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Medical Marijuana

 Mikey5e ·  
Mikey5eMikey5e mich 1051Members Posts: 1,051
Joined:  in Rules of Golf and Etiquette #1

What are the USGA rules on medical marijuana while competing in a tournament? I know of an individual who does this on a regular basis while playing to relieve stress, and wonder if he is breaking the rules?

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  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
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    Unless he's one of the three people who hold a Federal IND card (medical marijuana), he's breaking the law regardless of what the USGA allows.

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
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    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
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  • Mikey5eMikey5e mich 1051Members Posts: 1,051
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    @Philomathesq said:
    Unless he's one of the three people who hold a Federal IND card (medical marijuana), he's breaking the law regardless of what the USGA allows.

    I don't quite understand your answer, sorry, but according to him he has got legal Authority to smoke it. I'm not sure what kind of card he might have but I know he has some sort of documentation allowing him to smoke it due to post-traumatic stress.

    Posted:
  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
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    @Mikey5e said:

    @Philomathesq said:
    Unless he's one of the three people who hold a Federal IND card (medical marijuana), he's breaking the law regardless of what the USGA allows.

    I don't quite understand your answer, sorry, but according to him he has got legal Authority to smoke it. I'm not sure what kind of card he might have but I know he has some sort of documentation allowing him to smoke it due to post-traumatic stress.

    Sorry if my comment was more snarky than intended. I was simply making the point that only three individuals in the U.S. have true, unfettered, legal authority to use marijuana for medicinal purposes. One might have a "card" from a state or local authority, but marijuana is still a schedule 1 drug under federal law and, as such, cannot be legally used under federal law. That is, your friend's "card" from Colorado, California, or wherever, is not actually relevant to the legality of his actions under federal law.

    Practically speaking, unless he really pisses of a federal law enforcement officer, he's not going to get arrested. But, the point still stands that it is illegal.

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
    (Fairway woods in progress)
    (Long irons in progress)
    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
    Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Seven S

  • davep043davep043  3821Members Posts: 3,821
    Joined:  #5

    https://www.usga.org/championships-hub/additional-entry-resources/doping-policy-and-drug-testing.html
    USGA competitions are subject to one of several Anti-Doping policy, depending on which championship is it.. Marijuana is on the prohibited list. There are provisions for a Therapeutic Use Exemption which might cover medical marijuana, but that's a separate thing from any governmental permission to use the stuff. As for as the USGA policy for normal play, I just don't know.

    Posted:
  • Mikey5eMikey5e mich 1051Members Posts: 1,051
    Joined:  edited Sep 18, 2019 7:50pm #6

    Thank you for clearing up your original post, it helps me understand it better. With that in mind I can't imagine it being accepted by the USDA during tournament golf. I am at odds on what to do about it. Part of me says just leave it alone and stay out of the issue, but there is another part of me that thinks the rules should be abided by to make it fair on everyone. Not sure what to do at this point?

    Posted:
  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
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    Here is an excerpt from the USGA Anti-Doping Manual used by the PGA Tour. As you can see, marijuana is a banned substance because it is illegal under Federal law. Given this prohibition, I can't imagine they would allow it at any USGA-sanctioned event.

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
    (Fairway woods in progress)
    (Long irons in progress)
    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
    Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Seven S

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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5504Members Posts: 5,504
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    @Mikey5e said:
    Thank you for clearing up your original post, it helps me understand it better. With that in mind I can't imagine it being accepted by the USDA during tournament golf. I am at odds on what to do about it. Part of me says just leave it alone and stay out of the issue, but there is another part of me that thinks the rules should be abided by to make it fair on everyone. Not sure what to do at this point?

    if they let you drink during the tournament, I would leave it alone. I know guys who play local tournaments and crack beers open the entire round. If you can play good while drinking it is a slight advantage to keep you at ease over important putts and shots

    Posted:
  • VindogVindog Don't order the schnitzel. They're using schnauzer!  17792Members Posts: 17,792
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    I would leave it alone. It would be nearly impossible for the organizers of the event to enforce such an action unless the player was caught in the act. They can't test for it, and even if they could they would not be able to pinpoint how recently the player medicated.

