58 vs 60 degree wedge

 xyckin ·  
xyckinxyckin Singapore/Columbia,SC 26Members Posts: 26
Joined:  in Equipment #1

Would a 2 degree change in loft significantly change my yardage?
I'm currently using a 60 Hi Toe which I love for short shots and bunker shots but I've also found that from time to time I need to hit a high 100 yard shot which I try to do with my 60 wedge but it always comes up short. My full shots for 50 goes 125-130, 54 goes 115-120 and I can actually control these distances just fine so I assume that a 60 should get me about 100 but it comes up short at 85-90. The only way I can actually get my 60 to go 100-105 is by really just hammering down the 60 which leads me to be more inconsistent with my striking. Will the 58 be significantly different from the 60 in terms of short chips and bunker shots? I really love my 60 so far but this 100 yard shot is just crushing me especially if I can't approach the green with a low flighted PW or 50. The only reason the 60 hasn't moved down to a 58 is because of how versatile I've found it to be greenside and I don't really put myself in 100 yard distances but when I do by accident......
Also, if so, anyone tried the Big foot?

Posted:
Taylormade M5 (10.5) - Tensei Pro White 60 TX
Cobra F7 (16) - Fujikura Pro 65x
Taylormade P790 UDI (HZRDUS Black 85 6.0) ||  Mizuno CLK 19* (Fujikura Pro Hybrid X-Stiff)
Mizuno MP18 MMC FliHi 4-iron (C-Taper Lite 115X)
Mizuno JPX900 Forged 5-PW (C-Taper 130X)
Taylormade Milled Grind 50* SB/ 54* HB
Taylormade Hi-Toe ATV 60*
Taylormade Spider Black
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  • bkirkley09bkirkley09  431Members Posts: 431
    Joined:  #2

    I am right there with you. I struggle with the 100 yd gapping as well. I tried a 56 degree wedge which carries right around 95 -100 BUT I went with the ES grind for Ping and I do not find it all that forgiving on full shots. I much prefer a bit more effective bounce on my wedges. My 50 degree carries 120 and is always around that distance and I used to use it for chipping in from 100 and in but I did just get a Bigfoot 60 degree and it is fantastic. It is a bit odd with that much bounce for full shots but my chipping game has improved dramatically as it has made it fairly effortless to pop the ball up and land it around the pin. It will not be leaving my bag anytime soon which means it has one more round before its gone on these forums! lol.

    Posted:

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  • ChipNRunChipNRun  1753Members Posts: 1,753
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    It takes quite a touch to hit full shots with an LW - be it 58* or 60*.

    It appears you may be experiencing the lob effect with your 60*. The lob effect is the point(s) in your wedge mix at which going from to a fuller swing launches the ball higher, but not much longer. I have found the first 60* LW since before 2000 that I can hit reliably. Still, anything more than a 3/4 swing is unstable and unreliable.

    It's not just with LWs. A few years back, I found a Wilson SW that picked up the lob effect at more than a half swing. Half swing = 60 yards / 3/4 swing = 70 yards // full swing = ??whatever??

    In your case, it seems a 58* would give you a little extra distance to fill in your yardage gap.

    Posted:
    What's In The Bag *...

    Driver: Calla XR16 Pro 10.5° (set open) / Fuji Evolution II TS Speeder 665 R-flex 63 gr.
    FWs: Tour Edge XRail 4W + 7W / GraphiteDesign G60 R-flex 60 gr.
    or Calla Alpha 815, set 16° + 20° / Fuji Motore Speeder 665 R-flex 62 gr.
    Hybrid: Cobra FlyZ 3H 19° + 4H 22° / Matrix VLCT Altus Lite flex 73 gr.
    Irons: Tour Edge CB Pro Tungsten 4i - PW** / KBS Tour 90 R-flex 101 gr.
           4i refitted with SteelFiber 780 HLS Hybrid shaft R Flex 75 gr.
    Wedge: Calla MD3 48°/8.SS + 54°/12.WS + MD.PM 60°/10  | KBS Tour R-flex 110 gr. |
    Putter: Ping Sigma G Tyne (face-balanced) / 34" w. Ping Pistol PP60 grip (stock)
    Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag
    Ball: Calla SuperHot - orange
    * Either 7W or 3H left out, depending on course.
    ** Wedges: 46°and 48°are competing for bag space.
  • geochitowngeochitown  1996Members Posts: 1,996
    Joined:  #4

