Best Driver of 2019 | Full Article _HERE_ | Discussion Thread _HERE_

**** Ball Test - General Discussion

rkelso184rkelso184 Members Posts: 236 ✭✭✭

Obviously this is coming out shortly. Do you think many companies are nervous? Will this make you change your ball?

I think it will come down to some cheaper firm ball with good durability and not so much a big names top offering. I know top quality balls clearly make a difference but I also know alot of players who can still rip a no brand ball and shoot under par. Obviously companies pay players to use a certain ball which is why they do and why they have such a strong presence but also were not them players!

Hitting it straight is overrated! 

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Comments

  • jjfcpajjfcpa Driver - Tour Edge EXS 10.5 Omaha, NEMembers Posts: 505 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm guessing that what they found is that there is not that much difference between the middle tier ball and the top tier ball. Most 3 piece urethane balls will perform similarly and most 2 piece non urethane balls will perform similarly. Consequently, spending the extra money for the big brand names may not be providing you with much in the way of additional performance. The real difference between those balls will come down to dollars and cents, not performance. What I don't know, and would be very interested in, is if they will address the issue of lower compression balls providing better performance for slower swing speeds.

  • kcd38kcd38 Members Posts: 408 ✭✭✭✭

    My guess is they found large differences in the quality and consistency with some companies products.

    Driver - PING G400 LST 8.5, Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.0
    3 Wood - PING G400 14.5, AD Di 6s
    Hybrid - Ping G410 19 degree, Tour AD DI 95x Hybrid 
    4-PW - Mizuno JPX 919 Tour PW-6, 919 Forged 5 iron, 919 Hot Metal Pro 5 iron, all with Modus Nippon3 120s
    Wedges - Vokey SM7 50F, 55F, 60 D 
    Putter - Taylormade Spider Tour Black
  • wagsgtwagsgt Members Posts: 623 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I dont see why anyone would change. Each person will have different results with each ball. Use what works for you

  • cpeckcpeck North new jerseyMembers Posts: 597 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jjfcpa is that last sentence a fact?

  • Joker91Joker91 Westminster, COMembers Posts: 572 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What test and who is doing it?

  • jjfcpajjfcpa Driver - Tour Edge EXS 10.5 Omaha, NEMembers Posts: 505 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @cpeck said:
    @jjfcpa is that last sentence a fact?

    @cpeck said:
    @jjfcpa is that last sentence a fact?

    Definitely not a fact, but a if you look at packaging and website info for golf balls, you see comments like "for ball swings under 105" or "for ball swings over 105". What exactly is this implying? If you don't have a fast enough swing then you won't be able to compress the ball and it will result in less distance.

  • arbeckarbeck SeattleMembers Posts: 490 ✭✭✭✭

    @jjfcpa said:
    I'm guessing that what they found is that there is not that much difference between the middle tier ball and the top tier ball. Most 3 piece urethane balls will perform similarly and most 2 piece non urethane balls will perform similarly. Consequently, spending the extra money for the big brand names may not be providing you with much in the way of additional performance. The real difference between those balls will come down to dollars and cents, not performance. What I don't know, and would be very interested in, is if they will address the issue of lower compression balls providing better performance for slower swing speeds.

    From what Dean Snell has said, the lower compression being better for lower swing speeds is mostly a myth. On the other end, it's try super high swing speeds 120+ can lose ball speed off the driver and fairway woods with a too soft ball. But the reverse isn't really true. A slower player doesn't get more ball speed by playing a softer ball. And when you stop and think about it, it makes sense. TXG tests show that Matt doesn't lose any ball speed on a soft ball with a 6i or wedge. He only loses ball speed when he moves up to a driver or fairway wood. The soft ball also doesn't give him more speed off a wedge or 6i, where his ball speed corresponds to a 90MPH player's 6i and driver speeds.

    I've also wondered about the idea that a soft ball is better in the cold. I wouldn't think the temperature of the ball would effect distance much. What I think might be happening is that the cold air is denser so spin effects the flight off the ball more (as there is more air to interact with the spin creating more friction). A softer ball generates less spin, so the ball will go further in cold conditions simply because it is spinning less.

    Ping Traverse
    King Cobra F7 10.5* w/ Mitsubishi Tensi CK Blue 60 set at 9.5*
    TEE E8 4W, 7W
    Mizuno JPX-900 Hot Metal 5-SW w/ Veylix Alpina 873
    TEE CB PROs 60*
    Scotty Cameron Squareback
  • North ButteNorth Butte Members Posts: 11,520 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @Joker91 said:

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:
    What test and who is doing it?

