ANNOUNCEMENT:
Please have patience. We understand that this sucks and it will get MUCH better.

Link to full post HERE
Please add any bugs (problems) with new software in the Website Help Forum. There is a dedicated thread HERE.

Swing Speed Guidance

yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



Boys (upper-levels):





7 - 68+

8 - 72+

9 - 76+

10 - 80+

11- 85+

12 - 92+



I know ball speed is most important for distance.

Comments

  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    I think your upper levels might be off by a year.
  • Golfingdawg19Golfingdawg19 Advanced Members Posts: 328 ✭✭
    My friend’s son is 9 and he is right at 80mph and cranks his driver 200yds. That is extremely long for a 9 year old so my guess the average 9 year old is closer to 70. His oldest son is 11 and is close to 90. He is in the top of his age group but there are a few that get around 95 because they are so big.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭


    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    It actually on the low side for speed a lot kids are fast some girls are 100 mph plus out there at 12. I heard some boys are faster too.



    It actually more important that they got the ball in the center of the face or distance will not be maximized. Also technique and driver been used are all important.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    edited March 9
    leezer99 wrote:


    I think your upper levels might be off by a year.






    It actually on the low side for speed a lot kids are fast some girls are 100 mph plus out there at 12. I heard some boys are faster too.



    It is actually more important that they hit the ball in the center of the face or distance will not be maximized. Also technique and driver been used are all important. Most people can gain more yards if they do not have speed.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭


    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Chart is more accurate for girls as far as top speeds there are a few 12 year old girls out there more then 92 mph plus.



    Also the most important factor for distance is how well you hit the club. If you can’t center the impact your going to lose a lot of distance more then anything. A lot of yardage can be gained by technique and better ball striking.



    Too many people just focus on speed. Yes speed is nice but it not the only thing either.
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
    edited March 9
    Tiger - that would be amazing as lpga average is 93 (according to one chart - 246 drive). Also, contact is important that’s why I mentioned ball speed being most important for distance, but since everyone doesn’t have access to track man data, swing speed gives a good idea of potential.



    Leezer - which way should age group go in your opinion - down or up?
  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+
  • kekoakekoa ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 8,747
    I guess my son is uber short. He just turned 9 and swings it low to mid 70’s 🤔
  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    kekoa wrote:
    I guess my son is uber short. He just turned 9 and swings it low to mid 70’s �


    Longer or shorter than JS?
  • kekoakekoa ClubWRX Charter Members Posts: 8,747
    Shorter. Hes consistently 180+



    We played a par 3 today scoped at 170 and ball rested pin high with little to no roll. With driver image/wink.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    edited March 10


    Tiger - that would be amazing as lpga average is 93 (according to one chart - 246 drive). Also, contact is important that’s why I mentioned ball speed being most important for distance, but since everyone doesn’t have access to track man data, swing speed gives a good idea of potential.



    Leezer - which way should age group go in your opinion - down or up?




    Yes it amazing a few girls I know for a fact have this speed in Texas and Florida. They can easily go 240 plus for carry if the ball is struck correctly . Most will have a hard believing it but some are quite a bit faster then current LPGA players if you can believe that. Most girls though are well under that distance though but still could probably reach 200 or so with better contact.



    The advantage for girls who are does not happen until there above 13 playing courses close to 6000 yards. Girls at 12 play a lot courses under 5000 yards. A big problem for girls younger is on many courses 220-250 yards is where all the trouble is when they tee off. I think for boys you see it sooner because the yards increases at a younger age.



    The swing radar you talk about is off by about 10-15 mph. I know this because we have used both it an track man and it seems to run a bit faster then trackman. It however is consistent so it is a good training aid to gauge speed gain.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    tiger1873 wrote:


    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Chart is more accurate for girls as far as top speeds there are a few 12 year old girls out there more then 92 mph plus.



    Also the most important factor for distance is how well you hit the club. If you can’t center the impact your going to lose a lot of distance more then anything. A lot of yardage can be gained by technique and better ball striking.



    Too many people just focus on speed. Yes speed is nice but it not the only thing either.




