Tom Watson to join Jack and Gary on Masters 1st tee ?

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Comments

  • redfirebird08redfirebird08 Members Posts: 7,956 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @dalehead said:

    @agolf1 said:
    Based on overall record, I think Watson and Faldo are just as deserving as Phil (eventually). Phil is the obvious other choice in the Tiger era. But all three (Watson, Faldo, Phil) are all in the next tier behind the current guys and Tiger.

    I'd say "no" to the two-time Masters only guys like Crenshaw, Olazabal, Langer, etc.

    Why not two-time winners? The original honorary starters, Jock Hutchinson and Freddy McLeod won zero Masters between them.

    That was 60 years ago. Since 1980 it’s only been the legends of the game. This isn’t a next in line honorific. I’m fine with Watson but the others mentioned just aren’t there. Won’t happen.

    Faldo definitely belongs. I think we might get to a point when Tiger & Phil are done that this honorary starter thing needs to go into the dustbin of history. Who knows, maybe the next 40 years will surprise us and we'll end up with some younger guys worthy of that type of honor at some point.

  • LICCLICC Members Posts: 893 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @redfirebird08 said:

    @LICC said:

    @dalehead said:

    @agolf1 said:
    Based on overall record, I think Watson and Faldo are just as deserving as Phil (eventually). Phil is the obvious other choice in the Tiger era. But all three (Watson, Faldo, Phil) are all in the next tier behind the current guys and Tiger.

    I'd say "no" to the two-time Masters only guys like Crenshaw, Olazabal, Langer, etc.

    Why not two-time winners? The original honorary starters, Jock Hutchinson and Freddy McLeod won zero Masters between them.

    That was 60 years ago. Since 1980 it’s only been the legends of the game. This isn’t a next in line honorific. I’m fine with Watson but the others mentioned just aren’t there. Won’t happen.

    Faldo definitely belongs. I think we might get to a point when Tiger & Phil are done that this honorary starter thing needs to go into the dustbin of history. Who knows, maybe the next 40 years will surprise us and we'll end up with some younger guys worthy of that type of honor at some point.

    Faldo is not at the level of the people who have been the honorary starters for the last 40 years. Some of you seem to think the level should be less than it has been because Faldo won three Masters, and I can accept that as a valid point of view, but as someone said earlier, Faldo just has not had the combined level of success and impact on the game that the legends have.

  • redfirebird08redfirebird08 Members Posts: 7,956 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @redfirebird08 said:

    @LICC said:

    @dalehead said:

    @agolf1 said:
    Based on overall record, I think Watson and Faldo are just as deserving as Phil (eventually). Phil is the obvious other choice in the Tiger era. But all three (Watson, Faldo, Phil) are all in the next tier behind the current guys and Tiger.

    I'd say "no" to the two-time Masters only guys like Crenshaw, Olazabal, Langer, etc.

    Why not two-time winners? The original honorary starters, Jock Hutchinson and Freddy McLeod won zero Masters between them.

    That was 60 years ago. Since 1980 it’s only been the legends of the game. This isn’t a next in line honorific. I’m fine with Watson but the others mentioned just aren’t there. Won’t happen.

    Faldo definitely belongs. I think we might get to a point when Tiger & Phil are done that this honorary starter thing needs to go into the dustbin of history. Who knows, maybe the next 40 years will surprise us and we'll end up with some younger guys worthy of that type of honor at some point.

    Faldo is not at the level of the people who have been the honorary starters for the last 40 years. Some of you seem to think the level should be less than it has been because Faldo won three Masters, and I can accept that as a valid point of view, but as someone said earlier, Faldo just has not had the combined level of success and impact on the game that the legends have.

    Well, Faldo is the only one alive that can fill the chronological gap between Tom Watson and Tiger/Phil. The bigger question to me is what happens when Tiger and Phil are done. We'll see if any of the younger kids can make enough impact to justify this type of honor.

  • scruffynickscruffynick manchester, UKMembers Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

  • LICCLICC Members Posts: 893 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

  • Soloman1Soloman1 Members Posts: 2,552 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    And you are underrating Faldo because you’re what, 12 years old?

    Lol

    I'm quitting at 6.022 x 10^23 posts.
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  • daleheaddalehead Members Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I believe Phil thinks he can play the regular tour well into his 50’s. His play the last half of this season doesn’t support that idea. And we don’t know how many more years and swings are left in Tiger’s back. They might be ready for the honorary starter position sooner than we think. Add Tom Watson to Jack and Arnie and let that combination get us through the next 5 or 6 Masters and it may be Tiger and Phil time.