    A certain Site Who Must Not Be Named but whose name rhymes with "high golf pie".

    Ok so not a real test then. I can skip it

    You have learned well, young Grasshopper. There is nothing more for me to teach you.

    “1lb beefstak, with
    1pt bitter beer
    every 6 hours.
    1 ten-mile walk every morning.
    1 bed at 11 sharp every night.
    And don't stuff your head with things you don't understand.” 
  • kiw1982kiw1982 Members Posts: 1,212 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I am interested in this coming result, but I got sick of their super long tease.

    Mizuno        ST-180 Driver w/KuroKage HBP 50 S+
    Taylormade  M6 3 Wood w/NV 2KXV Blue 75 S+
    Taylormade  P790 2 UDI w/KBS Tour FLT 120 S+
    Taylormade  P790 4-G Irons w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Mizuno        T7 56/10 Wedge w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Mizuno        S18 60/06 Wedge w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Odyssey      Arm Lock Double Wide Putter
  • bcflyguy1bcflyguy1 Enjoying my coffee... Members Posts: 3,044 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @arbeck said:
    I've also wondered about the idea that a soft ball is better in the cold. I wouldn't think the temperature of the ball would effect distance much. What I think might be happening is that the cold air is denser so spin effects the flight off the ball more (as there is more air to interact with the spin creating more friction). A softer ball generates less spin, so the ball will go further in cold conditions simply because it is spinning less.

    Think I remember reading that cold can have a detectable but marginal effect on the elasticity of core materials, but that we're talking about really "cold soaking" golf balls (keeping them very cold for a very long time). If you're in conditions where that becomes a factor, I have to question the wisdom of playing in conditions like that in the first place...LOL

    The increasing density of air as temperature decreases and the increased drag that results from that has much more to do with distance loss as temps drop.

    Never forget that the luxury of being
    wrong is not enough to make you right.
    WITB Link
  • nsxguynsxguy Just anudder user FloridaMembers Posts: 5,983 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:
    What test and who is doing it?

    A certain Site Who Must Not Be Named but whose name rhymes with "high golf pie".

    Well now, look who's back after almost 6 months

    Welcome back NB !!! Hope all is well.

    Callaway Epic 10.5 Project X Hzrdus Yellow 63 gr, 6.0
    Adams A12 Pro hybrids, 16*, Aldila VS Proto Stiff
    Ping G400 19* hybrid Stiff 70 Stock shaft

    Ping G20, 5-PW, DGS300
    Ping Glide Forged 48*, 52* 56*, 60* DGS300
    Taylormade Tour Spider Black (Today - always subject to change LOL)
    Titleist AVX
  • arbeckarbeck SeattleMembers Posts: 490 ✭✭✭✭

    The most interesting thing about the ball test is probably going to be learning about QC in the brands. They have teased on twitter one brand of ball (unnamed) that had 3 different compression numbers ranging in 30 points from the same box when tested. Titlesist had some interesting videos with Crossfield where they had very small differences in dimple depth on one side of the ball that led to huge curvatures. Having a core misaligned at all could cause huge problems. These are also things that won't show up on an indoor launch monitor. You'll need Trackman outdoors to find this stuff out.

    Ping Traverse
    King Cobra F7 10.5* w/ Mitsubishi Tensi CK Blue 60 set at 9.5*
    TEE E8 4W, 7W
    Mizuno JPX-900 Hot Metal 5-SW w/ Veylix Alpina 873
    TEE CB PROs 60*
    Scotty Cameron Squareback
  • lopey986lopey986 ClubWRX Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Apr 26, 2019 4:43pm #16

    It's funny that the url for this discussion says **** but the actually title has the site name asterisks out like it's in the swear filter, lmao.

    hah, blurs the site name out in my comment too, now that's some funny ****.