    Not even close to average speed for girls.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    edited March 10
    leezer99 wrote:
    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    That is high. We went to worlds at 12 and mine was above average compared to other kids. He was 88 at top.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Speed radars are 5-8 mph higher than a launch monitor.
  • TripleBogeysrbetterTripleBogeysrbetter Members Posts: 59
    Just curious if that’s speed from:



    1. Radar gun

    2. Radar launch monitor

    3. Camera base launch monitor

    4. Calucated speed without a club head monitor.
    Cobra F8+ - Fujikura Regular
    Taylormade M1 5 Wood - Kuro Kage Regular
    Cobra Tour Forged 4-PW KBS Tour 90 R
    Fourteen 52 (Bent to 50) - Nippon R
    Fourteen 56 - Nippon R
    Vokey SM7 60 - Dynamic Gold
    Ray Cook Blue Goose BG40
    Titleist AVX
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254

    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Speed radars are 5-8 mph higher than a launch monitor.




    This is helpful - did not know this.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    edited March 10

    tiger1873 wrote:


    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Chart is more accurate for girls as far as top speeds there are a few 12 year old girls out there more then 92 mph plus.



    Also the most important factor for distance is how well you hit the club. If you can’t center the impact your going to lose a lot of distance more then anything. A lot of yardage can be gained by technique and better ball striking.



    Too many people just focus on speed. Yes speed is nice but it not the only thing either.




    Not even close to average speed for girls.




    I agree for average this very high speed I was thinking this was this for higher end speed ranges.
  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    leezer99 wrote:
    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    That is high. We went to worlds at 12 and mine was above average compared to other kids. He was 88 at top.


    Even for boys?
  • Golfingdawg19Golfingdawg19 Advanced Members Posts: 328 ✭✭
    Yes. My buddies kid is at the very high end of 9 year old boys and he is around 80. The average 9 year old boy is around 70. The high end for 11-12 would be low 90’s. His oldest son is 11 and won the future masters a couple years back and his is high 80’s.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    leezer99 wrote:
    leezer99 wrote:
    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    That is high. We went to worlds at 12 and mine was above average compared to other kids. He was 88 at top.


    Even for boys?




    Yes... 92+ for an 11 year old is really high. I think Yellow was pretty spot on for the high end at those ages.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭

    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I’ll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Speed radars are 5-8 mph higher than a launch monitor.




    This is helpful - did not know this.




    Flight Scope and Trackman measure the swing speed from the center of the face. A radar just picks up the fastest point. Generally speaking the radar is 5-8 mph fast.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    edited March 10
    We use swing speed radar and just did a session with trackman. So based on The data we did the I have after that session Is the higher the swing speed the more it is off.



    Lower speeds are 5-8mph but higher speeds above 100 mph is 10-15 mph. I figure it probably about 10-15 percent off on the speed. This tends to make sense based the various Facebook posts I have seen claiming extra fast swings on kids. Yes still fast but not as fast as you should believe. It’s a great tool but really just a toy.



    Also we did sessions at local PGA superstore and those are off by at least 5-10mph on the high side. Pretty much need a trackman to get reliable figured.



    It still a good tool just need to know they are off a lot. I have a feeling a lot speeds are quotes that are not using an actual trackman. I also don’t trust all those cheap launch monitors out there either there not acurate either.
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭
    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.
  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.
  • TigerswagTigerswag Members Posts: 34
    I sort of agree. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    My son is 15....so....speed stick training could be impacting 10-12 year olds more than a few years ago. My son was considered ‘long’ for a 12yo. He would hit his driver 210-230. There were alway outliers at worlds or future masters....but, rarely did he encounter longer players on a regional level.



    If it helps he has consistently been one of the longer players for his age.



    12 years old 82 mph SS

    13 broke 100

    14 105

    15 112



    These numbers are from trackman



    I can only imagine the swing speed progression of the above speeds.
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭
    edited March 11
    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175
  • leezer99leezer99 Advanced Members Posts: 892 ✭✭
    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I can name four right now off the top of my head that we play against locally.
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭
    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I can name four right now off the top of my head that we play against locally.




    Four in a single age group? Which age and what are their average distances (roughly)?
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
    edited March 11
    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I don’t know if you meant average (mean), but this is way low. You can just look at DPC qualifier results and see that this is low. Can’t go by distance bc all courses are different as are regions of the country (e.g., some places are fast and firm (southern CA), some have higher elevations, and some have little roll, particularly if you’re playing on muni’s).



