Early extension (Goat Humping)

golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
Hello GolfWRX Community,



My golf swing has been causing me a lot of wrist pain lately (right wrist, right handed golfer). I don't have arthritis or any other physical ailments.



I'm pretty sure I have a case of early extension which causes me to flip the club at a steep angle, causing the wrist pain.



If anyone has any pointers on how to "cure" this I would appreciate it.



Video: https://youtu.be/PwA3gbAfYfc



Regards

GP


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Comments

  • ryan983ryan983 Members Posts: 665 ✭✭
    A large reason why you stand up is bc you have way too much forward bend at address and especially at the top of your backswing.



    Stand taller, get your arms in sooner and set your wrists earlier.
  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
    ryan983 wrote:


    A large reason why you stand up is bc you have way too much forward bend at address and especially at the top of your backswing.



    Stand taller, get your arms in sooner and set your wrists earlier.




    Hi Ryan,

    I took screenshots on an app I have with angles. I've attached them. So it seems my forward bend is around 50*. One of the first google results I found suggested using 25* as a general number (adjustable depending on height and such). So I would guess I've got close around 25* of room to play with.

    I will try to make this adjustment.

    Thanks!





    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
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  • FullOfBrushManFullOfBrushMan Posts: 664 ✭✭
    edited Feb 18, 2019 10:21am #4
    ryan983 wrote:


    A large reason why you stand up is bc you have way too much forward bend at address and especially at the top of your backswing.



    Stand taller, get your arms in sooner and set your wrists earlier.


    Agreed 100%. You have a ton of pressure/weight forward which means you have to pull your head backwards on your way to impact thus your pelvis stands up/moves forward/ yada yada. You can see this from 0:06 to 0:09.



    Also it's a bad video. You need to take it where the camera's line of sight is through your upper-most rib or at worse the area between your elbow to shoulder. People need to stop doing down the ball's line. Here is a good video to show you what the correct angle is.
  • NikeGolferTXNikeGolferTX Posts: 315 ✭✭
    edited Feb 18, 2019 10:44am #5
    Your takeaway is decent.



    You're going to have to learn to get comfortable with your shoulders rotating, specifically your right shoulder lowering towards the ball while the left side of the hips move towards the tush line. Also not pulling on the handle and nor using your arms mostly to hit the ball.
  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭

    ryan983 wrote:


    A large reason why you stand up is bc you have way too much forward bend at address and especially at the top of your backswing.



    Stand taller, get your arms in sooner and set your wrists earlier.


    Agreed 100%. You have a ton of pressure/weight forward which means you have to pull your head backwards on your way to impact thus your pelvis stands up/moves forward/ yada yada. You can see this from 0:06 to 0:09.



    Also it's a bad video. You need to take it where the camera's line of sight is through your upper-most rib or at worse the area between your elbow to shoulder. People need to stop doing down the ball's line. Here is a good video to show you what the correct angle is.




    I appreciate the feedback.

    I see from your example that my camera angle is off. I will be sure to keep this in mind in the future.

    Thanks!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭


    Your takeaway is decent.



    You're going to have to learn to get comfortable with your shoulders rotating, specifically your right shoulder lowering towards the ball while the left side of the hips move towards the tush line. Also not pulling on the handle and using your arms to hit the ball.




    Thanks for the feedback.

    Do you know any drills that can help to create this feeling?


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
    Callaway Apex Pro '16 4-PW
    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
    Callaway MD3 56*
    Odyssey White Hot Fang



  • Your takeaway is decent.



    You're going to have to learn to get comfortable with your shoulders rotating, specifically your right shoulder lowering towards the ball while the left side of the hips move towards the tush line. Also not pulling on the handle and using your arms to hit the ball.




    Thanks for the feedback.

    Do you know any drills that can help to create this feeling?


    Yes.



  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭




    Your takeaway is decent.



    You're going to have to learn to get comfortable with your shoulders rotating, specifically your right shoulder lowering towards the ball while the left side of the hips move towards the tush line. Also not pulling on the handle and using your arms to hit the ball.




