How often do Tour Pros mis hit shots?

I am looking for anyone that has played with any tour pro on a regular basis to let me know how often they mishit shots a round. By mishitting I mean missing the sweet spot not hitting the ball straight when they were trying to draw it. I've played with a few guys that were on the Hooters and Canadian Tour and I'm wondering what others experiences were. Thanks guys!

rarely if ever. pull a 3 wood out of a tour players bag, they all have a dime sized wear spot right on the sweet spot. if a tour player mishit 1 out of 100 shots i would think that would be a lot, they hit everything solid.

[quote name='crzyshortgame' timestamp='1298511900' post='3003983']
I am looking for anyone that has played with any tour pro on a regular basis to let me know how often they mishit shots a round. By mishitting I mean missing the sweet spot not hitting the ball straight when they were trying to draw it. I've played with a few guys that were on the Hooters and Canadian Tour and I'm wondering what others experiences were. Thanks guys!
[/quote]
Ben Hogan said he struck ten shots a round the way he wanted to.



I've played with quite a few pros. I wasn't exactly impressed with their ballstriking. The thing they do so well is this. When they miss the sweet spot, their miss still ends up somewhere around the green.
I would take a guess and say about 30 percent of the time they mishit a ball.

I play with a couple fairly regularly. They very rarely mishit a shot. I will say this though, I hit it just as well from 100-200 yards and off the tee. Its from inside 100 and between 200-250 they beat me. that is where they make their money. wedges and not hitting it in trouble when they have long irons.

[quote name='Relaxxx' timestamp='1298512297' post='3003991']
[quote name='crzyshortgame' timestamp='1298511900' post='3003983']
I am looking for anyone that has played with any tour pro on a regular basis to let me know how often they mishit shots a round. By mishitting I mean missing the sweet spot not hitting the ball straight when they were trying to draw it. I've played with a few guys that were on the Hooters and Canadian Tour and I'm wondering what others experiences were. Thanks guys!
[/quote]
Ben Hogan said he struck ten shots a round the way he wanted to.



I've played with quite a few pros. I was exactly impressed with their ballstriking. The thing they do so well is this. When they miss the sweet spot, their miss still ends up somewhere around the green.
I would take a guess and say about 30 percent of the time they mishit a ball.
[/quote]

My guess is the 10 shots comment has more to do with shape and trajectory being perfectly in line with pre shot plan and less to do with missing the sweet spot.

From what I've read of Hogan his expectations where a tad high. His "misshit" would have most tour pros thinking about skipping practice after a good day at the office...
I reckon they hit everything solid 99% of the time but sometimes miss judge the shot - hence scrambling. I have seen some crazy hooks / slices but never a "duff" when following at the Open.

Depends on the context, if you watch the guys on Tour that barely make the cut or even miss the cut you'll definitely see some missed shots ie double crosses, just shots that you know the hole calls for the opposite ball flight. That being said, 9 out of 10 of them still hit it in the middle of the face just with the wrong curve. If you go for a full day at any tournament you'll definitely see some squirrelly shots.

I played with a few REALLY good players in college and honestly it's not like you're in constant awe of their ballstriking. They'll get up and hit it maybe left side of the fairway, then middle of the green, have mostly 15 or 20 footers, make a handful and then you add it up and it's like....well sh*t that was a nice and boring 68. It's not like the Moe Norman stories and they're hitting 6 pins a round, basically you just can't tell if they missed it or if they hit it just like they wanted.

ive played with a currently tour player....

ballstriking amazing, but missed a shot every once in a while, but his miss wasn't far off and managed his misses well anyways (most really good players i have played with are the same)

Depends on your definition of a mis-hit?

In terms of pure ball striking, there's actually a bit of a mix. It's often said that Freddie Couples [i]never[/i] misses the sweet spot. On the flip side, there are several well know players who don't strike it that well but they make it work for them.

In terms of a shot not going where they expected it to, it's quite a lot. That being said, most pro's will take into consideration that the shot might not be perfect and they know where the best place is to miss the fairway or green. That way, if they don't leave themselves the perfect approach or a birdie putt, they can still easily make par.

Sounds easy doesn't it.