    You could bring it up to them before hand, and they MIGHT tell him to not medicate for 4 hours, but you may be getting into some negative press, here.

    I'd leave it.

    Posted:
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  • NewbyNewby  7119Members Posts: 7,119
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    The USGA works to the PGA TUE (Therapeutic Use Exemption) process.
    See Section 6 here:

    https://www.usga.org/content/dam/usga/pdf/2018/2017-2018_Anti_Doping_Manual.PDF

    Posted:
  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
    Joined:  edited Sep 18, 2019 9:41pm #11

    Sorry if my comment was more snarky than intended. I was simply making the point that only three individuals in the U.S. have true, unfettered, legal authority to use marijuana for medicinal purposes.

    So you’re saying “ only 3 people have league authority to use medical marijuana?

    This seems a bit unbelievable.

    Posted:
  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
    Joined:  #12

    @justasgood said:

    Sorry if my comment was more snarky than intended. I was simply making the point that only three individuals in the U.S. have true, unfettered, legal authority to use marijuana for medicinal purposes.

    So you’re saying “ only 3 people have league authority to use medical marijuana?

    This seems a bit unbelievable.

    It may be unbelievable, but it's true. You can Google it. Or, you can see the links below. The CBS article states there are four patients, but one of them died in August 2018, I believe. See the second article for that.

    https://cbsnews.com/news/4-americans-get-medical-pot-from-the-feds/

    https://medicalcannabis.com/patients-care-givers/federal-ind-patients/

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
    (Fairway woods in progress)
    (Long irons in progress)
    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
    Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Seven S

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  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
    Joined:  edited Sep 18, 2019 10:00pm #13

    Seems like more than 3

    Posted:
  • NewbyNewby  7119Members Posts: 7,119
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    Wouldn't TUE override everything?

    Posted:
  • Mr. BeanMr. Bean  4414Members Posts: 4,414
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    @Newby said:
    Wouldn't TUE override everything?

    Or CIDH ?

    Posted:
  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
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    . Washington listed 32,123 recognition cards created as of May 16, 2018, but registration isn't required to be a medical marijuana patient except for patients under 18. As a result, we created an estimate based on the per capita patient numbers in Oregon.

    Posted:
  • davep043davep043  3821Members Posts: 3,821
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    There's a big difference between being legal under State law, and being legal under federal law. This is one reason that "state-legal" pot retailers don't use banks, their assets in a federally regulated or insured bank could be subject to federal enforcement efforts. Its a big legal gray area, a conflict between state and federal law, but pot is still illegal under federal law.

    Posted:
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  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
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    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    Posted:
  • davep043davep043  3821Members Posts: 3,821
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    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    If I'm reading this right, you're saying that over 1% of individuals in these states is legally (under state law) using marijuana for medical purposes? That seems really high, do you have a source? Not that its really germane to the discussion as relates to golf, I'm just interested.

    Posted:
  • lawsonmanlawsonman Freeport, Illinois 5667Members Posts: 5,667
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    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    The Feds still consider it illegal is his point I believe.

    Posted:
    Welcome to where dumb opinions are better than no opinion. :)

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  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
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    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    You are missing my point. Federal law trumps state law. While something may be allowed under state law, it is still illegal under federal law. If a DEA Special Agent were to talk up to someone in Denver who is smoking pot, the civilian's possession of a legal document issued by the State of Colorado would be of no consequence to the DEA Special Agent and would not act as a shield for a violation of federal law. The fact that states are openly passing laws and regulations that are in direct contravention of federal law does not mean those laws and regulations are legal under federal law.

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
    (Fairway woods in progress)
    (Long irons in progress)
    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
    Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Seven S

  • lawsonmanlawsonman Freeport, Illinois 5667Members Posts: 5,667
    Joined:  #22

    @Philomathesq said:

    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    You are missing my point. Federal law trumps state law. While something may be allowed under state law, it is still illegal under federal law. If a DEA Special Agent were to talk up to someone in Denver who is smoking pot, the civilian's possession of a legal document issued by the State of Colorado would be of no consequence to the DEA Special Agent and would not act as a shield for a violation of federal law. The fact that states are openly passing laws and regulations that are in direct contravention of federal law does not mean those laws and regulations are legal under federal law.

