Played in 4:45...and it was pleasant!

First off, want to say I'm a fast golfer and dislike slow play...I like getting around in three hours if possible.

Yesterday, a friend was in town from out of state, and decided to play Los Verdes in PV. This course is notorious for 5.5-6 hour rounds. In fact, the only time I've ever played was about two decades ago...and it took over 6 hours...never again!

We played as a fivesome, and only had to wait on a couple shots (not very long)...it was very relaxing and pleasurable...helped out of course by some of the best coast views in CA golf. Course was in nice condition...greens a little slow though. Didn't look at my watch once...which must be a first for a round of that length.

Honestly, I hate slow play. But good company, playing in a 5some probably paced you perfectly for the day.

I played Wednesday at a course that usually takes about 3:45-4 hrs and It took 4:20, but I had good company and it was a beautiful day.

We had to wait a bit on most holes, 5-7 minutes, which would usually bother me.....no problem on this day.

I'm used to going off first time of the day as a 4some or 5some and playing in 3:15-3:45. Lately we've been starting a little later and it seems like it will be a death march with groups in front of us, but when I check at the end we still finish in under 4 hours and wait maybe 2-3 holes all day. Guess I've gotten more patient the older I get!

> @halliedog said:

> I'm used to going off first time of the day as a 4some or 5some and playing in 3:15-3:45. Lately we've been starting a little later and it seems like it will be a death march with groups in front of us, but when I check at the end we still finish in under 4 hours and wait maybe 2-3 holes all day. Guess I've gotten more patient the older I get!

I'm same. Often times when we make the turn there are 9 hole'ers out in front of us slowing us down and it sticks in my craw. There was a twosome in front a couple weekend back and our foursome was on their butt the whole way. They walked like they were joined at the hip; first to one ball and then to the other. They just managed to stay ahead of us even though the course was open in front of them. I just don't get it.

I just don't get it. A lot of you guys must play with people you don't care for much to feel compelled to get a round in well under 4 hours. As I see it no one is enjoying themselves much. They guys playing fast and pushing groups in front aren't happy and you can be darned sure that the group being pushed isn't happy either. No wonder it's getting harder and harder to marshal when everyone is miserable and no one is enjoying themselves regardless of surroundings or the weather of the day. 4 hour rounds should not be viewed as a hardship!

> @scomac2002 said:

> I just don't get it. **_A lot of you guys must play with people you don't care for much_** to feel compelled to get a round in well under 4 hours. As I see it no one is enjoying themselves much. They guys playing fast and pushing groups in front aren't happy and **_you can be darned sure that the group being pushed isn't happy either_**. No wonder it's getting harder and harder to marshal when everyone is miserable and no one is enjoying themselves regardless of surroundings or the weather of the day. 4 hour rounds should not be viewed as a hardship!

>

I enjoy the people I regularly play with just fine, its the people in the second part of the bolded print I don't care much for. If they want to be out smelling the daisies, B.S.ing on every green/tee box, and are uncomfortable being pushed they should step aside and let the faster group through - no shame in that, then both groups could enjoy the day?

I mostly agree with you, as I stated in my first post I've learned to enjoy the day more for what it is when forced to play slower than normal. Just don't start on how your day is ruined by being pushed, common etiquette says the slower group should yield (if the course is open ahead).

> @halliedog said:

> > @scomac2002 said:

> > I just don't get it. **_A lot of you guys must play with people you don't care for much_** to feel compelled to get a round in well under 4 hours. As I see it no one is enjoying themselves much. They guys playing fast and pushing groups in front aren't happy and **_you can be darned sure that the group being pushed isn't happy either_**. No wonder it's getting harder and harder to marshal when everyone is miserable and no one is enjoying themselves regardless of surroundings or the weather of the day. 4 hour rounds should not be viewed as a hardship!

> >

>

> I enjoy the people I regularly play with just fine, its the people in the second part of the bolded print I don't care much for. If they want to be out smelling the daisies, B.S.ing on every green/tee box, and are uncomfortable being pushed they should step aside and let the faster group through - no shame in that, then both groups could enjoy the day?

>

> I mostly agree with you, as I stated in my first post I've learned to enjoy the day more for what it is when forced to play slower than normal. Just don't start on how your day is ruined by being pushed, common etiquette says the slower group should yield (**if the course is open ahead**).

>

The bold part is very important. Unfortunately for many, etiquette has been replaced with entitlement in that if I am capable in playing in 3 to 3 1/2 hours I should be allowed through regardless. It really comes down to the situation on course on the given day. All you can reasonably ask for is that you play ready golf from the appropriate tee boxes and let faster groups through if the hole ahead is open. Rarely is an entire hole ahead open.

From the course operator's perspective, rarely does letting faster groups play through improve pace of play on a course. It's the other things I mentioned that make the big difference -- ready golf, appropriate tee boxes, clear rules as to OB and searching for lost balls. Those are the things that suck up playing time like a sponge. So, I'm sorry for those that like to play quick, but can't get out early and are forced into a slower playing situation than they like, but sometimes you just have to go with the flow and not let in bother you. You could be at work instead or worse yet, lying in a hospital bed. Put that smile back on your face and make the best of the situation.