  • agolf1agolf1 Members Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Aug 6, 2019 6:14am #129

    @dalehead said:
    I believe Phil thinks he can play the regular tour well into his 50’s. His play the last half of this season doesn’t support that idea. And we don’t know how many more years and swings are left in Tiger’s back. They might be ready for the honorary starter position sooner than we think. Add Tom Watson to Jack and Arnie and let that combination get us through the next 5 or 6 Masters and it may be Tiger and Phil time.

    Who knows when Phil's time on the regular tour will end. Regardless of whether it's next year or 5+ years, don't you think he'll play the Masters (as a past champion) for the next 10 years (or so)? Gonna be kind of strange if he's hitting two balls off #1 on Thursday.

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  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,283 ClubWRX

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

  • LICCLICC Members Posts: 893 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @agolf1 said:

    @dalehead said:
    I believe Phil thinks he can play the regular tour well into his 50’s. His play the last half of this season doesn’t support that idea. And we don’t know how many more years and swings are left in Tiger’s back. They might be ready for the honorary starter position sooner than we think. Add Tom Watson to Jack and Arnie and let that combination get us through the next 5 or 6 Masters and it may be Tiger and Phil time.

    Who knows when Phil's time on the regular tour will end. Regardless of whether it's next year or 5+ years, don't you think he'll play the Masters (as a past champion) for the next 10 years (or so)? Gonna be kind of strange if he's hitting two balls off #1 on Thursday.

    And I doubt Tiger would be an honorary starter while he is still in his 40s.

  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,730 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    They both won the PGA Seniors Championship at ANGC.

    Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing-glove.  P.G. Wodehouse
  • scruffynickscruffynick manchester, UKMembers Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    Wtf are you blabbing on about?? Accurate?? What? Next you'll be saying Paul scholes ain't a Manchester legend!

  • BobMorrisBobMorris Farmingdale, NY.....Brentwood, CAMembers Posts: 216 ✭✭✭

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

  • tideridertiderider Members Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    he's never claimed they won the masters ... they won 'at augusta', and for THAT, they were made honorary starters for 15 years ... that difficult to understand?

  • PowderedToastManPowderedToastMan Members Posts: 4,007 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    Augusta National is the host venue of the Masters. Augusta National, the course, is not called the Masters. The annual major tournament is called the Masters. The course, Augusta National, is a private, members only club in Augusta Georgia, which currently and in the past, has held other tournaments besides the Masters Tournament, which is held at Augusta National Golf Club, a golf course in Augusta, Georgia.

    How many times do you think I need to keep repeating those facts to make sure Bob reads this? I feel like a CBS commentator (CBS being the television network which broadcasts the Masters tournament every April from Augusta National Golf Club) constantly repeating facts over a 5-hour broadcast live from the Masters Tournament at Augusta National Golf Club.

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  • ray9898ray9898 Members Posts: 829 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited Aug 7, 2019 1:11am #137

    Why do you guys keep feeding these two????? This is trolling 101.

  • BobMorrisBobMorris Farmingdale, NY.....Brentwood, CAMembers Posts: 216 ✭✭✭

    @tiderider said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    he's never claimed they won the masters ... they won 'at augusta', and for THAT, they were made honorary starters for 15 years ... that difficult to understand?

    For crissakes....my contention was that one poster found it absurd that Ben Crenshaw's record was good enough for him to be considered an honorary starter in the future. I mentioned that the original starters were never even Masters champions, so it stands to reason that Ben, with his 2 Masters victories, would merit some consideration, especially with his very popular victory in '95. Kindergarten.

  • BobMorrisBobMorris Farmingdale, NY.....Brentwood, CAMembers Posts: 216 ✭✭✭

    @PowderedToastMan said:

    Augusta National is the host venue of the Masters. Augusta National, the course, is not called the Masters. The annual major tournament is called the Masters. The course, Augusta National, is a private, members only club in Augusta Georgia, which currently and in the past, has held other tournaments besides the Masters Tournament, which is held at Augusta National Golf Club, a golf course in Augusta, Georgia.

    How many times do you think I need to keep repeating those facts to make sure Bob reads this? I feel like a CBS commentator (CBS being the television network which broadcasts the Masters tournament every April from Augusta National Golf Club) constantly repeating facts over a 5-hour broadcast live from the Masters Tournament at Augusta National Golf Club.

    You don't say. Thanks for the tutorial Mr. Science.

  • tideridertiderider Members Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @BobMorris said:

    @tiderider said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    he's never claimed they won the masters ... they won 'at augusta', and for THAT, they were made honorary starters for 15 years ... that difficult to understand?