    Thanks for the feedback.

    Do you know any drills that can help to create this feeling?


    Yes.



    https://www.instagra.../p/BinjVCwgc5-/




    Appreciate it!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
    Callaway Apex Pro '16 4-PW
    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
    Callaway MD3 56*
    Odyssey White Hot Fang
  • MountainGoatMountainGoat Mid-MarylandMembers Posts: 1,575 ✭✭


    Hello GolfWRX Community,



    My golf swing has been causing me a lot of wrist pain lately (right wrist, right handed golfer). I don't have arthritis or any other physical ailments.



    I'm pretty sure I have a case of early extension which causes me to flip the club at a steep angle, causing the wrist pain.



    If anyone has any pointers on how to "cure" this I would appreciate it.



    Video: https://youtu.be/PwA3gbAfYfc



    Regards

    GP




    You're certainly not steep. In fact, your downswing is underneath the impact plane. You're a little laid off and shut at the top, and you're really deep into your right hip. It's a tough position to get out of without a lot of lower body power. With respect to wrist pain, I'd like to see your grip. Something's wrong with the way you're hinging at the top, and your hands are fighting each other.
  • MonteScheinblumMonteScheinblum Rebellion Golf Sponsors Posts: 18,179 ✭✭
    Too much forward bend and right shoulder dropping too much. You need less forward bend at address and stay in left tilt longer (left shoulder needs to stay down longer).



  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭



    Hello GolfWRX Community,



    My golf swing has been causing me a lot of wrist pain lately (right wrist, right handed golfer). I don't have arthritis or any other physical ailments.



    I'm pretty sure I have a case of early extension which causes me to flip the club at a steep angle, causing the wrist pain.



    If anyone has any pointers on how to "cure" this I would appreciate it.



    Video: https://youtu.be/PwA3gbAfYfc



    Regards

    GP




    You're certainly not steep. In fact, your downswing is underneath the impact plane. You're a little laid off and shut at the top, and you're really deep into your right hip. It's a tough position to get out of without a lot of lower body power. With respect to wrist pain, I'd like to see your grip. Something's wrong with the way you're hinging at the top, and your hands are fighting each other.




    Maybe I'm getting my terms mixed up, when I said steep I was referring to the shaft being flatter on the backswing than on the downswing. I've attached images to illustrate what I was talking about.

    I'm guessing the "underneath the impact plane" you mentioned can probably be resolved by the shoulder rotation that everyone else has mentioned?

    I don't have any pics of my grip otherwise I would attach it. I'll see if I can get a pic later when I get my clubs out again.

    I appreciate your feedback!



    Backswing Parallel:



    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭


    Too much forward bend and right shoulder dropping too much. You need less forward bend at address and stay in left tilt longer (left shoulder needs to stay down longer).




    Hi Monte,

    I'm happy to hear that you're in agreement with everyone else about the forward bend. You mentioned the right shoulder dropping too much, and then mention the left shoulder needs to stay down longer. Are these one and the same? I interpreted this as a counter balance where if the right shoulder doesn't drop as much, then the left shoulder would also not raise up.

    Thanks for the feedback!

    GP


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
    Callaway Apex Pro '16 4-PW
    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
    Callaway MD3 56*
    Odyssey White Hot Fang
  • dj*dj* Members Posts: 71 ✭✭
    edited Feb 18, 2019 2:22pm #14
    Flipping wouldn't necessarily cause wrist pain on its own unless you're also crashing the flip into firm resistance, like a mat, tree root, fatty, frozen beer can...
  • MonteScheinblumMonteScheinblum Rebellion Golf Sponsors Posts: 18,179 ✭✭



    Too much forward bend and right shoulder dropping too much. You need less forward bend at address and stay in left tilt longer (left shoulder needs to stay down longer).




