Holy Grail found. Game improvement, zero offset, great company, great feel.

So after a little research I have found something I have always been looking for. I want a very forgiving game improvement iron with basically zero offset.

Enter the mizuno hot metal pro, very forgiving, very long. But minimal offset to start with, then I bent it....

Once I added 3 degrees of loft to the club all offset is visually gone. It looks every bit as straight necked as any club I have seen KZG Zo included. There is basically zero offset on the damn things.

Due to the construction of the face and overall hotness of the face they are still very, very long and super forgiving. But now, they just don't go left period.

The below pic is of the 4 iron which has the most offset of any of the clubs and I can't see hardly any.

Congrats on finding what you want and not giving in to whats just offered

Doesn't the bounce be affected by bending the lofts by that much?

When you say you took loft off I interpret that as strengthening the club which should in theory reduce bounce as @cgasucks said and increase the offset. If anything, I would expect increasing the loft to reduce the offset.

If you added 3-degrees of loft that might've improved the offset but I'd expect you to be hitting them quite high, no? Usually GI irons have strong lofts to compensate for the low CG.

> @MelloYello said:

> When you say you took loft off I interpret that as strengthening the club which should in theory reduce bounce as @cgasucks said and increase the offset. If anything, I would expect increasing the loft to reduce the offset.

>

> If you added 3-degrees of loft that might've improved the offset but I'd expect you to be hitting them quite high, no? Usually GI irons have strong lofts to compensate for the low CG.

I think he meant to use the term "weakening". A lot of people associate weakening with removing loft when if fact you are increasing loft which potentially decreases distances.

Weakening loft typically = More spin, less offset and more bounce.

Strengthening loft typically = Less spin, more offset and less bounce.

- KC

"Added" 3 degrees of loft to get less offset???

My eye sees offset in that pic.

All irons have "some" offset.

> @JStang said:

> All irons have "some" offset.

I don't want to live in that world.

> @MelloYello said:

> When you say you took loft off I interpret that as strengthening the club which should in theory reduce bounce as @cgasucks said and increase the offset. If anything, I would expect increasing the loft to reduce the offset.

>

> If you added 3-degrees of loft that might've improved the offset but I'd expect you to be hitting them quite high, no? Usually GI irons have strong lofts to compensate for the low CG.

Typo, I added 3 degrees of loft to each club basically they are bent 3 degrees weaker.

> @drake47 said:

> "Added" 3 degrees of loft to get less offset???

Correct, added loft removed offset

Bending weak by 3 degrees will reduce offset by about 1.12mm (.045").

> @Nessism said:

> Bending weak by 3 degrees will reduce offset by about 1.12mm (.045").

So I basically knocked off almost half the offset from the 4 iron and about 70% of the offset in the wedge.

> @grantc79 said:

> > @Nessism said:

> > Bending weak by 3 degrees will reduce offset by about 1.12mm (.045").

> So I basically knocked off almost half the offset from the 4 iron and about 70% of the offset in the wedge.

And did the spin come up a fair bit? I liked them a lot but they are way too long stock for my liking. I'm after control.

> @balls_deep said:

> > @grantc79 said:

> > > @Nessism said:

> > > Bending weak by 3 degrees will reduce offset by about 1.12mm (.045").

> > So I basically knocked off almost half the offset from the 4 iron and about 70% of the offset in the wedge.

>

> And did the spin come up a fair bit? I liked them a lot but they are way too long stock for my liking. I'm after control.

Spin went up about 500 rpm

I was having serious low spin issues this helped with that as well

I put the Mizuno Hot metal pro 4 and 5 iron in my bag and the ball comes off the clubface unbelievably hot with a wonderful trajectory.

So your 7 is 33deg now? How far you hitting it at what club head speed? I may do the same thing...

Superb irons by the way!

> @Crankenstein said:

> So your 7 is 33deg now? How far you hitting it at what club head speed? I may do the same thing...

7 iron flies about 175-180 in the air today per gc quad. My spin went up from 5800 range to 6400 range.

Club speed roughly 95 mph.

> @TKS said:

> My eye sees offset in that pic.

A lot of it.

If you are hitting them high, long, and straight then you found what works for you. But that iron pictured still has plenty of offset.

Do the math on that and compare it to other irons in the market.

It has less offset than most musclebacks now

> @JStang said:

> All irons have "some" offset.

I beg to differ

> @NRJyzr said:

> > @JStang said:

> > All irons have "some" offset.

>

> I beg to differ

>

>

And thats a what iron compared to a 4 iron?

> @NRJyzr said:

> > @JStang said:

> > All irons have "some" offset.

>

> I beg to differ

>

>

I think thats the whole point, I just took a look at my 8 iron which I'd guess is what that iron is there which I'm sure I don't have to tell you is going to have less offset than a 4 iron. There is a little more offset compared to that club but how close can you get to zero offset with a modern club with all the technology? Its the law of diminishing returns how bad do you wanna get rid of that last tiny bit of offset.

All I've wanted was a gigantic sweet spot, solid feeling club, as low offset as I can get because I don't wanna play blades.

I understand the skepticism about that club, which is an 8 iron. So I snapped a couple other pics. I don't have this set assembled, outside of the 8 iron, so I threw a shaft in a couple heads for comparison.

FWIW, these are Tommy Armour 986 Tour irons.

This is a 3 iron

This is a 4 iron

> @grantc79 said:

> I think thats the whole point, I just took a look at my 8 iron which I'd guess is what that iron is there which I'm sure I don't have to tell you is going to have less offset than a 4 iron. There is a little more offset compared to that club but how close can you get to zero offset with a modern club with all the technology? Its the law of diminishing returns how bad do you wanna get rid of that last tiny bit of offset.

> All I've wanted was a gigantic sweet spot, solid feeling club, as low offset as I can get because I don't wanna play blades.

There's nothing about any tech added to an iron design that requires offset to be present. They add it, but I would argue it's not *necessary*. It's there to add a bit of trajectory, just as Karsten did with the Eye2. And, because people probably expect it now. There's even a portion of touring pros who don't like looking down at irons that don't have offset.

If you really want something with no offset and some forgiveness, Maxfli Revolution irons from 1999. If you want something newer that fits that bill, Maltby TE Forged or PTM.

My first image post got hashed up, sorry about that....

> @NRJyzr said:

> I understand the skepticism about that club, which is an 8 iron. So I snapped a couple other pics. I don't have this set assembled, outside of the 8 iron, so I threw a shaft in a couple heads for comparison.

>

> FWIW, these are Tommy Armour 986 Tour irons.

>

> This is a 3 iron

>

> This is a 4 iron

>

Holy smokes....Tommy Armours and Maxflis. I feel like I got in an internet time machine! For the record, those zero offset irons look amazing.

> @"Big A HG" said:

> > @NRJyzr said:

> > I understand the skepticism about that club, which is an 8 iron. So I snapped a couple other pics. I don't have this set assembled, outside of the 8 iron, so I threw a shaft in a couple heads for comparison.

> >

> > FWIW, these are Tommy Armour 986 Tour irons.

> >

> > This is a 3 iron

> >

> > This is a 4 iron

> >

>

> Holy smokes....Tommy Armours and Maxflis. I feel like I got in an internet time machine! For the record, those zero offset irons look amazing.

I still have a sleeve or so of those lying around. Felt I just had to use one for these pics. LOL