Bunkers

If I were designing a course for the pros, there would be almost no bunkers. I get it, they frame the green, they frame the fairway. But the pros would much rather play out of a sand bunker than the rough.

I would use mostly grass bunkers around greens, and to have penal areas off tee shots. Pros hate high grass. Mounds and uneven lies with high grass - now that's a hazard for a good golfer.

Discuss.

one course we play has bunkers with the edges framed with long hairy edges. we call them the eyebrows.

another is a fescue lined place with traplike deep swales near some greens that are all grass .

variety is good.

Remove the rakes, enjoy the meltdown.

Golf maintenance would be a lot cheaper without sand traps

I like this, I hate bunkers.

I did get stuck on a downhill lie on the slope of a mound off to one side of a green last week, a lot tougher shot than a bunker shot.

I would much rather hit out of a bunker than thick Bermuda rough around me. Bunkers are quite easy to get out of with a little practice. The issue is most people never work on their sand bunker game.

Why would anyone design a golf course in order to thwart good players? Why not design a golf course which can be enjoyed by a wide variety of skill levels. Sand-filled bunkers, like tees, greens, fairways, rough and penalty areas are all a part of the deal.

Yeah, leave the bunkers. If they weren't meticulously maintained they would be different animals, but that's not really practical.

I think every tour course should double the amount of sand traps, get rid of the rakes, and breed cats. That'll teach em to respect bunkers.

All you have to do is make the sand fluffy. Tour style bunkers are a joy to play out of while fluffy sand filled ones are not quite as joyous.

I can guarantee you the pros wouldn't like the bunkers I play out of. Footprints, sometimes little to no sand, rock hard underneath. I would disagree that pros hate rough the most. I think they find extremely tight lies going up a steep slope to a fast green more troublesome than rough.

This.

Give them soft sand where they get a fried egg every time and they would avoid them like the plague. Modern tour bunkers are almost as easy as the fairway.

> @buckeyefl said:

> All you have to do is make the sand fluffy. Tour style bunkers are a joy to play out of while fluffy sand filled ones are not quite as joyous.

I think those giant sprawling bunkers are too much. They take so long to rake (and many people don't anyway), cost a fortune to maintain, and are major cause of slow play. Small pot bunkers and creative use of grass bunkers would make the game still challenging, but cheaper and quicker.

They need to have 10 foot deep bunkers like they have in the British open

You can look at the European Tour now for the next three weeks, to see what bunkers are supposed to look like! :-)

They were initially created that way, because they were wind shelter for the sheep. I kind of like that there is a story behind them.

But I agree that non-links style bunkers are too easy for pro’s. Hate hearing them say “get in the bunker” after a wayward approach shot.

I think some are missing the point. Hitting out of a bunker is very different from hitting out of the rough. So two different skills are required. If you eliminate bunkers, you reduce the number of skills the pros need to learn.

Fill the traps with those desiccant beads that are shipped with new shoes.

Remember - "do not eat."

> @Roadking2003 said:

> I think some are missing the point. Hitting out of a bunker is very different from hitting out of the rough. So two different skills are required. If you eliminate bunkers, you reduce the number of skills the pros need to learn.

There's also the fact that many are missing the fact that the guys you are watching on TV aren't playing out of the same bunkers many of us to. They have better sand, better crews to maintain that sand depth, and better drainage than what many are going to play out of. When you are playing out of bunkers that are perfect, you still need to have the skill to know how to hit the various shots necessary from them.

For example, there were a ton of guys at my club who complained about our new bunkers, which had different sand and drained better than the ones that were there prior. They were vastly different to hit out of because the sand was less firm, and you had to hit a more traditional bunker shot. Now that people have gotten used to them, going back to what we had would be insane. I can say the guys I hear complain the most are the ones who I see on the practice area actively avoiding anything to do with bunker practice.

I would like to see more pot bunkers in the US.

1. more of a challange

2. more traditional

3. less maintenance I would think, less sand to maintain, and the sand doesn't blow away as it's trapped in the bunker. Just need proper drainage, which I understand is easier on a true links that has sandy soil.

4. Bunkering in the US is more visual, where in the UK it's more strategic. Something to avoid.

5. Small bunkers surrounded by collection areas, similar to the Road Hole bunker, are better, they create more drama, and pain.

