Can’t Hit My New Irons

Hey Everyone,

I’m about a 12 handicap and recently switched from super old TaylorMade RaC OS irons with regular shafts to Titleist AP2’s with Project X LZ 6.0 shafts. I hit an average 7 iron about 170 yards. I made the club change at the advice of a PGA professional giving me lessons.

I hit my old irons reasonably consistent (at least for my handicap level), but I can’t hit my new irons very well at all. They are definitely the weakest part of my game and are preventing me from getting into single digits. I have pretty much every miss possible with them and even my good shots don’t feel very pure. This has been surprising to me since I’ve heard such good things about AP2’s. The irons also feel very heavy which im assuming is making them harder to hit.

Does anyone have any idea what might be going on with the new irons? I’ve heard Project X shafts run very stiff so I’m thinking it could be that..

what made you go PX 6.0 in AP2?

im not a Titleist guy, but i thought they ran the AMT series as standard?

i made the switch from XP95 r300 to AMT black s300 in CF16 Apex at the start of the year and had the same problems you are describing, was at my wits end also until a single digit capper took me aside and showed me the flaws in my swing, once i ironed them out (pun intended) i really loved the firmer stiff flex shafts and am hitting iron shots the best i ever have.

i had never heard of the TM irons you had, so had to Google, they look like GI irons where as AP2 is a players CB.

The PX 6.0 were the shafts recommended by the PGA pro giving me lessons. He thought a stiff and slightly heavier shaft was good for me. Not sure exactly why to be honest.

And you are correct, my old RACs are way more forgiving. I’m doing my best to figure these new irons out, but at some point I might have to look into either changing the shafts or getting a different set if I can’t figure them out.

Did you do a fitting session at all? One where you could hit multiple different combinations to see which was best for you?

If you hit them beforehand, did you see the numbers on an LM?

It could be just a timing issue where you need to spend some time and slow down the swing a bit to get accustomed to them?

> @Apd1992 said:

> The PX 6.0 were the shafts recommended by the PGA pro giving me lessons. He thought a stiff and slightly heavier shaft was good for me. Not sure exactly why to be honest.

>

> And you are correct, my old RACs are way more forgiving. I’m doing my best to figure these new irons out, but at some point I might have to look into either changing the shafts or getting a different set if I can’t figure them out.

Did the pro actually give you a fitting of irons, or just suggested the shafts? A proper fitting should start with weight class, proceed to profile, and then settle on flex. Also, was the suggestion PX 6.0 or PX LZ 6.0? These are different profiles that may affect your timing and feel.

Please also consider that it may take time to adjust to the new clubs. It can take me a few months to adjust to shafts (timing, feel, aggressiveness). Other people can hit anything. YMMV

I would say the shafts will take quite a bit to get used to, very different profile and feel quite a bit different.

Give them some time. You made a big change and it will take time to adjust.

There is no adjusting period or getting used to them, you and those shafts are a poor match. You need to get a proper fitting and either have those irons re shafted or get rid of them.

> @Davidv said:

> There is no adjusting period or getting used to them, you and those shafts are a poor match. You need to get a proper fitting and either have those irons re shafted or get rid of them.

How can you tell him that with any kind of validity?

Not sure if this applies or not, and not trying to be mean about it, but is the goal to shoot lower scores or learn to hit new irons? When I've gotten advice on irons from a club builder they almost always where a fairly quick improvement. Not always, some iron sets went to Nevada Bob's never to return. The idea about checking the lie angle of the new irons compared to your old ones I feel does have merit, that can make a big difference in several aspects.

> @lawsonman said:

> > @Davidv said:

> > There is no adjusting period or getting used to them, you and those shafts are a poor match. You need to get a proper fitting and either have those irons re shafted or get rid of them.

>

> How can you tell him that with any kind of validity?

Read his post, and it is very obvious that is how.

Please listen to Mr. @Davidv . You should have some window of opportunity to correct the situation, otherwise you’re stuck with something that’s either useless to you or that you try to adapt to and degrades your game and enjoyment of the activity.

Did you hit this setup before you bought them, or did you just buy them blind based off the pros recommendation?

Are the results significantly worse or just FEEL worse? Are your scores actually higher?

I'm guessing it's all the shaft. I helped fit a friend into a stiff flex for the first time and it took him a while to adjust especially on the confidence side. I personally could immediately see the ball flight becoming much flatter/better but he had been swinging some regular flex graphite irons for so long that he didn't like the feel even when the result was just as good if not better.

