TaylorMade M5 cracking already ???

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  • dcmidnightdcmidnight Marshals, BST Volunteer Mods Posts: 12,117 mod
    Redbird wrote:


    I just got my M5 today and I honestly can't see how the **** you can hit that part of the club unless you take a divot with your driver. If you're one to slam your club down after a bad tee shot, I'd probably avoid that with this club.




    After a week or so, these are my thoughts as well. I just dont see how you could do it. That being said, IMO, its a terrible design, doesnt seem to add anything at all unless a simulation showed that it increased the aerodynamics.



    BUT - I've also been around a while and I feel like this happens with some OEM club or another every during release season. There are always a handful of reports about...something happening. I caved in the face of an RBZ 3 wood back in the day. Called TM and I had a replacement in my hand in less than 48 hours.



    I will say this, I've used plastic tees for the last ten years or so (Epochs or Prides). If this does happen and if TM admits its because of the tees - two huge ifs BTW - it will go down as one of the biggest laughingstocks in recent memory.
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  • Ed SettleEd Settle #InsideTMAG ClubWRX Posts: 6,052 ClubWRX
    edited Jan 30, 2019 7:51am #93
    dcmidnight wrote:

    Redbird wrote:


    I just got my M5 today and I honestly can't see how the **** you can hit that part of the club unless you take a divot with your driver. If you're one to slam your club down after a bad tee shot, I'd probably avoid that with this club.




    After a week or so, these are my thoughts as well. I just dont see how you could do it. That being said, IMO, its a terrible design, doesnt seem to add anything at all unless a simulation showed that it increased the aerodynamics.



    BUT - I've also been around a while and I feel like this happens with some OEM club or another every during release season. There are always a handful of reports about...something happening. I caved in the face of an RBZ 3 wood back in the day. Called TM and I had a replacement in my hand in less than 48 hours.



    I will say this, I've used plastic tees for the last ten years or so (Epochs or Prides). If this does happen and if TM admits its because of the tees - two huge ifs BTW - it will go down as one of the biggest laughingstocks in recent memory.




    Agreed. Did you see picture above? Just one of the Tour pictures from this week. That is not from hitting a simulator tee or Indoor mat tee.
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  • dcmidnightdcmidnight Marshals, BST Volunteer Mods Posts: 12,117 mod
    Ed Settle wrote:


    Agreed. Did you see picture above? Just one of the Tour pictures from this week. That is not from hitting a simulator tee or Indoor mat tee.




    I really cant overly concern myself with what happens to a tour head being swung by a tour player. I avg 108 ss wth the driver so tour swings are at least 10-15 mph higher than mine. The likelihood of me doing something to a club that a tour guy does is bordering on zero. Plus its impossible to say without knowing exactly who it was, what happened, how long they had the club etc.
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  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,157 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 9:03am #95
    That’s not happening because of swing speed. It’s happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reinforced or removed all together or this will continue to happen. It’s in the design not the materials or craftsmanship. Problem is I’m guessing that lip is there in the first place to prevent tees from jamming into the weight rail.
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  • Here comes the BoomHere comes the Boom Members Posts: 223 ✭✭✭
    Big Ben wrote:


    That’s not happening because of swing speed. It’s happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reforced or removed all together.




    EXACTLY
  • t4t3rt4t3r Members Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Certainly doesn’t seem like the best design but TM would be one of my top choices as far as having to deal with a warranty issue. They have gone above and beyond on every issue I’ve ever had.
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  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day... south carolinaMembers Posts: 27,633 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 9:53am #98
    Big Ben wrote:


    That’s not happening because of swing speed. It’s happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reinforced or removed all together or this will continue to happen. It’s in the design not the materials or craftsmanship. Problem is I’m guessing that lip is there in the first place to prevent tees from jamming into the weight rail.