    Quit being a debbie downer!! :D

    Posted:
    Welcome to where dumb opinions are better than no opinion. :)

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  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
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    @davep043 said:

    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    If I'm reading this right, you're saying that over 1% of individuals in these states is legally (under state law) using marijuana for medical purposes? That seems really high, do you have a source? Not that its really germane to the discussion as relates to golf, I'm just interested.

    https://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=005889

    Posted:
  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
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    @lawsonman said:

    @Philomathesq said:

    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    You are missing my point. Federal law trumps state law. While something may be allowed under state law, it is still illegal under federal law. If a DEA Special Agent were to talk up to someone in Denver who is smoking pot, the civilian's possession of a legal document issued by the State of Colorado would be of no consequence to the DEA Special Agent and would not act as a shield for a violation of federal law. The fact that states are openly passing laws and regulations that are in direct contravention of federal law does not mean those laws and regulations are legal under federal law.

    Quit being a debbie downer!! :D

    So the 10th amendment has be revoked?

    Posted:
  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
    Joined:  #25

    @justasgood said:

    @lawsonman said:

    @Philomathesq said:

    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    You are missing my point. Federal law trumps state law. While something may be allowed under state law, it is still illegal under federal law. If a DEA Special Agent were to talk up to someone in Denver who is smoking pot, the civilian's possession of a legal document issued by the State of Colorado would be of no consequence to the DEA Special Agent and would not act as a shield for a violation of federal law. The fact that states are openly passing laws and regulations that are in direct contravention of federal law does not mean those laws and regulations are legal under federal law.

    Quit being a debbie downer!! :D

    So the 10th amendment has be revoked?

    And sanctuary cities don’t exist.......

    Posted:
  • justasgoodjustasgood Without Tempo, you are just a hacker.  2859Members Posts: 2,859
    Joined:  edited Sep 18, 2019 10:59pm #26

    Something similar is happening akin to this discussion. The federal auto emissions guidelines and the State of California (go figure) anywho, California wants to implement their own state auto emissions guidelines and the government is saying they can’t.

    Constitution 10th amendment says the states have a right to make their own laws and by that, the people will vote with their feet(exodus) if they don’t like em or at the polls to remove the laws or lawmakers.

    States have the constitutional right to make and enforce their laws and many allow both recreational and medical use of marijuana.

    Next you’ll say the government can “make” you buy health insurance.......

    Posted:
  • PhilomathesqPhilomathesq Legal Eagle 426Members Posts: 426
    Joined:  #27

    @justasgood said:
    Something similar is happening akin to this discussion. The federal auto emissions guidelines and the State of California (go figure) anywho, California wants to implement their own state auto emissions guidelines and the government is saying they can’t.

    Constitution 10th amendment says the states have a right to make their own laws and by that, the people will vote with their feet(exodus) if they don’t like em or at the polls to remove the laws or lawmakers.

    States have the constitutional right to make and enforce their laws and many allow both recreational and medical use of marijuana.

    Next you’ll say the government can “make” you buy health insurance.......

    Since political commentary is disallowed on this website, I will try to answer without treading into political territory. Whatever you believe the powers of the federal government should be, it is undeniable that current federal law, which supersedes state law, makes use of marijuana a crime. There is no grey area on this point. If the federal government wanted to, it could go into Colorado, for example, and shut down every single dispensary and charge the owners and operators with federal crimes. The fact that the federal government has not yet done so does not mean that the recreational use of marijuana is legal.