    Bend the 60 to 58

    Posted:
    Lead Tape lovingly applied - Driver through GW
    TEE XCG7 Beta +1* to 11.5* - Testing at 43" w/ Matrix 7M3 stiff/Driver stand-in Wishon 919THI 13* Matrix 7M3 at 42.75"
    TEE XCG7 Beta 4W 16.5* - Matrix 8M2 /5W 18* - Matrix 8M2 stiff tipped 2" at 41.75"
    OR TEE XCG7 Beta 19* H - Fujikura Fit-on Red Stiff - 85 g at 39.25"
    TEE XCG7 Beta 22*H - Diamana Thump T93 Stiff untipped at 38.75"
    TEE XCG7 Beta 25*H - Diamana Thump i465ct 4i shaft stiff 38.25"
    Wishon 560MC's 5-PW (27,31,35,39,43.5,48) at -1/2" length KBS Tour 105 Stiff
    Vokey SM4 52-08F
    Cleveland TA588 57-10 (bent to 56*, so 9* bounce)
    Vokey SM5 60-07S  
    SC Futura X5r 33' flownecked by Bastain-cerakote sniper gray-silver dots-white flange sight line-SS Flatso 2.0
    OR Bastain Milled BM-007 Prototype 371g at 33"
  • 1Mordrid11Mordrid1  709Members Posts: 709
    Joined:  #5

    @ChipNRun said:
    It takes quite a touch to hit full shots with an LW - be it 58* or 60*.

    **It appears you may be experiencing the lob effect with your 60***. The lob effect is the point(s) in your wedge mix at which going from to a fuller swing launches the ball higher, but not much longer. I have found the first 60* LW since before 2000 that I can hit reliably. Still, anything more than a 3/4 swing is unstable and unreliable.

    It's not just with LWs. A few years back, I found a Wilson SW that picked up the lob effect at more than a half swing. Half swing = 60 yards / 3/4 swing = 70 yards // full swing = ??whatever??

    In your case, it seems a 58* would give you a little extra distance to fill in your yardage gap.

    This ^^^^^

    It is also possible that with that much loft, you could be getting a "glancing blow" effect because you are unable to compress the ball due to the loft of the club.

    Even most pros will use their 56 with a less than full swing rather than hitting a full 60 degree wedge. The degree of difficulty of pulling off a full swing lob wedge shot just makes the shot not worth the risk on straight forward approach shots.

    Posted:
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    PXG 0211 irons 5-G True Temper Elevate 95 S (1°flat 1°weak D4)
    Callaway Mack Daddy PM Grind 19 54/ KBS Hi-Rev 2.0 115
    Callaway Mack Daddy PM Grind 19 60/KBS Hi-Rev 2.0 115
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  • iNeedMoreGolfiNeedMoreGolf Ri 68Members Posts: 68
    Joined:  #6

    Id say the 58 is going to be perfect for the 100yrd... plus greenside sbouldnt be effected too much.

    Posted:
  • rt_chargerrt_charger Ball Hitter  252Members Posts: 252
    Joined:  #7

    Not to be that person but I would highly recommend not trying to choose 58 or 60 based on distances - depending on what manufacturer, chose based on bounce (some don't have a 58 or 60 mold and bend to get loft affecting bounce) and on your need to hit lower or higher shots floppy/pitch shots around the green. I myself prefer a 60 to get more loft on flop shots, I hit it full once in a blue moon when I have a front pin, the exact yardage, and the right conditions to do so; I also carry 4 wedges and consider myself a short game specialist.

