G410 flat setting

Hi,

Just curious how people have gone who play flat irons using the flat setting on these clubs. I have never really got on with my hybrid since I changed my swing over to very in to out and play my irons 2deg flat. Has it helped with not only line but ball striking and general confidence? I have found a big difference since getting my irons fitted and thinking lie angle on woods and hybrids is my main issue with a very flat in to out swing shape.

cheers

My hybrid is 22, set to 21 and flat. Stiff shaft. I love it. Much more workable and as someone short in stature it matches better with my 2 degrees flatter irons and wedges. Looking at a matching 18 dropped to 17 and flat to add some beef to top end of bag.

In my experience the flat setting makes a really noticeable difference. The main thing I'd say with the G410 series of woods is that they can be fitted to work for anyone. As long as the shaft is a good match you really can't go wrong with anything in the line.

The sleeve is different in the 410 range as opposed to the 400 range correct? It’s hard to find any solid info and surprises me that there is so little options out there for flatter lie angle woods etc.. I used to hit my sldr driver off the deck but have changed to a m2 that has a flatter base and now it’s not an option for me.. really want to get the top end of my bag set up well and have confidence in it.. I think lie angle importance on woods and hybrids is far greater than most people think, all the talk is about direction but your shifting the contact point lower and effectively reducing your sweet spot, making a low strike worse etc.. also will effect how well the ball gets in the air due to low strikes.

elwhippy did you find good contact far easier to make due to better turf interaction?

Hi Tommoh,

Much better contact and less draw. Give them a try, really great clubs.

No doubt for me it has helped BIG TIME! Best I’ve ever hit my hybrids and get woods.

I have hit the driver at a demo day and own the hybrid, the flat lie angle definitely helps. I have the 19* set at flat and -1 and its one of the straightest hybrids I have hit, I did try it at the standard settings and the ball moved more right to left than it does at my current setting. I found the same things with the driver at the demo day.

On a side note, I notice this with 3 woods as well, I currently play Rogue Sub Zero that has 55* lie angle and I love it. When I look back at other 3 woods I have liked and not liked (aka hook machines) the 3 woods with lie angles around 55-56 are the 3 woods I hit the straightest. Its one of the reasons I haven't played Taylormade fairway woods in a while, and when looking to try a new fairway wood I look at lie angles first because I know what's going to happen if the lie angle is to upright.

Awesome, cheers guys. I have just tipped a old jetspeed 3 wood and tweaked the shaft in the head to get me to the correct lie angle so hopefully that will help out there. Will get in to try the 410 Hybrid out as soon as I get a chance. I can probably stretch for 1 club atm so hope the 3 wood is good, May also try chop down a old driver shaft and see how it plays shorter and closer to my lie specs.

I’ve had a g410 driver in the bag for a while now. I play a draw so We set up the 9° 410 At a normal 10.5° With the weight out to the toe. So anyways I tinkered and found moving the wieght back to the back and setting the head up at 9° flat I am hitting it farther and straighter than I have in years. So pleased to have discovered this, close to magic in my mind.

Before you cut down that driver I would choke down on it and see how you like it. You can use a piece of tape on the grip at the length you want to try it. Swing weight changes a lot when you cut it down, you will get the feel when you choke down on it.

Yeah I have a couple of shafts that I’m not going to use, one to soft and one a bit firm.. will tip or butt trim either one of them. I have one that is already chopped but I only butt trimmed it so it’s a bit whippy now.

that or I will go for a driver fitting and try out some shorter shafts, see what it does to contact etc. I would really like to have The driver off the deck back into shot choices but just can’t do it with the m2 and upright lie. I’m pretty keen for a shorter driver if it means more fairways.

Also yes I understand swing weight changes with club length, cheeers

How much shorter do you want to go?

I’m 5”8 and pretty happy to look at around 44”, really need to just get on a sim and see where my ss starts to drop off, I don’t swing my 3wood much slower so I’m thinking I won’t loose a lot. If I can make it work it will bring my lie angle in to about where I need at that length also I think so should have some extra benefit. I was swinging at 6degs up on the driver last week so can probably go a lower deg head as I’m playing 10.5 down to 9 which opens the face 3 degs, that’s probably helping me not over draw the ball atm with the incorrect lie. Thoughts?

I would read through this post from @Howard_Jones it has some great information and he is a lot smarter than I am on this!!https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/909991/diy-driver-tune-up-diy-fitting/p1

For club fit in general yes, that tread will be helpful for most, but i cant even recall that i covered LIE ANGLEs as a subject there. (ill have to check), but we both can and should check lie angles on hybrids, and we can use the same ball marker method as we use for irons and wedges.

Just grab a whiteboard pen/ dry erase marker, and make a THIN strait line in the ball (1 inch or longer). Align that line vertical against the face of the club at address.

After the ball is gone, look at the print the ball made on the club face. Lie angle should be as "neutral" as we can get it, meaning the line should be as strait up and down as possible

If that line aint vertical, but points against the toe side, we should go FLAT, and if that line points to the heel, go UPRIGHT.