    My son is 10.5. He has always been on the longer side, but not a 1%er. Yesterday, he was 83 on swing radar and averaged 80 after about 10 drives at the range (this was after 6 weeks of swing speed training). As HH pointed out, this may be off due to when it gets measued. Impact is good, so I am predicting some carries of 190+ this season.



    Can’t be 145 at 9. My son drove the green at world’s at 6 that was lasered 140, if I recall correctly.



    Again, this isn’t to boast, but on our tour, I would say most of the top 5 players we play with that are 10-11 today have to be around 76+. There are 2-3 kids I know that poke it farther than my son on our tour alone.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    Trying to find average speed is going to be tough because most people have never been put in front of a trackman. Getting a good driver and focusing on ball striking is going to increase much more than a few mph on speed training.



    If you kid is fast you already know this as well. It's pretty obvious and I would bet you noticed it from the first time they played golf. The average kid is going to be way less than 90 mph. The average adult is less than that if you include seniors.



    A better way to look at things is what are you seeing out there in tournaments.



    To me when I seen the boys hit between 10-12 the average distance is a little over 200 yards. I haven't followed a lot boys so I may be off but it seems that is about is where they are hitting when I seen them playing.



    For girls I would suspect 10-12 is around 180-190 yards for average.



    This is for higher level state wide tournaments so it may be high if you looking at something like a US kids tournament. I think though these numbers can be reached with reasonable expectations. Not all kids can hit it 250 or should need to based on yardage.
  • Golfingdawg19Golfingdawg19 Advanced Members Posts: 328 ✭✭
    tiger1873 wrote:


    Trying to find average speed is going to be tough because most people have never been put in front of a trackman. Getting a good driver and focusing on ball striking is going to increase much more than a few mph on speed training.



    If you kid is fast you already know this as well. It's pretty obvious and I would bet you noticed it from the first time they played golf. The average kid is going to be way less than 90 mph. The average adult is less than that if you include seniors.



    A better way to look at things is what are you seeing out there in tournaments.



    To me when I seen the boys hit between 10-12 the average distance is a little over 200 yards. I haven't followed a lot boys so I may be off but it seems that is about is where they are hitting when I seen them playing.



    For girls I would suspect 10-12 is around 180-190 yards for average.



    This is for higher level state wide tournaments so it may be high if you looking at something like a US kids tournament. I think though these numbers can be reached with reasonable expectations. Not all kids can hit it 250 or should need to based on yardage.




    Tiger your daughter and mine played together at the Honda and I would say that you are right on the girls. My daughter hits her drive 165 and she is 11. The other 11 year old girls were hitting it 190-200. Your daughter was past that but the good ones were all around 190-200. My daughter was the smallest one in the field for her age and that is a huge reason she is shorter than the other girls. The is a direct relationship in junior golf between the kids weight and their driving distance. The heavier kids always hit it further. If you look at the longest kids in each age group, they are usually the biggest kids. With girls, puberty comes earlier than boys and that plays a huge effect. You have some girls who look like full grown women by 12 and some who haven't even started puberty.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I can name four right now off the top of my head that we play against locally.




    http://www.drivechipandputt.com/finals/leaderboard



    The kids at the DCP in the 12-13 year old age group aren't breaking 95. A couple in the 10-11 age group are breaking 90. A kid breaking 90mph at 11 is in the top 1% in my opinion.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    Tigerswag wrote:


    I sort of agree. image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />



    My son is 15....so....speed stick training could be impacting 10-12 year olds more than a few years ago. My son was considered 'long' for a 12yo. He would hit his driver 210-230. There were alway outliers at worlds or future masters....but, rarely did he encounter longer players on a regional level.



    If it helps he has consistently been one of the longer players for his age.



    12 years old 82 mph SS

    13 broke 100

    14 105

    15 112



    These numbers are from trackman



    I can only imagine the swing speed progression of the above speeds.




    From what I can tell is speed really is not faster but the use of the swing speed radar and cheap launch monitors are much more widespread. This is resulting in a lot people thinking they are faster than they really are.