    Posted:
    "Golf is a game that is played on a five-inch course - the distance between your ears." - Bobby Jones
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  • pingplayerpingplayer  130Members Posts: 130
    Joined:  #8

    I would get a 56 and bend the 50 a little.

    Posted:
  • MelloYelloMelloYello Upstate, SC 3613Members Posts: 3,613
    Joined:  edited Nov 6, 2019 12:50pm #9

    @rt_charger said:
    Not to be that person but I would highly recommend not trying to choose 58 or 60 based on distances - depending on what manufacturer, chose based on bounce (some don't have a 58 or 60 mold and bend to get loft affecting bounce) and on your need to hit lower or higher shots floppy/pitch shots around the green. I myself prefer a 60 to get more loft on flop shots, I hit it full once in a blue moon when I have a front pin, the exact yardage, and the right conditions to do so; I also carry 4 wedges and consider myself a short game specialist.

    I would agree with this.

    I'm in a similar boat. I carry 4 wedges and they are my best clubs. I would NOT want to lose my 60 around the green. I've flirted with 58's before but they just aren't the same when it comes to chipping and pitching. I've always found the 58 behaved more like a 56 as compared to a 60.

    With regard to full-swing distances, I would simply pick a comfortable number and go play based on that. If you run into "in between" yardages, then no biggie. Taking 5- or 10-yards off a wedge shot should not be much of a problem if you're practicing those half-swings on the range a little bit.

    Posted:
    Driver: M3 (10.5) w. Tensei CK Pro Orange (60-TX)
    3w: M6 (15) w. Tensei CK Pro Orange (70-TX)
    5w: M6 (18) w. Tensei CK Pro Orange (80-TX)
    Hyb: 818 H1 (23)
    Irons: 716 CB w. DG AMT S300 
    Wedges: SM6 52-F / 56-F / 60-S
    Putter: Newport 2 Select
  • nitramnitram Take Dead Aim  5242Members Posts: 5,242
    Joined:  #10

    @MelloYello said:

    @rt_charger said:
    Not to be that person but I would highly recommend not trying to choose 58 or 60 based on distances - depending on what manufacturer, chose based on bounce (some don't have a 58 or 60 mold and bend to get loft affecting bounce) and on your need to hit lower or higher shots floppy/pitch shots around the green. I myself prefer a 60 to get more loft on flop shots, I hit it full once in a blue moon when I have a front pin, the exact yardage, and the right conditions to do so; I also carry 4 wedges and consider myself a short game specialist.

    I would agree with this.

    I'm in a similar boat. I carry 4 wedges and they are my best clubs. I would NOT want to lose my 60 around the green. I've flirted with 58's before but they just aren't the same when it comes to chipping and pitching. I've always found the 58 behaved more like a 56 as compared to a 60.

    With regard to full-swing distances, I would simply pick a comfortable number and go play based on that. If you run into "in between" yardages, then no biggie. Taking 5- or 10-yards off a wedge shot should not be much of a problem if you're practicing those half-swings on the range a little bit.

    Agree with everything said here.

    I also think it depends on the course conditions you expect to normally encounter.

    FWIW, Stan Utley advocated a 58 for 20+ years and now personally bags a 60.

    Posted:
    Epic Flash SZ 3D 10.5 Diamana ZF 60S
    Epic SZ Tour 13.5 Accra TZ6 75 M5
    Exotics CB2 18* Matrix Ozik TP8HDX
    PING S55 4-9 DGTI X100
    Callaway MD4 Raw 46S, 52S, 56W, 60C DGTI 115
    Bettinardi Tour DASS Minovai 2.0
  • Back9Back9  712ClubWRX Posts: 712
    Joined:  #11

    I have come to agree with the general consensus above. I used to be a big "full wedge swing" guy with up to 5 wedges at 4 degree intervals to cover distances down to 75 yards with a 64 degree. I have found a lot more consistency with using partial shots with less lofted wedges. For me, full shots with high lofts require a very specific degree of shaft lean at impact, contact point on face, and swingpath to get the expected height, distance and spin. Partial swings with less loft seem to be more forgiving and repeatable with a higher variation in contact resulting in acceptable results.