Scomac's post above is excellent, I must agree. "ready golf, appropriate tee boxes, clear rules as to OB and searching for lost balls" - Lost ball searching is definitely my biggest pet peeve and likely one of the major causes of slow play. I shudder in horror when I see a foursome ahead all fanned out and plodding away looking for a ball that nobody saw land in a specific location...like the walking dead on the golf course lol.

I'm totally good with 4h and 30m to complete 18 playing a full foursome. I really don't expect it to go any faster than that.

Couple years back we're playing a twilight round and a from a couple groups behind comes this dude along with his GF, riding in a cart with music blaring, hunting camo wearing...not kidding, dude was fricking hilarious and pathetic all at once. The course is full, nobody lagging behind but the wait at a particular par 3 was brutal. Anyway, cart camo guy manages to "play through" the group behind us and as we're about to finally tee off on the par3, he strolls right onto the box and proclaims "we're gonna play through" -

I curled over and tried not to break out laughing but one guy in our group was right on it with "the F you are!" and blocked him off the box. Dude seriously thought that if you're only two and riding a cart then you should be allowed to just blaze through all the foursomes ahead no matter what. He got back in his cart and skipped the par3, drove to the next hole and probably began tormenting the rest of the players in his path. Absolutely shocking how ignorant and entitled some people are!

Again slow golfers are upset. I like my company and meeting new people on the course. I also move in one direction (forward) and am very helpful in ball searches, pulling the flag and being positive. I also want to be done in 3:45 or less. Fortunately usually first off on the weekend. I'd much rather spend the time I apportion to golf on the patio grabbing a drink or bite afterwards.

And add to that I have a spouse I like to spend time with and being gone for 6-8 hours golfing does not fit well into that schedule. Again almost everyone who joins our group when there are 1-2 openings are surprised how a 3 hour round is easily doable without being rushed at all.

You can have a fast 5 hr round just as you can have a slow 3 hr round(yes this beast exists). Just a matter of perspective and how the round flows.

Really depends on the company doesn't it?

Some folks are funny and pleasant. You could hang with them all day. The golf is just there as you hang with them.

But if your partners are boring and golf is the main source of excitement then it'll feel slow all day long.

So be thankful when you find someone who's fun to be around. I think that's the take-home.

Spent 2 years in So Cal back in the early 80s and played 3 or 4 rounds every week all over the area. But generally Sunday mornings I either played Los Verdes or Recreation Park. Los Verdes was one of my most favorite places to play anywhere out there. Clear day, Catalina Island looked so close and private airplanes flying below the level of the course. Gorgeous!!!

I am somewhat spoiled these days because at my club, we play in under 4 hours most days. I do play a lot of other courses and I don't have a problem with slow play so much if the course is full but if I see 2 holes open ahead of me and the marshal is doing nothing to the group ahead...then it starts to get to me.

> @scomac2002 said:

> I just don't get it. A lot of you guys must play with people you don't care for much to feel compelled to get a round in well under 4 hours. As I see it no one is enjoying themselves much. They guys playing fast and pushing groups in front aren't happy and you can be darned sure that the group being pushed isn't happy either. No wonder it's getting harder and harder to marshal when everyone is miserable and no one is enjoying themselves regardless of surroundings or the weather of the day. 4 hour rounds should not be viewed as a hardship!

>

Had a situation come up just last weekend. Played in a tournament, first group out in tournament but not the first group out on the course. We kept up with the group ahead of us who was not playing in the tournament. However the group behind us was very quickly 2 holes behind and they never caught up. The marshal thought I was one of the officers in the league and he was chewing on my butt about the slow group. Well, it turns out they actually played in 4-1/2 hours and they were pleading their case based up on that fact. The point is...you are supposed to keep up with the group ahead of you, not try to play in a certain amount of time.

Four hours is 240 minutes. 240 mins divided by 18 holes is 13.3 minutes per hole. Say you shoot 80, that is only three minutes per shot. You'll be quicker on a tap in putt, longer on a drive where you need to wait to tee off or takes a little while to get to your ball and find a yardage if you hunt sprinkler heads. All told three minutes per shot is pretty fair.

> @RickKimbrell said:

> > @scomac2002 said:

> > I just don't get it. A lot of you guys must play with people you don't care for much to feel compelled to get a round in well under 4 hours. As I see it no one is enjoying themselves much. They guys playing fast and pushing groups in front aren't happy and you can be darned sure that the group being pushed isn't happy either. No wonder it's getting harder and harder to marshal when everyone is miserable and no one is enjoying themselves regardless of surroundings or the weather of the day. 4 hour rounds should not be viewed as a hardship!

> >

> The point is...you are supposed to keep up with the group ahead of you, not try to play in a certain amount of time.

