USKG yardages

Heard yesterday that USKG is going with long leaf system for yardages starting this summer. That brings boys 10 down to 2100 yards. Not sure why there would only be a 200 yard jump from boys 9 to boys 10. I guess they thought the jump to 2500 was too much for the shorter hitters? Not sure if all age groups will have adjusted yardages but I thought original USKG yardages were reasonable.

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Comments

  • bwbwbwbw Members Posts: 56 ✭✭

    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

  • mrshinsamrshinsa Members Posts: 156 ✭✭
    edited Apr 8, 2019 6:17pm #3

    I think its a change for the better.

    When boys turn 10, most struggle with the distance and lot of them cannot reach in regulations on 350+ yard holes.
    Girls are the opposite. Tall 11-year-old girls driving the green on 180yard par 4 should not be the norm and makes the game lopsided.
    This is just what I have observed, and of course, there are exceptions.

    Also, the yardage jump would be evenly spaced out 300 yards, not 200.
    1900(9y) -> 2200(10y) -> 2500(11y)

  • kekoakekoa ClubWRX Posts: 8,782 ClubWRX

    All the more reason to move away from US kids if the kid is established and looking to compete at a higher level.

  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Members Posts: 3,003 ✭✭

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

  • Golfingdawg19Golfingdawg19 Posts: 343 ✭✭

    My daughter is 11 and the distances for the local tour were extremely short compared to the regional and worlds. She is small for her size and the local level gave her a chance to shoot good scores. When we get to worlds the distance will be 5000 yds. A good score for her at that length will be 85. She just can’t score much better hitting 3 woods and hybrids all days. There are plenty of girls who can hit far enough to shoot low scores from that distance but they are mostly the bigger framed girls. Which girls hit puberty early also plays a big role. I know that US Kids has extensive data at their tournaments to track what the average players are hitting it. They base the yardages for their tees off this. At the holiday classic two years ago they had trackman out on hole 9 collecting data. The rep from US Kids sent me the data so that i could see where my daughter stacked up to the field. Each parent just has to decide what is best for their child based on their ability and size.

  • Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

  • leezer99leezer99 I swear I am quitting this site every day... Members Posts: 963 ✭✭

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

    Boys that hit driver 175 should be playing 2,500. No reason to hold back those that can hit it further. Part of the problem with US Kids IMO is that they don't allow kids to move up. Which is why it becomes so much less competitive as the kids get older... the better kids aren't playing US Kids anymore!

    There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.

  • @leezer99 said:

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

    Boys that hit driver 175 should be playing 2,500. No reason to hold back those that can hit it further. Part of the problem with US Kids IMO is that they don't allow kids to move up. Which is why it becomes so much less competitive as the kids get older... the better kids aren't playing US Kids anymore!

    There is plenty of competition in US Kids, even as they get older. For the most elite of players the local yardages are too short but that’s about 1%. The scores in regionals and worlds suggest that those yardages are appropriate as well.

    There’s no sense in setting it up at the local level to yardages that only the world top 20 can handle. Those kids are elite.

    The jump from 9 to 10 was MASSIVE for us. We went from breaking par to struggling to break 80 overnight. That’s ok because you get two ears at the yardage but the 10 year old jump moreso than any other is really big. I think it’s fine if they pull that back a little at the local level. Past local it needs to stay there.

  • darter79darter79 Members Posts: 682 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 1:17am #10

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Heard yesterday that USKG is going with long leaf system for yardages starting this summer. That brings boys 10 down to 2100 yards. Not sure why there would only be a 200 yard jump from boys 9 to boys 10. I guess they thought the jump to 2500 was too much for the shorter hitters? Not sure if all age groups will have adjusted yardages but I thought original USKG yardages were reasonable.

    Where did you hear that? I have a hard time thinking they could. That system is based on 1500 yards. The younger groups would suffer greatly unless they regrouped how they are doing the yardages. What is your source for this information?

    EDIT: Just talked to our local USKG director he said changes are coming but its not confirmed if it goes longer or shorter but he thinks they will go longer.