    I first noticed an issue with those little swing radar's when it said I had 130-135 mph swing. I guarantee you that I am not that fast. Wish I was but I am anywhere near that.



    We also seen crazy high numbers for my daughter as well. We have confirmed her speed on trackman for distance and speed but it was not as high as the swing radar at all. Probably at least 10-15 mph off.



    Also remember everyone talks about peak speed and distance. Average speed and distance is the real number you want.I had a good lesson in last week on how Very Very few people on this planet can hit a driver peak the majority of the time and people lie to themselves about true average.
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I don't know if you meant average (mean), but this is way low. You can just look at DPC qualifier results and see that this is low. Can't go by distance bc all courses are different as are regions of the country (e.g., some places are fast and firm (southern CA), some have higher elevations, and some have little roll, particularly if you're playing on muni's).



    My son is 10.5. He has always been on the longer side, but not a 1%er. Yesterday, he was 83 on swing radar and averaged 80 after about 10 drives at the range (this was after 6 weeks of swing speed training). As HH pointed out, this may be off due to when it gets measued. Impact is good, so I am predicting some carries of 190+ this season.



    Can't be 145 at 9. My son drove the green at world's at 6 that was lasered 140, if I recall correctly.



    Again, this isn't to boast, but on our tour, I would say most of the top 5 players we play with that are 10-11 today have to be around 76+. There are 2-3 kids I know that poke it farther than my son on our tour alone.




    Median - half above, half below.



    The median tournament golfer is shooting in the low 90s for those ages, even in the most competitive local tours.
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
    Tiger - you have to switch from KPH to MPH image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭
    CTgolf wrote:


    CTgolf wrote:




    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    I don't know if you meant average (mean), but this is way low. You can just look at DPC qualifier results and see that this is low. Can't go by distance bc all courses are different as are regions of the country (e.g., some places are fast and firm (southern CA), some have higher elevations, and some have little roll, particularly if you're playing on muni's).



    My son is 10.5. He has always been on the longer side, but not a 1%er. Yesterday, he was 83 on swing radar and averaged 80 after about 10 drives at the range (this was after 6 weeks of swing speed training). As HH pointed out, this may be off due to when it gets measued. Impact is good, so I am predicting some carries of 190+ this season.



    Can't be 145 at 9. My son drove the green at world's at 6 that was lasered 140, if I recall correctly.



    Again, this isn't to boast, but on our tour, I would say most of the top 5 players we play with that are 10-11 today have to be around 76+. There are 2-3 kids I know that poke it farther than my son on our tour alone.




    Median - half above, half below.



    The median tournament golfer is shooting in the low 90s for those ages, even in the most competitive local tours.




    I also think the average junior golfer and parent dramatically overestimates how far he is hitting his tee shots. Almost everyone I know who first uses Arccos or Game Golf is surprised by what their actual *average* driver distance is compared to what they estimated it to be.
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
    I think it’s less so over-estimation by competitive junior golfers/parents. Everything is being lasered these days. I think over-estimation comes when they don’t realize how much a ball rolled out. At the upper levels there are always a hole or there that can be drive chip and putt, so those get lasered from the tee box.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭

    tiger1873 wrote:


    Trying to find average speed is going to be tough because most people have never been put in front of a trackman. Getting a good driver and focusing on ball striking is going to increase much more than a few mph on speed training.



    If you kid is fast you already know this as well. It's pretty obvious and I would bet you noticed it from the first time they played golf. The average kid is going to be way less than 90 mph. The average adult is less than that if you include seniors.



    A better way to look at things is what are you seeing out there in tournaments.



    To me when I seen the boys hit between 10-12 the average distance is a little over 200 yards. I haven't followed a lot boys so I may be off but it seems that is about is where they are hitting when I seen them playing.



    For girls I would suspect 10-12 is around 180-190 yards for average.



    This is for higher level state wide tournaments so it may be high if you looking at something like a US kids tournament. I think though these numbers can be reached with reasonable expectations. Not all kids can hit it 250 or should need to based on yardage.