    I also feel there is a bigger difference in greenside shot performance between a 60 and a 58 than between a 58 and a 56. Probably more perceptual than physical but either way, it is real to me.

    Posted:
  • chisagchisag  3098Members Posts: 3,098
    Joined:  #12

    ... Well here is a dissenting opinion. I was basically forced to play a 58* instead of 60* when my pw went from 48* to 46*. So instead of 54/60* I started playing 52/58* to keep the 6* gaps with my wedges. I played all my green side shots for 30 years with my 60* so I was a little worried about going to 58*. After getting comfortable with the change, I wish I had made the move 25 years ago. As others have stated, hitting my 60* harder only produced a higher flight, and while that is a shot I don't hit very often, the 58* performs better for me. At 66, my short game is the cornerstone of my index and I would not make the change if it effected me negatively in any way. Around the green I found very little difference in performance between the 60* and 58* and I now prefer the 58*. Ymmv

    Posted:
    Cobra F9 Tour Length ... Tensei Orange 65s
    Cobra F9 15.5* ... Atmos Blue TS 75s
    Cobra F8 18.5* ... Even Flow Blue 75s
    TaylorMade GAPR Mid ... KBS 80Hys
    TaylorMade UDi 18* TP 2 iron... Kuro Kage Black 90Hys
    4-pw TaylorMade P760 ... Recoil Prototype 95's
    SM6 52* F Grind /SM7 D Grind 58* ... Recoil 110s
    Bobby Grace 6330 ... 33.5"
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  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16  8136Members Posts: 8,136
    Joined:  #13

    Learn to hit your SW and GW 100 yards. I have the same distances as you pretty much, and I literally never hit my LW the full 95-ish yards that it can go. A back pin that's at 100 yards I actually will play a soft knockdown PW, land it hopefully around 90-92, and let it roll out a bit. Middle or front pins at 100, I'll either choke up a an inch or two and hit a full GW or I'll hit a full SW if the hole is playing up hill and/or there's wind at my back.

    Posted:
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    UNDECIDED
    Irons - MP-20 SEL 4-PW | Modus 120
    GW - T20 50/7 | Modus 120
    SW - T20 54/8 | Modus 120
    LW - T20 58/12 | Modus Wedge 125
    P - Bettinardi 360-M
    Ball - ProV1x


  • daleheaddalehead  1643Members Posts: 1,643
    Joined:  #14

    I choose my lob wedge on how it performs around the green and out of bunkers not how it performs on full shots. If I need to take 10 yards or so off my 54 I choke it down an inch and make a full swing. Gives me better results than trying to hit the lob wedge hard.

    Posted:
  • RacineBoxerRacineBoxer  866Members Posts: 866
    Joined:  #15

    2 degrees should get you roughly 6-8 yards.

    IMO your distances for your 50, 54 and 60 are right about what I'd expect them to be and I'd leave well enough alone. Learn to hit the 54 to 100 yards. You do not want to be forcing your LW an extra 10-15 yards, bad idea.