  • tiger1873tiger1873 Members Posts: 1,011 ✭✭

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

  • @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That is silly. At USKG Worlds last year in the girls 12, only 4 girls broke par for 36 holes from 5,342. In girls 11 only 8 broke par at 4,700.

    It’s OK for the very best player or players to dominate a course. Dunham made the setup in boys 10 look silly by shooting -24, but he also won by 14 strokes.

    No clue why you want a course setup that the very elite probably wouldn’t break par and the middle and bottom would struggle to shoot under 85/90. That’s just stupid.

  • tiger1873tiger1873 Members Posts: 1,011 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 2:27am #13

    @Pinewood Golfer said:

    @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That is silly. At USKG Worlds last year in the girls 12, only 4 girls broke par for 36 holes from 5,342. In girls 11 only 8 broke par at 4,700.

    It’s OK for the very best player or players to dominate a course. Dunham made the setup in boys 10 look silly by shooting -24, but he also won by 14 strokes.

    No clue why you want a course setup that the very elite probably wouldn’t break par and the middle and bottom would struggle to shoot under 85/90. That’s just stupid.

    5600 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is not long for a lot them. A lot places already have them play from that yardage and the girls do well. Playing 4700 yard is way too short the longer hitters can’t even use a driver and I would guess are teeing up in areas in the fairway. This can be bad because the course was not designed to be played from where those tees are.

    I would Argue Very few girls can play 5600 yardage. Yes they will have a hard time getting a birdie but then again so does the average golfer.

    If your going to have shorter yardage kids will move on to the other tours even sooner. With US kids I believe most have by the time they are 12.

  • @tiger1873 said:

    @Pinewood Golfer said:

    @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That is silly. At USKG Worlds last year in the girls 12, only 4 girls broke par for 36 holes from 5,342. In girls 11 only 8 broke par at 4,700.

    It’s OK for the very best player or players to dominate a course. Dunham made the setup in boys 10 look silly by shooting -24, but he also won by 14 strokes.

    No clue why you want a course setup that the very elite probably wouldn’t break par and the middle and bottom would struggle to shoot under 85/90. That’s just stupid.

    5600 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is not long for a lot them. A lot places already have them play from that yardage and the girls do well. Playing 4700 yard is way too short the longer hitters can’t even use a driver and probably are teeing off in the fairway with messed up angles for anyone who can actually drive the ball..

    I would Argue Very few girls can’t play 5600 yardage. Yes they will have a hard time getting a birdie but then again so does the average golfer.

    Again, this is INSANE. This discussion began as a local tour level discussion. In any case, the scores I just cited are proof (not opinion) that these “way too short” yardages hold up very well. In my opinion, an appropriate yardage is one where the country/world’s Best players break par. It’s fine to have a war of attrition from time to time where 78-78 wins, but I don’t want a world championship or a regional set up that way.

    You say “very few girls can’t play 5,600 yards...”. On what data are you basing this? You say “they will have a hard time making a birdie but so does the average golfer”. These aren’t average golfers we are talking about. These are world class 11-12 year olds.

  • BertGABertGA Posts: 270 ✭✭

    @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That’s about 500 less than a collegiate tournament. Seems a little long for a 5th grader.

  • mrshinsamrshinsa Members Posts: 156 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 3:14am #16

    @leezer99 said:

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

    Boys that hit driver 175 should be playing 2,500. No reason to hold back those that can hit it further. Part of the problem with US Kids IMO is that they don't allow kids to move up. Which is why it becomes so much less competitive as the kids get older... the better kids aren't playing US Kids anymore!

    10-year-old boys that are carrying 175, total 210+ are the exceptions. I've only seen one or two kids in our local tour that can do so. Most 10-year-old boys are carrying 140~150, total 170~180.

    US Kids was established for the majority of juniors to introduce them into competitive golf, hence should cater to the middle of the bell curve.

  • kekoakekoa ClubWRX Posts: 8,782 ClubWRX

    @mrshinsa said:

    @leezer99 said:

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

    Boys that hit driver 175 should be playing 2,500. No reason to hold back those that can hit it further. Part of the problem with US Kids IMO is that they don't allow kids to move up. Which is why it becomes so much less competitive as the kids get older... the better kids aren't playing US Kids anymore!

