Pace of play and the new rules

With the new rules taking effect on the LPGA last week, most notably caddies no longer being able to line up shots for the women. Will we see any change in pace of play on the LPGA?

No.

No. The vast majority of time is still wasted discussing the shot options on approach shots, and reading putts from 97 different angles. Oh, then one has to consider the remote chance that the wind has shifted direction by 0.7 degrees, or increased in speed from 4 mph to 5 mph.

The thing that bugs me the most is that all players reach their balls in the fairway at roughly the same time, but you still see players starting their decision making process after their playing partner on the other side of the fairway has hit their ball. I've timed players taking over 90 seconds to hit, when 30 should be plenty of time.

I firmly believe that the current timing rules are a total joke. A fast player should not be put on the clock because they are playing with a snail. A fast player will often adjust their routine to make up for the slower player, and that's simply not fair. I think the answer is quite straightforward. There should be a timing official with every group or player, and every shot should be timed, not just when the group is put on the clock.

Who cares if pace of play in a tour gets improved or not. The broadcasts are scheduled for a certain time and will run that time refardless. The tours get af money and aren’t going to reduce air time and lose revenue. It’s not like they show every shot of every player, they do cutaway or go to a replay.

Unfortunately, the coverage will often not cut away, and instead sit there watching a player take 90 seconds to decide on a club. They could have shown three shots in that time. Also, there are some tournaments where they split coverage between the morning and afternoon waves. If the rounds were faster, we'd see more shots by more players.

The GC generally has only two mobile cameras that are used to cover the "feature" groups. If these groups played faster, the cameras could be put back into action on another group(s).

I would like to see caddies gone all together. Allow rangefinders, use push carts, make your own choices.

I want to see your skills,your knowledge of the course, your choice of clubs not the caddies. If you need a therapy session, or a shoulder to lean on, do it after the round. This goes for guy and gals.

With the new rules taking effect on the LPGA last week, most notably caddies no longer being able to line up shots for the women. Will we see any change in pace of play on the LPGA?

The answer is NO. The next time someone says caddies lining up players is affecting the pace of play I am going to blow a gasket. It takes 3 seconds to line up a player. Bryson DeChambeau takes 2 minutes to survey the air particles, so does JB Holmes plumb bobbing a 1 footer.

This is basically a LPGA rule. And it has become an image thing rather than a pace of play issue. A common argument is that it is a "basic skill" to line oneself up. Fine, but shouldn't reading a putt or calculating yardage also qualifies as such ?

And you can count on the governing bodies trying to address a grey area issue and turning it into a mess.

Why would it when it was implemented to address the skill in lining up issue?

As to the previous poster saying lining up to getting yardage and reading a green, lining up is getting confirmation from a person in a position who can say with certainty.

Reading a green and guesstimating yardage doesn't have that certainty.

Being lined up would be more line using a range finder or those green reading/level devices.

I would like to see caddies gone all together. Allow rangefinders, use push carts, make your own choices.

 

I want to see your skills,your knowledge of the course, your choice of clubs not the caddies. If you need a therapy session, or a shoulder to lean on, do it after the round. This goes for guy and gals.

Would this also apply to Slicer and Dave when they play the Old Course? Of course not, caddies are part of the history of golf, and are specifically allowed under the Rules. Much like the flagstick rule, the Tour can't eliminate caddies without eliminating the Rules of Golf.

I would like to see caddies gone all together. Allow rangefinders, use push carts, make your own choices.

 

I want to see your skills,your knowledge of the course, your choice of clubs not the caddies. If you need a therapy session, or a shoulder to lean on, do it after the round. This goes for guy and gals.

Would this also apply to Slicer and Dave when they play the Old Course? Of course not, caddies are part of the history of golf, and are specifically allowed under the Rules. Much like the flagstick rule, the Tour can't eliminate caddies without eliminating the Rules of Golf.

Agreed. Caddies c an give advice, but not execute the shot. It boils down to whether one believes that alignment is part of the "shot", or advice. I believe it's part of the shot, and agree with the new rule.

Now, for the love of God, please start enforcing the other rules. You know, the rules governing the time for each shot? It should take 80 seconds to line up a putt.