If you hit a 7i 170, you probably shouldn't be playing regular flex irons and while it'll be weird for a bit, ultimately the stiff shafts should improve your ball flight/dispersion. I'd say stick with it.

I would give yourself a little more time with your new irons.

> @Davidv said:

> > @lawsonman said:

> > > @Davidv said:

> > > There is no adjusting period or getting used to them, you and those shafts are a poor match. You need to get a proper fitting and either have those irons re shafted or get rid of them.

> >

> > How can you tell him that with any kind of validity?

>

> Read his post, and it is very obvious that is how.

Not even close to obvious. Playing an old set of Rac OS, no one knows what those shafts actually played to... This goes back to the thread where people say you should just instantly be able to make equipment changes if you were fit to it with no issues what so ever is truly absurd.

Thanks for the input guys. I did not go through a full fitting session with the irons. It was just a recommendation from the pro. I tested out the irons during a range session and a round of 18 and hit them very well then but things went down hill from there.

The irons both feel worse and my scores are higher. I can sometimes find something with them on the range and string together some good shots but every time back on the course it’s inconsistent contact and far left misses.

I’ll give it some more time and try to get used to them. But it has been about 2 months since I’ve had them and I play almost every day.

> @Apd1992 said:

> Hey Everyone,

>

> I’m about a 12 handicap and recently switched from super old TaylorMade RaC OS irons with regular shafts to Titleist AP2’s with Project X LZ 6.0 shafts. I hit an average 7 iron about 170 yards. I made the club change at the advice of a PGA professional giving me lessons.

>

> I hit my old irons reasonably consistent (at least for my handicap level), but I can’t hit my new irons very well at all. They are definitely the weakest part of my game and are preventing me from getting into single digits. I have pretty much every miss possible with them and even my good shots don’t feel very pure. This has been surprising to me since I’ve heard such good things about AP2’s. The irons also feel very heavy which im assuming is making them harder to hit.

>

> Does anyone have any idea what might be going on with the new irons? I’ve heard Project X shafts run very stiff so I’m thinking it could be that..

I played PX 6.0 shafts from 2006 to earlier this year. You heard right. In the wrong hands, they may feel like rebar. Nonetheless, **PX LZ 6.0 shafts do NOT feel anything like PX 6.0**. I tested them before changing to my current shafts. PX LZ has a unique bend/kick profile. They are smooth as butter with the right swing tempo but if that swing is at all too slow or off, it's going to feel and sound like a clunker/thud.

I don't believe AP2 heads are the problem, as they fit a lot of golfers. However, what may be part of the problem is AP2 heads are NOT nearly as **offset **as TM Rac-OS irons. I have always played minimal offset heads but a few years back bought a set of TM RSi TP irons which as it turns out, has more offset. They are great irons for someone that benefits from the offset but in my hands, the offset felt like I was hitting clunkers.

If you are taking lessons and your instructor suggested the new irons, then maybe he was trying to put you into clubs for the swing you want, not the swing you currently have. I would say continue the lessons for a bit and see if the swing changes make the clubs more "playable" for you.

I'm curious... I am guessing you have already asked your instructor about what you are experiencing.. what has he\she said?

He says the stiffer shafts and kickpoint of the PX LZ 6.0 is a better fit for my swing speed. And then he gets more technical and looks at swing video when I bring up my misses with the irons.

> @Apd1992 said:

> I have pretty much every miss possible with them **(AP2)** and even my good shots don’t feel very pure. This has been surprising to me since I’ve heard such good things about AP2’s. The irons also feel very heavy which im assuming is making them harder to hit.

First, it appears you didn't really get a fitting on a launch monitor, with comparisons for different types of shafts. So... let's look at the two iron sets... (The asterisk in the grid assumes you had the stock Ultralite steel shaft* in the RACs.)

A couple of things. The offset is much less on the AP2 irons. Make sure you are lining up AP2 clubhead square to target line. You may have face a tad open, given your long years of looking at the RAC OS.

The PX LX is definitely heavier. This will change your tempo. Since you hit a 175-yd 7i, you need more than 90-gram R-flex shafts. But without a true launch monitor fitting, you don't know if the PX LZ is the best heavier shaft.

> ... I’ve heard Project X shafts run very stiff so I’m thinking it could be that..

Again, if you had the Ultralite R steel shafts in your RACs, the LZs are 30 grams heavier. That increases shaft weight by one-third. That's extra resistance.

As for PX LZ... At the February golf expo, I hit LZ 5.5 shafts in both Callaway and Ping irons. I remember even the 5.5 flex was more work than all other R-range shafts I tried. The LZ shaft was smoother than the base PX shafts, but still a bit of work.

