McIlroy and the European Tour

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  • OldTomMorrisOldTomMorris Edinburgh, ScotlandMembers Posts: 2,228 ✭✭
    edited Nov 14, 2018 #62


    It is always funny when people blast American players for not coming over to Europe to play their tour's big events when the European Tour can't even get their own top players to show up. For example, Francesco Molinari skipping the first two events of the European Tour playoffs.




    Its a fair point but in Molinari's case he changed his schedule mid-season chasing FedEx Cup points and it was a success but it's clear to see he is paying the price for it mentally. He looked shot in the recent events, maybe he might not have played both anyway.
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  • OldTomMorrisOldTomMorris Edinburgh, ScotlandMembers Posts: 2,228 ✭✭
    With McIlroy only looking like he'd need to add 2 events to fulfil his commitment doesn't seem like a problem at all. With that in mind it feels like an awfully strange thing to put out into the public domain that he might forfeit his obligations for a year.



    It might set off a few alarm bells with Keith Pelley, things are OK at the moment with the Rolex Series but nothing last forever and if the ET were to lose that then it could be disaster. It appears for some players the only thing that might ensure commitment to the tour is the RC, clearly an issue.
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  • Dave230Dave230 Members Posts: 3,769 ✭✭
    edited Nov 14, 2018 #64
    jmck wrote:

    Dave230 wrote:


    The European Tour helped Koepka get to three majors, helped Molinari this year and helped himself win majors.



    He won a major in a year he had no PGA Tour membership if I remember.



    So not necessarily looking out for his game but for his bank account (Fed Ex goes up to $15m this year).



    If he is skipping Dubai there's no reason he couldn't play Irish or Scottish, Omega Masters, Wentworth and Dubai. Wouldn't be hard at all and it would have no impact on his PGA Tour season. And he could still have 20 weeks off or however many he has.



    The 'I'll come back for the Ryder Cup' comment was selfish, what suits me.



    Dave230 wrote:


    If you want to be the greatest European golfer, you don't skip the European Tour when you only have to play 4 measly events in 12 months. Seve has 50 wins and Faldo was a stalwart, if you want to be the best European golfer you don't ditch your own tour in my opinion.




    First of all, Rory doesn't need the money, and, forgetting the FedEx Cup money for a moment, has done very very little in the way of chasing appearance fees, unlike some other top players I could name (cough*Tiger*cough). Heck, Rory got in trouble a few years back when he said the $10m FedEx prize didn't mean much to him! People were on here ripping him a new one about that, lol.



    Secondly, he didn't say he wanted to be the greatest European Tour player. He said he wanted to be the greatest European golfer. That means playing against the best, which by and large mean a limited schedule on the Euro tour. Here's a quote from his interview: "I guess my thing is that I want to play against the strongest fields week in and week out, and for the most part of the season that is in America." I don't see how anyone can argue against that.



    No one loved Seve more than me, but when it comes to ranking him among the all time greats he gets dinged for running up his win totals in minor tournaments against inferior competition, and rightly so. He played very little in America, and he spent a lot of time chasing appearance fees all over the globe. People complained about that at the time, now people are complaining about Rory doing the opposite.




    He has a full uninterrupted PGA Tour schedule anyway, I don't see how he can't play four events over the course of a year.



    Not saying that he should play the Indian Open to support the Tour, just a very small selection of the best events, he'd only have to play half of the Rolex Series to satisfy the criteria.



    Appearance money/prize money are means to the same end, if all the money was in Europe then Rory would not be in America. They're all chasing the biggest purses and they are in the US right now with the Fed-Ex splurge.