    That’s correct. Pic above is a tour head. So no doubt it’s not simulator tee involved.
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  • ignitewvuignitewvu Members Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Toothpaste wrote:

    noodle3872 wrote:


    Look at all the Tour WITB. These guys hit hundreds if not thousands of balls and none of the M5’s in the pics show this damage. Sure, it breaks, they get a new one and so on. I still believe the root cause of the carbon breakage is abuse.




    http://www.golfwrx.c...8#entry18567688




    There are a lot of people in total denial on how bad this is gonna be to TM. The design is a mess.......I would expect in due time 50-70% of all M5's sold will have this issue if the owner actually plays a lot of golf. That number will go up exponentially if the golfer spends time at the drive range with Mats on Concrete.
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  • swgolf12swgolf12 Members Posts: 952 ✭✭✭✭✭
    dcmidnight wrote:

    Ed Settle wrote:


    Agreed. Did you see picture above? Just one of the Tour pictures from this week. That is not from hitting a simulator tee or Indoor mat tee.




    I really cant overly concern myself with what happens to a tour head being swung by a tour player. I avg 108 ss wth the driver so tour swings are at least 10-15 mph higher than mine. The likelihood of me doing something to a club that a tour guy does is bordering on zero. Plus its impossible to say without knowing exactly who it was, what happened, how long they had the club etc.




    The PGA Tour average is 5MPH faster than yours, and with the guys swinging 120+ that means there's plenty of guys swinging your swing speed on tour. You mentioned you caved a RBZ 3 wood, pros do that. It almost seems like you're going out of your way to say this is a non issue for TM, when the photographic evidence is saying something else.
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  • jll62jll62 ClubWRX Posts: 2,147 ClubWRX

    Big Ben wrote:


    That's not happening because of swing speed. It's happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reinforced or removed all together or this will continue to happen. It's in the design not the materials or craftsmanship. Problem is I'm guessing that lip is there in the first place to prevent tees from jamming into the weight rail.




    That's correct. Pic above is a tour head. So no doubt it's not simulator tee involved.




    That head belongs to a section pro, not a regular tour pro. Who's to say he isn't practicing out of a hitting bay periodically using mat with one of those fiberbuilt tees?



    Not saying that's the case, but just because it's a tour head does not imply a range tee isn't involved.
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  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,157 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    This is a problem folks I don’t care how it happens (even though it’s definitely a tee). It’s a design flaw plain and simple. I would expect it to be corrected however.
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  • JagpilotohioJagpilotohio 45+ inch drivers are evil. Columbus, OHMembers Posts: 7,253 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Big Ben wrote:


    That’s not happening because of swing speed. It’s happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reinforced or removed all together or this will continue to happen. It’s in the design not the materials or craftsmanship. Problem is I’m guessing that lip is there in the first place to prevent tees from jamming into the weight rail.




    Very Interesting theory there Ben. Maybe they ADDED that stupid little flap....that does look oddly out of place....because tees were getting jammed up in that track after impact during some initial prototype testing.



    They tried to fix one problem and inadvertently created a new one. Hummmm.
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  • dcmidnightdcmidnight Marshals, BST Volunteer Mods Posts: 12,117 mod
    edited Jan 30, 2019 11:50am #104
    swgolf12 wrote:


    The PGA Tour average is 5MPH faster than yours, and with the guys swinging 120+ that means there's plenty of guys swinging your swing speed on tour. You mentioned you caved a RBZ 3 wood, pros do that. It almost seems like you're going out of your way to say this is a non issue for TM, when the photographic evidence is saying something else.




    I dont think I said anything of the sort. In fact I think I said if this turns out to be an issue for TM it will be one of the biggest laughingstocks in recent memory. Thats actually what I said.



    BTW what "evidence" are we talking about? All I'm saying is so far I've seen a couple of pictures and a couple of stories about issues. Thats a far cry from being a 50% failure rate.


    Big Ben wrote:


    That's not happening because of swing speed. It's happening because the tee is jamming into that overlapping lip. I bet that lip will be reinforced or removed all together or this will continue to happen. It's in the design not the materials or craftsmanship. Problem is I'm guessing that lip is there in the first place to prevent tees from jamming into the weight rail.




