High Cap Fitted For X100's - Thoughts?

Hello all,

Quick info about me. 29 y/o male, shoots around 90 on average, some days are better and some are worse but I'm making a concerted effort to improve my handicap this year, including lessons and better fitted equipment. I struggle off the tee and irons are probably the stronger part of my game. I had initially decided from a brief hitting that the i210's were what I wanted. But after getting some opinions from members here and some internal reflection I decided to get properly fit and knew those probably wouldn't give me the best score on the golf course, despite how much I liked them. I tried multiple heads and ended up deciding on the G410s. I also really enjoyed the HM Pros but I'm a big Ping fan and the extra blade length seemed to help, numbers wise they were virtually identical. The G410's gave me great numbers, plenty of forgiveness, and confidence to pull the 4 iron that I would typically shy away from, so I decided to move forward with that head.

Once the head was dialed in, it was time to work on the shaft. My initial fitting was at the PGATSS and the fitter seemed very disinterested and less than helpful to say the least, he gave me a couple shafts to try but didn't look at any averages or numbers just basically said to pick one that felt good. I left that "fitting" quickly and did some research before settling on another fitter. I found a local Ping Top 100 fitter and scheduled an appointment with a guy who came highly recommended. I explained my situation and what I was looking for and we got to work. The first thing we did after warming up was use their new Mizuno Swing Optimizer to get a basis of where to begin, he told me that the staff had all used it and were impressed with its accuracy, but it was still important to hit the shafts and get real world numbers. After warming up and taking a few swings we went over the results and I was a little shocked to say the least. The top three shafts were:

1. Dynamic Gold X100 SS

2. KBS Tour 130 x

3. KBS CTaper X

The fitter explained that I had a significant amount of toe down and put a lot of load on the shaft. I don't remember all of the numbers from the optimizer (I really regret not taking a picture) but my 7iron swing speed was 90 and my toe down was 7*, unfortunately I do not remember the rest. Regardless, I didn't want to make my decision based solely on the optimizer alone. Once we were done reviewing the numbers I actually began hitting balls with a large range of shafts to see if an X shaft would suit me as I certainly didn't think that's what I would be fitted for. I will make a long story short from here and say that I did get the best results from the x100ss (tightest dispersion by far, great flight and felt good), I did not like the ctaper feel at all and the KBS flight was very high. I also tried the DG 120 series, PX Lz, and some of the Modus shafts thinking that since the industry is trending towards lighter shafts that It would benefit me as well, but it wasn't the case. I expressed my concerns to the fitter that mentally I had always thought x100's were for scratch players only, not someone like me, and he said that the swing speed is only part of the equation, how you load and release the shaft along with the shafts bend profile is more important than just weight and the letter associated with the shaft (R, S, X etc). The fitter mentioned that the weight helps keep me in plane and control my tempo as well which seemed to be true during the fitting. So finally, my question for all of you club experts:

Do you see any issues with a higher handicap playing x100 (soft stepped) and do you disagree with anything my fitter said? Is there any reason I should reconsider a lighter 120 gram shaft? I see a lot of people mention fatigue from the heavier shafts at the end of a round but I'm just not sure If 10 grams would actually make that big of a difference. I apologize for the long winded-ness, just wanted to hear what the general consensus is here before I place my order. Thank you for any input.

Don't think there's a correlation between handicap and shaft.

Agree with shaolin, handicap and swing speed are not correlated. However, remember that the Mizuno shaft optimizer fits you into shafts they offer, not all shafts. I heavily load the shaft as well and X100's to me were not a great fit. The softer grip section would set with my downswing but the rest of the shaft was like rebar and felt boardy to me. I like shafts with a softer mid-section for more kick feel. Like KBS Tour, Nippon Tour125, Tour105, etc.

Personally, I normally don't have issues to what fitters say, however, I don't place a lot of faith in the Optimizer. Fatigue will be an issue with any golfer. 10 grams over 3.5-4.5 hours can start to affect a swing over time. If we can get a golfer into something that will keep the performance up over the length of a round, I'm all for it. Golf shouldn't be made harder. Assuming the fit was good, there shouldn't be an issue with staying with the flex they recommended. You saw flight and dispersion the way you liked it, that's cool. Just trust your fit and see where you go with it. I'd lose the 10 grams personally, but that may just be me.