    I don't like the idea that playing on the European Tour is detrimental to your chances of majors, the European Tour produces lots of major winners because there is a great variety of courses and I definitely think it has helped Koepka and others who have played it. Danny Willett and Sergio Garcia both won the Masters after winning the Dubai Desert Classic for example. It's another case of McIlroy losing an element of what made him one of the world's best players.
  • Matt JMatt J Members Posts: 8,717 ✭✭
    I think Rors might benefit from simply taking a step back all together. Maybe just sit out 2019. Perhaps he'd come back in 2020 with some fire in his belly. You don't have to watch him more than about 10 minutes to see a look on his face that screams, "I don't care about golf."
  • Jacked_LoftJacked_Loft Steps Ahead Members Posts: 487 ✭✭
    Non issue here. He'll later add on events as needed to keep his ET membership.
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  • airjammerairjammer Members Posts: 988 ✭✭
    leftyDH04 wrote:


    I think Rors might benefit from simply taking a step back all together. Maybe just sit out 2019. Perhaps he'd come back in 2020 with some fire in his belly. You don't have to watch him more than about 10 minutes to see a look on his face that screams, "I don't care about golf."




    He really makes me think if he had zero sponsors, he would just retire. I’d bet a good bit of money that if he had already won the masters he would retire regardless of his sponsors
  • bscinstnctbscinstnct Members Posts: 26,384 ✭✭
    leftyDH04 wrote:


    I think Rors might benefit from simply taking a step back all together. Maybe just sit out 2019. Perhaps he'd come back in 2020 with some fire in his belly. You don't have to watch him more than about 10 minutes to see a look on his face that screams, "I don't care about golf."




    Rory gonna retire from golf and



    Go full Murica!



    And play baseball like MJ



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  • Dave230Dave230 Members Posts: 3,769 ✭✭
    leftyDH04 wrote:


    I think Rors might benefit from simply taking a step back all together. Maybe just sit out 2019. Perhaps he'd come back in 2020 with some fire in his belly. You don't have to watch him more than about 10 minutes to see a look on his face that screams, "I don't care about golf."




    If you remember he took an extended period off at the end of last year, mailing it through the playoffs, then not playing for three or four months. Now he's only playing one tournament in three months. He plays relatively few events as it is, and loves a long break. I don't think burnout is the issue.
  • marmooskapaulmarmooskapaul Members Posts: 1,342 ✭✭
    I would think missing the ET this year and becoming ineligible to be a Ryder Cup Captain would be a positive. Now he knows his life won't be interrupted when he's 50 something to do that pain in the butt job.
  • IVMIVM Members Posts: 454 ✭✭
    Rory has all the money that he will ever need and does not care about where he came from the European Tour or if he wins another Major . Just as long as TaylorMade are paying $$$$ each year and his other sponsors are too he is happy . If a Major falls in his lap that is gravy .But the truth is the kid does not have the heart to be as good as he could have been .
  • bscinstnctbscinstnct Members Posts: 26,384 ✭✭
    edited Nov 14, 2018 #72
    His preference for playing here has been the case for his entire pro career....





    "I'm not a fan of tournaments that the outcome is predicted so much by the weather -- it's not my sort of golf," said the 22-year-old. "I'm looking forward to getting back to America and getting back into some nice conditions.



    "I'd rather play when it's 80 degrees and sunny and not much wind -- and there's no point in changing your game for one week a year."



    https://www.pga.com/...es-golf-weather
  • imakaveliimakaveli Moli Moli Moli Moli Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy... Members Posts: 12,631 ✭✭

    cardoustie wrote:


    The one negative I see with Rors is he seems to mentally check out if things don't go his way ... like him missing the short eagle on 2 at The Masters in Rd 4. He handed that title to PR




    Rory didn’t “mentally check out” after “missing the short eagle on 2 at Masters in rd4”. The reality that is golf is sometimes players (Rory that day) just didn’t have much of a swing all day…



    Hole 1:

    Let me remind you Rory’s very first tee shot on hole 1 was a disaster block right and despite such a terrible start did well mentally digging deep, fighting to rescue a superb par from where he was. Do you remember Rory gained 1 shot on hole 1 when Reed made bogey?



    Hole 2:

    Despite Rory missing that 4ft eagle putt he STILL made birdie while Reed only made par. Have you forgot Rory gained yet another shot on Reed, so 2 shots in the first 2 holes? You really think Rory & his caddie didn’t know/speak of this 2 shot advantage they just created and “mentally checked out”?



