:  TM Stage 2 Tour, Nv105 stiff -or- 1 iron: Maxfli Revolution, DGS400
    2-PW, Golden Ram Tour Grind, Dynamic S
    SW: Ram Tour Grind Feel Matched 58*, DGS
    Putter: Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34.5", PP58 midsize grip
    (Cleveland Huntington Beach #1 35" -or- Mizuno TPM-2, 35" as backups)
    Balls: in no particular order... Wilson Staff FG Tour, Duo Urethane, or 50 Elite, Srixon ZStar/ZStar XV, Snell MTB Black... will trot out Maxfli HT-100 or Elite 90 from time to time
    Shoes by True Linkswear
  • baloobaloo A Person Members Posts: 1,083 ✭✭
    Play what you want. If you want to hit the ball as far as possible, go buy some modern gear.

    If you want to put together a bag of classics and have a blast that way, go for it. You'll find it's easily done for <$100.



    Personally, playing vintage gear is just more fun. It's a bit shorter, but not 40 yards shorter. I'd guess 20 or so if you're using the same ball.
    Driver, 3W, 4W - Macgregor Custom Tourney
    2-10 - 1954 Spalding Synchro Dyned
    SW - Wilson Staff
    Putter - Bullseye
    Ball - Pro Plus

    YT Channel - https://www.youtube....PlayVintageGolf
  • ShilgyShilgy PhoenixMembers Posts: 11,603 ✭✭
    jslane57 wrote:


    I appreciate the premise of this thread. But come on man. There is a photo that I can't find at the moment from a year ago where DJ hit is driver so far off the toe of the club (in one of his victories last year) that the club was like totally flexed sideways after impact, and yet he found the fairway. With a persimmon driver he would have literally whiffed the ball with that swing...
    Have you ever seen him whiff a 5 wood? About the same size as persimmon. I am certainly not a comparison to DJ but the small headed clubs are easier to hit in the center-not harder.



    Have you ever hit this training aid? imo it is easier to hit this center than a 460cc driver https://golfpsp.selz.com/
    WITB
    Tools for the job!

    To paraphrase Dr Seuss: Don't cry because the round of golf is over-smile because it happened . :)

    Game is recovering from total ankle replacement. Getting there and glad to be pain free!
  • jslane57jslane57 Members Posts: 3,929 ✭✭
    Shilgy wrote:

    jslane57 wrote:


    I appreciate the premise of this thread. But come on man. There is a photo that I can't find at the moment from a year ago where DJ hit is driver so far off the toe of the club (in one of his victories last year) that the club was like totally flexed sideways after impact, and yet he found the fairway. With a persimmon driver he would have literally whiffed the ball with that swing...
    Have you ever seen him whiff a 5 wood? About the same size as persimmon. I am certainly not a comparison to DJ but the small headed clubs are easier to hit in the center-not harder.



    Have you ever hit this training aid? imo it is easier to hit this center than a 460cc driver https://golfpsp.selz.com/
    Of course not. And he would never. The modern driver does allow for a level of attention taken away from perfect contact in exchange for power. And the modern pros as well as ams do take advantage of that, which simply makes the club easier to hit. No professional would ever whiff the ball because of the smaller the hitting area, they'd simply focus more on that aspect. The not so professional may not have that going for them. I have seen regular people whiff the ball, which would be even easier to do if using a smaller club...
  • sdandreasdandrea Steve Members Posts: 2,397 ✭✭
    I can argue that the old Peter-Kessler-TV-offer-only-Perfect Club is "better" than any fairway metal out there today because I still hit mine better than the modern FW metals. It has a shorter shaft and a heavier head with enough offset to make a blade-player puke. I hit it better because of my inability to make solid/proper contact off of tight lies with the long shafted modern metals - it's not because the Perfect Club is "better".

    Cobra Max 10.5*
    Cobra Baffler 5w 19*
    Cobra Baffler 5H
    PING G400 6-UW
    PING Eye 2 Gorge 56*
    Odyssey V-Line


  • wrmillerwrmiller Members Posts: 1,569 ✭✭
    baloo wrote:


    Play what you want. If you want to hit the ball as far as possible, go buy some modern gear.

    If you want to put together a bag of classics and have a blast that way, go for it. You'll find it's easily done for <$100.



    Personally, playing vintage gear is just more fun. It's a bit shorter, but not 40 yards shorter. I'd guess 20 or so if you're using the same ball.




