DG x7 spin too much

I was wondering if anybody could help. I currently have a set of ap2's with dynamic golf x7's.. hitting shots on trackman earlier I noticed that my spin with a 7 iron was 7500 .club speed was 95mph with ball carrying on average 185... I then tried my friends p790 irons which have dgsl shafts and I was only getting 5500 spin, 98mph and was hitting the ball on average 215 with his 7 iron and his 4 iron 255( mine goes 220... I compared the loft on both irons and it was identical.

I am predominantly a coach but also play, so my knowledge of equipment is limited as cusom fitting is something I have never done.

Can anyone explain these numbers? I think the weight of shafts will play a factor, when I got fitted for dgx7 I was powerlifting regularly and alot stronger than I am now but the spin I don't understand . Is that purely from the p790 head?

My AOA is -4 (7 iron) and dispersion was good with both.

Are the p790s really that long and low spinning?

I compete regularly in Scotland( always windy) and so low spin would be a big help for me

Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> @Cwebb said:

> Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

Head design IS the #1 factor.

I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

790s are lofted strong. The 790 7 iron is an AP2 6 iron.

> @Cwebb said:

> Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> @"Howard Jones" said:

> > @Cwebb said:

> > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

>

> His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> Head design IS the #1 factor.

I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

@BM5D said:

> I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> @ckay said:

> 790s are lofted strong. The 790 7 iron is an AP2 6 iron.

Right you are! Strange as I checked the lofts of both, must have rushed it or misread it as I though they were both 33. I will double check tomorrow but doubt they will be much different from standard

You likely looked at ap3 lofts

790 gives lots of guys 1 to 1.5 extra club via low spin

Definitely club-head... go get some rebar and put them in those ap2s. might bring the spin down a touch.

> @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > @Cwebb said:

> > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

>

> Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > @Cwebb said:

> > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> >

> > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

>

> I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

>

> I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > Head design IS the #1 factor.

>

> I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> @BM5D said:

> > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

>

> Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

>

>

>

> Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

>

>

>

>

Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

> @BM5D said:

> > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > @Cwebb said:

> > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> >

> > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > >

> > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> >

> > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> >

> > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> >

> > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > @BM5D said:

> > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> >

> > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

Well I'm afraid you are wrong.the range is outdoor, with a small studio built behind a grass bay. The balls were flying over the 250 mark...

I like a doubter but you need to think about things ABIT more before you post.

Also the spin is not artificially low for a 4 iron. I averaged them numbers for 10 balls with a 4 iron.

Guessing you don't have a trackman

Regardless of trackman, I could feel the ball coming off like a bullet from the p790s, a very low spinning penetrating flight and I could see the balls finishing over 250 (252 average for 6 shots according to trackman) as I said I was spinning 5000 with my ap2's with less speed so I'm guessing the p790s are just powerful af.

As Howard mentioned above, be curious to know what the descent angle was on the monitor? If you play links golf, I guess it's not a terrible thing, but versaitlity would probably be a bit of an issue.

On the SF number, you look like you only have about 15* of spin loft....high COR iron, little bit of margin for error on club head speed and/or impact location...pretty understandable.

Those are massive numbers, that tricked me into playing them for awhile. All I can say is good luck scoring with that low of spin on any course that is even slightly firm. The huge numbers look great on trackman and for ego, but it's tough to play it. I'm back to a 47* PW based set (bent) and it's night and day in play-ability.

> @Golfrnut said:

> As Howard mentioned above, be curious to know what the descent angle was on the monitor? If you play links golf, I guess it's not a terrible thing, but versaitlity would probably be a bit of an issue.

>

> On the SF number, you look like you only have about 15* of spin loft....high COR iron, little bit of margin for error on club head speed and/or impact location...pretty understandable.

I had no problem launching them into the air if need be so that shouldn't be a problem, I tried the p730s today and got on great with them, lower spinning than my current irons and with more speed(lighter shafts) also a tighter dispersion in distance than the p790s... I have already ordered a 2 iron in the p790s but not the kind of club I want to be hitting into a small green...> @"DFS PFD" said:

> Those are massive numbers, that tricked me into playing them for awhile. All I can say is good luck scoring with that low of spin on any course that is even slightly firm. The huge numbers look great on trackman and for ego, but it's tough to play it. I'm back to a 47* PW based set (bent) and it's night and day in play-ability.

Yeh I'm not planning on putting them in the bag, much prefer the p730s after trying them today.. interesting to hear that, what clubs are you using now?

> @BM5D said:

> > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > @Cwebb said:

> > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> >

> > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > >

> > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> >

> > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> >

> > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> >

> > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > @BM5D said:

> > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> >

> > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

Those look more like driver numbers with the dynamic loft, launch angle, smash factor (I'm not even sure 1.49 is possible with an iron??)

Anyway, 5500 is not enough spin for a 7 iron, better with irons to error a little over than under.

I don’t have anything to add to the conversation here, but did the OP’s username change in the middle of this thread, or is it me?

