No distance gap between 6 and 5 iron?

Yes, that's my dilemma. I'm currently playing the Apex CF19's. I have maybe a couple yards distance difference between my 6i and 5i. I've got some loaner clubs and found that lack of a gap holds true with pretty much every club that I've tried.

I did get 10 more yards than my 6i Apex with the Rogue X, but I'm guessing that's due more to the difference in loft than anything else because everything else is pretty much the same.

I do get better gapping with the Rogue X at the expense of spin with all the irons and I'm a little reluctant to game the Rogue X knowing that these are now obsolete.

So do I put the Rogue X in the bag as my 5i or do I drop the 5i and look for a hybrid to fill in the gapping?

What's your club head speed like with the 5 and 6i? I believe Tom Wishon had a table/chart with cut off points for irons based on club head speed.

Yep, sounds like a lowest effective loft problem to me.

I.e. once the loft gets too low you don't have enough speed to generate the required launch/spin conditions to get the optimal distance.

Or it could just be that the loft of the 5i is off.

Why would the Rogue X iron be obsolete? It still hits the ball the same distance as it did when new. Sounds like it might fit into your bag instead of the Apex iron.

I had issues with distances with my irons. I had loft and lie adjusted and now, I am getting the distance gaping as I should be.

Some OEM lie/loft tolerance is higher. Example: if your 6 iron is + 2* stronger and your 5 iron is = 1* weaker, there is only 1* of separation. of the two irons. I strongly suggest you have them checked and adjusted accordingly.

I had that situation between 3 and 4 irons. Solved it by going to a 3 hybrid.

Bag full of hybrids

You could still game the Rouge X. However, it's 21* that's the same as the 4i in your Apex set and really is a 3i. There are a lot of tour pros that don't game a 21* iron. You might get the distance you need with the Rouge X, but I bet your peak height, descent angle, and spin make it hard to stop it. If you are only going to use it as a tee club, or you only need it into greens you can run on to, it might work. But I think you probably need a hybrid. I bet a 23* or 24* hybrid will give you a great gap.

I took the 5 iron out and put a 5 hybrid in and couldnt be happier.

The hybrid is just so much easier for me to hit.

Sorry guys, should have added that I'm a senior golfer and a slow swing speed, so I'm guessing that whomever said I'm not generating a high enough swing speed for a 23.5* (that's what the Apex is) versus 21* for the Rogue X. Of course, when I hit the Rogue X, the swing speed is much lower (about 1,000 rpm) than the Apex.

However, I was hitting the Apex 5 again today and I was getting a 10 yard increase over the 6i. I think that's about what I should be getting.

I do think a hybrid would probably be a little more consistent than the Apex 5i, but I'm going to stick with the 5i for now.

I'm using the Winter months to work on my impact. I also noticed that the smash factor with the Rogue X is about 1.2 - 1.25 and the smash factor with the Apex is about 1.05 - 1.2. Is this because of the difference in loft or is it my swing difference with the two clubs.

The shaft on the Rogue X is a KBS 40 gram. The Apex is a UST 780 ES F2.

The Rogue X is a little easier to get those distance points that I've set, but I'm worried about the reduction in spin. I've been playing the Apex CF19's most of last year and really like the way they feel and play. I've yet to find a club that delivers on performance and I've tried a few others.

The Rogue X was fitted by Club Champion and I can see why they selected it, but as I said, Callaway has discontinued it and the reduction in spin may be a bigger issue when hitting into greens.

I'm going to run over to Golf Galaxy and check the lofts and lies tomorrow.

check the lofts

AS others have said - 5 hybrid is the answer. I ditched my old Apex 5 iron for a Apex 5 hybrid - best move I've ever made equipment wise.

I'm also a senior with non-Wrx average swing speed.

I'm 55. My bag went Driver (185 yards) then 4w (175 yards), then my M2's starting with 19* and 22* hybrids before moving to the irons. After enough sessions on launch monitors to finally accept that there was no difference between my hybrids at about 165 yards, and not even being happy with how I hit the 22*, I tried a 7w and immediately kicked both hybrids out of the bag because I hit it the same distance, but higher and more consistently. I then tried a 9w and it immediately replaced my 5i. I now go Driver, 4w, 7w, 9w, 6i and my handicap dropped from 18 to 16 within a few weeks of making the changes.

Try some different type clubs (hybrid irons, hybrids, woods) to see what works best for you and set your bag up with what gives you the best results.

Check out Mark Crossfield's latest videos where he's doing exactly that by mixing-and-matching clubs to get the best setup for him.

My issues isn’t swing speed but I have ball striking issues. I’m actually looking at adding one of these hybrid-irons as a 5 iron or even a 5 and 6 iron replacement. I Struggle with my 5 iron but hit my 6 ok. Those Cleveland launchers look like a good blend from my hybrid to my irons that I hit well enough.

If I were to replace the 5i with a 5h, would I pick a hybrid with the same loft as the 5i?

Would it make any sense to drop the 5i and put in a 4h to fill a slightly bigger gap and then drop in a 5w and 3w for fairways?