    Completely disagree with...the combination of ideas here. If the tee>lip is what the issue is, what you are saying is that the force the average amatuer puts on it with a 90 mph swing speed imparts the same "damage" on that lip that a tour guy with a 120mph swing speed does. And I strongly disagree with that. If that is in fact the issue, its only natural the higher swing speed guys are going to do more damage to that lip.
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  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,157 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 11:53am #105
    No, I’m not saying force or “speed” has anything to do with it. Im saying the tee is naturally ending up there through impact. Haven’t you ever notice the lines a white tee will make across the sole of a driver?
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  • dcmidnightdcmidnight Marshals, BST Volunteer Mods Posts: 12,117 mod
    Big Ben wrote:


    No, I'm not saying force or "speed" has anything to do with it. Im saying the tee is naturally ending up there through impact. Haven't you ever notice the lines a white tee will make across the sole of a driver?




    No I've never noticed those lines, tell me more.



    If we agree that the tee>lip is the problem, I dont know how you could argue that speed has nothing to do with the potential potency of the damage. If that is your contention, we will have to agree to disagree.
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  • 3 Jack Par3 Jack Par I only answer to "Ace" now Members, ClubWRX Posts: 6,134 ClubWRX
    Redbird wrote:


    I just got my M5 today and I honestly can't see how the **** you can hit that part of the club unless you take a divot with your driver. If you're one to slam your club down after a bad tee shot, I'd probably avoid that with this club.


    The exposed lip or whatever you want to call it is just barely on the heel side of the clubhead, so I think it's a huge stretch to say that it's hard to see how anyone can hit that part of the club. This is just bad design and it's going to be a big problem if they don't update the design and reinforce that area. It seems like they should have stopped the carbon fiber material similarly to how it is on the toe side of the head. I don't understand how they didn't foresee this as a problem -- even if it may not be a big issue for pros (and the pic at the top of this page shows that's some of them also are seeing issues), their business is selling clubs to regular golfers, and many of them aren't pro or scratch level players who rarely mis-hit a ball. A club that has a piece that breaks if you mis-hit a ball or use a particular type of tee is simply not going to be acceptable to consumers.

    Additionally, it's a minor consideration for most people, but some people do also hit driver off the deck on occasion, and with this design flaw, that's a recipe for disaster.
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  • mesomikemesomike ClubWRX Posts: 548 ClubWRX
    I can't believe we are still arguing this. Its a design problem, shouldn't happen on a mat or a golf course, end of story. It will have to be addressed.
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  • RedbirdRedbird Members Posts: 2,264 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    3 Jack Par wrote:

    Redbird wrote:


    I just got my M5 today and I honestly can't see how the **** you can hit that part of the club unless you take a divot with your driver. If you're one to slam your club down after a bad tee shot, I'd probably avoid that with this club.


    The exposed lip or whatever you want to call it is just barely on the heel side of the clubhead, so I think it's a huge stretch to say that it's hard to see how anyone can hit that part of the club. This is just bad design and it's going to be a big problem if they don't update the design and reinforce that area. It seems like they should have stopped the carbon fiber material similarly to how it is on the toe side of the head. I don't understand how they didn't foresee this as a problem -- even if it may not be a big issue for pros (and the pic at the top of this page shows that's some of them also are seeing issues), their business is selling clubs to regular golfers, and many of them aren't pro or scratch level players who rarely mis-hit a ball. A club that has a piece that breaks if you mis-hit a ball or use a particular type of tee is simply not going to be acceptable to consumers.

    Additionally, it's a minor consideration for most people, but some people do also hit driver off the deck on occasion, and with this design flaw, that's a recipe for disaster.




    Yes it's on the heel side, but it's elevated away from the face of the club (if the club is on the ground), it's not flush with the bottom of the face.



    If it's a widespread problem they'll either address it by a redesign or just keep replacing the heads.
  • ignitewvuignitewvu Members Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    3 Jack Par wrote:

    Redbird wrote:


    I just got my M5 today and I honestly can't see how the **** you can hit that part of the club unless you take a divot with your driver. If you're one to slam your club down after a bad tee shot, I'd probably avoid that with this club.