> @MountainKing said:

> > @BM5D said:

> > > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > >

> > > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > >

> > > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> > >

> > > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> > >

> > > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> > >

> > > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > > @BM5D said:

> > > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> > >

> > > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

>

> Those look more like driver numbers with the dynamic loft, launch angle, smash factor (I'm not even sure 1.49 is possible with an iron??)

>

> Anyway, 5500 is not enough spin for a 7 iron, better with irons to error a little over than under.

Why is 5500 not enough spin for a 7 iron? If I can still launch it high and get a steep descent? Just curious to know.

I have a friend who fits clubs for a living and he suggested that I should be looking for 1000rpm under the iron(6000 for a 7iron, 3000 for a 4 iron) to produce the shots im looking for and to stop the ball spinning up.

Again this isn't my area of expertise, just looking to expand my knowledge

Regarding the low high SF, that's just the difference in club and ball speed so surely if you have a hot faced iron( hollow,speedfoam,strong lofts) it would be able to come off the face very fast particularly with a high club head speed

> @GoIrish17 said:

> I don’t have anything to add to the conversation here, but did the OP’s username change in the middle of this thread, or is it me?

Think it's just you ?

> @GoIrish17 said:

> I don’t have anything to add to the conversation here, but did the OP’s username change in the middle of this thread, or is it me?

My apologies, I just looked and it did change ?

> @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @BM5D said:

> > > > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > >

> > > > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > > >

> > > > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> > > >

> > > > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > > > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> > > >

> > > > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > > > @BM5D said:

> > > > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > > > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> > > >

> > > > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > > > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

> >

> > Those look more like driver numbers with the dynamic loft, launch angle, smash factor (I'm not even sure 1.49 is possible with an iron??)

> >

> > Anyway, 5500 is not enough spin for a 7 iron, better with irons to error a little over than under.

>

> Why is 5500 not enough spin for a 7 iron? If I can still launch it high and get a steep descent? Just curious to know.

> I have a friend who fits clubs for a living and he suggested that I should be looking for 1000rpm under the iron(6000 for a 7iron, 3000 for a 4 iron) to produce the shots im looking for and to stop the ball spinning up.

>

> Again this isn't my area of expertise, just looking to expand my knowledge

>

> Regarding the low high SF, that's just the difference in club and ball speed so surely if you have a hot faced iron( hollow,speedfoam,strong lofts) it would be able to come off the face very fast particularly with a high club head speed

That's too low of spin. 5500 with your speed isn't going to stop. It's going to bounce and roll probably. If anything you should be over 7000.

I've been patiently waiting for this exact thread title, and my patience has been rewarded.....

Spin is your friend

> @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > @BM5D said:

> > > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > >

> > > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > >

> > > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> > >

> > > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> > >

> > > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> > >

> > > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > > @BM5D said:

> > > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> > >

> > > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

>

> Well I'm afraid you are wrong.the range is outdoor, with a small studio built behind a grass bay. The balls were flying over the 250 mark...

> I like a doubter but you need to think about things ABIT more before you post.

> Also the spin is not artificially low for a 4 iron. I averaged them numbers for 10 balls with a 4 iron.

> Guessing you don't have a trackman

If it's an enclosed bay there can still be misreads on club data. Were you hitting off grass or a mat?

> @Krt22 said:

> > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > @BM5D said:

> > > > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > >

> > > > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > > >

> > > > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> > > >

> > > > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > > > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> > > >

> > > > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > > > @BM5D said:

> > > > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > > > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> > > >

> > > > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > > > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

> >

> > Well I'm afraid you are wrong.the range is outdoor, with a small studio built behind a grass bay. The balls were flying over the 250 mark...

> > I like a doubter but you need to think about things ABIT more before you post.

> > Also the spin is not artificially low for a 4 iron. I averaged them numbers for 10 balls with a 4 iron.

> > Guessing you don't have a trackman

>

> If it's an enclosed bay there can still be misreads on club data. Were you hitting off grass or a mat?

It's an open range off grass, I hit Infront of the bay. Numbers are accurate

> @chiva said:

> Spin is your friend

Maybe in a different climate, I play regularly in high winds(links courses) so IV found spin to be something to avoid. I see it all the time with great players who spin the ball too much and completely lose control once the ball reaches its max height and get blown around.

The players that do well here all have very low penetrating flights.

I have competed in Spain before and the opposite is true there as pretty much every day was calm or a bit breezy

> @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > @MountainKing said:

> > > @BM5D said:

> > > > @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > >

> > > > Yeh i I'll try out some different configurations tomorrow and see how i get on. Head design is more influential than I thought.