    10-year-old boys that are carrying 175, total 210+ are the exceptions. I've only seen one or two kids in our local tour that can do so. Most 10-year-old boys are carrying 140~150, total 170~180.

    US Kids was established for the majority of juniors to introduce them into competitive golf, hence should cater to the middle of the bell curve.

    I thought those driving distances were the norm for 9 yr olds?

  • tiger1873tiger1873 Members Posts: 1,011 ✭✭

    A bit of misconception here on yardages and what kids are capable of hitting. The technology has gotten a lot better and the average Kid has gone way up in real yardages when driving.

    There has been a huge increase from just a few years ago. My kids are about 3 years apart and a few years ago the yardages were ok. Back then most kids used cheap stainless steel drivers. Fast forward to today and every kid is a using a OEM driver and can almost hit the green on every hole. So if anything the younger ages need to go up in yardage if anything. If you not using a newer OEM driver the yardages probably seem just fine to you.

    When it comes to the older kids by the time they are 12 the better kids have all moved on from US kids tournaments because the yardage is short and you can not age up.

  • JuniorGolfParentJuniorGolfParent Members Posts: 21 ✭✭

    Wow the yardages people are talking about seem much longer than what I am seeing watching kids (even the good ones) competing in our area.

    If the 5th place 7-9 year old boy in Drive Chip & Putt finals (who is probably 9?) is hitting it about 160 yards, and the 6th place 10-11 year old finalist is hitting it 190 yards, how do the yardages above make any sense?

    (Scratching head)

  • BloctonGolf11BloctonGolf11 Members Posts: 207 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 1:03pm #20

    @kekoa said:

    @mrshinsa said:

    @leezer99 said:

    @yellowlover519 said:
    Here is the longleaf suggestions. Boys 10 should be playing 2500 IMO:

    https://www.randa.org/~/media/DFFFCE626B384C81A53152A9FE8A1DB5.ashx

    Boys that hit driver 175 should be playing 2,500. No reason to hold back those that can hit it further. Part of the problem with US Kids IMO is that they don't allow kids to move up. Which is why it becomes so much less competitive as the kids get older... the better kids aren't playing US Kids anymore!

    10-year-old boys that are carrying 175, total 210+ are the exceptions. I've only seen one or two kids in our local tour that can do so. Most 10-year-old boys are carrying 140~150, total 170~180.

    US Kids was established for the majority of juniors to introduce them into competitive golf, hence should cater to the middle of the bell curve.

    I thought those driving distances were the norm for 9 yr olds?

    The norm, not in my opinion. Not the norm if your definition is the average "competitive" golfer in USKids, which I would tab as somewhere between low to mid 40s on 9 holes in my opinion. Taking out the kids who are beginners or not very good yet I still think these competitive kids, who are a good marker for a "norm" are carrying the ball around 135-145 with roll hitting 150-160 on good solid drives from what i have seen. The best 9 year old in our division who is a metronome golfer of 37-39 scores is right at 130s-140s carry with a total drive of 165-170 when he hits it well. My son is very big for his age (almost 5' at 9 years old but VERY LANKY) and he is a 150-160ish kid on average with occasional pokes out further. What we see down here in the South.

    Dad's Bag

    Driver: Ping G30 10 degree, Aldila Reg Flex
    3W, and 7W: Cleveland Black, Bassara, Lite Flex
    5i - PW: Titleist AP1 716, DG XP90 Reg Flex
    W: 48 Cleveland Rotex 3
    W: 52 Cleveland Rotex 2
    W: 56 Vokey SM6 F Grind
    P: TP Mills Flat-T Proto
    Ball: Srixon Q-Star

    Son's Bag (9 years old)
    Driver: Callaway XR16, Flynn Shaft (Set to 15.5)
    3W: Cobra Biocell, Flynn Shaft (Set to 19.5)
    4H: Cobra Biocell, Flynn Shaft (Set to 25)
    5i-PW: US Kids Tour Series TS2
    W: 52, 56 degree US Kids Tour Series TS2
    P: Nike Oven MC-07W Prototype
    Ball: Wilson Duo Soft/Callaway Chrome Soft Truvis
  • leezer99leezer99 I swear I am quitting this site every day... Members Posts: 963 ✭✭

    Here are the drives of the top 3 kids in each age group with an average at the bottom. I didn't watch but someone said there may have been conditions less favorable to certain groups that went earlier?