  • rgk5rgk5 rgk5(OLB) Members Posts: 3,658 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Apr 26, 2019 4:49pm #17

    I am interested in their results from the Callaway ERC Soft. I played it last weekend and found it be short and dead feeling. Disappointing to say the least, but the lines were good for putting. ;)

    Cobra F8+, 10*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F2
    Cobra F8 3-4 wood 15.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F3

    Cobra F8 5-6 wood 17.5, Tensei Blue R
    Taylor Made Super Launch 22*, stock "R"
    Ping Eye 2 BeCu 4-9, Microlite S
    Vokey 200 Series 52 degree(bent to 50*), DG S-200
    Ping Glide 1.0 55*, CFS Wedge flex

    Cleveland CBX 58/10, DG 105
    Evnroll ER6

  • nsxguynsxguy Just anudder user FloridaMembers Posts: 5,983 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @rgk5 said:
    I am interested in their results from the Callaway ERC Soft. I played it last weekend and found it be short and dead feeling. Disappointing to say the least, but the lines were good for putting. ;)

    I played the ERC Soft for about 4 or 5 rounds and didn't find it dead at all. Quite the opposite actually. And distance was excellent as well; almost as long as the AVX. I ended up back to the AVX because I didn't like the clicky feel, it seemed to release a bit too much on short irons shot to the green and it seemed a little too lively chipping.

    Strangely(?) enough, although I have a terrible time trying to get a single line on a golf ball pointed correctly for putting, the 3 line system was a lot easier to do it, so I did use the 3 lines and it seemed to work pretty well.

    Callaway Epic 10.5 Project X Hzrdus Yellow 63 gr, 6.0
    Adams A12 Pro hybrids, 16*, Aldila VS Proto Stiff
    Ping G400 19* hybrid Stiff 70 Stock shaft

    Ping G20, 5-PW, DGS300
    Ping Glide Forged 48*, 52* 56*, 60* DGS300
    Taylormade Tour Spider Black (Today - always subject to change LOL)
    Titleist AVX
  • backhillbackhill Members Posts: 114 ✭✭✭

    @rgk5 said:
    I am interested in their results from the Callaway ERC Soft. I played it last weekend and found it be short and dead feeling. Disappointing to say the least, but the lines were good for putting. ;)

    Curious to see if they test Kirkland and how it compares. Some tee shots I feel it's on par with others, other shots I feel it spins much more than others.

  • rgk5rgk5 rgk5(OLB) Members Posts: 3,658 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    It was cold (50*) and wet. I'll try it again tomorrow and Sunday when it should be in the low 60s.

    Cobra F8+, 10*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F2
    Cobra F8 3-4 wood 15.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F3

    Cobra F8 5-6 wood 17.5, Tensei Blue R
    Taylor Made Super Launch 22*, stock "R"
    Ping Eye 2 BeCu 4-9, Microlite S
    Vokey 200 Series 52 degree(bent to 50*), DG S-200
    Ping Glide 1.0 55*, CFS Wedge flex

    Cleveland CBX 58/10, DG 105
    Evnroll ER6

  • FlashbackPTFlashbackPT ClubWRX Posts: 32 ClubWRX

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:
    What test and who is doing it?

    A certain Site Who Must Not Be Named but whose name rhymes with "high golf pie".

    Ok so not a real test then. I can skip it

    You have learned well, young Grasshopper. There is nothing more for me to teach you.

    Do they have a history of inaccurate tests? I’m not familiar.

  • MahamiltoMahamilto NYCMembers Posts: 1,957 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @FlashbackPT said:

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:

    @North Butte said:

    @Joker91 said:
    What test and who is doing it?

    A certain Site Who Must Not Be Named but whose name rhymes with "high golf pie".

    Ok so not a real test then. I can skip it

    You have learned well, young Grasshopper. There is nothing more for me to teach you.

    Do they have a history of inaccurate tests? I’m not familiar.

    They have been pretty good from my reading.... the big newsstand articles seem much less relevant IMHO...

    Titleist TS3 - 9.75* - HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.5 (C1 Setting, STD Fade)
    Titleist U510 1-iron - HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.5
    Titleist 716 T-MB 3 and 4-iron - KBS C-Taper 130x
    Titleist 716 T-MB 5-9-iron - DG AMT x100
    Titleist 718 AP2 PW, 50* - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM7 55* S-Grind - DG AMT x100
    Titleist SM3 60.07 - DG Tour Issue x100
    Evnroll ER6-B
    Bridgestone Tour B X
    Titleist Staff Stand Bag
  • jcorna01jcorna01 Members Posts: 654 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Apr 27, 2019 12:21pm #23

    I like the work they do and will definitely read this test. I have enough experience with my preferred ball that it won’t sway my opinion. I’m not much of an experimenter, though, at least when it comes to this.

