MACHINE Demo Putters

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  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
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    Hey Steve,



    Glad you are liking it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':good:' /> I can't wait to hear further thoughts from you on what your thoughts are. Hopefully the weather stays good, we've been getting alot of rain here. LOL



    Thanks



    -Chris
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  • MacMiaMacMia Members  774WRX Points: 62Posts: 774 Golden Tee
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    I was very excited to take part in this demo program, having spent countless hours drooling over the Art and Prototypes from about a year ago. Thanks to Machine- Chris, Doug, Dave- for the opportunity.



    Quick context on the reviewer. I play (statistically) off a 1.2 GHIN. My stroke is solid, and a gate stroke. I game a Scotty Circle T Newport Beach 1.5 neck, 350 grams, 1 degree flat at 34 inches. Love this putter, although I fear for theft every time I game it or play away.



    I got the Machine M2A Converter in a neatly packed Fed Ex box. The first thing that I did was to I pull out the sheet that has all of the components listed- fat back, blade back, and tongue back, and all of the weights / screws. Before touching a thing, I got a calculator. The end game was to come up with 3 or so different versions of a 350-365 gram head using the pieces. I got the calculator and came up with the following combinations (and reviewed each one)



    __Combo 1: Standard Blade Set Up__



    Head (247)+ Neck (42) + Blade Back (44) + 2 ¾ Tungsten weights (15) + 2 ¾ Steel (7) = 355 grams



    __Combo 2: Fat Back__



    Head (247) + Neck + (42)+ Fat Back (89) = 378 grams



    __Combo 3: Tongue Back__



    Head (247) + Neck (42) + Tongue Back (70) + 2 ¾ Steel (7) = 366 grams





    *Craftmanship:



    The look of the Machine is of.. well.. a Machine. The pieces are incredibly well made and the finishes, curves, etc are extremely high quality. Paint fill looks great and the milling is pristine. When you put the pieces in their places, everything “lines up” which to me shows that the tolerances are very tight. The finishes match perfectly, and the putter is very much serious business.



    In addition to the putter itself, the accessory bags / tools / head cover are first class. AME made, cool logos, and reasonable sizes given what is in them. I would suggest going with the smaller assembly tool rather than the long one as it is easier to use and hold in the bags.



    *Feel and Performance:



    Before I review the combos, let me talk a little about the VMG grooves. As I said, my gamer is a Scotty Cameron Circle T 1.5 Newport Beach. It has milling marks on the front, but the Machine has MILLING MARKS. They do not look or feel like the C Groove on a YES putter but feel far more functional that those or something like the AGSI inserts. I felt that a major portion of the roll performance that I got from the various combos was attributable to the VMG milling- not just cool looking, but seemed to promote better over spin and roll.



    *Assembly:



    With some planning, assembly is a no brainer. You just need to know what you are trying to build. This is not a set of Legos, but a finely crafted set of pieces that when put together can do some cool stuff. If you rush it, you will get frustrated. After having Machine send me a new 2 prong bit (the one I got was broken), I proceeded to break the new one in about 5 minutes when I over-torqued a weight.



    __Reviews:



    When doing the review of each combo, I looked at three things:



    1. Looks- how the combo suited my eye

    2. “Dead Center” Feel- striking a putt dead center in the sweet spot, both short and long

    3. “Off Center” Feel- striking a putt off the toe to deaden the putt (e.g. as might be used for slick down hill putt)



    __Combo 1: Standard Blade__



    Intuitively, I thought that this would be my “go to” set up as it was the most similar to what I game.



    Looks: 9/10



    Set up is clean, putter looks like it was built this way, not assembled this way. Pulls off the Anser look but adds some cleaner lines to the tried and true formula.



    Dead Center Feel: 9/10



    The rolls that I put on this putter are fantastic. Seem to grab and roll with little to no hop off the face. Contact is crispy soft- not “clicky” like an Odyssey Black Series / Cameron Studio but not mushy like some insert putters. It was very close to my Circle T and the end over end roll was very impressive. No change in performance for short or long putts- all rock solid.



    Off Center Feel: 10/10



    The putter allowed me to “take something off of it” when I needed to in order to moderate speed. It still felt steady and responsive.