    There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.

  • hangontighthangontight Members Posts: 538 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 1:35pm #22

    @Pinewood Golfer said:

    @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That is silly. At USKG Worlds last year in the girls 12, only 4 girls broke par for 36 holes from 5,342. In girls 11 only 8 broke par at 4,700.

    It’s OK for the very best player or players to dominate a course. Dunham made the setup in boys 10 look silly by shooting -24, but he also won by 14 strokes.

    No clue why you want a course setup that the very elite probably wouldn’t break par and the middle and bottom would struggle to shoot under 85/90. That’s just stupid.

    • Remember though that Worlds last year was VERY WET. Day two was a washout at most courses - those that played played in aweful condition and those that got pushed to play on day 3 were playing in still wet conditions. Our course, at least, did play longer/tougher because of this and seemed to show on scoring.

    • My son is 8, just regionals and worlds now for the last few years (minus a few locals last summer leading up to World) - it is my observation that the yardages at the regionals almost always seem to be shorter than advertised for whatever reason.

    • As someone else mentioned, the upper tier of kids are going to eat the USKG yardages up. However, for the average of the field , they seem to be appropriate (my experience so far - again, he is only 8...been playing USKG since 5). I think that USKG , even at the regional level, is still a learning ground for kids. It is not meant to be "mini-ajga" and be a stern test for all. Yes, a core group of top level kids (especially in the younger groups) still play in regionals & worlds (even locals for some) because it is hard to find that same level of competition locally unless you live in a hotbed area. I expect that the top level kids will gravitate away from USKG, but at the younger ages it still seems to be the best option available for most for good competition.

  • darter79darter79 Members Posts: 682 ✭✭

    @JuniorGolfParent said:
    Wow the yardages people are talking about seem much longer than what I am seeing watching kids (even the good ones) competing in our area.

    If the 5th place 7-9 year old boy in Drive Chip & Putt finals (who is probably 9?) is hitting it about 160 yards, and the 6th place 10-11 year old finalist is hitting it 190 yards, how do the yardages above make any sense?

    (Scratching head)

    using DCP as a judge for kids and driving distance on ONE drive isn't a good indicator of distance. Th girls who won 7-9 hit hers almost 190 so are you going to say that's an average for girls of that age range? Most hit theirs 130-150 is that the average? Using DCP for driving distances for kids would be a bad stat in my opinion. I know some of those from worlds and other events and and I would say the numbers were inflated by conditions and wind a bit.

  • @hangontight said:

    @Pinewood Golfer said:

    @tiger1873 said:

    @heavy_hitter said:

    @bwbw said:
    I'll be interested in seeing that. For girls, 10-11 plays 9 holes, 1,900 yards. At 12, though, they jump to 18 holes, 5,000 yards. That is 600 yards longer than what they played in the previous year/season. I thought the jump only benefited the long hitters (not my daughter) and penalized those girls that may hit short, but are accurate. I understand Worlds being longer, but at the local level, only the long hitters would ever have looked at birdies.

    My preference would have been to split the different and play them at 4,500 - 4,600.

    To be honest, 5000 yards for a 11-12 year old girl is pretty short. I would think that 12 year old girl's for the World Championship would be at 5300-5500 yards in my opinion. The regional tours in Florida (FJT, SFPGA,) are all 5000-5500 yards. Hurricane Tour is 5000-5100 yards.

    5000 yards for a 11-12 year old is way too short for the vast majority of girls. I think 5500 -5700 would be a better yardage for that age group and bring in more iron play. Too many girls just hit the ball as far as they can and hope they can play a wedge into the green.

    Anything less and it seems like everyone can birdie a few holes. Local tournaments should not be a birdie fest either. I Think this gives a false sense of hope because at 13 the course get a lot harder and longer for girls.