    Posted:
  • islesmbislesmb Myrtle Beach, SC (from Long Island) 181Members Posts: 181
    Joined:  #16

    @xyckin said:
    Would a 2 degree change in loft significantly change my yardage?
    I'm currently using a 60 Hi Toe which I love for short shots and bunker shots but I've also found that from time to time I need to hit a high 100 yard shot which I try to do with my 60 wedge but it always comes up short. My full shots for 50 goes 125-130, 54 goes 115-120 and I can actually control these distances just fine so I assume that a 60 should get me about 100 but it comes up short at 85-90. The only way I can actually get my 60 to go 100-105 is by really just hammering down the 60 which leads me to be more inconsistent with my striking. Will the 58 be significantly different from the 60 in terms of short chips and bunker shots? I really love my 60 so far but this 100 yard shot is just crushing me especially if I can't approach the green with a low flighted PW or 50. The only reason the 60 hasn't moved down to a 58 is because of how versatile I've found it to be greenside and I don't really put myself in 100 yard distances but when I do by accident......
    Also, if so, anyone tried the Big foot?

    I've been using my 58° for just about all shots 100 yards and in for years. I've never felt the need for more loft.

    Posted:
  • RainShadowRainShadow Tucson AZ (for now) 3980Members Posts: 3,980
    Joined:  #17

    I went to a 58* many years ago and haven't looked back.
    More consistent full shots ( Rarely used for those) and same function around greens.
    I use mine as 75yd full. 54* goes 90yd full, 50*GW is 105 Full.
    Learned to control distances with all wedges and short irons....develop those golf skills.

    Posted:
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  • DFS PFDDFS PFD  1183Members Posts: 1,183
    Joined:  #18

    Why not hit the 54* up in your stance when that awkward shot is needed? 60 or 58 will never be optimal at 100% of your max distance.

    Posted:
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    TS3 15* Tensei PW 80TX
    2-PW Ping Blueprint DG X7
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  • dlygrissedlygrisse Kansas 13671Members Posts: 13,671
    Joined:  #19

    If you are comfortable with it around the green a 58* should do the trick. Personally it's my favorite club in my bag. Just make sure you find the right bounce/grind combo for your game.

    Posted:
    I pick 14 of the following:
    Ping G400
    Callaway Epic Flash 3w 
    Ping G410 5 and 7 wood
    Callaway Apex 23*
    Ping G 4-U
    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 54, 58 SS or Vokey M Grind 58
    Grips NDMC +4
    Odyssey Pro #1 black
    Jones Utility
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  • puttingmattputtingmatt puttingmatt Summer/ Michigan-- Winter/ Florida 5256Members Posts: 5,256
    Joined:  #20

    @chisag said:
    ... Well here is a dissenting opinion. I was basically forced to play a 58* instead of 60* when my pw went from 48* to 46*. So instead of 54/60* I started playing 52/58* to keep the 6* gaps with my wedges. I played all my green side shots for 30 years with my 60* so I was a little worried about going to 58*. After getting comfortable with the change, I wish I had made the move 25 years ago. As others have stated, hitting my 60* harder only produced a higher flight, and while that is a shot I don't hit very often, the 58* performs better for me. At 66, my short game is the cornerstone of my index and I would not make the change if it effected me negatively in any way. Around the green I found very little difference in performance between the 60* and 58* and I now prefer the 58*. Ymmv

    Agreed, I also made this change in wedges years ago,
    Works great, can still open the 58* to give even more
    loft for versatile shots around the green,

    Posted:


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  • MitchellGolfingMitchellGolfing  1364Members Posts: 1,364
    Joined:  #21

    I’m able to do everything with a 58 that I used to do with a 60. Much more predictable on the full shots as well.

    Posted:
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  • Lacey UnderallLacey Underall  1200Members Posts: 1,200
    Joined:  #22

    I played a 60* for years with good success. It went 100 yards on a full swing and I used it almost exclusively around the greens. Then about a year ago I seemed to lose some distance with it (even though my other club distances remained the same). Could have been a little swing change that caused it to launch even higher.

    Switched to a 58* around that time. I find it much more effective on full or near full swings. Can easily hit it anywhere between 90-105 yards with not nearly as much height. No doubt I'm losing something around the greens though.

