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Titleist TS3 vs Callaway Epic Flash Sub Zero vs TM M5

hypergolfhypergolf Advanced Members Posts: 1,221
edited January 6 in Equipment
You all know what to do image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' /> Please discuss, argue or debate your thoughts, experience, feel, distance etc.Thanks guys.
«1

Comments

  • Bomber_11Bomber_11 Enjoy the Chase. ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 3,523 ClubWRX
    I think you'll find very few people who've had a chance to hit all 3....



    What I will say is this...



    Titleist's improvement from 917D2/D3 to TS2/TS3 was a much bigger progression than Rogue -> Flash or M3 -> M5.
    ‘16 Taylormade M2 Tour Issue 8.5° w/ KuroKage Dual Core XT 60TX
    Callaway Rogue Sub Zero 15° w/ Tensei Pro White 70TX
    PXG 0311X 2i w/ KBS Tour Hybrid Prototype 105S+
    Mizuno JPX919 Tour 3-PW w/ DG Tour Issue X100
    Titleist Vokey SM7 50F/54S/60D w/ Pink DG S400
    Scotty Cameron Newport 2 Button Back
    Jones x Greyson Stand Bag

    Work. Play. Win. Repeat.
  • MtlJeffMtlJeff The GOAT Advanced Members Posts: 27,950 ✭✭
    1 of those 3 drivers is released where i live (TS3). So that's my favorite so far.
    Cobra F8+ 8.5 w/ Aldila NV 2KXV 65
    Callaway Epic Subzero 14* w//Matrix Black Tie 80
    Callaway Apex Hybrid 20 w/Diamana D+ 95
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
    Callaway MD Forged 52,56,60 w/S300
    Odyssey O-works #7 Red Tank
  • texcromtexcrom ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 3,466 ClubWRX
    edited January 6
    TS3.......longer, sounds better, better looking, and less money.
    Titleist TS3 10.5 degree HZRDUS Black Smoke 6.0 70g Stiff <br/> Titleist TS2 16.5 degree HZRDUS Black Smoke 6.0 70g Stiff <br/> Titleist 718 T-MB 3 iron Project X PXi 6.0<br/> Titleist 718 T-MB 4 iron Project X PXi 6.0<br/>Titleist 718 AP2 5 - 9 irons AMT Tour White S-300 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 48-10 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 52-08<br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 56-10 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 60-12 <br/> Odyssey O-works 2 Ball Red <br/> Titleist Pro V1X <br/> <br/> Titleist 905R 10.5 degree YS6+ Stiff <br/> Titleist 718 AP2 4 iron and pitching wedge <br/> Taylormade R7 425 TP <br/> Taylormade R7 TP Titanium 3 wood <br/> Scotty Cameron Select Newport <br/> Ping Anser 35 inch <br/> Cleveland Designed By blade putter (2) <br/> <br/>GO VOLS!!
  • moorebaseballmoorebaseball Advanced Members Posts: 215 ✭✭
    One of these or one if the new offerings from PING and Mizuno will be in my bag this year. Time will tell.
  • radimanradiman Advanced Members Posts: 4,481 ✭✭
    Bomber_11 wrote:


    I think you'll find very few people who've had a chance to hit all 3....



    What I will say is this...



    Titleist's improvement from 917D2/D3 to TS2/TS3 was a much bigger progression than Rogue -> Flash or M3 -> M5.




    I honestly had such a bad taste in my mouth from the 915 series that I never even tried the 917. After a while, I noticed that it was getting some good feedback. Was it a dog for most? It can be had for a steal now. Plus, it is a beautiful driver. I'm contemplating grabbing one for craps and giggles.
    Callaway Epic Flash 9* Tensei Pro Orange 70 TX
    Titleist 917 F3 15* Tensei Pro Blue 70 TX
    Callaway X-Forged UT 21* w/Motore Speeder TS 8.8 X
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW KBS 130X
    Taylormade Spider X Navy/White 35"
    Callaway MD3 54, 60, 64
    All sitting comfortably in my Sun Mountain Sync Cart Bag
  • texcromtexcrom ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 3,466 ClubWRX
    radiman wrote:

    Bomber_11 wrote:


    I think you'll find very few people who've had a chance to hit all 3....



    What I will say is this...



    Titleist's improvement from 917D2/D3 to TS2/TS3 was a much bigger progression than Rogue -> Flash or M3 -> M5.




    I honestly had such a bad taste in my mouth from the 915 series that I never even tried the 917. After a while, I noticed that it was getting some good feedback. Was it a dog for most? It can be had for a steal now. Plus, it is a beautiful driver. I'm contemplating grabbing one for craps and giggles.




    917 D3 is an excellent driver. Played it with a Diamana white for almost two years. Solid, and a great looking club.



    That being said, the TS3 is noticeably longer (probably because I got properly fitted, as well as a little hotter head), and more forgiving.