    That is silly. At USKG Worlds last year in the girls 12, only 4 girls broke par for 36 holes from 5,342. In girls 11 only 8 broke par at 4,700.

    It’s OK for the very best player or players to dominate a course. Dunham made the setup in boys 10 look silly by shooting -24, but he also won by 14 strokes.

    No clue why you want a course setup that the very elite probably wouldn’t break par and the middle and bottom would struggle to shoot under 85/90. That’s just stupid.

    • Remember though that Worlds last year was VERY WET. Day two was a washout at most courses - those that played played in aweful condition and those that got pushed to play on day 3 were playing in still wet conditions. Our course, at least, did play longer/tougher because of this and seemed to show on scoring.

    • My son is 8, just regionals and worlds now for the last few years (minus a few locals last summer leading up to World) - it is my observation that the yardages at the regionals almost always seem to be shorter than advertised for whatever reason.

    • As someone else mentioned, the upper tier of kids are going to eat the USKG yardages up. However, for the average of the field , they seem to be appropriate (my experience so far - again, he is only 8...been playing USKG since 5). I think that USKG , even at the regional level, is still a learning ground for kids. It is not meant to be "mini-ajga" and be a stern test for all. Yes, a core group of top level kids (especially in the younger groups) still play in regionals & worlds (even locals for some) because it is hard to find that same level of competition locally unless you live in a hotbed area. I expect that the top level kids will gravitate away from USKG, but at the younger ages it still seems to be the best option available for most for good competition.

    Fair enough. In 2017 all courses in the area played firm and fast. There were 4 girls 11 that broke par for 54 holes and 4 girls 12 that did. This is a really silly discussion. I see a lot of people saying “I think” or “I believe” or “from what I see”. There is very little fact being used to support these opinions. Mostly just a bunch of parents with ill-informed guesses.

  • leezer99leezer99 I swear I am quitting this site every day... Members Posts: 963 ✭✭

    @Golfingdawg19 said:
    The issue is that some want you to build the yardages around the elite golfers which is a very small percentage. The majority of the kids playing at each level are perfect at the current yardages that US Kids have and some may even need them to be shortened. If the goal is to grow the game, then making the courses so long that only elite players excel will be counterproductive. If your child is that elite, then move them up to a higher level and let them compete against older kids.

    Which USKG doesn't allow so they all leave. At the local tour level you're only seeing middle of the road players.

    There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.

  • BloctonGolf11BloctonGolf11 Members Posts: 207 ✭✭

    @leezer99 said:

    @Golfingdawg19 said:
    The issue is that some want you to build the yardages around the elite golfers which is a very small percentage. The majority of the kids playing at each level are perfect at the current yardages that US Kids have and some may even need them to be shortened. If the goal is to grow the game, then making the courses so long that only elite players excel will be counterproductive. If your child is that elite, then move them up to a higher level and let them compete against older kids.

    Which USKG doesn't allow so they all leave. At the local tour level you're only seeing middle of the road players.

    I think once you get to and past ages 10-11 you are dead on the nose. USKG is very well run and does a lot of things extremely well; however, not allowing kids to age up is kind of ridiculous and holds back talented players while discouraging other players at the same time when kids who honestly shouldn't still be playing a developmental tour are still there pounding away, sometimes playing multiple local tours just to rack up "victories". You need to keep the yardages reasonable for kids who came in late to the game but allow the good players to move up.

    Dad's Bag

    Driver: Ping G30 10 degree, Aldila Reg Flex
    3W, and 7W: Cleveland Black, Bassara, Lite Flex
    5i - PW: Titleist AP1 716, DG XP90 Reg Flex
    W: 48 Cleveland Rotex 3
    W: 52 Cleveland Rotex 2
    W: 56 Vokey SM6 F Grind
    P: TP Mills Flat-T Proto
    Ball: Srixon Q-Star

    Son's Bag (9 years old)
    Driver: Callaway XR16, Flynn Shaft (Set to 15.5)
    3W: Cobra Biocell, Flynn Shaft (Set to 19.5)
    4H: Cobra Biocell, Flynn Shaft (Set to 25)
    5i-PW: US Kids Tour Series TS2
    W: 52, 56 degree US Kids Tour Series TS2
    P: Nike Oven MC-07W Prototype
    Ball: Wilson Duo Soft/Callaway Chrome Soft Truvis
  • JuniorGolfParentJuniorGolfParent Members Posts: 21 ✭✭
    edited Apr 9, 2019 2:20pm #28

    @darter79 said:

    @JuniorGolfParent said:
    Wow the yardages people are talking about seem much longer than what I am seeing watching kids (even the good ones) competing in our area.