    Hole 3:

    So Rory after gaining 2 shots in the first 2 holes you think Rory’s poor wedge on hole 3 missing the green resulting in bogey was a result of him “mentally checking out”? Or could it just be a poor wedge that he’s prone to recently?



    Hole 4:

    Do you think Rory’s stunning 5 iron from 232 yards to 3ft making birdie (gaining another shot on Reed) was Rory “mentally checking out” with Reed only making par?



    The reality was Rory just didn’t have much of a swing from the very first hole, he battled hard all day to find something but if you don’t have it, you don’t have it - it happens, even to the very best - it’s still Golf. Let me give you an example using the same standards with Tiger… did he “mentally check out” in Rd 1 after making birdie and then 2 bogies on holes 4 & 5 shooting a relatively poor +1? Did Tiger continue to “mentally check out” in Rd 2 also shooting a poor +3 round? The reality is Tiger like Rory he just didn’t have it when he needed it and they both couldn’t find anything on different days.



    Here’s Rory’s Greens Hit at Augusta in rds 1-3, he was 61%, 67%, 67% - but in round 4 he only hit 44% of greens. Putting can only do so much but the key to scoring is Approach play, and if you’re not hitting greens consistently, especially at AN when being out of position is so costly, then pars & bogey & doubles will inevitably fill your scorecard. This is what happened with Rory final round at AN and Tiger in rds 1 & 2. It’s Golf. Here’s Rory’s own words about his 4th round at Augusta 2018…



    Rory on his Masters 2018 Performance:

    "I was trying to hit good shots and good putts and anytime I felt like I hit a good shot I got myself on the wrong side of the pin or gave myself a tricky one down the hill.”



    In closing, I would agree he “mentally checked out” at the Honda event a few years back, but since then I’ve noticed the opposite reaction when things haven’t gone his way by digging deep even though in the moment he still outwardly shows his emotions (and there’s nothing wrong with that). I could give you many examples of when Rory started poorly in a round / event and then dug deep to finish strong and sometimes win. Don’t mistake Rory wearing his frustration / emotions on his sleeve (face etc), as him “mentally checking out”. I actually appreciate this showing of emotion from him.




    So you are saying you believed Rory could have still won the Master after the 2nd?

    I continued watching only because it was the Masters...
  • KRAMER1997KRAMER1997 Members Posts: 34
    Good for him, playing a tour that is on life support is a waste of his time.
  • OldTomMorrisOldTomMorris Edinburgh, ScotlandMembers Posts: 2,228 ✭✭
    ^^ No doubt tour has issues but over €35M ET winnings for McIlory, not my idea of a waste of time.
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  • KrazyTrain18KrazyTrain18 Members Posts: 3,164 ✭✭
    Rory has certainly changed his mind over the years on a variety of things not limited to the Ryder Cup or Open Championship. I think he'll play the required events and this will become a non story.
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  • dolfinackdolfinack Members Posts: 468 ✭✭
    Moleman wrote:


    Rory doesn’t really like golf anymore... image/sad.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':(' />




    What's it like to be a close personal friend of a tour player?
  •  Dave D Dave D Members Posts: 4,002 ✭✭


    I would think missing the ET this year and becoming ineligible to be a Ryder Cup Captain would be a positive. Now he knows his life won't be interrupted when he's 50 something to do that pain in the butt job.




    Not as pain in the butt as having to be an American captain and suffer an a$$ whooping more often than not image/laugh.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />
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  • SuperbritSuperbrit Members Posts: 464 ✭✭
    IVM wrote:


    Rory has all the money that he will ever need and does not care about where he came from the European Tour or if he wins another Major . Just as long as TaylorMade are paying $$$$ each year and his other sponsors are too he is happy . If a Major falls in his lap that is gravy .But the truth is the kid does not have the heart to be as good as he could have been .




    12 months ago i would have told you stop being so daft, nowadays i'm actually starting to agree, sort of, i reckon he would still work his butt off to win The Masters, but apart from that??