    The exposed lip or whatever you want to call it is just barely on the heel side of the clubhead, so I think it's a huge stretch to say that it's hard to see how anyone can hit that part of the club. This is just bad design and it's going to be a big problem if they don't update the design and reinforce that area. It seems like they should have stopped the carbon fiber material similarly to how it is on the toe side of the head. I don't understand how they didn't foresee this as a problem -- even if it may not be a big issue for pros (and the pic at the top of this page shows that's some of them also are seeing issues), their business is selling clubs to regular golfers, and many of them aren't pro or scratch level players who rarely mis-hit a ball. A club that has a piece that breaks if you mis-hit a ball or use a particular type of tee is simply not going to be acceptable to consumers.

    Additionally, it's a minor consideration for most people, but some people do also hit driver off the deck on occasion, and with this design flaw, that's a recipe for disaster.




    Exactly, & there have been reports from members at NUMEROUS Golf Galaxy/Club Champions of this issue appearing. I saw it with my own eyes on BOTH M5's at the GG in Pittsburgh.



    Also No one is really talking about the overlap on the weight track when is literally cracking right down the ridge of the track.



    There are 2 issues not 1.....look at the pic provided on the 1st page & you will see the crack along the ridge of the front/back track.....that is exactly what I saw at GG.
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  • 3 Jack Par3 Jack Par I only answer to "Ace" now Members, ClubWRX Posts: 6,134 ClubWRX
    Redbird wrote:


    Yes it's on the heel side, but it's elevated away from the face of the club (if the club is on the ground), it's not flush with the bottom of the face.



    If it's a widespread problem they'll either address it by a redesign or just keep replacing the heads.


    It's a surface that is extremely likely to come into contact with a tee, though, as evidenced by the tee streaks you see on the bottom of any driver, so for the design to have an exposed ridge that can't handle the force of the impact that it undergoes when being used for its intended purpose is a pretty big problem, and it's hard to understand how it made it into production like this.
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  • BaroneBarone Members Posts: 20 ✭✭
    has anyone who has a cracked m5 head contacted tm about the problem? as I posted earlier tm customer service told me this issue has not been reported to them.is this tm's way of deflecting a problem plead ignorance and keep selling product. my m5 delivery date is feb 5, not excited as I once was about this purchase.
  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,157 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 2:49pm #113
    Barone wrote:


    has anyone who has a cracked m5 head contacted tm about the problem? as I posted earlier tm customer service told me this issue has not been reported to them.is this tm's way of deflecting a problem plead ignorance and keep selling product. my m5 delivery date is feb 5, not excited as I once was about this purchase.
    Unless you have a warranty claim they have no incentive or obligation to inform you of this issue. If you offer them a serial number and a photo that's another enchilada.
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  • jll62jll62 ClubWRX Posts: 2,147 ClubWRX
    Barone wrote:


    has anyone who has a cracked m5 head contacted tm about the problem? as I posted earlier tm customer service told me this issue has not been reported to them.is this tm's way of deflecting a problem plead ignorance and keep selling product. my m5 delivery date is feb 5, not excited as I once was about this purchase.




    Nobody has cracked heads besides the retailers with cracked demos, and section pro playing in Phoenix this week. There's nothing for TM customer service to say at this point. That said, TM is definitely aware of the situation.



    My M5 arrives soon and I am still extremely excited about the new club. None of the heads I saw at the Kingdom had this issue and most of them had been subjected to a bunch of usage by the time we visited. Once all the smoke clears, I think we'll find out this problem really was mainly caused by the hard range tee people have talked about. If I'm wrong and it becomes an issue in real world usage, I have no doubt TaylorMade customer service will handle the issue if it happens on my club.
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  • 3woodvt3woodvt 5 test drives for clubface contact. #footpowder Members Posts: 1,628 ✭✭
    3 Jack Par wrote:

    Redbird wrote:


    Yes it's on the heel side, but it's elevated away from the face of the club (if the club is on the ground), it's not flush with the bottom of the face.



    If it's a widespread problem they'll either address it by a redesign or just keep replacing the heads.