> @JDubya89 said:

> I expressed my concerns to the fitter that mentally I had always thought x100's were for scratch players only, not someone like me, and he said that the swing speed is only part of the equation, how you load and release the shaft along with the shafts bend profile is more important than just weight and the letter associated with the shaft (R, S, X etc). The fitter mentioned that the weight helps keep me in plane and control my tempo as well which seemed to be true during the fitting. So finally, my question for all of you club experts:

>

> Do you see any issues with a higher handicap playing x100 (soft stepped) and do you disagree with anything my fitter said? Is there any reason I should reconsider a lighter 120 gram shaft? I see a lot of people mention fatigue from the heavier shafts at the end of a round but I'm just not sure If 10 grams would actually make that big of a difference. I apologize for the long winded-ness, just wanted to hear what the general consensus is here before I place my order. Thank you for any input.

>

Quoting the relevant part. Your fitter here is dead on. Handicap and shaft flex are not at all correlated.

If you like the feel and they give good results, that's all that matters.

The fatigue issue that gets raised is more to due with your ability to load the shaft properly as you get tired. As an example, if you could only hit the X100's well with your best, full speed swings then as you get tired they wouldn't perform as well. Heavier generally means stiffer so that's how the extra weight comes into play.

Just curious. The 2nd fitter - how much did the fitting cost ?

Anywho, I don't consider myself a club expert but I do know that HDCP doesn't correlate to SS. I swing DGS300 (130 gram) irons with a 95mph driver SS (probably about high 70s to low 80s in 7 iron SS & carries about 153 if it matters). I selected the DGS300s 7 years ago while testing my G20 head over at least 5 different sessions. The DGS300s "cost" me about 2-3 yards in distance but the consistency and the considerably narrower dispersion was clearly worth it.

And while I don't think flex matters all that much I do think weight does and I'd think you'd be fine with something from 120-130 grams. Heavier shafts, as you described, kida sorta "stabilize" the swing in many cases. Too light shafts can exacerbate the possibility of the shaft "waving all over the place" during the swing and you certainly don't sound like you need the extra distance a lighter shaft would likely give you (at the possible risk of wider dispersion)

Further, I don't know what kind of shape you're in but I am considerably older than you and not in the greatest physical shape and I'm always wondering where this "fatigue" comes in at the end of a round. I don't feel like I'm swinging any differently on 18 than I did on 1. Actually, probably since I don't hit a bucket before the round, I find the early holes producing slightly less than expected distance than later in the round.

Bottom line, it sounds to me like your fitter knows what he/she is talking about.

Good luck.

Shaft weight is one of the most critical shaft fitting elements because the way a shaft feels in your hand has a significant effect on the way you swing. X100 or S300 doesn't matter as much as 130 grams vs. 120 grams.

Nothing wrong with it. Lots of folks on here say play the softest shaft you can control, I say the opposite, play the stiffest shaft you can load/get decent distance out of

> @nsxguy said:

> Just curious. The 2nd fitter - how much did the fitting cost ?

>

> Anywho, I don't consider myself a club expert but I do know that HDCP doesn't correlate to SS. I swing DGS300 (130 gram) irons with a 95mph driver SS (probably about high 70s to low 80s in 7 iron SS & carries about 153 if it matters). I selected the DGS300s 7 years ago while testing my G20 head over at least 5 different sessions. The DGS300s "cost" me about 2-3 yards in distance but the consistency and the considerably narrower dispersion was clearly worth it.

>

> And while I don't think flex matters all that much I do think weight does and I'd think you'd be fine with something from 120-130 grams. Heavier shafts, as you described, kida sorta "stabilize" the swing in many cases. Too light shafts can exacerbate the possibility of the shaft "waving all over the place" during the swing and you certainly don't sound like you need the extra distance a lighter shaft would likely give you (at the possible risk of wider dispersion)

>

> Further, I don't know what kind of shape you're in but I am considerably older than you and not in the greatest physical shape and I'm always wondering where this "fatigue" comes in at the end of a round. I don't feel like I'm swinging any differently on 18 than I did on 1. Actually, probably since I don't hit a bucket before the round, I find the early holes producing slightly less than expected distance than later in the round.