    For crissakes....my contention was that one poster found it absurd that Ben Crenshaw's record was good enough for him to be considered an honorary starter in the future. I mentioned that the original starters were never even Masters champions, so it stands to reason that Ben, with his 2 Masters victories, would merit some consideration, especially with his very popular victory in '95. Kindergarten.

    crenshaw would obviously merit consideration, as faldo would ... hawkeye simply responded to an absurd claim that trevino's stature in the game, being equal to faldo's, warrants consideration as a starter ... hawkeye responded to that absurdity by stating every honorary starter has won at augusta national, with the exception of venturi ... no one has responded to your claim that crenshaw is deserving ... no one has denied that ... you attempted to call out hawkeye for being wrong by refuting his claim that every starter, with the exception of venturi, has won at augusta ... his claim is correct ... kindergarten, indeed ...

  • deadsolid...shankdeadsolid...shank ClubWRX Posts: 14,771 ClubWRX

    W> @BobMorris said:

    @tiderider said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    he's never claimed they won the masters ... they won 'at augusta', and for THAT, they were made honorary starters for 15 years ... that difficult to understand?

    For crissakes....my contention was that one poster found it absurd that Ben Crenshaw's record was good enough for him to be considered an honorary starter in the future. I mentioned that the original starters were never even Masters champions, so it stands to reason that Ben, with his 2 Masters victories, would merit some consideration, especially with his very popular victory in '95. Kindergarten.

    If the poster you’re referencing is me, I never said I found it absurd. I said, in my opinion, he just doesn’t seem to fit the mold of what the position has evolved into.

    I think that’s a long way from saying the idea is absurd.

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  • daleheaddalehead Members Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    In the years from 1977-1980 and 2003-2006 there was no honorary starter at the Masters. So maybe the answer to the question of who will replace Jack and Gary is no one.

  • LICCLICC Members Posts: 893 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

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    @LICC said:

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    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    Wtf are you blabbing on about?? Accurate?? What? Next you'll be saying Paul scholes ain't a Manchester legend!

    Ha! I would never say that about the legendary Paul Scholes!

  • scruffynickscruffynick manchester, UKMembers Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

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    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    Wtf are you blabbing on about?? Accurate?? What? Next you'll be saying Paul scholes ain't a Manchester legend!

    Ha! I would never say that about the legendary Paul Scholes!

    At least we agree about one thing

  • LICCLICC Members Posts: 893 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

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    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    Wtf are you blabbing on about?? Accurate?? What? Next you'll be saying Paul scholes ain't a Manchester legend!

    Ha! I would never say that about the legendary Paul Scholes!

    At least we agree about one thing

    You are a good man @scruffynick

  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,283 ClubWRX

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @BobMorris said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    With the exception of Venturi (basically last minute sub but a nice gesture) every "honorary starter" won at Augusta National.

    Uhhh...no.

    Uhhh - yes.

    Hutchison and McLeod weren't Honorary Starters? That's news. Anyway, just correcting your comment. Those two never won Masters titles, and between them, they were Honorary Starters to the Masters tournament between 1963 and 1978.

    For the third time, they won at Augusta National so nothing to correct except for you continuing to be wrong about it.

    Seniors titles don't count, Hawk. Show me the Masters titles they won.....which years? I'll wait.

    Give it up Bob.

  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,283 ClubWRX

    @dalehead said:
    In the years from 1977-1980 and 2003-2006 there was no honorary starter at the Masters. So maybe the answer to the question of who will replace Jack and Gary is no one.

    I’d say it’s become more ingrained with the TV coverage, BUT wouldn’t put it past the club to do without either.

  • StrömsborgStrömsborg StockholmMembers Posts: 533 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bscinstnct said:

    Looks like my father.

    Hey chopper, what are you hitting there?

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    After how long does being "out of form" turn into "a bad golfer"?
  • QuigleyDUQuigleyDU Members Posts: 7,490 ✭✭✭✭✭✭✭

    I think they should have Greg Norman as a honorary starter... Just cause... Karma...

    Driver: Callaway Epic SubZero 3D 10.5*, Fujikura Ventus 7X
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  • scruffynickscruffynick manchester, UKMembers Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭✭✭✭

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @Hawkeye77 said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @scruffynick said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:

    @LICC said:

    @gvogel said:
    Tom Watson, Ben Crenshaw and Jose Maria can handle the duties after Jack and Gary, and until Faldo is ready. Much later, Phil and Tiger if they are able.