    Good luck, you won’t be disappointed.
    Titleist TS3 10.5 degree HZRDUS Black Smoke 6.0 70g Stiff <br/> Titleist TS2 16.5 degree HZRDUS Black Smoke 6.0 70g Stiff <br/> Titleist 718 T-MB 3 iron Project X PXi 6.0<br/> Titleist 718 T-MB 4 iron Project X PXi 6.0<br/>Titleist 718 AP2 5 - 9 irons AMT Tour White S-300 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 48-10 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 52-08<br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 56-10 <br/> Titleist Vokey SM7 60-12 <br/> Odyssey O-works 2 Ball Red <br/> Titleist Pro V1X <br/> <br/> Titleist 905R 10.5 degree YS6+ Stiff <br/> Titleist 718 AP2 4 iron and pitching wedge <br/> Taylormade R7 425 TP <br/> Taylormade R7 TP Titanium 3 wood <br/> Scotty Cameron Select Newport <br/> Ping Anser 35 inch <br/> Cleveland Designed By blade putter (2) <br/> <br/>GO VOLS!!
  • dmeeksDCdmeeksDC ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 2,084 ClubWRX
    I thought the 917 sounded and felt great — also very accurate — but it is clear the TS line is superior for distance.



    Like the shape of the Flash SZ but have yet to see it. Some have knocked the sound but I want to hear it for myself.
    Ping G400 9 degrees, Ping Tour stiff shaft, 65 grams
    Callaway XHot2 Pro 5 wood, 17 degrees, Aldila Tour Blue stiff shaft
    Titleist 915F fairway, 21 degrees, Diamana Blue 70 stiff
    Srixon 565 4 iron, Nippon 980GH stiff shaft
    Adams CMB irons, 5-PW, KBS C Taper regular shafts (110g)
    Titleist Vokey SM7 50 degree, F grind, Dynamic Gold S200 shaft
    Callaway Mack Daddy 2 54-degree wedge, S grind, DG wedge shaft
    Ben Hogan TK wedge, 59 degree, KBS black wedge shaft
    TaylorMade TP Chaska putter, sliver, 34 inches
  • tdk8180tdk8180 Advanced Members Posts: 2,392
    Titleist is late to the game and they still dont have a piece of equipment that can best the Callaway and Taylormade offerings. All their stuff is very nice looking, but I dont see any performance benefits.. ever.



    Looking forward to hitting the new Cally and TM offerings.
  • bogeyprobogeypro The Original Bogeypro ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 3,133 ClubWRX
    I loved the 917 d3. Great look and easy to hit fairways. It took some work to get distance out of it, but it was there. Get fit.
    Taylormade M1 (2017) 440 9.5* tour w/Speeder 757 Evo ii X<br />Taylormade M1 (2017) 3 wood w/Aldila Tour Blue 75x<br />Mizuno MP18 flihi 3 iron <br />Mizuno MP18 SC 4-pw KBS Tour<br />Taylormade High Toe 52/58 wedges <br />Scotty Cameron 5.5m
  • MahamiltoMahamilto Advanced Members Posts: 1,816 ✭✭
    edited January 7
    tdk8180 wrote:


    Titleist is late to the game and they still dont have a piece of equipment that can best the Callaway and Taylormade offerings. All their stuff is very nice looking, but I dont see any performance benefits.. ever.



    Looking forward to hitting the new Cally and TM offerings.




    Someone hasn't hit the TS2/TS3 me thinks...



    Granted, its one reviewer, but the best head to head can be seen in the Rick Sheils videos...



    Hit hit the TS2 as far as the Rogue SZ and the M3



    Hit the TS3 further than either



    Hit the M5/M6 the same as the TS3, and the Flash SZ barely edged them all...



    At the very least, the TS line keeps up with anything on the market. I've also found the TS3 to be significantly more forgiving than the M3 or Rogue SZ on ball speed retention and direction when off the screws. I hit literally every driver on the market head to head when the TS series came out. The only thing close to the TS3 was the G400LST, which wanted to go left more (my miss) so the TS3 made the bag.



    No, I haven't hit the Flash SZ or M5, but I'm not going to either. There is no shot they are going to give me much more than lower bank account.
    Titleist TS3 - 10.5 - HZRDUS Smoke Black 60 6.5
    Titleist 917F2 - 15*, Diamana S+ LTD 80TX
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3-4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-PW - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM2 59.12* - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Titleist AVX
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • stk123stk123 Advanced Members Posts: 439 ✭✭
    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...
  • Smitty120Smitty120 Advanced Members Posts: 431 ✭✭
    I agree 100% with your findings Mahamilto.
    M6 (9.0*) - ACCRA TZ6 65 M5
    M3 HL - Tensei 70TX
    P790 3 Iron - ADDI 95X
    P760 4-PW - DG TI X-100
    MG Raw 52, 58 - DG TI S-400

    Toulon Garage Atlanta
    TP5X
  • MahamiltoMahamilto Advanced Members Posts: 1,816 ✭✭
    edited January 7
    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    That is the shaft, not the head. The GP6s spun less in my TS3 than the Smoke 6.5



    Yes... GP6s...



    It actually spun so little that it will be on the BST soon.



    Driver SS is 115 or so here as well.
    Titleist TS3 - 10.5 - HZRDUS Smoke Black 60 6.5
    Titleist 917F2 - 15*, Diamana S+ LTD 80TX
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3-4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-PW - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM2 59.12* - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Titleist AVX
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16 Advanced Members Posts: 7,029 ✭✭
    F9 has to be tossed in there, too.
    WITB
    LTD Pro Kiyoshi White 65X
    LTD Kai'li 70X
    818H2 Tour Blue 85X
    Apex Pro Smoke incoming!!
    Stealth 2.0 50/10SS
    Stealth 2.0 54/12SS
    Stealth 2.0 58/10SS
    TP Black Copper Juno
    TP5X
    Sun Mountain 4.5 Bag
  • Puttfordough91Puttfordough91 Banned Posts: 120
    Bomber_11 wrote:


    I think you'll find very few people who've had a chance to hit all 3....