    Overall Combo: 28/30



    __Combo 2: Fat Back__



    This putter plays almost exactly like Combo 1, with two notable exceptions. The larger flange inspired more visual confidence and the stroke felt smoother due to where the mass is positioned from the Fat Back.



    Looks: 10/10



    Set up is clean, putter looks like it was built this way, not assembled this way. Longer flange makes it look like a game improvement / High MOI putter without any of the crazy stuff. I could easily see myself using this attachment when I lost confidence in the standard blade.



    Dead Center Feel: 9/10



    Very similar to Combo 1 with the exception of the impression that the Fat Back promotes a feeling of rolling the weight over the ball, not into the ball. Roll was pure- although distance control was a little tougher on the long putts.



    Off Center Feel: 8/10



    I had a hard time “take something off of it” when I needed to. This was probably a function of all of the mass behind the ball across the entire face (it was also the heaviest combo). Then again, I could probably just stroke it lighter but that would require a technique change, not equipment.



    Overall Combo: 27/30



    __Combo 3: Tongue Back__



    This putter is the best of both worlds- looks like a blade, but has the Tongue to give you the “2 Ball” effect. This one has Gamer potential.



    Looks: 9/10



    Set up is great- the diameter of the Tongue and the fact that the heel and the toe look like a classic Blade is a fantastic look. I could easily see myself using this attachment.



    Dead Center Feel: 10/10



    Very similar to Combo 2. Still a feeling of rolling the weight over the ball, not into the ball. Only difference is that the weight is more “controllable”. Roll was pure- no change in performance for short or long putts- all rock solid. Best feeling of all three for Dead Center hits.



    Off Center Feel: 10/10



    This combo gave me exactly what I got with the standard blade- I felt that the speed could be regulated by hitting it off the toe. Very well done.



    Overall Combo: 29/30



    __Overall “Overall’ Review:__



    This is finely crafted set of putting tools that puts together some great combinations with patience.



    When put together, it looks as if the pieces were meant for each other- and feel absolutely rock solid in virtually any combination. The Machine M2A Converter provides a unique option where you can get your “base” set- head shape, materials, neck- and then experiment from there- without having to buy another flat stick. Even when you go for some of the options- and Machine has some of the coolest like melted bumpers and hand peening, etc- the price comes no where close to what I paid for my Circle T. Machine does a great job at the complete package- Head, Neck, Attachments, and Accessories- which in my mind puts it in elite class of putter craftsmen (none of which currently provide this creative of a set up)



    I am grateful to have participated in this Demo program- and even more excited to get to work on my order form for my new Machine. I plan to add one to the arsenal- and based on the early feedback, it has a real shot at being the gamer.
    Posted:
  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #64
    All I can say is WOW. Now that is what I call a in depth Review. Thank you for your time and dedication in putting all this together. I look forward to working with you on your putter.



    Thanks



    -Chris
    Posted:
  • aue21aue21 Members  619WRX Points: 89Posts: 619 Golden Tee
    Joined:  #65
    Great review, Love to see people that appreciate the Demo's........
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  • SteveL1SteveL1 St. Louis, MOMembers  1413WRX Points: 110Handicap: 4.8 Posts: 1,413 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  edited Sep 16, 2008 #66
    MacMia wrote on Sep 16 2008, 05:25 PM:
    The first thing that I did was to I pull out the sheet that has all of the components listed- fat back, blade back, and tongue back, and all of the weights / screws.






    Doh!!!!! I didn't bother to turn the sheet over after reading the nice letter from David Billings. The first thing I did was grab the digital scale and weigh everything. What an idiot I am! Curious about a couple of the weights you listed though. The fat back is listed as 89 grams and mine is 80 and your tongue back is 70 which is the same as mine. Did you get the solid head or the South Beach version? I assumed mine was the South Beach as all of the back options were the lighter ones.



    Oh, and did you sneak in and read my notes? Nice review and one that will be tough to top.



    I'm taking my demo to the course tomorrow for an 18 hole test drive. More to follow.
    Posted:
  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #67
    I smell a challange. LOL



    Can't wait to read your final Steve image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />



    -Chris
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  • MacMiaMacMia Members  774WRX Points: 62Posts: 774 Golden Tee
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    SteveL1 wrote on Sep 16 2008, 09:26 PM:
    MacMia wrote on Sep 16 2008, 05:25 PM:
    The first thing that I did was to I pull out the sheet that has all of the components listed- fat back, blade back, and tongue back, and all of the weights / screws.