    If the 5th place 7-9 year old boy in Drive Chip & Putt finals (who is probably 9?) is hitting it about 160 yards, and the 6th place 10-11 year old finalist is hitting it 190 yards, how do the yardages above make any sense?

    (Scratching head)

    using DCP as a judge for kids and driving distance on ONE drive isn't a good indicator of distance. Th girls who won 7-9 hit hers almost 190 so are you going to say that's an average for girls of that age range? Most hit theirs 130-150 is that the average? Using DCP for driving distances for kids would be a bad stat in my opinion. I know some of those from worlds and other events and and I would say the numbers were inflated by conditions and wind a bit.

    Maybe you misunderstood my post - I think I am agreeing with you.

    People are implying 9 year old boys drive it 170-180 yards, and others are posting charts showing the top 3 finishers in the "Drive" portion of the DCP finals. These numbers seem inflated and/or taking a very small sample of high-performing elite junior golfers who are some of the best in the country. I agree they should NOT be used in talking about yardages for competitions average junior tournament golfers.

  • heavy_hitterheavy_hitter Members Posts: 3,003 ✭✭

    US Kids Local distances are short and they play them short for a reason.

    US Kids Regional and State distances are a little on the short side as well but fair.

    US Kids Worlds distances are fair, but I think they should stretch them more. It is THE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS, it is supposed to be hard.

  • leezer99leezer99 I swear I am quitting this site every day... Members Posts: 963 ✭✭

    @JuniorGolfParent said:

    @darter79 said:

    @JuniorGolfParent said:
    Wow the yardages people are talking about seem much longer than what I am seeing watching kids (even the good ones) competing in our area.

    If the 5th place 7-9 year old boy in Drive Chip & Putt finals (who is probably 9?) is hitting it about 160 yards, and the 6th place 10-11 year old finalist is hitting it 190 yards, how do the yardages above make any sense?

    (Scratching head)

    using DCP as a judge for kids and driving distance on ONE drive isn't a good indicator of distance. Th girls who won 7-9 hit hers almost 190 so are you going to say that's an average for girls of that age range? Most hit theirs 130-150 is that the average? Using DCP for driving distances for kids would be a bad stat in my opinion. I know some of those from worlds and other events and and I would say the numbers were inflated by conditions and wind a bit.

    Maybe you misunderstood my post - I think I am agreeing with you.

    People are implying 9 year old boys drive it 170-180 yards, and others are posting charts showing the top 3 finishers in the "Drive" portion of the DCP finals. These numbers seem inflated and/or taking a very small sample of high-performing elite junior golfers who are some of the best in the country. I agree they should NOT be used in talking about yardages for competitions average junior tournament golfers.

    If you're ok with staying in the fat part of the bell curve then so be it.

    There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.

  • kcapkcap Members Posts: 154 ✭✭

    What is everyone criteria of appropriate distance? I have seen this statement used but what does that mean?
    Does it imply that majority of the field shoot from par to the mid/high 70s?
    I think Pinewood has hit the nail.. in every category.. worlds or regional you have only a few kids breaking par - call it 5% of the field. How can that be short ? Even boys 12 in 2017 @ Worlds at 6000 yds only 5 kids broke par. How is that short or not hard enough?
    The same is true for girls etc..the distance are okay for the majority, your kid just might be minority because of a growth spurt or cause they have been playing it 12 months for the last 5 years..

    We play yardages from 5000 to 6100 - my son just turned 12. Each round is evaluated based on yardage played..just like the handicap system..

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