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Do tournament scores mean anything for your handicap?


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I've been getting messages on TheGrint regarding events that qualify as a "tournament score" for my club. The posts make it seem like these are big opportunities to get a tournament score on your card.

 

Im not sure what that means. Is it just the novelty of "look i played in a tournament event", or does it have some mathematical impact towards your handicap (weighted heavier or something)? I tried Google but the search terms bring up a whole slew of stuff. Thanks in advance.

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T scores last 12 months, where ordinary scores drop off after 20 rounds. A T score with a differential lower than your current index may temporarily, mathematically, without human intervention, cause a downward revision to your handicap until either your index goes down or 12 months passes. There’s nothing inherently “good” about posting a T other than the more you post Ts the less likely you will be hit with a downward revision to your handicap based on a single low T score.

 

I recognize all that sounds peculiarly complicated, but checking out the USGA handicap manual math will make things a little less incomprehensible.

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So assuming you're playing more than 20 rounds per year, it sounds like a good T score is something you want to have in the bank. Makes sense. I doubt I play enough for it to make much difference personally (20 rounds vs 12 months will probably always be pretty close, card currently goes back to Sept 2018 atm) but it's good to know. Thanks!

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Oh wow, I also found this in the manual that you mentioned:

 

_The following procedure must be used as an alternate calculation of a Handicap Index for players with two or more eligible tournament scores. A player's Handicap Index may be reduced under this procedure when a player has a minimum of two eligible tournament score differentials that are at least 3.0 better than the player's Handicap Index_

 

Seems like that is the big selling point for me even if I can't take advantage of the 12 month thing. Bonus reductions for good tournament scores? Sweet. Thanks again since your info led me to the manual

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> @Celeras said:

> Oh wow, I also found this in the manual that you mentioned:

>

> _The following procedure must be used as an alternate calculation of a Handicap Index for players with two or more eligible tournament scores. A player's Handicap Index may be reduced under this procedure when a player has a minimum of two eligible tournament score differentials that are at least 3.0 better than the player's Handicap Index_

>

> Seems like that is the big selling point for me even if I can't take advantage of the 12 month thing. Bonus reductions for good tournament scores? Sweet. Thanks again since your info led me to the manual

 

Thats one way of looking at it. The thing is, if you get that revised handicap reduction, youll get the dreaded 'R' beside your cap. To many that would scream "sandbagger".

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The T-scores you post put an upper limit on how high your cap can go. The formula is in the handicap manual. Basically...

 

If you post 2 T-scores, or more, in a 12 month period your cap may be reduced. The formula looks at your current index and compares that to your SECOND lowest T-score differential. If those two numbers are more than 3.0 apart, the reduction kicks in and you get an R after your cap.

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> @Augster said:

> The T-scores you post put an upper limit on how high your cap can go. The formula is in the handicap manual. Basically...

>

> If you post 2 T-scores, or more, in a 12 month period your cap may be reduced. The formula looks at your current index and compares that to your SECOND lowest T-score differential. If those two numbers are more than 3.0 apart, the reduction kicks in and you get an R after your cap.

 

At last year's club championship, it was my turn to be "that guy" in the hacker flight. First day I posted a good round (in the past I'm usually miles worse than my 'cap in tournaments) and the second day backed it up with a really great round. I had heard of people getting their handicaps reduced severely by some kind of "T score rule" but never bothered to check out the details. I kind of figured I'd be playing off some super-low index for the next few months.

 

What I found was exactly as friend Augster describes it. What mattered wasn't my really great round (its differential was 4.5 strokes better than my index) but the merely good round, which was my "SECOND lowest T-score differential". It was about one stroke better than my index. Not even close to tripping the T-score reduction.

 

That rule seems to only come into play when at least two scores are seriously hard to believe.

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I understand the sentiment however that is not a concern for me. My personal goal is to get as low as possible, and if I can do that by having a good round at the right time I will do my best to fully take advantage.. regardless of whatever labels might come with it. If I can actually pull it off (and who says I even can, bad round seems more likely!), I will wear that 'R' with pride haha.

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I get an R nearly every spring. And my handicap is as honest a cap as one can have. I usually fluctuate between 5-7 depending on how I’m playing. Every so often, I’ll shoot a keeper for a T score. Last year these A-hats were playing LCP through the green and had the audacity to still post it as a T-score. I shot 72.

 

Anyway, every February I go down to Florida to see my dad and a couple friends come with. We play 36 holes most every day. In 5 days I usually post 8 or 9 rounds. This is nearly 1/2 of my 10/20. Also, I rarely break 90 in those rounds. So none of them are keepers and we’ll over my normal differentials.

 

As I start playing in the spring, the fall rounds start falling off and my 10/20 starts including a few of those horrible rounds in Florida. Thus raising my index 4-5 points higher than my 2nd best T-score. And then the R kicks in and limits me.

 

For example, on 4/1/19, the start of our season, I was a 7.3R. Even though my actual 10/20 was 8.3. (I really love the GHIN app). The chart cut me a full shot. On 4/15/19 I was a 7.0R. By 5/1/19 I had played enough golf at my home course that my index dropped to 6.4 and I no longer had the R after my index.

 

We joke that the R is for sandbagger, but it’ll do little to actually limit sandbaggers. The R puts a limit on a player’s index when they start to play horrible golf. It limits how high the index can go. If you never have a two T-scores posted in a year, you’ll never see an R.