> > > > > @"Howard Jones" said:

> > > > > > @Cwebb said:

> > > > > > Most likely the head design difference, but if you're hitting a different shaft better then it's well worth testing it further, even if it's not a flex and weight you would normally assume would fit

> > > > >

> > > > > His spin level is not unexpected at 95 mph with a #7 iron, but AP2 is both high launch and spin, on the other hand, 5500 rpms of spin from a #7 iron on that club speed is too little unless you get a descent angle up in the area of 50, if not you want be able to stop the ball on the green, and with a #7 iron, we should not have much roll, so dont get blinded of distance alone, look at both dispersion and stopping power.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't so my homework when I got the ap2's as I didn't realise they were a high launch hi spin.. i will try them on the course tomorrow along with some others to get a better idea of how they play as trackman numbers only tell half the story. Your right about stopping the ball as I play alot of links golf with firm greens so that is a very important part, I think my launch and height should still be able to hold the green but I won't know till I experiment > @Valtiel said:

> > > > > Yeah it is not likely that the shafts themselves are causing any spin problems, rather what is happening with your swing as a result of either their stiffness or weight. X7's are extremely similar to Project X 7.0's and are some of the absolute stiffest shafts you can buy. At 95mph you are not overpowering the shaft, therefore it is not adding the extra dynamic loft necessary to create more spin, something else is going on. As Cwebb said, head design also probably plays a factor as well, but it would be worth trying out a different, lighter shaft in one of your AP2's to see what the difference is.

> > > >

> > > > I think my lack of strength now Vs when I got the shafts plays a big part with the weight. I am going to try some lighter shafts and keep hold of the x7s for when I get my strength back up

> > > > Regarding head designs I have just been reading up on the p790s (speedfoam, hollow cavity etc) and seems the was design can have a big influence on distance and spin not just the loft! > @chiva said:

> > > > > Head design IS the #1 factor.

> > > >

> > > > I think you are right! Certainly seems that way from the comments and the bit of reading if done since I posted.. I just thought in terms of blades, mbs, cavity backs but alot more goes into the designs.>

> > > > @BM5D said:

> > > > > I'd question the simulator numbers and/or the lofts. You aren't hitting a 4 iron 255 with a 95mph 7 iron swing. Secondly you should pay attention to the spin loft because you might be flipping at impact to get that much spin with a 7.

> > > > We have a trackman 4 so it's about a accurate as you can get. With the lighter shafts I was averaging 98mph, if I went flat out it was around the 101mph by I rarely ever hit a 7 iron that hard. The x7s are ABIT heavy for me now so can't generate as much speed.

> > > >

> > > > Interesting the 4 iron I hit 255 was only 101mph. But IV never and a smas factor like that with an iron!

> > > > I hit some with 103/4 speeds that didn't go any further.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for the comments, very knowledgeable group of guys here .. I will look forward to tinkering tomorrow and get a new set in play..

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Trackman produces misreads indoors all the time. Outdoors it's much more accurate. That is a misread. You aren't getting 1.49 smash with a 4 iron and the spin is artificially low.

> >

> > Those look more like driver numbers with the dynamic loft, launch angle, smash factor (I'm not even sure 1.49 is possible with an iron??)

> >

> > Anyway, 5500 is not enough spin for a 7 iron, better with irons to error a little over than under.

>

> Why is 5500 not enough spin for a 7 iron? If I can still launch it high and get a steep descent? Just curious to know.

> I have a friend who fits clubs for a living and he suggested that I should be looking for 1000rpm under the iron(6000 for a 7iron, 3000 for a 4 iron) to produce the shots im looking for and to stop the ball spinning up.

>

> Again this isn't my area of expertise, just looking to expand my knowledge

>

> Regarding the low high SF, that's just the difference in club and ball speed so surely if you have a hot faced iron( hollow,speedfoam,strong lofts) it would be able to come off the face very fast particularly with a high club head speed

Irons aren't distance clubs, they're designed for precision with hopes that you hit a certain number and the ball comes to rest quickly. You generally want your irons spin to match the number on the club as a best practice, a 5 iron should hit somewhere around 5000rpm, 7 iron should hit around 7000rpm. Spin is what helps you get the ball up in the air, control left and right movement and bring the ball to a stop.. I'd be curious to see how high you're hitting it with that low of spin, but even at that you're still dropping a knuckle ball down onto a firm surface so it's still not going to have great stopping power. In your case 7500 is closer to where it should be, a shaft change will probably hep shave off a few hundred more to get it even more ideal.

As far as the wind goes, I'd suggest learning how to control trajectory. If you're losing the ball into the wind due to spin take one more club and swing a little easier. The PGA guys are masters at that.

> @Dreamsofgolf said:

> > @chiva said:

> > Spin is your friend

>

> Maybe in a different climate, I play regularly in high winds(links courses) so IV found spin to be something to avoid. I see it all the time with great players who spin the ball too much and completely lose control once the ball reaches its max height and get blown around.

> The players that do well here all have very low penetrating flights.

> I have competed in Spain before and the opposite is true there as pretty much every day was calm or a bit breezy

Not to sound condescending, but that’s why you hit a knockdown shot. A little “3” fingered shot to take something off it and control the trajectory and spin. Almost never a full swing into the wind.