    Hi Monte,

    I'm happy to hear that you're in agreement with everyone else about the forward bend. You mentioned the right shoulder dropping too much, and then mention the left shoulder needs to stay down longer. Are these one and the same? I interpreted this as a counter balance where if the right shoulder doesn't drop as much, then the left shoulder would also not raise up.

    Thanks for the feedback!

    GP




    Yes same thing.
  • glkglk send it in jerome Members Posts: 3,288 ✭✭



    Too much forward bend and right shoulder dropping too much. You need less forward bend at address and stay in left tilt longer (left shoulder needs to stay down longer).




    Hi Monte,

    I'm happy to hear that you're in agreement with everyone else about the forward bend. You mentioned the right shoulder dropping too much, and then mention the left shoulder needs to stay down longer. Are these one and the same? I interpreted this as a counter balance where if the right shoulder doesn't drop as much, then the left shoulder would also not raise up.

    Thanks for the feedback!

    GP


    Here is a good thread to read on left shoulder. http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/1608380-lead-shoulder-in-transition/



    Couple of instrgram to demonstrate https://www.instagram.com/p/BqYLDStl_fy/ https://www.instagram.com/p/Bs9FLhIlmbU/



    Important to not let that lead knee drift too much in toward the trail knee - move it out over the toes. Lead side is lower than trail side at end of backswing -ankles, knees, hip, shoulders - then go downhill from there.
  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
    glk wrote:




    Too much forward bend and right shoulder dropping too much. You need less forward bend at address and stay in left tilt longer (left shoulder needs to stay down longer).




    Hi Monte,

    I'm happy to hear that you're in agreement with everyone else about the forward bend. You mentioned the right shoulder dropping too much, and then mention the left shoulder needs to stay down longer. Are these one and the same? I interpreted this as a counter balance where if the right shoulder doesn't drop as much, then the left shoulder would also not raise up.

    Thanks for the feedback!

    GP


    Here is a good thread to read on left shoulder. http://www.golfwrx.c...-in-transition/



    Couple of instrgram to demonstrate https://www.instagra.../p/BqYLDStl_fy/ https://www.instagra.../p/Bs9FLhIlmbU/



    Important to not let that lead knee drift too much in toward the trail knee - move it out over the toes. Lead side is lower than trail side at end of backswing -ankles, knees, hip, shoulders - then go downhill from there.




    Ah. This is a good thread with good videos. Appreciate it!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


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  • BottleCapBottleCap Members Posts: 1,266 ✭✭
    Your takeaway is under plane. Get it steeper and you'll start making changes to accommodate this.
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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
    BottleCap wrote:


    Your takeaway is under plane. Get it steeper and you'll start making changes to accommodate this.




    Interesting... I drew a line from the shaft through the butt of the club up through my body and when I watched the backswing the clubhead was just a tad below that. I think once I get myself standing more upright as suggested my swing will naturally become more steep.

    Thanks for the feedback!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
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  • smashdnsmashdn Let's cut them trees down. Posts: 935 ✭✭
    Dangit. This is me too. I didn't know there was a phrase for this swing fault other than standing up. Glad I got intrigued and took a look.
  • HoosierMizunoHoosierMizuno Members Posts: 3,346 ✭✭
    hard to tell from the video but for me having a square to slightly closed clubface at p6 allowed me to continue turning through the shot and not need to feel the last minute flip with the hands that often cause me to stand up prior impact. i just felt my left forearm begin to rotate a little sooner after the transition.



    if you pause the video right before impact you can see your left wrist is into ulnar deviation. check out tour striker impact strap or at least the videos on what it intends to teach.
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  • BottleCapBottleCap Members Posts: 1,266 ✭✭

    BottleCap wrote:


    Your takeaway is under plane. Get it steeper and you'll start making changes to accommodate this.




    Interesting... I drew a line from the shaft through the butt of the club up through my body and when I watched the backswing the clubhead was just a tad below that. I think once I get myself standing more upright as suggested my swing will naturally become more steep.

    Thanks for the feedback!