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> @Augster said:

> I get an R nearly every spring. And my handicap is as honest a cap as one can have. I usually fluctuate between 5-7 depending on how I’m playing. Every so often, I’ll shoot a keeper for a T score. Last year these A-hats were playing LCP through the green and had the audacity to still post it as a T-score. I shot 72.

>

> Anyway, every February I go down to Florida to see my dad and a couple friends come with. We play 36 holes most every day. In 5 days I usually post 8 or 9 rounds. This is nearly 1/2 of my 10/20. Also, I rarely break 90 in those rounds. So none of them are keepers and we’ll over my normal differentials.

>

> As I start playing in the spring, the fall rounds start falling off and my 10/20 starts including a few of those horrible rounds in Florida. Thus raising my index 4-5 points higher than my 2nd best T-score. And then the R kicks in and limits me.

>

> For example, on 4/1/19, the start of our season, I was a 7.3R. Even though my actual 10/20 was 8.3. (I really love the GHIN app). The chart cut me a full shot. On 4/15/19 I was a 7.0R. By 5/1/19 I had played enough golf at my home course that my index dropped to 6.4 and I no longer had the R after my index.

>

> We joke that the R is for sandbagger, but it’ll do little to actually limit sandbaggers. The R puts a limit on a player’s index when they start to play horrible golf. It limits how high the index can go. If you never have a two T-scores posted in a year, you’ll never see an R.

 

Yeah, I've seen guys get the "R" after a couple great T-scores, but I've also seen guys get an "R" after playing in Florida over the winter and just going up some and T-scores from 6 months ago all of a sudden get the guy the R. Totally different scenario.

 

ANYWAY. . .I checked back in on this thread because I just heard the craziest "R" story I've ever heard.

 

Calcutta at my Dad's FORMER club last weekend. Keep in mind, this story is now from a guy at the club --> my dad --> me --> you, but as he told it. . .some guy shows up for the calcutta who USED to be a 5 and got up to a 18 (CH) because of his winter play in Florida. The calcutta used 1 low gross and 1 low net from each threesome. The guy. . .getting 18 strokes (might have been played at 80% of 18. I'm not sure) shot 81 and followed it up with a 73 (net 55).

 

My dad told me he got "R'ed" down 9 strokes.

 

The best legit round I've ever seen was a 13 who shot a 73 in a tournament and he was a member of the club who had been around forever, never been a problem as a sandbagger. Everyone accepted it as just "one of those days" and history bore that out. When I was a kid, I put up some net rounds in the 50's the summer I dropped from like a 30 to a 15 (the year when I really started playing and practicing), but you only get one summer like that in your life.

 

 

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> @Celeras said:

> I've been getting messages on TheGrint regarding events that qualify as a "tournament score" for my club. The posts make it seem like these are big opportunities to get a tournament score on your card.

>

> Im not sure what that means. Is it just the novelty of "look i played in a tournament event", or does it have some mathematical impact towards your handicap (weighted heavier or something)? I tried Google but the search terms bring up a whole slew of stuff. Thanks in advance.

 

Don't worry about it. Ts and Rs won't be around much longer

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> @Newby said:

> > @Celeras said:

> > I've been getting messages on TheGrint regarding events that qualify as a "tournament score" for my club. The posts make it seem like these are big opportunities to get a tournament score on your card.

> >

> > Im not sure what that means. Is it just the novelty of "look i played in a tournament event", or does it have some mathematical impact towards your handicap (weighted heavier or something)? I tried Google but the search terms bring up a whole slew of stuff. Thanks in advance.

>

> Don't worry about it. Ts and Rs won't be around much longer

 

But I just learned how it worked!! Drats haha

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Another reason you might want T scores in your handicap is that some tournaments that use handicaps require a certain number of T scores to enter with your full handicap. Otherwise you get reduced. They will also reduce you if you don't have enough regular posted rounds. These are tournament specific requirements, not USGA.

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By way, just to add one more tirade while I'm on my soapbox...

 

There is nothing to prevent a golfer from putting "T" next to any score he likes when posting to GHIN. Or not putting the "T" next to scores that should have.

 

Not a problem at clubs with functioning peer review but then again 'most any system will work fine for clubs with functioning peer review. Those clubs are not the problem.

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I wouldn't take any handicap seriously unless it's got 3 or 4 Ts in it

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My HC went from 3.7 down to it's current 2.4 in about 3 weeks with 4 or 5 decent tournament rounds. Those tournament rounds are about 40% of my annual play. I wasn't aware of the 2nd T score limiting factor, so it's no wonder my HC does nothing but go down (not a humblebrag - I genuinely do not enjoy giving strokes).

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> @D0ch0l1d4y said:

> My HC went from 3.7 down to it's current 2.4 in about 3 weeks with 4 or 5 decent tournament rounds. Those tournament rounds are about 40% of my annual play. I wasn't aware of the 2nd T score limiting factor, so it's no wonder my HC does nothing but go down (not a humblebrag - I genuinely do not enjoy giving strokes).

 

Its appropriate that your handicap goes down as a result of good play, the system is working properly. The thing that's difficult to accept, for a player whose Handicap Index has been Reduced for Exceptional Tournament scores, is that the worse he plays, the lower his handicap goes. In my area, northern Virginia with year round posting, handicaps commonly rise for whose who continue to play through difficult winter conditions. Expected and appropriate, in my mind. But if the handicap rises high enough, the "R" kicks in automatically, based on T scores from the previous summer, and the handicap starts dropping.

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