This is the reason why a lot of OEMs are making progressive sets now. Keep in mind that today's 5 irons are basically 4 iron loft or less. In order to hit a players club 5 and 6i you need some speed. If not, get fit for a progress set with faster, bigger, hotter long irons you can get the proper gaps back. Fitting is the Key!

As suggested above, many golfers would be better served with a 7W and a 9W, especially guys that swing a driver less than 85mph. Hybrids can be a solution but in my experience you still need decent speed to get gapping from hybrids, woods are easier.

I am a senior. My first iron is a 7. The lofts are a lot stronger today, and I can't get a 5/6-iron in the air like I can with a fairway wood (I have a 24º 9-wood). I disagree that the Rogue X are obsolete. They are only a year old and probably won't be considered obsolete for a good number of years.

If there is a good reputable proshop nearby, I would recommend going there. Generally speaking, I’ve found Golf Galaxy, Golf town, former Golf Smith, etc. lie/loft machines are not well calibrated. If workers are not that familiar with their LL machine, you will not get a correct reading.

Note: find the original specs to your iron set, print it out and take it with you.

I think you can go same loft on the hybrid. The length of the hybrid will be longer, likely lighter, which should equate to more distance than your similarly lofted 5 iron.

I’ve got 3h, 4h, and 5h. Then 6-iron.

Might be easier to have the 6-iron adjusted to create the correct gap between the 5h and 7-iron.

20 years ago we had trouble getting distance gaps in the 3 and 4 iron. Well now the 5 iron is the old 3 iron and we're in the same place as before, just now we have 2 extra wedges.

If you get good days and bad days with the Apex CF19 five iron, consider getting the shaft softstepped.

You would have the clubfitter insert a shaft tipped for 4i - this would increase the flexible portion of the shaft, and help improve launch. A single "softstep" would lighten the flex about 1/3 a flex.

I had the same thought as you. The Rogue X irons were released in 2018. Because Callaway may no longer produce them doesn't make them obsolete by any stretch.

For me it's between 4i and 5i. Obviously I get more roll with the 4. For a guy who doesn't get along with hybrids, I usually game a GI type iron for my 4i. Sometimes it takes a shaft change as well. There are diff ways to fix the issue. Tinker with some clubs or see a fitter. I say bag the Rogue X.

I really enjoy hitting irons as opposed to hybrids. For me, the swing is different with a hybrid than with an iron and that means practicing with hybrids AND irons. I'd much rather get by with irons and perhaps a fairway wood or two and skip the hybrids altogether, but that would leave a big gap that could only be handled by swinging say a 5w at 70%. Somehow, that never works out.

My latest practices determined that I can get a 10 yard gap from the 6i to the 5i and that works for me, but I'll probably need something like a hybrid to fill in the gap to my 5w. Maybe even two hybrids.

I really need to get the lofts checked because I noticed that the PW in the Apex CF19 does not gap well with the 9i. I think I read something to this effect when the CF19's first came out. I think there is a 4.5* loft difference between the PW and 9i, but with my slow swing speed, there is more than 15 yard gap between the two. Maybe even a little more.

Is 10 yards the correct gapping to have between clubs?

I have the same issue as the OP. I dropped my 5 iron and replaced it with a ping g410 hybrid during my fitting last spring. Don’t regret it one bit.

A few things. You mentioned you were fit for the Rogue, were you fit for the Apex as well? You seem to be a bit hung up on the fact that they aren’t making the Rogue X anymore. Lots of great irons that aren’t being made anymore played on tours.

That said, personally I’d stick with the apex if they are a reasonable fit for you because of the lofts. I find it hard to believe that the demographic the RogueX were marketed at can effectively play the 5 or even 6 iron effectively at 21 and 24 degrees respectively. Regardless of shorter shafts, these are the lofts that amateurs with slower swing speeds really struggle with. The whole point of the stronger lofted clubs is that they will generate more ball speed to go higher and despite the low spin be descending from a steep enough angle to stop quickly. Even well struck I’d be willing to bet even the 7 iron isn’t getting much height or stop as it’s actually a 5 iron. Also important to note that if you’re getting the gapping right (10 yards is fine for an amateur in long irons) how often are you getting it right? If you’re only hitting 1 or 2 out of 10 shots well with the 5 and the rest are miss hits dropping down to your 6 or 7 iron distances, I’d argue that club isn’t playing a very effective role in your bag.

I also challenge your assertion that hybrids require a different swing. I am the opposite with my 7 iron SS sitting at around 93mph but the last month I’ve been playing a 5-PW set (26 degree 5 iron in the 785 set) and then jumping to a 23* hybrid. I was only playing them as I was waiting on my two sets to be built and I didn’t have a shaft for my 4 iron so I put the hybrid in play. It was really nice. Although the head looks different the swing is identical to my long irons. The difference is a massive increase in forgiveness coupled with more spin/height - traits I believe are a positive for almost all golfers. Nearly every LPGA player uses a hybrid in place a 21/24/27 degree irons. No reason you couldn’t do it with 7/9/11 woods if you’re more comfortable with that look.

I didn't think they allowed you on here under 125mph. ?