No. The vast majority of time is still wasted discussing the shot options on approach shots, and reading putts from 97 different angles. Oh, then one has to consider the remote chance that the wind has shifted direction by 0.7 degrees, or increased in speed from 4 mph to 5 mph.

 

The thing that bugs me the most is that all players reach their balls in the fairway at roughly the same time, but you still see players starting their decision making process after their playing partner on the other side of the fairway has hit their ball. I've timed players taking over 90 seconds to hit, when 30 should be plenty of time.

 

I firmly believe that the current timing rules are a total joke. A fast player should not be put on the clock because they are playing with a snail. A fast player will often adjust their routine to make up for the slower player, and that's simply not fair. I think the answer is quite straightforward. There should be a timing official with every group or player, and every shot should be timed, not just when the group is put on the clock.

In my opinion, that is one area that players needs to work on and one of the biggest factor of slow play. I see that too often on the greens. One just stands around looking around then start preparing for their putts only when it is their turn to play.

I would like to see caddies gone all together. Allow rangefinders, use push carts, make your own choices.

 

I want to see your skills,your knowledge of the course, your choice of clubs not the caddies. If you need a therapy session, or a shoulder to lean on, do it after the round. This goes for guy and gals.

Would this also apply to Slicer and Dave when they play the Old Course? Of course not, caddies are part of the history of golf, and are specifically allowed under the Rules. Much like the flagstick rule, the Tour can't eliminate caddies without eliminating the Rules of Golf.

 

Agreed. Caddies c an give advice, but not execute the shot. It boils down to whether one believes that alignment is part of the "shot", or advice. I believe it's part of the shot, and agree with the new rule.

 

Now, for the love of God, please start enforcing the other rules. You know, the rules governing the time for each shot? It should take 80 seconds to line up a putt.

This is the problem, there isn't a rule governing the time for each shot, at least not until a group falls significantly behind the preceding group. At least that's the policy in the men's PGA Tour, I'm not completely sure what the LPGA policy is.

The LPGA policy is the same. The game needs a shot clock on all shots, not just ones after a group has been put on the clock. If the first twosome or threesome out pokes along at a 5 hour pace, it's rare that any group behind them will fall behind, but they're all playing too d*mn slow.

The LPGA policy is the same. The game needs a shot clock on all shots, not just ones after a group has been put on the clock. If the first twosome or threesome out pokes along at a 5 hour pace, it's rare that any group behind them will fall behind, but they're all playing too d*mn slow.

The first group can, and should, be put on the clock if they fall behind the "pace of play chart". But until the players as a group decide they want to change the policy, we're unlikely to see any change.

The LPGA did well yesterday, Nelly and Haru played in 3:50.

I know this would be against the spirit and make things worse in the short term, but if I was playing with a slow player, I would slow down to even slower pace than the slower players pace and try to get put on the clock. If I have a good pace being on the clock will only be a slight nuisance but if the slow players have to speed up it will drive them crazy and affect their games.

Argonne touched on this, but when a player at the tour level hits a drive into the fairway, they have to know pretty much where the ball ends up. Walking down the fairway, the wind is blowing in whatever direction, which seems impossible to ignore. However, it seems that they are surprised by their location, and the wind has not entered their mind at all. So, you have players standing around, throwing grass, peering at the trees, looking at their yardage books, all of which should have been done before it's time to play. The TV time is a strawman, the tour can adjust starting times, and we would see more players if rounds were shortened by 30 minutes. The lining up was annoying to watch, but once aligned, the players pulled the trigger.

The LPGA policy is the same. The game needs a shot clock on all shots, not just ones after a group has been put on the clock. If the first twosome or threesome out pokes along at a 5 hour pace, it's rare that any group behind them will fall behind, but they're all playing too d*mn slow.

Generally I agree with this/your prior comments (and Brooks/Adam Scott). Go the NBA/NFL model and either be lying 2 or backup 5 yards (could be an advantage) if you don't hit the ball in time.

One thing I think the players do (that we probably would do too if playing for the stakes they are playing for) is watch the ball flight of the others' shots in their group. Obviously, they won't know exactly how flush the shot was but they can get some clues on whether the wind is doing something different than they thought.

But this does't mean they can't have yardages / a planed club ready to go the vast majority of the time.