    Does he ever look like he enjoys it out there? it just seems like Golf sort of gets in the way now

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  • SuperbritSuperbrit Members Posts: 464 ✭✭
    edited Nov 16, 2018 #80
    KRAMER1997 wrote:


    Good for him, playing a tour that is on life support is a waste of his time.




    The European Tour has never had so much prize money and sponsors, its not got as much as the PGA tour obviously, but its hardly on life support!

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  • widow-makerwidow-maker Members Posts: 1,600 ✭✭
    Rory can't win no matter what he does. He catches grief for not being willing to do what's necessary to win majors, then when he makes a selfish decision to concentrate on majors he gets grief for not supporting the Euro Tour.



    It's his life, his choices. He seems to have made a plan and he's committed to it for the first 8 months of the year. Seems like a wise choice to me. Make a plan that you're comfortable with and stick with it. He'll have September, October, and November to play in whatever Euro events he chooses. He doesn't have to make those choices right now, so why commit to anything?



    He's in the prime of his career right now. I don't blame him for being selfish and doing everything in his power to have immediate success. He's probably got a 5 year window to take advantage of being in his prime. Cut out the distractions and do what you've got to do. He's probably tired of being pulled in multiple directions with multiple obligations which limit his ability to concentrate on his golf. So... simplify your life and do what makes you comfortable in order to play the best golf you possibly can. Tiger figured it out at an early age. Do what you have to do to focus all of your energy on your goals. He needs to win... and now's the time.
  • new2g0lfnew2g0lf Members Posts: 3,382 ✭✭
    Overall, younger generations place a higher value on quality of life, relationships and parenting than the older generations. Rory should be financially set for life, he doesn't need to play in every tournament every week to keep food on his table and most of the PGA Tour tournaments provide better prize money so logically why would he want to compete for less money.
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  • Dave230Dave230 Members Posts: 3,769 ✭✭
    edited Nov 16, 2018 #83
    To quote Paul McGinley - https://www.skysport...and-justin-rose



    "It's quite extraordinary that Rory's not going to play just two more events to fulfil his European Tour membership next season. It's very disappointing and it is obviously a blow for the European Tour.

    I've been racking my brains wondering how that can be. Obviously Rory sees it in other ways and has got his own rationale for that, although I'm finding it hard to understand!

    Of the 12 players that represented Europe in the Ryder Cup this year, Rory is the only one who is going to do that and the others have all signed up to play the minimum of four events outside of the majors and WGCs.

    The FedExCup finishes in August next year, so you've got all of September, October, November and December where the PGA Tour is played in Malaysia, Korea and various other places.

    Is Rory going to play in those rather than play in Dubai, where he has had unbelievable success and offers the exact same prize money as those events? Or is he just not going to play at all over the last four months?"



    As McGinley says, I don't see how this relates to majors, it's a question of McIlroy just not playing for the last three months of the year. And he is only planning to play once from mid-November to late February as well. So in the next 12 months, he's planning to take 5-6 of those months off at age 29?
  • Darth PutterDarth Putter Members Posts: 4,756 ✭✭
    swing is irrelevant, score is everything

    just say NO.... to practice swings
  • WidespreadPanicWidespreadPanic Wizard in the Corner Members Posts: 4,826 ✭✭
    I don’t understand why there are Euros ripping him for this. I hate when people think they’re owed something when they just aren’t.
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  • bscinstnctbscinstnct Members Posts: 26,384 ✭✭
    edited Nov 16, 2018 #86
    Dave230 wrote:


    To quote Paul McGinley - https://www.skysport...and-justin-rose



    "It's quite extraordinary that Rory's not going to play just two more events to fulfil his European Tour membership next season. It's very disappointing and it is obviously a blow for the European Tour.

    I've been racking my brains wondering how that can be. Obviously Rory sees it in other ways and has got his own rationale for that, although I'm finding it hard to understand!

    Of the 12 players that represented Europe in the Ryder Cup this year, Rory is the only one who is going to do that and the others have all signed up to play the minimum of four events outside of the majors and WGCs.