    Posted:

    Driver: Mizuno ST190G, Oban Kiyoshi Tour Limited 70 O5 flex
    (Fairway woods in progress)
    (Long irons in progress)
    5i - PW: New Level 902, DG Tour Issue X100
    Wedges: New Level M-Type Black 50/54, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx; Titleist Vokey SM7 60K Black, DG Tour Issue X100 Onyx
    Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Seven S

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  • lawsonmanlawsonman Freeport, Illinois 5667Members Posts: 5,667
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    @justasgood said:

    @lawsonman said:

    @Philomathesq said:

    @justasgood said:
    If the average number of medical marijuana patients per 1,000 residents in states with legal medical marijuana is extrapolated to all 50 states (population 325,719,178 in 2017, according to the US Census Bureau), then the total number of medical marijuana users as of May 16, 2018 would theoretically be 3,514,510 [10.79/1,000 x 325,719,178 = 3,514,510].

    You are missing my point. Federal law trumps state law. While something may be allowed under state law, it is still illegal under federal law. If a DEA Special Agent were to talk up to someone in Denver who is smoking pot, the civilian's possession of a legal document issued by the State of Colorado would be of no consequence to the DEA Special Agent and would not act as a shield for a violation of federal law. The fact that states are openly passing laws and regulations that are in direct contravention of federal law does not mean those laws and regulations are legal under federal law.

    Quit being a debbie downer!! :D

    So the 10th amendment has be revoked?

    I had a smiley face in my post!! :)

    Posted:
    Welcome to where dumb opinions are better than no opinion. :)

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  • lawsonmanlawsonman Freeport, Illinois 5667Members Posts: 5,667
    Joined:  #29

    @Philomathesq said:

    @justasgood said:
    Something similar is happening akin to this discussion. The federal auto emissions guidelines and the State of California (go figure) anywho, California wants to implement their own state auto emissions guidelines and the government is saying they can’t.

    Constitution 10th amendment says the states have a right to make their own laws and by that, the people will vote with their feet(exodus) if they don’t like em or at the polls to remove the laws or lawmakers.

    States have the constitutional right to make and enforce their laws and many allow both recreational and medical use of marijuana.

    Next you’ll say the government can “make” you buy health insurance.......

    Since political commentary is disallowed on this website, I will try to answer without treading into political territory. Whatever you believe the powers of the federal government should be, it is undeniable that current federal law, which supersedes state law, makes use of marijuana a crime. There is no grey area on this point. If the federal government wanted to, it could go into Colorado, for example, and shut down every single dispensary and charge the owners and operators with federal crimes. The fact that the federal government has not yet done so does not mean that the recreational use of marijuana is legal.

    I was going to post something about what the federal government could do but I better not.

    Posted:
    Welcome to where dumb opinions are better than no opinion. :)

    Ping G400 9°
    Ping Anser 17,20,23, hybrid
    Ping G410 6-UW
    Ping Glide 54,58ES
    Scotty Cameron Newport 3
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    Snell MTB Black
  • wkuo3wkuo3 RELEASE  4370Members Posts: 4,370
    Joined:  edited Sep 18, 2019 11:32pm #30

    I believe each individual case needs apply to and be approved by the U.S.G.A. and the Tournament Board. Of course, no light up, only alternative form of ingestion is allowed.
    I admire those whom are on prescription to be able to qualify and play golf tournament. Must be difficult if they already have the needs for prescription drug to function.
    Again, the rules to "protect the field" is at question here.
    If your friend is that good to have a chance of making it to the golf tournaments, have him prepare all the documentations from his M.D. whom issued the prescription and present it to the Tournament Board. Allow time for them to verify and go through the process of approving. He can't just show up at the Tournament with a note from his Doctor.
    We all know it that some of these "medical case" are borderline the grey area of whether the "patients" really needs the prescription. And there are Doctors whom will prescribe anything based on their personal believe without solid medical base.
    If any golfer could be playing good tournament golf while under the influence, good for them, because that would make it more difficult for the majority of us to play our best.

    Posted:
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  • AugustokAugustok  92Members Posts: 92
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    At my club in Massachusetts (where it’s legal recreational and medical I guess) marijuana isn’t allowed. The theory being members or guests aren’t allowed to bring their own booze so they can’t being marijuana either. Don’t know if anyone does. But people are rubbing I don’t know what all over their hurting joints. The club elders also didn’t think it was a good look for members since there are minors around. But this might be off topic but marijuana is an issue.

    Posted:
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