Again, a launch-monitor comparison would tell you a lot.

_Note:_ If any of the courses in your area are still holding Titleist Thursdays this season, you might drive over and get a second opinion.

> @danielt823 said:

> Did you do a fitting session at all? One where you could hit multiple different combinations to see which was best for you?

> If you hit them beforehand, did you see the numbers on an LM?

>

> It could be just a timing issue where you need to spend some time and slow down the swing a bit to get accustomed to them?

I'd have to say something similar to the quoted post, and ask you didn't you hit them before you bought them? I would never buy a set of clubs without demoing them first. I sense surprise in your post as to you not being able to hit them.

> @Apd1992 said:

> Thanks for the input guys. I did not go through a full fitting session with the irons. It was just a recommendation from the pro. I tested out the irons during a range session and a round of 18 and hit them very well then but things went down hill from there.

>

> The irons both feel worse and my scores are higher. I can sometimes find something with them on the range and string together some good shots but every time back on the course it’s inconsistent contact and far left misses.

>

> I’ll give it some more time and try to get used to them. But it has been about 2 months since I’ve had them and I play almost every day.

>

2 months playing almost every day ? Minimum of 40 rounds ? They're not for you.

The AP2s are definitely less forgiving than your old RACs but the shafts are almost certainly the main issue. 95 grams and regular would typically be way too soft for someone who carries(?) a 7 iron 170,,,,,,,,,, unless that someone has a super smooth and very consistent tempo. Which, at double digits, you probably don't have.

I would expect the heavier and stiffer shafts to actually help smooth out your swing a bit but as others mentioned you really shouldn't have bought anything without getting to a launch monitor and trying all sorts of different shafts AND heads.

Good luck.

Yea, I didn't see the post saying you played everyday for 2 months and still couldn't hit them. They are definitely not for you.

Something else to consider as far as distance at least. I wouldn't be surprised if your old irons are delofted at this point. Those old sub 100g shafts are very weak at the tip.

I just did a reshaft for someone with some Burner 2.0s which are 5 to 10 years newer. Had sub 100g shafts and 7 out of 8 were bent strong at the tip. So now you are coming from super strong lofts, and even more offset.

That being said you are changing the weights a lot. 30g shaft change will take some getting used to.

Holy extreme shaft change Batman! The feel change alone has to be pretty significant from your old to new set.

RAC OS to AP2, not as drastic, but will require some learning time.

If I were you, consider trying some other shafts on say the 6 iron, then go from there. Or, go see a fitter who has a cart you can try different shafts.

Good Luck, fitting always as adventure as are equipment and swing changes.

I did hit them before I bought them, but definitely not as much as I should have. I jumped at the deal since they were pretty much brand new clubs and I got them for $500. I figured at the worst I could turn them for a small profit.

Sounds like my best course would be getting fitted with a launch monitor and possibly selling the AP2's since it's been a couple months with no improvement.

> @Apd1992 said:

> Thanks for the input guys. I did not go through a full fitting session with the irons. It was just a recommendation from the pro. I tested out the irons during a range session and a round of 18 and hit them very well then but things went down hill from there.

>

> The irons both feel worse and my scores are higher. I can sometimes find something with them on the range and string together some good shots but every time back on the course it’s inconsistent contact and far left misses.

>

> I’ll give it some more time and try to get used to them. But it has been about 2 months since I’ve had them and I play almost every day.

>

Are you going to the range or just playing everyday? Range time is UNDER-RATED.

I had a similar situation with my new irons for the first few weeks. I was hitting pull hooks and had a hard time figuring out why. I tried a few different things on the range and figured out I was shifting my weight too far forward on the downswing and coming over the top (thanks to some video work from my wife). The different shafts/weighting forced me to think more about those two things. Since then, I've developed a pretty good habit of staying back and coming down further inside.

I agree with getting fit for what works best for you, but don't expect immediate results. You'll need to get used to get some repetition with them to feel comfortable. Good luck!

There's been a lot of talk about the weight and stiffness of the shafts, but are length and lie the same between the irons?

I've got a buddy who's about a scratch golfer who was an absolute ringer in high school, but doesn't play as much anymore. He's been playing the same clubs for about a decade and they don't fit him at all. Ultralite and whippy shafts in his clubs and he hits everything sky high. I asked if he thought about getting new clubs and he said it was hard to justify paying money to get worse. He struggles to hit better equipment when he tries it and doesn't play enough to get used to it. I guess what I'm trying to say is that you're not the only person who's gotten used to clubs that don't "fit" them and then struggle to adjust to something that should fit them better.