    What I will say is this...



    Titleist's improvement from 917D2/D3 to TS2/TS3 was a much bigger progression than Rogue -> Flash or M3 -> M5.


    Definitely agree
    TBD
    Tour issue 2017 m2 tour shaft tbd
    Nike vapor fly pro 3 fuji pro 115 ts
    4-9 jpx 919 tour c taper x
    Vokey 48 52 56 60 kbs c taper/hi rev
    Scotty buttonback newport 2
  • MahamiltoMahamilto Advanced Members Posts: 1,816 ✭✭
    I never could get the D2 to spin low enough, and the D3 was great when nutted, but really sprayed if missed.



    To me the TS3 is as easy to hit as the D2, but as low spinning (with higher launch) as the D3
    Titleist TS3 - 10.5 - HZRDUS Smoke Black 60 6.5
    Titleist 917F2 - 15*, Diamana S+ LTD 80TX
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3-4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-PW - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM2 59.12* - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Titleist AVX
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • GoGoErkyGoGoErky Advanced Members Posts: 991 ✭✭
    Imo ts3>m5>flash sz
  • LaymanMLaymanM Advanced Members Posts: 1,966 ✭✭
    Ts3 is a monster. One of longest drivers I've hit. Not experience with flash or m5/m6 yet.
    PING G400 Max 9*, Adidla Rogue Max 75x
    Callaway 815 Alpha 3W and 5W Speeder 665 stiff
    Srixon U65 4, Modus 105s
    Srixon Z785 5-PW Modus 120s
    Edel DVR 50, s200
    SM7 54F / 58K
    SC Studio Style Newport 2
  • SoCalTitleistSoCalTitleist Members, Advanced Members Posts: 3,250 ✭✭
    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    6.5 is too stiff for 100mph.
  • Puttfordough91Puttfordough91 Banned Posts: 120
    Never had this much trouble trying to decide which direction to go with a driver before
    TBD
    Tour issue 2017 m2 tour shaft tbd
    Nike vapor fly pro 3 fuji pro 115 ts
    4-9 jpx 919 tour c taper x
    Vokey 48 52 56 60 kbs c taper/hi rev
    Scotty buttonback newport 2
  • tdk8180tdk8180 Advanced Members Posts: 2,392
    Mahamilto wrote:

    tdk8180 wrote:


    Titleist is late to the game and they still dont have a piece of equipment that can best the Callaway and Taylormade offerings. All their stuff is very nice looking, but I dont see any performance benefits.. ever.



    Looking forward to hitting the new Cally and TM offerings.




    Someone hasn't hit the TS2/TS3 me thinks...



    Granted, its one reviewer, but the best head to head can be seen in the Rick Sheils videos...



    Hit hit the TS2 as far as the Rogue SZ and the M3



    Hit the TS3 further than either



    Hit the M5/M6 the same as the TS3, and the Flash SZ barely edged them all...



    At the very least, the TS line keeps up with anything on the market. I've also found the TS3 to be significantly more forgiving than the M3 or Rogue SZ on ball speed retention and direction when off the screws. I hit literally every driver on the market head to head when the TS series came out. The only thing close to the TS3 was the G400LST, which wanted to go left more (my miss) so the TS3 made the bag.



    No, I haven't hit the Flash SZ or M5, but I'm not going to either. There is no shot they are going to give me much more than lower bank account.




    Rick Shiels...ya, I hit a bunch of great shots out of the garage door range at Carls Golfland as well. After he shot in the high 80s at a tournament, I stopped watching his videos. Too many other reviewers out there for me to get some irrelevant information.



    Now...I have hit the TS stuff. Its alright, but it just doesnt perform as well as I thought it would. I thought the feel was ok at best. Swingweight felt odd to me, maybe too light. Im pulling it off the rack, so Im comparing to Cobra, Cally, and TM off the rack.



    Maybe I have to try it with my GD Tour AD collection that I have for the Callaway drivers. More fair test that way.



  • LaymanMLaymanM Advanced Members Posts: 1,966 ✭✭
    tdk8180 wrote:

    Mahamilto wrote:

    tdk8180 wrote:


    Titleist is late to the game and they still dont have a piece of equipment that can best the Callaway and Taylormade offerings. All their stuff is very nice looking, but I dont see any performance benefits.. ever.



    Looking forward to hitting the new Cally and TM offerings.




    Someone hasn't hit the TS2/TS3 me thinks...



    Granted, its one reviewer, but the best head to head can be seen in the Rick Sheils videos...



    Hit hit the TS2 as far as the Rogue SZ and the M3



    Hit the TS3 further than either



    Hit the M5/M6 the same as the TS3, and the Flash SZ barely edged them all...



    At the very least, the TS line keeps up with anything on the market. I've also found the TS3 to be significantly more forgiving than the M3 or Rogue SZ on ball speed retention and direction when off the screws. I hit literally every driver on the market head to head when the TS series came out. The only thing close to the TS3 was the G400LST, which wanted to go left more (my miss) so the TS3 made the bag.



    No, I haven't hit the Flash SZ or M5, but I'm not going to either. There is no shot they are going to give me much more than lower bank account.




    Rick Shiels...ya, I hit a bunch of great shots out of the garage door range at Carls Golfland as well. After he shot in the high 80s at a tournament, I stopped watching his videos. Too many other reviewers out there for me to get some irrelevant information.



