Open Championship: Did Rules Officials blow a call on Ricky Fowler's opening shot, forth round?

 markatthelake ·  
markatthelakemarkatthelake Members  1WRX Points: 40Posts: 1 Starters
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I believe they made a mistake. He hit a worker who was in bounds deflecting the ball out of bounds. He was assessed the OB penalty and hit again. We watched it several times. Double bogey on the first hole.
Here is the rule: 19-1

The first thing to note is that in the Rules of Golf a spectator is an outside agency. In fact, in stroke play, any person other than a playing partner (i.e. someone on the player’s own side) and any caddie of the side is an outside agency, including fellow competitors. Knowing this helps in arriving at the correct ruling where a spectator is involved. The most common occurrence is when a ball is accidentally deflected or stopped by a spectator, a true example of a ‘rub of the green’.
A "rub of the green" occurs when a ball in motion is accidentally deflected or stopped by any outside agency (see Rule 19-1).
If this happens following a stroke from anywhere other than the putting green, under Rule 19-1 there is no penalty and in most cases the ball must be played as it lies.

Did anyone else see that???

Posted:
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  • tideridertiderider Members  2997WRX Points: 2,029Handicap: 5ishPosts: 2,997 Titanium Tees
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    don't know the rule or how to interpret it, but the ball "as it lies" was ob, was it not? ...

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  • SocratesSocrates Warning Points 1+ WinnipegClubWRX  10201WRX Points: 1,107Handicap: 4ishPosts: 10,201 ClubWRX
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    That’s a lot of typing for a first post. But, OB is OB.

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  • bladehunterbladehunter south carolinaMembers  30917WRX Points: 7,191Handicap: NONEPosts: 30,917 Titanium Tees
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    Op. Cut and paste this in the rules section. Somebody there will answer it.

    Posted:
  • TerpFangolferTerpFangolfer Members  704WRX Points: 150Handicap: 6.2Posts: 704 Golden Tee
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    On -, @markatthelake said:

    I believe they made a mistake. He hit a worker who was in bounds deflecting the ball out of bounds. He was assessed the OB penalty and hit again. We watched it several times. Double bogey on the first hole.
    Here is the rule: 19-1

    The first thing to note is that in the Rules of Golf a spectator is an outside agency. In fact, in stroke play, any person other than a playing partner (i.e. someone on the player’s own side) and any caddie of the side is an outside agency, including fellow competitors. Knowing this helps in arriving at the correct ruling where a spectator is involved. The most common occurrence is when a ball is accidentally deflected or stopped by a spectator, a true example of a ‘rub of the green’.
    A "rub of the green" occurs when a ball in motion is accidentally deflected or stopped by any outside agency (see Rule 19-1).
    If this happens following a stroke from anywhere other than the putting green, under Rule 19-1 there is no penalty and in most cases the ball must be played as it lies.

    Did anyone else see that???

    A bit confused by what you are saying? First of all, I believe you meant Rule 11-1 (not 19-1) - do you not think Fowler should have been ruled OB? The only way he wouldn't was if the ball was "deliberately" knocked OB by someone.

    Rule 11 from USGA website:
    "Purpose of Rule: Rule 11 covers what to do if the player’s ball in motion hits a person, animal, equipment or anything else on the course. When this happens accidentally, there is no penalty and the player normally must accept the result, whether favourable or not, and play the ball from where it comes to rest. Rule 11 also restricts a player from deliberately taking actions to affect where any ball in motion might come to rest."

    The key point being - "the player must accept the result, whether favorable or not..."
    The only exception would be for "deliberate" interference...for example if the person had thrown, kicked, batted the ball OB (must have KVC!) - then he would get to drop where it was determine that the ball most likely would have ended up ( from 11.2.c)

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  • Route 66Route 66 Members  42WRX Points: 82Posts: 42 Bunkers
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    By this logic, if it hit someone who was out of bounds and bounced back in bounds he would then have to re-tee as if it went out of bounds? The bounces work both ways.

    Posted:
  • GolfjackGolfjack All about the rotation Members  1564WRX Points: 469Posts: 1,564 Platinum Tees
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    What's there to talk about? OP answered his own question quite eloquently with the cut and paste. Sure sucks for Rickie. Often spectators are a benefit for pro's though. Just the way the ball bounces.

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  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 IowaClubWRX  21461WRX Points: 5,424Posts: 21,461 ClubWRX
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    Claims they made a mistake but posting the rule that proves they didn’t. Seems like normal rules accusation on here.

    Posted:
  • straightshot7straightshot7 Members  3581WRX Points: 1,119Posts: 3,581 Titanium Tees
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    No penalty, play it as it lies: ball is out of bounds.