I am not sure if you covered lie angle in that post either, but he is also talking about cutting down the driver and that post has so much good information I have it saved, along with a couple other ones. As always thanks for all your knowledge @Howard_Jones

Ohh sorry was only reading the OPs first post in the tread and saw it was about hybrids and lie angles....

That DIY driver tune up will get a "update" soon, there is a lot of info missing about BIAS weighting and adjustable hosels on drivers i will add, plus "improvement of language" in parts of the text that might be hard to read as it is. Its also a reference to post #8 in the same tread missing who is the chapter VISUAL FITTING where 2 playing buddies can help each other trough the fitting process. As players we can only feel and notice improvements to impact, but we dont "see" what happens to our swing when we tweak club specs, and thats what VISUAL FITTING is all about. We are able to SEE when a player goes beyond his limits for total weight as one example, we cant always feel that ourself, but a helping friend who knows what to look for will be able to see it, and thats what that chapter is about. What to look for in the players swing to judge if the club is good or not for him. We simply take advantage of the players body language who cant lies, its always "unfiltered" language easy to understand if we know what to look to. That chapter is just as important as post #1, so they belongs together.

cheers guys I will have a read. I have never actually put a line on a ball but have a range matt at home And put tape on the bottom to see where I’m bottoming the club out. I won’t use lie boards as well they lie.. I always seem to get very different results from them. Very keen to get the top end of the bag fitted correctly as the lie angle on irons has made a huge difference and I think the hybrid and woods with closer turf interaction will benefit more.

Can’t get onto that thread, Copy paste or open in new browser keeps sending me back to this one..

Never use a lie board, it cant do the job right, and this dont really have anything to do with turf interaction either, so even turf marks can lie here...

If lie angle is anything but neutral at impact, the LOFT PLANE is tilted, who cause a tilt on the balls spin axis, and thats how back spin "pulls the ball" to the right or to the left like a draw of fade, but unwanted when lie angles is off. The only way we as players can compensate for a wrong lie angle if by face angle and thats no good since we should be able to shot shape both ways as we like, and not use face angle to compensate for a wrong lie angle.

now that the ranges are back open I will be drawing some lines on balls and see exactly where I am at, going flatter but I definitely feel like a can start to cut the ball again! It’s good! Looking forward to getting more time in with the irons adjusted.

I’m not a club guru but i think turf interaction does play a big part in a sense, yes you should not be hitting the turf first but without proper lie angle it’s not just loft plane that is effected. You have also lowered the strike point on the face by not allowing the correct (centre) part closer to the ground. This would have a large effect on many aspects, launch height, spin, forgiveness due to lower strikes on the face.

all I can ever find when looking up lie angle topics is loft plane and never about strike location as mentioned above, so these are all my own thoughts in convincing myself that’s what my issue is lol like to hear what you think about what I wrote. Cheers

Use the advance search and in the author section put Howard_Jones and in the title searc DIY driver tune up

I was fit into green dot (2.25 deg upright) G410 irons, so where should I have my G410 22 deg hybrid set? F- (for 1 deg less flat)? Sorry if this is something of a thread hijack....

Here is the link to that DIY driver tune uphttps://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/909991/diy-driver-tune-up-diy-fitting/p1

Lie angle has the potential to move impact away from the center of the face, and thats one of many reasons for why lie angles is important, but impact outside of the center dont have to be related to lie angle, it could be total weight, club balance & head weight or simply a swing flaw, but we should trace and notice what happens to impact position when we change lie angles.

F- on Ping means flat, -1* of loft. So the hybrid is a flatter lie angle with less loft than stated. As a Green dot you should play it at the standard settings.

There is so many parameters, both tech related and swing related that can cause a heel or toe side impact, but wrong lie angles has a tendency to move impact heel or toe side, and that can be as simple as the players attempt to adjust/compensate his swing to club specs as they are. So impact can be anywhere on the face, we only look at the line angle. If the line is Good / Lie angle are good, but impact is still not in the center. Toe side impact indicates that the club is to short (9-PW-GW), or that head weight / Total weight is to low, Heel side means to long, or too heavy, then we have ball position, to close or to far away from the player, swing path (too much in to out or to much out to in) so there might be many reasons for heel or toe impact, wrong lie is only one of them,

The shaft bends both forward and down, and lie shall be as neutral as possible at impact, but turn it "up side down"....when we adjust lie angle we deliver the grip in a different height and position, so seen from that direction, we fit lie angles against upright for players with "high hands at impact", and against flat for players with "low hands at impact"...

VERTICAL to ground goes UP with UPRIGHT, and DOWN with lie against FLAT

The average ratio between Length and lie to get to the same Vertical to ground is 1/8" on Play length = 0.25* on lie angle.

For each 1* we change lie angle, we raise or lower VTG by 0.35 inch, and thats why clubs often is bent upright instead of going longer...its a question of "high or low hands" at impact.