    Now...I have hit the TS stuff. Its alright, but it just doesnt perform as well as I thought it would. I thought the feel was ok at best. Swingweight felt odd to me, maybe too light. Im pulling it off the rack, so Im comparing to Cobra, Cally, and TM off the rack.



    Maybe I have to try it with my GD Tour AD collection that I have for the Callaway drivers. More fair test that way.




    High 80s in a tournament...savage lol
    PING G400 Max 9*, Adidla Rogue Max 75x
    Callaway 815 Alpha 3W and 5W Speeder 665 stiff
    Srixon U65 4, Modus 105s
    Srixon Z785 5-PW Modus 120s
    Edel DVR 50, s200
    SM7 54F / 58K
    SC Studio Style Newport 2
  • hypergolfhypergolf Advanced Members Posts: 1,221
    edited January 7
  • ryan983ryan983 Advanced Members Posts: 665 ✭✭
    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    How did you pick up 14 mph club of head speed in such a short period of time?
  • MahamiltoMahamilto Advanced Members Posts: 1,816 ✭✭
    edited January 8
    I was just suggesting hitting the same shafts.



    And no, sheils isn’t perfect, but his strike pattern is very similar on gcquad on each review...



    Al I can tell ya is the TS3 easily paced the m5/m6, and maybe was a touch behind, but negligible than the Flash SZ.



    It’s the most apples to apples at this point. He’s not a robot, but his SS, AoA, and strike pattern were the same for each driver per GCQuad (a reference quality LM)



    It’s just safe to say that all the modern drivers will be reasonably close. One isn’t going to blow the doors off any other, unless it’s a poor shaft fit.
    Titleist TS3 - 10.5 - HZRDUS Smoke Black 60 6.5
    Titleist 917F2 - 15*, Diamana S+ LTD 80TX
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3-4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-PW - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM2 59.12* - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Titleist AVX
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • rt_chargerrt_charger Ball Hitter Advanced Members Posts: 132
    edited January 8
    tdk8180 wrote:


    Now...I have hit the TS stuff. Its alright, but it just doesnt perform as well as I thought it would. I thought the feel was ok at best. Swingweight felt odd to me, maybe too light. Im pulling it off the rack, so Im comparing to Cobra, Cally, and TM off the rack.


    Well there's your problem... Titleist woods are not going to work off the rack, you need to be fitted unless you know your specs and what shaft. Comparing their woods off the rack is like driving a car with the seat and mirrors not adjusted for you.
    "Golf is a game that is played on a five-inch course - the distance between your ears." - Bobby Jones
  • stk123stk123 Advanced Members Posts: 439 ✭✭
    ryan983 wrote:

    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    How did you pick up 14 mph club of head speed in such a short period of time?




    It was just a commitment to gain swing speed. I was about 110mph 3 years ago, then injury last year got me down to 101mph. Finally healed my injury (for most part) and worked out a ton, ate healthy, and committed to gaining swing speed. Swinging hard, overspeed training, etc. But one of the biggest difference makers was a major swing change as well. I gained back a lot of what I lost, and then some. A whole lot of gym/fitness and dedication. In the end, it was very hard work.
  • Albatross85Albatross85 The straightest hitters in golf don't hit it straight Advanced Members Posts: 2,810 ✭✭
    TS3 is a monster. Beat everything on the market for me in October.



    Haven't tried M5 or Flash, honestly not even tempted. All the reviewers have already shown there is nothing special in them. Seems like we are back to the high launch/low spin phenomenon for extra distance. M5 added no ballspeed from what i saw.



    TS3 was 3mph faster than 2nd place for me. I swing 116-118
    Titleist TS3 8.5* Tensei Pro White 70TX proto 44.5" D5 (206g)
    Titleist TS2 15.75* Tensei Pro White 80TX proto 42.5" D4
    Mizuno MP18 Fli-Hi #2 17.5* Handcrafted HZRDUS 105 6.5 39.75" D4
    Titleist 712U 4 iron C-taper S+ 125 D4
    Wilson FG Tour V6 5-P PX LZ 6.5 +3/8" D3.5 off 46* PW
    SM6 50.12F PX LZ 6.5 + 3/8"" D5
    RTX-4 Raw 56.08 Tour Issue S400 35.5" D6
    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 60.06TS DG Onyx S400 35.5" D6
    Odyssey Tour Only Jailbird Mini Versa BWB Plumbers Neck WHP insert
    Bridgestone Tour B XS
    UA Storm Match Play 14 way
    WITB Link
  • minteqminteq Advanced Members Posts: 2,855
    For me, the TS3 has been the longest and most forgiving driver I have hit to date. I will hit the Flash SZ and M5 when they come out, but I seriously doubt they will a huge amount better. Plus I like the all black head on the TS range, not to keen on the colors, lines and graphics on the other two. Just my $.02.
    Callaway Epic SZ Hzrdus T800
    Titleist TS2 16.5 Hzrdus Smoke 70s
    Nike VPC 4-Aw
    Callaway PM 56/60
    Nike 006 Proto
    Callaway Chrome Soft
  • stk123stk123 Advanced Members Posts: 439 ✭✭


    TS3 is a monster. Beat everything on the market for me in October.



    Haven't tried M5 or Flash, honestly not even tempted. All the reviewers have already shown there is nothing special in them. Seems like we are back to the high launch/low spin phenomenon for extra distance. M5 added no ballspeed from what i saw.