    Posted:
    2019 WITB
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    3 Wood: Callaway Epic 15* - Aldila Rogue Max 85x
    2-PW: Callaway X-Prototype MBs - Project X 6.5 flighted
    52* Wedge: Callaway MD2 Slate S Grind
    58* Wedge: Callaway MD2 Slate S Grind
    Putter: Odyssey Sabertooth Versa
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  • VNutzVNutz  6401Members Posts: 6,401
    Joined:  edited Nov 8, 2019 5:16pm #23

    Each person is different so you've got to figure it out for your own game unfortunately. For myself, I've been on the 58* for 15-20 years now. Growing up I was a 60* guy, primarily for chipping around the green, but anything over 40-50 yards was difficult, and full swings a nightmare. I switched to a 58 in the same bounce, grind, etc and I could hit full shots with ease, and half to 3/4 shots just as easily. No more sliding under or scooping shots, no fear of hitting it between 60 and 100 yards on full swings. 100 yards is now a breeze. And around the green I have lost nothing except maybe the super flop that I might have to use but twice a season, and even then you can adjust. Just my .02 but I cannot get by without a 58 now.

    Posted:
  • Hougz79Hougz79  338Members Posts: 338
    Joined:  #24

    I too grew up playing a 60, but switched to a 58 about 12 years ago and haven't looked back. Same as others have mentioned, more predictable approach shots (I won't say full because I also don't like to swing my 58 more than 3/4), and gives me the versatility that I need.

    Posted:
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    Titleist 818 H1 19*, Fuji Motore Speeder 8.8HB S
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    Ping Glide 3, 54/12 SS, 58/10 SS
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  • SammyShafSammyShaf  336Members Posts: 336
    Joined:  #25

    I have always had a 60 in the bag until recently. I found that I never hit square faced shots with it, only open cut lobs and pitches. I switched to 54/58 just to see if the wedge guy article about less loft and more consistent distance control would result. I can still hit the high, soft as a broken footed butterfly lobs with a 58 but more importantly I can hit square faced distance wedge shots that I previously delegatef to my 56.

    Posted:
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  • Bill GuyBill Guy Golfbuddy  129Members Posts: 129
    Joined:  #26

    In my experience a 60+ wedge is extremely difficult to hit on a full shot and is a high tariff shot at best as you have to be so precise. A 58 is much easier to use both for short and full shots with little or no difference especially if you are able to open the head to create a flop type shot, yet it is much easier to hit a full shot with better penetration. Consider a 50*, 54* and 58* wedge set and practice to establish your distances with half, 3/4 and full swings with each with the ball set in a forward, mid and back position in your stance and when placing your hands in your normal position on the shaft grip and then when moved maybe an inch down so as to shorten the shaft with a resulting reduction in shot distance. Depending on head sole style you can also get further shot types by opening or closing the face. If you record each combination on paper you will find some combinations that travel the same distance, some with a low flight that will travel a bit further on landing and others that will travel higher and stop quickly. Practice each and the bottom line is that I would be surprised if you find any distance or shot type that one of the above will not cover. Must good wedge players will say you will get better results with a low wedge shot wherever possible.

    Posted:
  • texcromtexcrom Franklin, TN 3584ClubWRX Posts: 3,584
    Joined:  #27

    I made the mistake a few years ago of moving from a 60 to a 58 degree lob wedge. I though having the 58 from the fairway would give me a weapon I lacked with the 60. I then moved to a 50 and 54 to create proper gapping.

    Unfortunately, the move cost me my strength, which was my short game around the green. I stubbornly kept working with the 58 to no avail, and longer than I should have. It could have been the look of the 58, which visually looked strong to me, or just mental. But I could not get the loft of my shots and the control I have with the 60.

    I finally went back to a 52-56-60 configuration, and literally chipped in from off the green first round back.I am now back to where if I have the 60 in my hands around the green, I seldom bring my putter from the cart.

    But I never use the 60 for more than a 50-60 yard shot, which is just a smooth half swing. Beyond that is a disaster waiting to happen.

    Posted:
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