    It's a surface that is extremely likely to come into contact with a tee, though, as evidenced by the tee streaks you see on the bottom of any driver, so for the design to have an exposed ridge that can't handle the force of the impact that it undergoes when being used for its intended purpose is a pretty big problem, and it's hard to understand how it made it into production like this.
    I agree. After reading this thread I went to a GG and took a close look at the T rail and the carbon fiber jutting out in the front will be an issue...All anyone has to do is go over and look in the used rack and see the bottom of a driver takes some whacks...If I was a gambler I'd put money on a bunch of broken carbon fiber pieces in this area. Guess that's the price you pay when you push boundaries. Hats off to TM for trying... Good luck
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  • desailledesaille Members Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 5:10pm #116
    It’s simply a carbon fiber sticker overlay on the titanium body overhanging flange.



    Other than looks, it’s really nothing. Pretty sure TM will come out with something to remedy the issue
  • 3woodvt3woodvt 5 test drives for clubface contact. #footpowder Members Posts: 1,628 ✭✭
    desaille wrote:


    It’s simply a carbon fiber sticker overlay on the titanium body.



    Other than looks, it’s really nothing. Pretty sure TM will come out with something to remedy the issue
    lol..like buying a car and the vinyl dash has a scratch in it and the salesman saying its only cosmetic it won't hurt the performance of the car at all....no thanks TM.



    Question: If TM comes out with something do they have to resubmit to the USGA for it to be a conforming driver or will it be considered illegal? Major SNAFU from one of the big boys. This is going to be interesting to follow.
    Cobra F9 8.0 Atmos TS Black7x
    Cobra F8+ 13.5 Aldila7x
    Adams A12 19* VTS Proforce 100hs
    Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS Tour 120s
    Cleveland 2.0 51**,55**,59*
    Ping Zing TR
    Srixon Z
  • 3woodvt3woodvt 5 test drives for clubface contact. #footpowder Members Posts: 1,628 ✭✭
    Carbon Fiber on the sole of a driver...what could possibly go wrong??….Well, you see what happened was.... I can see the excuses coming... Someone's getting fired. Might be the beginning of the end for CF on sole plates. RIP CF 2019. Profits is what it's all about and TM is saying Holy s*&! Who approved This!!
    Cobra F9 8.0 Atmos TS Black7x
    Cobra F8+ 13.5 Aldila7x
    Adams A12 19* VTS Proforce 100hs
    Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS Tour 120s
    Cleveland 2.0 51**,55**,59*
    Ping Zing TR
    Srixon Z
  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,157 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Jan 30, 2019 6:06pm #119
    desaille wrote:


    It’s simply a carbon fiber sticker overlay on the titanium body overhanging flange.



    Other than looks, it’s really nothing. Pretty sure TM will come out with something to remedy the issue
    Normally if something cosmetic is isolated so be it. But this particular area is not going to hold up well. I’ve analyzed this edge for a while and it’s not going to be a simple fix. Cosmetic maybe or maybe not. I have zero skin in the game it looks like a nice driver but I will be interested in following this topic. And no I’m not an engineer but my family has owned a CNC/machine shop and racing team for a million years. I see this structurally on small parts in race cars. It’s always the lowest common denominator.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    Irons: 19' Cobra CB's
    Drivers: Titleist TS3 & Cobra F9
    Fairway: Titleist 917F2
    Hybrid: A-Grind
    2 iron: Ping Rapture
    Wedges: Ping Gorge 2.0 Stealth's
    Putter: Evnroll 9.1
    Balls: ProV1
  • Captain Morgan Captain Morgan Members Posts: 709 ✭✭
    Sounds like this is turning into crackgate.
    Sent from my iPhone using GolfWRX Mobile
  • ga_pikega_pike Members Posts: 491 ✭✭
    Am I wrong or didn't Callaway have a carbon faced driver? C4 or something? I also seem to think maybe Goldwin or someone else had one as well?
    TM 2017 M1 w DI-6S
    Callaway Rogue Sub Zero 5 wood
    Callaway Rogue X 3H
    Callaway Rogue X 5H
    Callaway XR Pro 6-AW
    Ping Glide 2.0 54 & 58
    Big Oak Havana Custom or Slighter Custom

    HDCP 10

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