    TS3 was 3mph faster than 2nd place for me. I swing 116-118




    Is high launch and low spin a bad combo? Is it less forgiving and more erratic? Can you please explain pros and cons? Genuinely interested in learning.
  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Advanced Members Posts: 4,680 ✭✭
    stk123 wrote:



    TS3 is a monster. Beat everything on the market for me in October.



    Haven't tried M5 or Flash, honestly not even tempted. All the reviewers have already shown there is nothing special in them. Seems like we are back to the high launch/low spin phenomenon for extra distance. M5 added no ballspeed from what i saw.



    TS3 was 3mph faster than 2nd place for me. I swing 116-118




    Is high launch and low spin a bad combo? Is it less forgiving and more erratic? Can you please explain pros and cons? Genuinely interested in learning.




    High launch and low spin is a brilliant combination but drivers that specailise in that tend to be less forgiving. The prime example is the Taylor Made SLDR which seemed to really usher in the high spin/low launch generation. It was brilliant if you had the speed and put a good swing on it. If you struck it badly it was one of the least forgiving drivers you could find.



    My understanding is that create low launch and high spin the centre of gravity needs to be further forward in the head. That reduces the MOI. More forgiving drivers tend to have the centre of gravity further back.
    Titleist TS3 8.5 Stiff Project X Even Flow White T1100
    Titleist 915Fd 15 Stiff Rogue Black
    Titleist 915Hd 17.5 Stiff Diamana S+
    Titleist 714 AP2 4-PW Stiff KBS Tour
    Titleist Vokey SM6 50.08, 54.10 & 60.04
    Scotty Cameron Futura 5S
    ProV1x
  • gjlang76gjlang76 Advanced Members Posts: 212 ✭✭


    TS3 is a monster. Beat everything on the market for me in October.



    Haven't tried M5 or Flash, honestly not even tempted. All the reviewers have already shown there is nothing special in them. Seems like we are back to the high launch/low spin phenomenon for extra distance. M5 added no ballspeed from what i saw.



    TS3 was 3mph faster than 2nd place for me. I swing 116-118

    minteq wrote:


    For me, the TS3 has been the longest and most forgiving driver I have hit to date. I will hit the Flash SZ and M5 when they come out, but I seriously doubt they will a huge amount better. Plus I like the all black head on the TS range, not to keen on the colors, lines and graphics on the other two. Just my $.02.




    These 2 posts sum up it's performance perfectly. The TS3 is the best driver I have used to date and it looks great. Fastest ball speeds I have ever seen for my swing and it's very low spin. Even more impressive is that it gives me consistent (higher) launch, something I missed last year with the G400.
  • TollBrosTollBros Overseer of the Test Range Sponsors Posts: 4,813 ✭✭
    edited January 8
    We've hit them all so I'll give you a little summary.



    TS3 is a huge improvement in Titleist drivers. It brings them a lot closer than they have been to Callaway and Taylormade, especially in controlling spin. Ball speed is also quite respectable. They have not caught up but they are a lot closer than ever. Mid spin guys can now look at Titleist as an option when it used to really be only low spin players unless they wanted to give up 15+ yards.



    Epic Flash SZ is basically the same club as the original SZ with a bit better off center ball speed with their new face design. It's not massively better, but it's an improvement.



    M5 is going to give you the same high end of the industry ball speeds that Taylormade always produced, as well as even lower spin numbers from the previous generation. Twist face works no matter what anyone says and even the slightest advantage is worth having.



    Overall every company is going to claim more ball speed every year but the CT is maxed out so any additional ball speed is very small and best. However they do keep finding ways to keep the mishits cloer to and farther down the fairway. Anyone claiming huge ball speed jumps either had a dud head or a misfit set up for them previously. 1-3 mph MAX is all you'll see assuming apples to apples on specs.
    http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/forum/608-greengrassevaluationscom/

    Please click the link above for our Sponsor area with rare and Tour only products.
  • radimanradiman Advanced Members Posts: 4,481 ✭✭
    TollBros wrote:


    We've hit them all so I'll give you a little summary.



    TS3 is a huge improvement in Titleist drivers. It brings them a lot closer than they have been to Callaway and Taylormade, especially in controlling spin. Ball speed is also quite respectable. They have not caught up but they are a lot closer than ever. Mid spin guys can now look at Titleist as an option when it used to really be only low spin players unless they wanted to give up 15+ yards.



    Epic Flash SZ is basically the same club as the original SZ with a bit better off center ball speed with their new face design. It's not massively better, but it's an improvement.



    M5 is going to give you the same high end of the industry ball speeds that Taylormade always produced, as well as even lower spin numbers from the previous generation. Twist face works no matter what anyone says and even the slightest advantage is worth having.



    Overall every company is going to claim more ball speed every year but the CT is maxed out so any additional ball speed is very small and best. However they do keep finding ways to keep the mishits cloer to and farther down the fairway. Anyone claiming huge ball speed jumps either had a dud head or a misfit set up for them previously. 1-3 mph MAX is all you'll see assuming apples to apples on specs.