    You just want the takeaway steeper, this should promote a shallower downswing. It's a loop, if you start steep, you end up shallow, if you start shallow you end up steep
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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
    Hello All,



    I was able to take a few swings at Golf Galaxy yesterday and as suggested, I tried standing more upright. It felt awkward, like I was setting up to do a barbell squat but I experienced very little wrist pain that eventually subsided as I continued swinging. The contact was pretty pure too for the majority of shots, however it seems I was struggling with a fade (per their simulator, which who knows how accurate that actually is). I'm going to hit the range tonight to get some actual results.



    I appreciate everyone's feedback!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
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    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
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  • BottleCapBottleCap Members Posts: 1,266 ✭✭
    You don't want to stand upright, you want the golf shaft to be more upright during the take away



    from the down the line view, you want the club head first cross your body at the bicep or higher during your backswing
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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭
    BottleCap wrote:


    You don't want to stand upright, you want the golf shaft to be more upright during the take away



    from the down the line view, you want the club head first cross your body at the bicep or higher during your backswing




    Hi BottleCap,

    Everyone suggested less forward tilt, which I understand is to stand more upright (more knee flex, less hip bend). I understand the concept you've described of steep up/shallow down and I think it would help my game. But are you suggesting I not reduce forward tilt? I'm not standing upright, when I took another video while putzing around my house, the angle was reduced from 50* (pictured above) to probably 35* - 40*.

    regards


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
    Callaway Apex Pro '16 4-PW
    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
    Callaway MD3 56*
    Odyssey White Hot Fang
  • HoosierMizunoHoosierMizuno Members Posts: 3,346 ✭✭
    i'd like others to comment, but if viewing the setup on the target line behind the golfer, if we draw a line from the back of the shoulder socket am i correct in that it should intersect just forward of the center of feet.



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  • golfing_programmergolfing_programmer Cincinnati, OHMembers Posts: 31 ✭✭


    i'd like others to comment, but if viewing the setup on the target line behind the golfer, if we draw a line from the back of the shoulder socket am i correct in that it should intersect just forward of the center of feet.



    Proper-Golf-Stance-Day.jpg




    This is a good reference, it'll be easier for me to immediately tell if I'm too far forward rather than check a picture/video after the fact.

    Thanks for posting it!


    Programmer by day.... Also programmer by night since programmers don't have social lives.
    Sometimes I get to play golf


    Titleist 917D3 9.5*
    Titleist 910F 13.5* Callaway Epic Flash Sub-Zero 13.5*
    Callaway Steelhead XR Hybrid 21*
    Callaway Apex Pro '16 4-PW
    Cleveland RTX4 52*, 60*
    Callaway MD3 56*
    Odyssey White Hot Fang
  • finleysgfinleysg MinnesotaPosts: 1,235 ✭✭
    A phrase I hear a lot doing yoga (Rodney Yee dvds) is "center your weight in front of your heels". This is typically for very upright poses, but I find it's a good reminder at address over the golf ball. Not out on the balls of your feet. Not back on your heels. Centered.
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  • glkglk send it in jerome Members Posts: 3,288 ✭✭
    In addition to HoosierMizuno's example I also do this - I check pretty often at home in a mirror, practice range, sometimes even when playing (though more the hand test than getting out an alignment stick)



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0RUUuLWFwM
  • Coy MCoy M OG Baby Members Posts: 1,148 ✭✭
    GGswingtips released a video today on setup. From what I took from it is that the arm pits, knees, and balls of your feet should line up at address.
  • tchildstchilds Members Posts: 357 ✭✭
    This may not make sense, but it could be a sequencing issue. That is your hips have turned pretty much their full amount before the club reaches halfway back...right knee is stiffening a bit and I would make a guess that your hips are sort of reverse pivoting (from a face on angle anyway). So your lower body outraces your upper body going back so there is really nowhere for your hips to go coming down so yo have to stand up. I would tell you to let the hips turn when they MUST going back and see if it is easier to sequence your downswing...with the feeling there of the exact opposite, but works back feeling and chest is over the ball more. as they say here, just my $.02.
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