    It has been a couple of years, but last time I had my Powerbilt persimmon at the range I was only about 15 yds shorter with it than I was with my Titleist toaster oven-on-a-stick. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    This winter I'll be looking for a set of blonde Ping woods and put them in a bag with my BeNi ISIs and call it my 'classic' bag. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
    Primary bag:
    Titleist 913 D3 8.5
    Titleist 915Fd 13.5
    Titleist 913h 17
    Mizuno MP-18 4-PW
    Scratch wedges 50, 55, and 60
    Bettinardi mid-shank putter

    Backup bag:
    Ping G400 9
    Ping G30 fw 13
    Ping G30 hybrid 19
    Ping iBlade 4-PW power spec
    Macgregor VIP wedges 51, 56, and 60
    Bettinardi mid-shank putter
  • SwingingkSwingingk ClubWRX Posts: 585 ClubWRX
    wrmiller wrote:

    baloo wrote:


    Play what you want. If you want to hit the ball as far as possible, go buy some modern gear.

    If you want to put together a bag of classics and have a blast that way, go for it. You'll find it's easily done for <$100.



    Personally, playing vintage gear is just more fun. It's a bit shorter, but not 40 yards shorter. I'd guess 20 or so if you're using the same ball.




    It has been a couple of years, but last time I had my Powerbilt persimmon at the range I was only about 15 yds shorter with it than I was with my Titleist toaster oven-on-a-stick. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    This winter I'll be looking for a set of blonde Ping woods and put them in a bag with my BeNi ISIs and call it my 'classic' bag. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />




    That'll be a nice setup. Don't Forget the Anser 2!
  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,243 ✭✭
    Swingingk wrote:

    wrmiller wrote:

    baloo wrote:


    Play what you want. If you want to hit the ball as far as possible, go buy some modern gear.

    If you want to put together a bag of classics and have a blast that way, go for it. You'll find it's easily done for <$100.



    Personally, playing vintage gear is just more fun. It's a bit shorter, but not 40 yards shorter. I'd guess 20 or so if you're using the same ball.




    It has been a couple of years, but last time I had my Powerbilt persimmon at the range I was only about 15 yds shorter with it than I was with my Titleist toaster oven-on-a-stick. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    This winter I'll be looking for a set of blonde Ping woods and put them in a bag with my BeNi ISIs and call it my 'classic' bag. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />




    That'll be a nice setup. Don't Forget the Anser 2!




    And eye 2+ wedges. Classic beyond classic. Inspiration for Phi’s PM grind.
    9.5* Cobra LTD, Old school Grafalloy Blue, 43.5"
    14* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X 42"
    16* Cally 815 alpha fuji 665 X, 41.5" (set to 17*)
    19* Titleist 816 H2 fuji 8.8X TS 40.0"
    4-7 2016 Hogan PTx, KBS Tour V, 120X.  
    Ping i210 8 & 9 Proto 125 F5 hardstepped 1x.
    Ping glide 2 46-12, 50-12, 54-14 (at 55) stealth, Vokey SM6 60M (61). Wedges Recoil Proto 125 F5
    33.5" Ghost spider slant neck.
    Srixon Z-star XV
    Jones Trouper Bag
  • BIG STUBIG STU Members Posts: 11,396 ✭✭
    sdandrea wrote:


    I can argue that the old Peter-Kessler-TV-offer-only-Perfect Club is "better" than any fairway metal out there today because I still hit mine better than the modern FW metals. It has a shorter shaft and a heavier head with enough offset to make a blade-player puke. I hit it better because of my inability to make solid/proper contact off of tight lies with the long shafted modern metals - it's not because the Perfect Club is "better".
    In your case the shorter heavier club is perfectly balanced for you---- **** fire some of the modern hybrids are larger than my V-Steel fairways and we proved it the other day at the range that the modern hybrids are larger than my persimmon Macgregor MT Custom 4 and 5 woods.
  • BIG STUBIG STU Members Posts: 11,396 ✭✭

    Swingingk wrote:

    wrmiller wrote:

    baloo wrote:


    Play what you want. If you want to hit the ball as far as possible, go buy some modern gear.

    If you want to put together a bag of classics and have a blast that way, go for it. You'll find it's easily done for <$100.



    Personally, playing vintage gear is just more fun. It's a bit shorter, but not 40 yards shorter. I'd guess 20 or so if you're using the same ball.




    It has been a couple of years, but last time I had my Powerbilt persimmon at the range I was only about 15 yds shorter with it than I was with my Titleist toaster oven-on-a-stick. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    This winter I'll be looking for a set of blonde Ping woods and put them in a bag with my BeNi ISIs and call it my 'classic' bag. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />




    That'll be a nice setup. Don't Forget the Anser 2!




    And eye 2+ wedges. Classic beyond classic. Inspiration for Phi’s PM grind.
    And also the inspiration for the newer TM High Toe wedges
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