>

>

This is literally the most accurate post on pace of play in any thread in the history of WRX.

I have zero problem with a packed course. Fall behind, and I rage out. It's simple, no one... NO ONE should fall behind a foursome.

> @smashdn said:

> Four hours is 240 minutes. 240 mins divided by 18 holes is 13.3 minutes per hole. Say you shoot 80, that is only three minutes per shot. You'll be quicker on a tap in putt, longer on a drive where you need to wait to tee off or takes a little while to get to your ball and find a yardage if you hunt sprinkler heads. All told three minutes per shot is pretty fair.

The point is, everyone should be taking their three minutes at the same time, or pretty close. It's not 3 min X 4, independently. A lot of this would be solved if people pulled up to their partners ball, let them out, grab club, and head to their ball. Ready golf. First player walks over to second after his shot.

> @"Hack Daddy" said:

> The point is, everyone should be taking their three minutes at the same time, or pretty close. It's not 3 min X 4, independently. A lot of this would be solved if people pulled up to their partners ball, let them out, grab club, and head to their ball. Ready golf. First player walks over to second after his shot.

Agreed. I got behind a foursome with only two actually playing. They turned the number five tee box into their own personal driving range. I walk and they were in carts. I put my bag down on the blue tee box as I putted out on No 4 to keep from needlessly packing it up a hill out of my way. They knew I was right behind them but they were goofing around none the less. They were putting on no 1 when I pulled into the course. After I got parked, shoes on, paid, took a wizz, etc., I caught them on the no 3 tee.

Pace of play is all about context, course and traffic.

Yesterday, I played the front 9 behind a group 5 ... And waited for them on every shot. They weren't slow for a 5, but I was a single walker and they were riding and refused to let me through, even though the course was literally wide open in front of them. The front 9 took 2 hours, which isn't horrible, but in this context, there was no reason for. I asked to go by at the turn and played the back in 1:15 (shot a 38 on 123 course). Not everybody has to play at the same pace. Just respect and look out for your fellow golfers. If someone faster is behind you and open holes are in front, let them through. If someone slower is in front of you but there is nowhere to go, cool your jets and slow your pace, there's no reason to push the group ahead of you.

> @halliedog said:

> I'm used to going off first time of the day as a 4some or 5some and playing in 3:15-3:45. Lately we've been starting a little later and it seems like it will be a death march with groups in front of us, but when I check at the end we still finish in under 4 hours and wait maybe 2-3 holes all day. Guess I've gotten more patient the older I get!

Played as a single yesterday. I walk. Joined by two other older guys who were riding. We had three walking ladies in front of us and 4 walkers behind us.

We had to wait a couple times on the front nine and once on the back.

We started at 12:08 and finished at 3:50. The marshals expect 4:15.

Nobody complained when we waited and I never had to hustle to keep up to the riding guys.

When I go out, I plan nothing after golf before two hours after a 4:30 round. Otherwise I book earlier.

I leave for golf about 45 minutes before start time and usually get home 45 minutes after finish. Another 30 minutes on the course ain't gonna make any difference to my life.

> @tatertot said:

> Pace of play is all about context, course and traffic.

>

> If someone slower is in front of you but there is nowhere to go, cool your jets and slow your pace, there's no reason to push the group ahead of you.

Depends on how slow the play is. I call it mass insanity when the course is playing real slow: the guys ahead are slow so you are forced to pace off them, and the guys behind follow suit, etc, etc. Nobody is pushing forward because everyone is resigned to just play slow. I've seen this happen countless times where there is some group out front with a hole open in front of them and nobody from behind is pushing so they think it's okay.

In regards to Los Verdes in PV, that course is so slow I all but refuse to play there unless we have an early tee time. I walked off at the turn one time because the front took 3 hours...and there were 3 groups waiting on the 10th tee. The place is a joke.

> @tatertot said:

> Pace of play is all about context, course and traffic.

>

> Yesterday, I played the front 9 behind a group 5 ... And waited for them on every shot. They weren't slow for a 5, but I was a single walker and they were riding and refused to let me through, even though the course was literally wide open in front of them. The front 9 took 2 hours, which isn't horrible, but in this context, there was no reason for. I asked to go by at the turn and played the back in 1:15 (shot a 38 on 123 course). Not everybody has to play at the same pace. Just respect and look out for your fellow golfers. If someone faster is behind you and open holes are in front, let them through. If someone slower is in front of you but there is nowhere to go, cool your jets and slow your pace, there's no reason to push the group ahead of you.

I think another point to drive home is that not enough singles look to join up. I was raised to believe that singles are only allowed on the course at the discretion of the folks at the counter. Most of the higher-end courses forced people to pair up.

If a person goes out as a single and expects to be put on the course and let through on every hole they are not going to get their wish very often.

It's always preferable to join up with others not only because it makes the round more pleasant but because it helps balance out the pace between groups. Plus it makes the golf course more money.