    Tiger your daughter and mine played together at the Honda and I would say that you are right on the girls. My daughter hits her drive 165 and she is 11. The other 11 year old girls were hitting it 190-200. Your daughter was past that but the good ones were all around 190-200. My daughter was the smallest one in the field for her age and that is a huge reason she is shorter than the other girls. The is a direct relationship in junior golf between the kids weight and their driving distance. The heavier kids always hit it further. If you look at the longest kids in each age group, they are usually the biggest kids. With girls, puberty comes earlier than boys and that plays a huge effect. You have some girls who look like full grown women by 12 and some who haven't even started puberty.




    There is also a direct correlation that as you age, the heavier you are hinders how long you can hit a golf ball. Chris Finn at Par4Success does some great work.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭


    I think it's less so over-estimation by competitive junior golfers/parents. Everything is being lasered these days. I think over-estimation comes when they don't realize how much a ball rolled out. At the upper levels there are always a hole or there that can be drive chip and putt, so those get lasered from the tee box.




    You would be surprised. I don't think it is less over estimated at all by competitive junior golf parents.



    Upper Levels? I haven't seen a 250 yard par 4 in some time.
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254



    I think it's less so over-estimation by competitive junior golfers/parents. Everything is being lasered these days. I think over-estimation comes when they don't realize how much a ball rolled out. At the upper levels there are always a hole or there that can be drive chip and putt, so those get lasered from the tee box.




    You would be surprised. I don't think it is less over estimated at all by competitive junior golf parents.



    Upper Levels? I haven't seen a 250 yard par 4 in some time.




    I meant upper levels for boys 8-11. Those distances are measured on short par 4s so driving distance is a little more accurate. I agree, even at shorter USKG setups, once you hit 12, not going to be any DCP holes. Even at 10-11, I guess the shortest par 4s measure 270ish and those are definitely laser'd from the tee box, even if it's not DCP. So players/caddie gets a good idea of distance off drives.
  • darter79darter79 Advanced Members Posts: 654 ✭✭
    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    My 8 year old daughter drives it further than 145. I would think that be a little low. Unless you are talking carry
  • CTgolfCTgolf Advanced Members Posts: 391 ✭✭
    darter79 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:

    CTgolf wrote:

    leezer99 wrote:


    9 - 80+

    10 - 85+

    11 - 92+




    With all due respect, this seems way off (inflated), unless by "upper range" you are referring to top 1% (basically a handful of players in the US).



    Top 10-25% of 11yo boys are not hitting their drives 240-245, nor are 10yo's or 9yo's consistently hitting it 220 or 200+, respectively.




    If you say so.




    How about this: how many boys do you know who can actually *consistently* drive the distances mentioned above? More than a few?



    A more reasonable discussion might revolve around what the *median* driving distance is among tournament golfers by age. I would guess it would look something like the following:

    Boys

    9 - 145

    10 - 160

    11 - 175




    My 8 year old daughter drives it further than 145. I would think that be a little low. Unless you are talking carry




    Is your daughter bigger/better than the 50th percentile 9yo boy golfer?
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    CTgolf wrote:






    Is your daughter bigger/better than the 50th percentile 9yo boy golfer?




    I think those numbers are low for the median.
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭


    Tiger - you have to switch from KPH to MPH image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />






    I am MPH and for sure it's off for sure a lot had an extensive session with my daughter on trackman and I am going off the difference based on that. She fast for sure but not as fast as it states. There totally useless as a measurement device only helps as a baseline. But perhaps mine got the chip means for golf stores to make you feel like the new club goes farther.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    Looking into the DCP a little further, because that is really all there is statistically to look at driving distances, for the most part the 14-15 year old boy's aren't swinging above 100 mph.
  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Advanced Members Posts: 2,905 ✭✭
    This is an article from my son's fitness instructor on swing speed. I personally feel that the age group 10-16 is not ideal for the sample size as their is a big difference in kids that have been through puberty. Chris is a contributor to WRX as well.



    http://www.mytpi.com/articles/swing/club_head_speed_by_age_group_what_percentile_are_you_in?fbclid=IwAR0DRBK_rGxsdopAzWlIvAMgZlpSne-SQRQFJyg2VNTsVxjdN0k4aEg34jA
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭


    I think it's less so over-estimation by competitive junior golfers/parents. Everything is being lasered these days. I think over-estimation comes when they don't realize how much a ball rolled out. At the upper levels there are always a hole or there that can be drive chip and putt, so those get lasered from the tee box.