  • jjfcpajjfcpa Driver - Tour Edge EXS 10.5 Omaha, NEMembers Posts: 505 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @arbeck said:

    @jjfcpa said:
    I'm guessing that what they found is that there is not that much difference between the middle tier ball and the top tier ball. Most 3 piece urethane balls will perform similarly and most 2 piece non urethane balls will perform similarly. Consequently, spending the extra money for the big brand names may not be providing you with much in the way of additional performance. The real difference between those balls will come down to dollars and cents, not performance. What I don't know, and would be very interested in, is if they will address the issue of lower compression balls providing better performance for slower swing speeds.

    From what Dean Snell has said, the lower compression being better for lower swing speeds is mostly a myth. On the other end, it's try super high swing speeds 120+ can lose ball speed off the driver and fairway woods with a too soft ball. But the reverse isn't really true. A slower player doesn't get more ball speed by playing a softer ball. And when you stop and think about it, it makes sense. TXG tests show that Matt doesn't lose any ball speed on a soft ball with a 6i or wedge. He only loses ball speed when he moves up to a driver or fairway wood. The soft ball also doesn't give him more speed off a wedge or 6i, where his ball speed corresponds to a 90MPH player's 6i and driver speeds.

    I've also wondered about the idea that a soft ball is better in the cold. I wouldn't think the temperature of the ball would effect distance much. What I think might be happening is that the cold air is denser so spin effects the flight off the ball more (as there is more air to interact with the spin creating more friction). A softer ball generates less spin, so the ball will go further in cold conditions simply because it is spinning less.

    I've seen lots of product specs related to golf balls that say, for example, "for swing speeds below 105", "for swing speeds above 105". I can see why they would say for swing speeds "below 105" because those with high swings might lose distance; but why say anything regarding "swings speeds above 105" if there is no detriment to distance if they have a slower swing speed? I know Bridgestone's product specs includes this information and probably others...

  • arbeckarbeck SeattleMembers Posts: 490 ✭✭✭✭

    @jjfcpa said:

    @arbeck said:

    @jjfcpa said:
    I'm guessing that what they found is that there is not that much difference between the middle tier ball and the top tier ball. Most 3 piece urethane balls will perform similarly and most 2 piece non urethane balls will perform similarly. Consequently, spending the extra money for the big brand names may not be providing you with much in the way of additional performance. The real difference between those balls will come down to dollars and cents, not performance. What I don't know, and would be very interested in, is if they will address the issue of lower compression balls providing better performance for slower swing speeds.

    From what Dean Snell has said, the lower compression being better for lower swing speeds is mostly a myth. On the other end, it's try super high swing speeds 120+ can lose ball speed off the driver and fairway woods with a too soft ball. But the reverse isn't really true. A slower player doesn't get more ball speed by playing a softer ball. And when you stop and think about it, it makes sense. TXG tests show that Matt doesn't lose any ball speed on a soft ball with a 6i or wedge. He only loses ball speed when he moves up to a driver or fairway wood. The soft ball also doesn't give him more speed off a wedge or 6i, where his ball speed corresponds to a 90MPH player's 6i and driver speeds.

    I've also wondered about the idea that a soft ball is better in the cold. I wouldn't think the temperature of the ball would effect distance much. What I think might be happening is that the cold air is denser so spin effects the flight off the ball more (as there is more air to interact with the spin creating more friction). A softer ball generates less spin, so the ball will go further in cold conditions simply because it is spinning less.

    I've seen lots of product specs related to golf balls that say, for example, "for swing speeds below 105", "for swing speeds above 105". I can see why they would say for swing speeds "below 105" because those with high swings might lose distance; but why say anything regarding "swings speeds above 105" if there is no detriment to distance if they have a slower swing speed? I know Bridgestone's product specs includes this information and probably others...

    Something like 80% of Golfers prefer a softer ball. It just feels nicer to hit. Given that you can make a softer ball and slower swing speeds won't lose distance, it makes sense for a manufacturer to recommend the softer ball to them.

    Ping Traverse
    King Cobra F7 10.5* w/ Mitsubishi Tensi CK Blue 60 set at 9.5*
    TEE E8 4W, 7W
    Mizuno JPX-900 Hot Metal 5-SW w/ Veylix Alpina 873
    TEE CB PROs 60*
    Scotty Cameron Squareback
  • NJpatbeeNJpatbee Ocean County, NJMembers Posts: 1,540 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I still do not know who "they" are so I have no idea if I care about the ball test.

  • noodle3872noodle3872 Chilliwack B.C. CanadaMembers Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @NJpatbee said:
    I still do not know who "they" are so I have no idea if I care about the ball test.

    Google “Tony Covey golf”.