    Why bother? They would go from legends of the game to pretty good players (Watson is a great but not at the Nicklaus, Palmer, Nelson, Snead, Player level).

    Some might debate that with Watson at 8 majors, and Player of the Year more than a few times.

    I could see Watson at most. The others you mentioned, not really. The Masters hasn't always had ceremonial starters. It has skipped for years at a time when there weren't players that fit the role ready to do it. Since 1980 there has been Gene Sarazen, Byron Nelson, Sam Snead, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player. I don't see Crenshaw or Olazabal or Faldo as being right for it. Maybe Watson, maybe not.

    Curious why not faldo..... Won it 3 times and was the man to beat for best on a decade. Couldn't think of a better choice in the future

    Oh please. To go from Nelson, Snead, Arnie, Jack, and Player to Faldo?

    He's won 6 friggin majors....so oh please, in my eyes he's ahead of Nelson. He's won the masters 3 times so in my eyes worth being a starter in the future

    Faldo is no legend. Won’t happen.

    Are you serious? Come to the UK and say that, he's a sporting icon and one of our greatest ever spietsman .....so very much a legend

    In the UK. So let him hit a ceremonial first ball at the Open. He doesn't meet the standard for the Masters.

    He's won it 3 times..... I repeat 3 friggin times.... Please explain the standard of the masters when faldo has been a major part of its history. More deserving than most that's without doubt, I suspect if he was American you'll have a different tune

    The standard is a legend of golf. He is not. Transitioning Watson in would be fine and he can hold the position until Tiger is ready.

    Idiotic.

    Nick Faldo is a living golf legend, period.

    He is at Ernie Els, Lee Trevino level.

    Do you just troll along in every thread?

    Forget about Els for now.

    Faldo and Trevino each with 6 majors and yes, golf legends.

    Again, idiotic, but you seem to enjoy it for some reason.

    Would you have Trevino and Els be the honorary starters too?

    Because they won The Masters when?

    Just more nonsense upon more nonsense.

    You are missing the point. Faldo is around the same level as Trevino, Els, Norman, Singh. The honorary Masters starters for the last 40 years have been at a higher level

    Trevino was way higher than most, one of the greats and if the masters has treated him better he would be a starter now. To say faldo is only on the same level with the names you provided is pure stupidity and quite clearly someone looking for a argument. Faldo is without doubt a legend of the game, and without doubt one of the games finest ever players period....frankly I really don't care what ramblings you have on here now because I really don't care

    You are an Englander so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    I'm not an englander.....live here and brought up here but I'm not English so good try. So I rate faldo because he is a great and not in his nationality....not in pal

    Ok, revised: You were brought up in England and live in England, so you are overrating Faldo. Understandable, even if not accurate.

    Wtf are you blabbing on about?? Accurate?? What? Next you'll be saying Paul scholes ain't a Manchester legend!

    Ha! I would never say that about the legendary Paul Scholes!

    At least we agree about one thing> @QuigleyDU said:

    I think they should have Greg Norman as a honorary starter... Just cause... Karma...

    If he hadn't lost the plot in 96, hit certainly would have been popular after what happened to him in the past

  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,283 ClubWRX
    edited Aug 10, 2019 12:26pm #151

    @QuigleyDU said:
    I think they should have Greg Norman as a honorary starter... Just cause... Karma...

    He can go on with Jack next year. Jack can hit one down the middle and with everything on the line Greg can push another 4 iron right.

    And really, I was a huge Norman fan when he played and anyone who watched him a lot learned what the heat of battle can do to the best of the best at times. The show he put one just getting back into it on Sunday in '86 was scaring us Nicklaus fans pretty good and I still remember getting everything organized, food plans set, viewing comfort assured for what I thought would finally be his Masters coronation in '96.

    My oldest daughter was only 3 1/2 in '96, we watched some of her favorite movies that Sunday morning, took a walk, etc. because the one TV we had at the time was mine once The Masters came on (and we always did that stuff anyway). This I recall because the next year she'd heard me talking about this kid named Tiger and was fascinated by the name, and he was a "kid", and she'd putted around a bit on the course by then and she became a lifelong Tiger fan starting with the '97 Masters and a dedicated little golfer, lol. Still have the sleeve of Wheaties Tiger golf balls my wife bought the cereal for and did the old send in the box tops as a little project with our daughter (just holding them for safekeeping for her at present).

    Oh well, that's a little far afield, but honorary starters win at Augusta National, period and guys with 5+ majors are legitimate legends in the game of golf no matter how you analyze it. Just not a matter of reasonable disagreement.

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