    I know shaft testing is your wheel house. But, when you guys test these heads, do you collect similar data? Is there any chance of said data making its way here? I think you guys do a great job of representing different speeds and your testers do a good job of verbally describing the results.
    Callaway Epic Flash 9* Tensei Pro Orange 70 TX
    Titleist 917 F3 15* Tensei Pro Blue 70 TX
    Callaway X-Forged UT 21* w/Motore Speeder TS 8.8 X
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW KBS 130X
    Taylormade Spider X Navy/White 35"
    Callaway MD3 54, 60, 64
    All sitting comfortably in my Sun Mountain Sync Cart Bag
  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Advanced Members Posts: 4,680 ✭✭
    Looks like the Scottish Golf magazine Bunkered, has been taking note of WRX, this was just posted 20 minutes ago - https://youtu.be/Dqvlq2Qcs3E



    I've not watched it yet but thought some of you guys might like to take a look at it.
    Titleist TS3 8.5 Stiff Project X Even Flow White T1100
    Titleist 915Fd 15 Stiff Rogue Black
    Titleist 915Hd 17.5 Stiff Diamana S+
    Titleist 714 AP2 4-PW Stiff KBS Tour
    Titleist Vokey SM6 50.08, 54.10 & 60.04
    Scotty Cameron Futura 5S
    ProV1x
  • radimanradiman Advanced Members Posts: 4,481 ✭✭
    MattyO1984 wrote:


    Looks like the Scottish Golf magazine Bunkered, has been taking note of WRX, this was just posted 20 minutes ago - https://youtu.be/Dqvlq2Qcs3E



    I've not watched it yet but thought some of you guys might like to take a look at it.




    Thanks for posting that. As kind of expected. They are all within a few mph's and yards to one another.
    Callaway Epic Flash 9* Tensei Pro Orange 70 TX
    Titleist 917 F3 15* Tensei Pro Blue 70 TX
    Callaway X-Forged UT 21* w/Motore Speeder TS 8.8 X
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW KBS 130X
    Taylormade Spider X Navy/White 35"
    Callaway MD3 54, 60, 64
    All sitting comfortably in my Sun Mountain Sync Cart Bag
  • moorebaseballmoorebaseball Advanced Members Posts: 215 ✭✭
    Choose the driver that fits your eye and finds the fairway when you test. Sounds easy enough!
  • boycer11boycer11 ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 3,416 ClubWRX
    edited January 8
    That mean it's all about forgiveness then? He say the m5 is the most forgiving?



    For those that dont want to waste your time, in summary, they are all great driver, he picked the epic sz, which was 4 yards longer.



    Pick the one you like the best and get fit.
    Ping G400 max tensei orange pro
    Callaway epic flash sz 3 wood
    Ping g400 5 wd rogue black 7s
    ping g410 tensei hybrid
    Epon 705 5-aw limited black kbs flt matte black/Callaway Apex 2019 combo
    miura limited black tour 2018 54/58
    taylormade jdm itsy bitsy spider
    ping hoofer
    tp5x
  • smdykassmdykas Advanced Members Posts: 141 ✭✭
    radiman wrote:

    Bomber_11 wrote:


    I think you'll find very few people who've had a chance to hit all 3....



    What I will say is this...



    Titleist's improvement from 917D2/D3 to TS2/TS3 was a much bigger progression than Rogue -> Flash or M3 -> M5.




    I honestly had such a bad taste in my mouth from the 915 series that I never even tried the 917. After a while, I noticed that it was getting some good feedback. Was it a dog for most? It can be had for a steal now. Plus, it is a beautiful driver. I'm contemplating grabbing one for craps and giggles.




    I had similar experience. I did hit the TS line. Totally different. Very amazing.



    I have purchased a Rogue SZ late last year for an incredible deal and so I am not in the market for a new driver. Epic Flash tech looks legit. G410 could be a show stopper.
  • smdykassmdykas Advanced Members Posts: 141 ✭✭
    gjlang76 wrote:



    TS3 is a monster. Beat everything on the market for me in October.



    Haven't tried M5 or Flash, honestly not even tempted. All the reviewers have already shown there is nothing special in them. Seems like we are back to the high launch/low spin phenomenon for extra distance. M5 added no ballspeed from what i saw.



    TS3 was 3mph faster than 2nd place for me. I swing 116-118

    minteq wrote:


    For me, the TS3 has been the longest and most forgiving driver I have hit to date. I will hit the Flash SZ and M5 when they come out, but I seriously doubt they will a huge amount better. Plus I like the all black head on the TS range, not to keen on the colors, lines and graphics on the other two. Just my $.02.




    These 2 posts sum up it's performance perfectly. The TS3 is the best driver I have used to date and it looks great. Fastest ball speeds I have ever seen for my swing and it's very low spin. Even more impressive is that it gives me consistent (higher) launch, something I missed last year with the G400.




    I had the problem of hitting the G400 too high. TS is amazing. Let me know if you want to sell that G400...
  • TollBrosTollBros Overseer of the Test Range Sponsors Posts: 4,813 ✭✭
    radiman wrote:

    TollBros wrote:


    We've hit them all so I'll give you a little summary.



    TS3 is a huge improvement in Titleist drivers. It brings them a lot closer than they have been to Callaway and Taylormade, especially in controlling spin. Ball speed is also quite respectable. They have not caught up but they are a lot closer than ever. Mid spin guys can now look at Titleist as an option when it used to really be only low spin players unless they wanted to give up 15+ yards.



    Epic Flash SZ is basically the same club as the original SZ with a bit better off center ball speed with their new face design. It's not massively better, but it's an improvement.



    M5 is going to give you the same high end of the industry ball speeds that Taylormade always produced, as well as even lower spin numbers from the previous generation. Twist face works no matter what anyone says and even the slightest advantage is worth having.



    Overall every company is going to claim more ball speed every year but the CT is maxed out so any additional ball speed is very small and best. However they do keep finding ways to keep the mishits cloer to and farther down the fairway. Anyone claiming huge ball speed jumps either had a dud head or a misfit set up for them previously. 1-3 mph MAX is all you'll see assuming apples to apples on specs.