    Taylormade M6 driver MCA Tensei CK Pro Blue 60 S Flex
    Taylormade M6 fairway wood MCA Tensei CK Pro Blue 70 S Flex
    Taylormade M4 19° hybrid MCA OT Tour Hybrid 80 S Flex
    Taylormade M4 22° hybrid MCA OT Tour Hybrid 90 S Flex
    Mizuno JPX 919 Hot Metal Pro 5-PW Modus3 Tour 105 S flex
    Mizuno S18 Gunmetal Wedges 50-07, 54-12, 58-12 and 62-08 Modus3 115 Wedge
    Scotty Cameron Futura 5.5M
    Scotty Cameron Futura 7M
    Titleist Yellow Pro V1
  • c50soonerc50sooner Members Posts: 86 ✭✭✭

    Regarding the soft ball for slower swing speed debate, note that Bridgestone switched from swing speed to handicap for parsing out ball model recommendations. So, they're either assuming swing speed correlates directly with handicap (which it definitely doesn't), or they're saying more variables come into play than just raw swing speed. Like center-face hits for instance, which probably correlates pretty well with handicap. I think the tolerance of less than perfect strikes is the main benefit of soft balls, you can still compress the ball on less than perfect strikes. For a low handicap golfer that consistently compresses the ball, there is no need to take the tradeoffs associated with playing a softer ball. I don't think it is possible to maximize ball speed while at the same time maximizing the tolerance for variation in strike quality, hence the decrease in max ball speed on low compression balls vs high compression balls when both are struck purely.

    Cobra F8+ 9.5* - Aldila NK2V Green SCallaway GBB 3 Wood - Kuro Kage TiNi RCallaway Apex 20, 23 Hybrid - Kuro Kage Black SSrixon Z355 4,6-PW - NS Pro 950GH SCallaway MD2 47,52,56 - DG S300Odyssey Rossie 2TaylorMade TP5x
  • rkelso184rkelso184 Members Posts: 236 ✭✭✭

    @noodle3872 said:

    @NJpatbee said:
    I still do not know who "they" are so I have no idea if I care about the ball test.

    Google “Tony Covey golf”.

    Some say they are spy's who like the game of golf... I once saw them test the cortex driver on TV.

    Hitting it straight is overrated! 

  • trackcoach13trackcoach13 Members Posts: 1,035 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @c50sooner said:
    Regarding the soft ball for slower swing speed debate, note that Bridgestone switched from swing speed to handicap for parsing out ball model recommendations. So, they're either assuming swing speed correlates directly with handicap (which it definitely doesn't), or they're saying more variables come into play than just raw swing speed. Like center-face hits for instance, which probably correlates pretty well with handicap. I think the tolerance of less than perfect strikes is the main benefit of soft balls, you can still compress the ball on less than perfect strikes. For a low handicap golfer that consistently compresses the ball, there is no need to take the tradeoffs associated with playing a softer ball. I don't think it is possible to maximize ball speed while at the same time maximizing the tolerance for variation in strike quality, hence the decrease in max ball speed on low compression balls vs high compression balls when both are struck purely.

    The best correlation in golf is:
    handicap average driver club speed

    [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Driver: Cobra F9 w/ Aldila NV 2KXV Green 65 Stiff
    3W: Titleist 917F2 w/Fujikura Speeder Pro Tour Spec 84 Stiff [/font]

    [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]2I: Srixon Z U65 18 Degree w/Miyazaki Kaula 7s
    Irons: Wilson FG Tour v6 4-GW DG S300 AMT
    Wedge: 56/11 Wilson FG Tour PMP Raw Tour Grind[/font]

    Wedge: Vokey SM6 60-12 K-Grind
    [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Putter: [/font]Odyssey O-WORKS Red Marxman
  • c50soonerc50sooner Members Posts: 86 ✭✭✭

    Interesting curve, thanks for posting. Not sure what kind of sample set that is showing, but my statement was based on all the guys in my golf league with way higher swing speed than me, that shoot way worse scores. I'm sure this is a common scenario, given that all you need to be able to swing a club fast is some strength/size and a reasonable amount of athleticism. Actual golf skill not required at all.

    Cobra F8+ 9.5* - Aldila NK2V Green SCallaway GBB 3 Wood - Kuro Kage TiNi RCallaway Apex 20, 23 Hybrid - Kuro Kage Black SSrixon Z355 4,6-PW - NS Pro 950GH SCallaway MD2 47,52,56 - DG S300Odyssey Rossie 2TaylorMade TP5x

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