    Doh!!!!! I didn't bother to turn the sheet over after reading the nice letter from David Billings. The first thing I did was grab the digital scale and weigh everything. What an idiot I am! Curious about a couple of the weights you listed though. The fat back is listed as 89 grams and mine is 80 and your tongue back is 70 which is the same as mine. Did you get the solid head or the South Beach version? I assumed mine was the South Beach as all of the back options were the lighter ones.



    Oh, and did you sneak in and read my notes? Nice review and one that will be tough to top.



    I'm taking my demo to the course tomorrow for an 18 hole test drive. More to follow.




    I wish I had the digital scale- I felt like I got a new Erector set when I opened this up. I was going purely off of the sheet- and got the solid version of the head..



    Great putter- lots of fun to work with and a great roll..
    Posted:
  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #69
    Michael,



    We'll get you one with the SBC mailed out to you so you can see what your thoughts are on that.



    Also, I would like to thank all the Demo Participants so far. Using the feedback we have recieved from yall we have moved to a lower Strength Thread Locker for the weights, this will make them easier to change out while still keeping them secure. We have also redesigned the Dual Prong Bit to be more durable and stronger and to prevent breaking.



    Much Appreciated, and I can't wait to continue to hear more members feedback as the Demo Program Continues.



    Thanks



    -Chris
    Posted:
  • w8liftrw8liftr w8lifting, club swinging, Metal Monster!!! ClubWRX  2258WRX Points: 62Posts: 2,258 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  #70
    Great reviews. I can't wait for my turn. I have a lot to live up to with my review image/pimp.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />
    Posted:
  • w8liftrw8liftr w8lifting, club swinging, Metal Monster!!! ClubWRX  2258WRX Points: 62Posts: 2,258 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  #71
    Received my Machine demo today. First impression is fantastic craftsmanship! Now on to the real fun.........
    Posted:
  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #72
    I can't wait to hear your thoughts once you actually get to roll it on the green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />



    -Chris
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  • 8thehardway8thehardway Members  1907WRX Points: 69Handicap: 8Posts: 1,907 Platinum Tees
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    I've never read such in-depth reviews on any other putter... they border on the fanatical concerning the 'nuts and bolts' aspects while remaining objective and "kool aid free" about performance. What a testament to Dave's efforts and the putters that inspire such reactions.
    Posted:
    Callaway Big Bertha 12.5*
    Jones/Ortiz 4 wood 17*
    Kasco hybrid 23*
    Adams Idea Black CB2 irons 26, 29, 33, 37, 41, 45*
    Callaway MD3 S grind 52, 56, C grind 60, PM grind 64*
    Tom Slighter Needle 450g, 3* loft, 74* lie
  • Bones01gtBones01gt Members  1001WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,001
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    When I opened the box and saw that thing I was in awe of the craftsmanship. I am somewhat of a traditionalist so this putter has a bit too much going on for me. I'm sure for some the interchangeable weights is a fun thing to tinker with, but just like the R7 SuperQuad I had, it was just a distraction for me. The putter is beautifully crafted and I can definitely see myself buying one if I can get a one piece design. No interchangeable flanges, weights or whatnot. With the backs and weights I just couldn't seem to get this putter light enough. My Byron Dale Head is extremely light which I prefer, and the Machine demo I have can't come close with either flange installed. I even putted without a flange, which suited me best. The darn thing is super long too. I putt with a 33" putter and this thing is more like 35 which is standard I suppose, but too long for me to get a confident feel when I putt the ball. Anyhow, I love the craftsmanship, it is stunning to look at which is enough for me to consider putting one in my bag. It breeds confidence which piques my interest...I just wish I had one that set up for my stroke so I could give a more in depth critique or it's performance.



    If I give you the specs from my Byron Dale Head can you make a one piece head similar in weight and set up?
    Posted:
  • choeppnerchoeppner Blue Ridge, GACharter Members  10370WRX Points: 110Posts: 10,370 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #75
    Hello,



    Thanks for the review. We went with 35" as that is market standard. I know some use shorter and some longer, but we went with the most common length.



    What is the weight of the Dale Head? We can make you one without any weights or adjustable flanges. They are called the M1A Fixer's.



    Thanks



    -Chris
    Posted:
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