    Posted:
  • sui generissui generis Members  4454WRX Points: 783Posts: 4,454 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @markatthelake said:

    I believe they made a mistake. He hit a worker who was in bounds deflecting the ball out of bounds. He was assessed the OB penalty and hit again. We watched it several times. Double bogey on the first hole.
    Here is the rule: 19-1

    The first thing to note is that in the Rules of Golf a spectator is an outside agency. In fact, in stroke play, any person other than a playing partner (i.e. someone on the player’s own side) and any caddie of the side is an outside agency, including fellow competitors. Knowing this helps in arriving at the correct ruling where a spectator is involved. The most common occurrence is when a ball is accidentally deflected or stopped by a spectator, a true example of a ‘rub of the green’.
    A "rub of the green" occurs when a ball in motion is accidentally deflected or stopped by any outside agency (see Rule 19-1).
    If this happens following a stroke from anywhere other than the putting green, under Rule 19-1 there is no penalty and in most cases the ball must be played as it lies.

    Did anyone else see that???

    Try the 2019 Rules of Golf:
    https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/rules-of-golf/rules-and-interpretations.html#!ruletype=fr&section=rule&rulenum=1
    Now again, what's your beef?

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  • TServosTServos Members  503WRX Points: 180Posts: 503 Golden Tee
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    I would have been mortified if I was that person who deflected his ball OB. I counted 4 people standing inside the ropes right where his ball landed.

    Posted:
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  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Members  6070WRX Points: 1,526Handicap: 3Posts: 6,070 Titanium Tees
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    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

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  • imakaveliimakaveli Moli Moli Moli Moli Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy... Members  13160WRX Points: 1,020Handicap: 3.8Posts: 13,160 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

    Made a mistake in 2017 ;)

    Posted:
  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Members  6070WRX Points: 1,526Handicap: 3Posts: 6,070 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

    Made a mistake in 2017 ;)

    Spieth on 13?

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  • imakaveliimakaveli Moli Moli Moli Moli Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy... Members  13160WRX Points: 1,020Handicap: 3.8Posts: 13,160 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

    Made a mistake in 2017 ;)

    Spieth on 13?

    yup

    Posted:
  • NewbyNewby Members  7762WRX Points: 627Posts: 7,762 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @markatthelake said:

    Here is the rule: 19-1
    That was last year

    The first thing to note is that in the Rules of Golf a spectator is an outside agency.
    No he is an Outside Influence
    In fact, in stroke play, any person other than a playing partner (i.e. someone on the player’s own side)
    That person is a Partner
    A Fellow Competitor was often referred to as a playing partner by TV commentators in particular.
    Playing Partner does not and has never existed in the Rules

    Posted:
  • SawgrassSawgrass Members  15874WRX Points: 1,156Posts: 15,874 Titanium Tees
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    Worst R&A conspiracy theory ever.

    Posted:
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  • sui generissui generis Members  4454WRX Points: 783Posts: 4,454 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @Sawgrass said:

    Worst R&A conspiracy theory ever.

    Especially since we know Ricky was aiming for that person and intended for the ricochet to put his ball into the ideal spot for his next shot.

    Posted:
    Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.
  • MattyO1984MattyO1984 Members  6070WRX Points: 1,526Handicap: 3Posts: 6,070 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @Roadking2003 said:

    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

    Made a mistake in 2017 ;)

    Spieth on 13?

    yup

    Nope.

    The driving range was in bounds it may have been a complicated ruling and I could understand people making an argument that the driving range should have been out of bounds but it wasn't and as such the ruling was completely correct.

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  • imakaveliimakaveli Moli Moli Moli Moli Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy... Members  13160WRX Points: 1,020Handicap: 3.8Posts: 13,160 Titanium Tees
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    On -, @Roadking2003 said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    On -, @Roadking2003 said:

    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    On -, @imakaveli said:

    On -, @MattyO1984 said:

    It was OB, no question about it.

    The prospect of the R&A making a mistake on that at their biggest tournament is non-existent. Of course if it had been the USGA...

    Made a mistake in 2017 ;)

    Spieth on 13?

    yup

    Nope.

    The driving range was in bounds it may have been a complicated ruling and I could understand people making an argument that the driving range should have been out of bounds but it wasn't and as such the ruling was completely correct.

    Exactly! "Should have been OB..." has no meaning.

    This event has been reviewed ad nauseam and the bottom line is the rulings were correct.

    Says the guy from Texas :D

    Posted:
  • bladehunterbladehunter south carolinaMembers  30917WRX Points: 7,191Handicap: NONEPosts: 30,917 Titanium Tees
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    I’ve played many courses where the range or part of the range is in play. Not rare at all. Also know of a Donald Ross where the range has a net on 3 sides. Range is OB but the net will save it from going OB.

    Posted:

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