>

> Bottom line, it sounds to me like your fitter knows what he/she is talking about.

>

> Good luck.

Thanks, the iron fitting was only 50 so not that bad. I think I’m gonna go for them and see how it goes. I want to give them a few rounds to see how they really feel after prolonged use and worst comes to worst I flip them and I’m out a little bit of money, no big deal I guess

If I were you, I would pay another $50 and go back to the fitter and tell him you want to do comparison between the standard DG’s X100’s vs the DG 120 X100’s and then make your decision.

I did this with my last iron fitting and I’ll do it going forward too. The piece of mind knowing you have the right shaft is worth the $50 in my opinion.

Well I got out tonight and was able to spend about an hour and a half on the sim hitting different shafts, I tried the px and kbs one more time and was able to rule them out for sure. They are not included in the averages above, only the following three shafts are:

DGX100

DG120X

DG120S

Based on the averages above and without knowing which is which, what shaft would you pick?

> @JDubya89 said:

>

>

> Well I got out tonight and was able to spend about an hour and a half on the sim hitting different shafts, I tried the px and kbs one more time and was able to rule them out for sure. They are not included in the averages above, only the following three shafts are:

> DGX100

> DG120X

> DG120S

>

> Based on the averages above and without knowing which is which, what shaft would you pick?

I assume that they're not labeled correctly and they were all 7 irons, yes ?

If that's the case, you're obviously not hitting them the same. Then again, you are about a 20 handicapper, yes ? revenant is the only 20+ handicapper I've ever seen that is so very consistent in his iron dispersion and distance. LOL

Way too much variation in ball speed to get a good handle on it. Really poor strikes, IMO, should be taken OUT of the averages assuming they are really outliers, i.e. (many ?) fewer of them than good strikes. If they're NOT outliers it MAY be the shaft that's the problem in GETTING a good strike.

I mean, if you hit 10 "decent" shots and top 1 only 20 yards, is the resulting average worthwhile ? The blue circle has the shortest strike(s) according to the ellipses and not surprisingly the shortest average ball speed. Just how short was it/they ?

Without more info, impossible to pick one.

> @nsxguy said:

> > @JDubya89 said:

> >

> >

> > Well I got out tonight and was able to spend about an hour and a half on the sim hitting different shafts, I tried the px and kbs one more time and was able to rule them out for sure. They are not included in the averages above, only the following three shafts are:

> > DGX100

> > DG120X

> > DG120S

> >

> > Based on the averages above and without knowing which is which, what shaft would you pick?

>

> I assume that they're not labeled correctly and they were all 7 irons, yes ?

>

> If that's the case, you're obviously not hitting them the same. Then again, you are about a 20 handicapper, yes ? revenant is the only 20+ handicapper I've ever seen that is so very consistent in his iron dispersion and distance. LOL

>

> Way too much variation in ball speed to get a good handle on it. Really poor strikes, IMO, should be taken OUT of the averages assuming they are really outliers, i.e. (many ?) fewer of them than good strikes. If they're NOT outliers it MAY be the shaft that's the problem in GETTING a good strike.

>

> I mean, if you hit 10 "decent" shots and top 1 only 20 yards, is the resulting average worthwhile ? The blue circle has the shortest strike(s) according to the ellipses and not surprisingly the shortest average ball speed. Just how short was it/they ?

>

> Without more info, impossible to pick one.

Thanks for the input. Yes all 7 irons, and I hit about 20 shots with each shaft and tried to swing the same through each shaft, obviously my swing is not perfectly repeatable every time but I did remove some shots that I completely chunked and were complete outliers but I did not remove all of the mishits that may have missed the sweet spot, which I guess I should have so I could have had a good sample of only good swings. Not sure why there was so much loss of ball speed between the shafts though, especially the first and third shaft. The one labeled driver is the dgX100, FW is dg120X and iron is dg120S