    The FedExCup finishes in August next year, so you've got all of September, October, November and December where the PGA Tour is played in Malaysia, Korea and various other places.

    Is Rory going to play in those rather than play in Dubai, where he has had unbelievable success and offers the exact same prize money as those events? Or is he just not going to play at all over the last four months?"



    As McGinley says, I don't see how this relates to majors, it's a question of McIlroy just not playing for the last three months of the year. And he is only planning to play once from mid-November to late February as well. So in the next 12 months, he's planning to take 5-6 of those months off at age 29?




    I think this is the key to understand his thinking



    "McIlroy says that after this week he intends to play just once in the next 13 weeks.



    "The way the schedule has worked for next year, it is going to be different for a lot of guys," McIlroy said. "I think everything is going to be so condensed between March and August so that's why I'm going to be taking quite a big off season to get myself ready."



    https://www.golfdige...bership-in-2019





    And this is another GD/Feinstien piece with some insight



    The outrage over Rory McIlroy's European Tour membership is crazy*



    *And so is thinking he won't be a Ryder Cup captain some day





    https://www.golfdige...-john-feinstein
  • jmckjmck Members Posts: 4,277 ✭✭


    I don't understand why there are Euros ripping him for this. I hate when people think they're owed something when they just aren't.




    Not only that, they're ripping him for things he hasn't said or done. Look at that McGinely quote from Dave230 up above. First sentence: "It's quite extraordinary that Rory's not going to play just two more events to fulfill his European Tour membership next season."



    All Rory said was that he's only committed to two events at this time, and he'll reevaluate after May. He never said two was all he's playing for the year and that he for sure won't play enough to be a Euro tour member. He only said it's a possibility--and one that doesn't bother him much. McGinely (and a whole bunch of other people) are acting like Rory's schedule for the next 365 days is set in stone as of this past weekend.



    Gotta wonder how much more of this Rory puts up with before he just gives up and starts answering every question like DJ. Dude speaks his mind and, sure, that often means his foot goes into his mouth. But I'd rather have pros like that then a bunch of automatons.
  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Members Posts: 4,792 ✭✭
    jmck wrote:



    I don't understand why there are Euros ripping him for this. I hate when people think they're owed something when they just aren't.




    Not only that, they're ripping him for things he hasn't said or done. Look at that McGinely quote from Dave230 up above. First sentence: "It's quite extraordinary that Rory's not going to play just two more events to fulfill his European Tour membership next season."



    All Rory said was that he's only committed to two events at this time, and he'll reevaluate after May. He never said two was all he's playing for the year and that he for sure won't play enough to be a Euro tour member. He only said it's a possibility--and one that doesn't bother him much. McGinely (and a whole bunch of other people) are acting like Rory's schedule for the next 365 days is set in stone as of this past weekend.



    Gotta wonder how much more of this Rory puts up with before he just gives up and starts answering every question like DJ. Dude speaks his mind and, sure, that often means his foot goes into his mouth. But I'd rather have pros like that then a bunch of automatons.




    I am certain that he will end up playing at least four events and I get what he is saying in that he has only committed to two at this stage and that he will see how the year goes but Rory should be media savvy enough to know that what he said was going to cause controversy. It makes me wonder what was behind him saying what he said in the way that he said it. He is after something from the European tour but should remember that the Tour has bent over backwards to accommodate him previously, he should remember that.
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  • MarkFromTheUKMarkFromTheUK Members Posts: 4,639 ✭✭
    edited Nov 17, 2018 #89
    Stuff like this annoys me. He’s European. Being European doesn’t oblige him to play on the European tour. He wants to play against the best, and that’s in the USA.



    Golf fans and commentators are far too precious about stuff. It’s bad enough when people whine that player X missed Jack, or Arnie or Bob’s tournament, stating it shows disrespect. Who cares? Play where you want, when you want. Very few sports hark back to history in such a cringeworthy and sycophantic manner that golf does.
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