I would love to see Strokes Gained for bunkers vs rough. I don't see anything on the pga tour site to give me any kind of objective measure.

sand saves vs scrambling?

East Texas red clay used to be used almost everywhere in my region...

It was/is wildly sticky and unpredictable....which is a problem for regular golfers but would be an easy “swap” for most courses...

The cowboys course in grapevine uses it still because they have deep bunkers, all sand, and the clay sand sticks and will stay in a nearly vertical condition...

Plus it’s burnt orange so hook ‘em...pun intended

This is not the cowboys course but u get the idea

> @Roadking2003 said:

> I think some are missing the point. Hitting out of a bunker is very different from hitting out of the rough. So two different skills are required. If you eliminate bunkers, you reduce the number of skills the pros need to learn.

I like your thought process. What about the skills needed to hit long irons(1-3) into greens on long par 4’s? They took that out of the game too.

Fill the bunkers with water and alligators...then watch the pros play out of them.

> @Lagavulin62 said:

> I think every tour course should double the amount of sand traps, get rid of the rakes, and breed cats. That'll teach em to respect bunkers.

All I could picture was this boss Tom cat and his lady friends doing the deed beside the green while the eventual winner putts out. That will distract them. Cats in heat !!

> @Lagavulin62 said:

> > @Roadking2003 said:

> > I think some are missing the point. Hitting out of a bunker is very different from hitting out of the rough. So two different skills are required. If you eliminate bunkers, you reduce the number of skills the pros need to learn.

>

> I like your thought process. What about the skills needed to hit long irons(1-3) into greens on long par 4’s? They took that out of the game too.

Not quite. Now they hit long irons into long par threes and fives.

> @dlygrisse said:

> I would like to see more pot bunkers in the US.

> 1. more of a challange

> 2. more traditional

> 3. less maintenance I would think, less sand to maintain, and the sand doesn't blow away as it's trapped in the bunker. Just need proper drainage, which I understand is easier on a true links that has sandy soil.

> 4. Bunkering in the US is more visual, where in the UK it's more strategic. Something to avoid.

> 5. Small bunkers surrounded by collection areas, similar to the Road Hole bunker, are better, they create more drama, and pain.

There is no "better". I think you have to decide, from a design view, how penal you want bunkers to be for amateurs. Pot bunkers are usually a one-stroke penalty. Other bunkers are more like a half stroke penalty. For amateurs, bunkers are never just "visual".

> @gvogel said:

> If I were designing a course for the pros, there would be almost no bunkers. I get it, they frame the green, they frame the fairway. But the pros would much rather play out of a sand bunker than the rough.

>

> I would use mostly grass bunkers around greens, and to have penal areas off tee shots. Pros hate high grass. Mounds and uneven lies with high grass - now that's a hazard for a good golfer.

>

> Discuss.

Penal design is only one trick to make it hard for the pros. Give them decisions to make that they are not expecting and they mess up. Give them just enough rope and they tie their own noose.

Furyk at Olympic Club in 2012 as an example.

I think green contours are the way to go. Make those guys not only hit in the correct section of the green but ask them to control their spin to keep it there. It is easy for them to hit it 118 on the number. Another ask is to hit it 118 and let it release another 12 feet or keep from backing it up more than 4 foot to keep it in that spot. I'd also slow the greens down to around 9.5 or 10.5. Make them make a stroke to get the ball moving. Not just touch the back of it on the right line, but actually hit the ball. Would expose any faulty putting mechanics.

Those skinned down slopes around a green mixed with your mounds and hollows would be good to see too. Give them options, putt, 8 iron chip or wedge.

I would love to see a par five where the best place to lay up or the safe play is well past the green on the opposite side from the tee. Maybe the whole green complex slopes away and if you stay short of the green you can't see the whole putting surface or even a wedge won't hold it. Could be that going long and chipping back into that slope is the way to go.

> @buckeyefl said:

> All you have to do is make the sand fluffy. Tour style bunkers are a joy to play out of while fluffy sand filled ones are not quite as joyous.

This. Pros have very step descent angle on their shots. They'll learn not to hit into the bunkers as much if they keep getting fried eggs.