    I know shaft testing is your wheel house. But, when you guys test these heads, do you collect similar data? Is there any chance of said data making its way here? I think you guys do a great job of representing different speeds and your testers do a good job of verbally describing the results.




    We test everything, and I mean everything. Long term durability of golf bags, shirts, shoes, etc. We test golf ball performance and durability, shafts, heads, etc. If it's golf, there's a customer that submits it for testing so we are very familiar with every form of equipment testing.



    As for the data, the issue is that the customer who presents the product, legally owns the data. That handcuffs us on being able to release it. We generally will retest product on our own, which is what you see in the site here, but we generally have embargos on any data gained with new products and this needs to be cleared with the client before we can post anything data related. It's a legal process we are bound to, which is why we don't post a lot more. Saying all that, you'll see the M5 and M6 hard data when we have the Tour heads in stock in about 5-6 weeks.
    http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/forum/608-greengrassevaluationscom/

    Please click the link above for our Sponsor area with rare and Tour only products.
  • radimanradiman Advanced Members Posts: 4,481 ✭✭
    TollBros wrote:

    radiman wrote:

    TollBros wrote:


    We've hit them all so I'll give you a little summary.



    TS3 is a huge improvement in Titleist drivers. It brings them a lot closer than they have been to Callaway and Taylormade, especially in controlling spin. Ball speed is also quite respectable. They have not caught up but they are a lot closer than ever. Mid spin guys can now look at Titleist as an option when it used to really be only low spin players unless they wanted to give up 15+ yards.



    Epic Flash SZ is basically the same club as the original SZ with a bit better off center ball speed with their new face design. It's not massively better, but it's an improvement.



    M5 is going to give you the same high end of the industry ball speeds that Taylormade always produced, as well as even lower spin numbers from the previous generation. Twist face works no matter what anyone says and even the slightest advantage is worth having.



    Overall every company is going to claim more ball speed every year but the CT is maxed out so any additional ball speed is very small and best. However they do keep finding ways to keep the mishits cloer to and farther down the fairway. Anyone claiming huge ball speed jumps either had a dud head or a misfit set up for them previously. 1-3 mph MAX is all you'll see assuming apples to apples on specs.




    I know shaft testing is your wheel house. But, when you guys test these heads, do you collect similar data? Is there any chance of said data making its way here? I think you guys do a great job of representing different speeds and your testers do a good job of verbally describing the results.




    We test everything, and I mean everything. Long term durability of golf bags, shirts, shoes, etc. We test golf ball performance and durability, shafts, heads, etc. If it's golf, there's a customer that submits it for testing so we are very familiar with every form of equipment testing.



    As for the data, the issue is that the customer who presents the product, legally owns the data. That handcuffs us on being able to release it. We generally will retest product on our own, which is what you see in the site here, but we generally have embargos on any data gained with new products and this needs to be cleared with the client before we can post anything data related. It's a legal process we are bound to, which is why we don't post a lot more. Saying all that, you'll see the M5 and M6 hard data when we have the Tour heads in stock in about 5-6 weeks.




    Didn't realize that. Thanks for sharing. Sounds like a cool job! Totally understand the legalities of it all. Look forward to the M5 and M6 data though.
    Callaway Epic Flash 9* Tensei Pro Orange 70 TX
    Titleist 917 F3 15* Tensei Pro Blue 70 TX
    Callaway X-Forged UT 21* w/Motore Speeder TS 8.8 X
    Callaway 2016 Apex Pro 4-PW KBS 130X
    Taylormade Spider X Navy/White 35"
    Callaway MD3 54, 60, 64
    All sitting comfortably in my Sun Mountain Sync Cart Bag
  •  SwooshLT SwooshLT Advanced Members Posts: 6,926 ✭✭
    MattyO1984 wrote:


    Looks like the Scottish Golf magazine Bunkered, has been taking note of WRX, this was just posted 20 minutes ago - [url=&quot;



    I've not watched it yet but thought some of you guys might like to take a look at it.






    Beat me to it!
  • wfrogge1wfrogge1 Advanced Members Posts: 1,183 ✭✭
    edited January 8
    Just a few years ago TM drivers were by far the leaders when it came to distance. You would have one or two other OEMs every year that would have a driver that were close distance wise and slightly more forgiving they were rare and OEMs that could match TM would vary year by year. I hated to admit it at the time but it was 100% true.



    When Callaway released the Epic line two years ago the game changed. They matched TM step for step with distance and forgiveness and were both a step ahead of every other OEM.



    2018 it seems that every OEM figured out how to match these two. Ping, Cobra, Titleist, Srixon, Mizuno, TEE, **** even Wilson figured out how to match TM and Callaway. The game has changed....



    Its more than safe to say that for 2019 the three drivers you mentioned will be equal so it will come down to looks and feel.
  • ryan983ryan983 Advanced Members Posts: 665 ✭✭
    stk123 wrote:

    ryan983 wrote:

    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    How did you pick up 14 mph club of head speed in such a short period of time?




    It was just a commitment to gain swing speed. I was about 110mph 3 years ago, then injury last year got me down to 101mph. Finally healed my injury (for most part) and worked out a ton, ate healthy, and committed to gaining swing speed. Swinging hard, overspeed training, etc. But one of the biggest difference makers was a major swing change as well. I gained back a lot of what I lost, and then some. A whole lot of gym/fitness and dedication. In the end, it was very hard work.




