Mystery - help solve!

Hoping one of you could help me solve a mystery...

Been playing Edel (variable length) irons/wedges for the past 18 months. Recently decided to have my old set (Mizuno MP-53) refit to match the setup of the Edel (length, weight, loft, lie) and leave them at my parent’s place to avoid hauling clubs back-and-forth. Hit the refit Mizunos for the first time today. 60° thru 8i are money - the distances are pretty close to my Edel numbers. The mystery is with the 7i-3i, which are all cavity backs in this set (vs muscle backs for lower irons). The cavity backs are now all crazy short (distance). For reference, both 8i = 150yd. But Mizuno 7i is same as my Edel PW. 6i = 9i, 5i = 8i, 4i = 160yd (should be 190yd), 3i = 170yd (should be 200yd). I can’t for the life of me figure out why cavity backs would be such a difference and how to possibly fix them. Ideas?

Thanks!

Same shaft and grips in both sets?

Exactly what changes were made to Mizzy's to get them to match the setup of the Edels?

OK, some context... originally, the Mizzys were fit for me at +1” over with DG X100, sw = D7. 2 yrs ago I went for a lesson to work on greater consistency and the pro told me the clubs were all wrong for me, that I needed standard lengths. Since I *had to*, I decided to get custom fit for a new set (Edel) at standard length with DG S400 tour issue, sw = D2. So, to answer your question, the Mizzys were set to match, but keeping the X100 (now cut down 1”). Add’l note: while I didn’t swing the Mizzys before refitting (so not sure what current distances would have been before refit), but originally (@ +1”), they were similar distances to what I see w/Edel’s today.

Hopefully that helps?

When the Mizzys were cut down that 1" - was anything done to compensate for the swing weight change (yes I see it was high to begin with, so might not have needed much compensation)? Or do you know what the SW currently is for the Mizzy's?

It would be better to see actual LM numbers with the two sets (e.g. comparing 7 irons). But off hand, the different shaft weight alone could potentially account for the difference in a few different ways. Even if you were hitting them well prior to getting the Edel's, your swing could have adjusted to the lighter weight shafts for the time you've been playing them (not to mention any swing changes that might have been going on) in such a way to cause problems when going back to the heavier shafts.

With LM numbers it might be possible to be more specific - e.g. was swing speed lost, a difference in the dynamic loft delivered, etc... With the amount you did loose, it's likely a combination of multiple things. The only thing you might do is use some foot powder spray to check the impact location on the faces of the Mizzy's, that's another potential source of distance loss.

Great thoughts! Thanks. I’ll have to circle back once I can get on a LM. In the meantime though, just focusing on the drop off from the Mizzy 8i (muscle back) @150yd to the 7i (cavity back) @130yd. Doesn’t that, in-and-of itself seem odd?

Yes, a sudden drop off does seem very odd. Enough to warrant blueprinting the whole set to look for any abnormalities in the specs. But it doesn't (by itself) change where (or how) to look for a root cause. If it was some type of thin faced, high-cor iron, or even graphite shafts that had been pulled and re-used, that might add some possibilities for a source of distance loss, or even a poor epoxy job if the shafts were pulled and reinstalled. But if the only thing that was done to them was some butt cutting, I can't think of any way the integrity of the clubs could have been compromised. Which means we still should be primarily focusing on what the different specs might be doing to your swing.

If the L/L/L all checked out , and the swing weight is close within one point, then, It'll be the different shaft caused the variance between the sets.

This is often caused by COG = more or less spin.

Loft id just one part of the equation

So... not as dramatic of a drop-off as previously witnessed. Likely attributed to outdoors + range balls vs indoor TM + ProV1. Nonetheless, interesting to see. On the whole, the Mizzys (back up set), seem to be about a club to two shorter than my Edels (considering, Edel 8i = 150 carry and 4i = 190 carry).

Are those numbers both the Mizzy 4i and 8i?

Looks like a little more dynamic loft delivered (less forward shaft lean) in the 8i vs the 4i. First suspect would be swing weight or MOI differences so just confirms that getting the swing weights checked in the whole set would probably be a good idea (or if not, just playing around with adding some head weight to the shorter clubs).

As far as the difference between the Edel's and Mizzy's - would really need to see Mizzy numbers vs Edel numbers for the same club (and include dynamic loft if possible). I suspect there may be some swing speed lost due to the heavier shafts - but that's just a guess and even if true could be other reasons as well.

Are those numbers both the Mizzy 4i and 8i?

 

Looks like a little more dynamic loft delivered (less forward shaft lean) in the 8i vs the 4i. First suspect would be swing weight or MOI differences so just confirms that getting the swing weights checked in the whole set would probably be a good idea (or if not, just playing around with adding some head weight to the shorter clubs).

 

As far as the difference between the Edel's and Mizzy's - would really need to see Mizzy numbers vs Edel numbers for the same club (and include dynamic loft if possible). I suspect there may be some swing speed lost due to the heavier shafts - but that's just a guess and even if true could be other reasons as well.

Exactly... Mizzy 8i + 4i. Many thanks. All good thoughts to consider - heavier shafts makes a lot of sense. It'll be a while before I'm back home with the Edel's to get them on the TM, but as I fall deeper in the rabbit hole, certainly interested to see comparative numbers.