    Almost everyone overestimates their distances especially kids who are growing a lot. Yes everyone knows their peak distance but once you play a few holes and have pressure of a narrow fairway those distance can drop a lot. When you factor in weather and if the ball is wet or not the distances can drop even more.



    The difference between 80 and a 68 is the person who really understands their true distances based on the current conditions. If you add in the fact that kid is growing and distances change day to day with irons. It amazing that kids score as low as they do.
  • yellowlover519yellowlover519 Advanced Members Posts: 254
    tiger1873 wrote:



    I think it's less so over-estimation by competitive junior golfers/parents. Everything is being lasered these days. I think over-estimation comes when they don't realize how much a ball rolled out. At the upper levels there are always a hole or there that can be drive chip and putt, so those get lasered from the tee box.




    Almost everyone overestimates their distances especially kids who are growing a lot. Yes everyone knows their peak distance but once you play a few holes and have pressure of a narrow fairway those distance can drop a lot. When you factor in weather and if the ball is wet or not the distances can drop even more.



    The difference between 80 and a 68 is the person who really understands their true distances based on the current conditions. If you add in the fact that kid is growing and distances change day to day with irons. It amazing that kids score as low as they do.




    Your contributions to these discussion are truly amazing. “The difference between 80 and a 68 is the person who really understands their true distances based on the current conditions.”
  • tiger1873tiger1873 Advanced Members Posts: 930 ✭✭
    edited March 11
    CTgolf wrote:

    darter79 wrote:


    My 8 year old daughter drives it further than 145. I would think that be a little low. Unless you are talking carry




    Is your daughter bigger/better than the 50th percentile 9yo boy golfer?




    My 8 year old drives also quite a bit father then 145 and she is just using a US kids driver. The real problem though like most 8 year olds that is only 50% of the time that you actually see a nice long drive. Most of us don't talk about the flubs that go 50 yards. If you add that in her real carry average is much lower and ends up being around 125 or so if you have to go over a hazard.



    I actually think 145 is probably a good average for an average 9 year old boy who doesn't play many tournaments since they probably mess up 25-40% of their drives. I am not talking about kids who play week in week out though there probably on the higher side of things.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • ShilgyShilgy Advanced Members Posts: 11,096 ✭✭
    tiger1873 wrote:


    tiger1873 wrote:


    Does anyone have guidance on swing speed with driver for 12U? Just curious what the upper range is. Also, is the swing radar device usually used for swing speed training accurate (the little grey/blue box)?



    I would guess that you would go up an age group when speaking of girls. So 10-year old boy v 11/12 year-old girl would be a good barometer. I'll take a stab, but have no idea:



    Boys (upper-levels):





    7 - 68+

    8 - 72+

    9 - 76+

    10 - 80+

    11- 85+

    12 - 92+



    I know ball speed is most important for distance.




    Chart is more accurate for girls as far as top speeds there are a few 12 year old girls out there more then 92 mph plus.



    Also the most important factor for distance is how well you hit the club. If you can't center the impact your going to lose a lot of distance more then anything. A lot of yardage can be gained by technique and better ball striking.



    Too many people just focus on speed. Yes speed is nice but it not the only thing either.




    Not even close to average speed for girls.




    I agree for average this very high speed I was thinking this was this for higher end speed ranges.
    This lady is not a short hitter on the LPGA-94.7

    https://blog.trackmangolf.com/sei-young-kim-winner-of-the-thornberry-creek-lpga-classic/
    PING G400 LST Alta CB 55s
    TM M1 3w 14* Graphite Design BB7s
    TM M2 5w 18* Fujikura Atmos TS Blue 8S or Srixon U65 18° Atmos Red 7s
    Adams A12 UST Silver S 21°
    Srixon Z585 5 & 6 Nippon Pro Modus 125S
    Srixon Z785 7-PW Nippon Pro Modus3 125S
    Vokey SZM7 50°
    Cleveland RTX4 S400TI raw 56° & 60°
    Toulon Garage Rochester flow neck H5/ Toulon Rochester stock

    To paraphrase Dr Seuss: Don't cry because the round of golf is over-smile because it happened . :)

    Game is recovering from total ankle replacement. Getting there and glad to be pain free!
Sign In or Register to comment.