    Glad you are back healthy! Interested to see how your fitting turns out. I’d have a hard time making claims about something spinning too much for me if I was injured or just coming off injury. I have no dog in this fight. I play an M3 and Titleist fw, hybrid and irons
  • rt_chargerrt_charger Ball Hitter Advanced Members Posts: 132
    wfrogge1 wrote:


    Just a few years ago TM drivers were by far the leaders when it came to distance. You would have one or two other OEMs every year that would have a driver that were close distance wise and slightly more forgiving they were rare and OEMs that could match TM would vary year by year. I hated to admit it at the time but it was 100% true.



    When Callaway released the Epic line two years ago the game changed. They matched TM step for step with distance and forgiveness and were both a step ahead of every other OEM.



    2018 it seems that every OEM figured out how to match these two. Ping, Cobra, Titleist, Srixon, Mizuno, TEE, **** even Wilson figured out how to match TM and Callaway. The game has changed....



    Its more than safe to say that for 2019 the three drivers you mentioned will be equal so it will come down to looks and feel.


    This 100%. Why I'll be going the ST190
    "Golf is a game that is played on a five-inch course - the distance between your ears." - Bobby Jones
  • stk123stk123 Advanced Members Posts: 439 ✭✭
    ryan983 wrote:

    stk123 wrote:

    ryan983 wrote:

    stk123 wrote:


    My problem with the TS3 was that it spun too much. And this was when I was swinging my club 101mph (now about 115mph, so I assume it will spin way more). I was hitting the TS3 with Smoke 6.5 shaft about 2600 RPM, while I was hitting my Epic SZ (not Flash) 1800 RPM with front weight 12g and rear 2g and GP6-X shaft.



    I really liked the TS3, but spun too much. Will give it another shot at Club Champion fitting coming up this month next to the Epic Flash and other offerings. We will see...




    How did you pick up 14 mph club of head speed in such a short period of time?




    It was just a commitment to gain swing speed. I was about 110mph 3 years ago, then injury last year got me down to 101mph. Finally healed my injury (for most part) and worked out a ton, ate healthy, and committed to gaining swing speed. Swinging hard, overspeed training, etc. But one of the biggest difference makers was a major swing change as well. I gained back a lot of what I lost, and then some. A whole lot of gym/fitness and dedication. In the end, it was very hard work.




    Glad you are back healthy! Interested to see how your fitting turns out. I'd have a hard time making claims about something spinning too much for me if I was injured or just coming off injury. I have no dog in this fight. I play an M3 and Titleist fw, hybrid and irons




    Just to clarify, I had a nagging injury for over a year and played that way all year (pretty successfully too). Over that time my swing got slower and slower (100mph), probably subconsciously to protect myself from injuring further. I still hit my Epic SZ with GP 6x shaft 1800rpms on Trackman while TS3 with Smoke 6.5 was 2600+rpms. I know shafts make a difference, but both those models are supposed to be low spin (albeit GP is lower).



    Over that period of time, I was also hitting my irons a little too low.



    Now I got my swing speed back up over 110mph and everything goes way higher and I would assume even more spin. But I will keep an open mind. It is very possible that the smoke shaft just spun too much for my swing. Sad part is that I hit that combo perfectly during the demo day. Just felt right to me. Either way I am sure CC will fit me properly into something out there.
  • MahamiltoMahamilto Advanced Members Posts: 1,816 ✭✭
    On gcquad the Hzrdus smoke 6.5 spun average of 2400



    The GP6S (stiff! Not even X) spun 1950



    Both same TS3 head.



    The GP, for me, was much lower spin. Too low considering the lower launch I saw.



    The feel may change my release or something, but I promise you those shafts aren’t even close to comparable... at least not for me.
    Titleist TS3 - 10.5 - HZRDUS Smoke Black 60 6.5
    Titleist 917F2 - 15*, Diamana S+ LTD 80TX
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3-4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-PW - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM2 59.12* - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Titleist AVX
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • Smitty120Smitty120 Advanced Members Posts: 431 ✭✭
    Each time I have been fitted indoors and pay attention to numbers the result on course is always different. I wanted to love and continue to game my M3 with my go to shaft. With the Exact same driver head weight, swing weight, Shaft length and loft the M3 was longer by 9 yards indoors on monitors. I went onto the course with that outlook, but on course in the "real world" the TS3 is longer and straighter. The misses with the TS3 are much better than M3.
    M6 (9.0*) - ACCRA TZ6 65 M5
    M3 HL - Tensei 70TX
    P790 3 Iron - ADDI 95X
    P760 4-PW - DG TI X-100
    MG Raw 52, 58 - DG TI S-400

    Toulon Garage Atlanta
    TP5X
  • bcflyguy1bcflyguy1 Enjoying my coffee... Advanced Members Posts: 3,012 ✭✭
    Say what you will about Crossfield, but his message in every driver review is the same and pretty much hits the nail on the head.



    1. Test clubs for yourself. Someone else's results or opinions to include his own, while they might be entertaining, are of little or no value in determining what will work best for you.



    2. When you find a club you particularly like, get fit for it.



    3. All the major OEM's make a great product, and any performance differences between them are negligible (hence he goes on and on about 262).



    4. If you want a new club simply because you want a shiny new toy, that's a perfectly legitimate reason to buy.
    Never forget that the luxury of being
    wrong is not enough to make you right.
    WITB Link
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