Don't really know the answer to that, might have to ask woods


[quote name='crzyshortgame' timestamp='1298511900' post='3003983']
I am looking for anyone that has played with any tour pro on a regular basis to let me know how often they mishit shots a round. By mishitting I mean missing the sweet spot not hitting the ball straight when they were trying to draw it. I've played with a few guys that were on the Hooters and Canadian Tour and I'm wondering what others experiences were. Thanks guys!
[/quote]

[quote name='Iggypop' timestamp='1298589247' post='3006526']
From what I've read of Hogan his expectations where a tad high. His "misshit" would have most tour pros thinking about skipping practice after a good day at the office...
I reckon they hit everything solid 99% of the time but sometimes miss judge the shot - hence scrambling. I have seen some crazy hooks / slices but never a "duff" when following at the Open.
[/quote]

i hope he cleaned up after himself! puhaha no... anyways, i think i read on this forum or something that ian poulter will shank about one shot per round. also, i've played a couple rounds with a tour pro and they never really seem to miss hit the ball, but like others said, their "miss" is a wrong curvature or just being a bit long or short. very manageable misses.

[quote name='lkangsterl' timestamp='1298652549' post='3008331']
[quote name='Iggypop' timestamp='1298589247' post='3006526']
From what I've read of Hogan his expectations where a tad high. His "misshit" would have most tour pros thinking about skipping practice after a good day at the office...
I reckon they hit everything solid 99% of the time but sometimes miss judge the shot - hence scrambling. I have seen some crazy hooks / slices but never a "duff" when following at the Open.
[/quote]

i hope he cleaned up after himself! puhaha no... anyways, i think i read on this forum or something that [b]ian poulter will shank about one shot per round[/b]. also, i've played a couple rounds with a tour pro and they never really seem to miss hit the ball, but like others said, their "miss" is a wrong curvature or just being a bit long or short. very manageable misses.
[/quote]

That wasn't far off the truth until a couple of years ago (he's pretty much sorted it out nowadays). The source was his financial advisor, with whom he plays several times a year.

Poults still has a tendency to get one or two near the hosel. Remember the '09 Masters when he hit 2 full-blown Sh**** in consecutive holes?

Darren Clarke is another who also gets one or two off the pipe every now & then

The last tournament pro I saw miss a full shot, in person, was Tiger in Dubai a couple of weeks ago. It was on the 7th in the first round of the Desert Classic, a par 3 playing 174 yards. it was into the wind and he was trying to go in with a firm 6 iron. He got it fat and it splashed into the water, more than 25 yards short of the pin. As soon as he hit it he started shouting 'Go hard!'. Truth is, it was never going to be even close to clearing the H20.

Another classic duff I recall was Nick Price in the 1993 Open on the 14th. He clean topped his 2nd shot with a 3 wood. It didn't go more than 60 yards. To his credit, he laughed it off

Edit: Hogan said he only hit one or two shots per round exactly as he wanted, not ten

It's nearly impossible to know if a golfer has genuinely totally pured a shot. David Howell was awarded 'Shot of the Year' in 2004, for his tee shot on the 17th in the Ryder Cup at Oakland Hills. Several tournament professionals were on the panel who chose it, yet Howeller admitted afterwards it was very slightly fat and somewhat off the toe!

If any of you have Tiger's book "How I Play Golf" there's a picture of his clubs in the bag. You can clearly see a tee mark on the bottom of his 3 wood that goes straight to the heel end of the club. Definitely a mis-hit.

Also check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgOzOxfH8Wk

I have several friends that are tour winners that I've played a lot with, they miss hit shots more than you think. But they can recover from those shots with great short games. Boo Weekley comes to mind as a guy that rarely misses a shot though. Ben Crenshaw is a "terrible" ball striker, but he's a pretty decent putter.

[quote name='Tmiller72' timestamp='1298682567' post='3009354']
I have several friends that are tour winners that I've played a lot with, they miss hit shots more than you think. But they can recover from those shots with great short games. Boo Weekley comes to mind as a guy that rarely misses a shot though. Ben Crenshaw is a "terrible" ball striker, but he's a pretty decent putter.
[/quote]
Two good examples mate. For those that don't know, Boo is one of the best ball strikers on tour.

David Toms is similar to Crenshaw in the fact that he's not a great ball striker but they both have world class short games.

[quote name='Iggypop' timestamp='1298589247' post='3006526']
From what I've read of Hogan his expectations where a tad high. His "misshit" would have most tour pros thinking about skipping practice after a good day at the office...
I reckon they hit everything solid 99% of the time but sometimes miss judge the shot - hence scrambling. I have seen some crazy hooks / slices but never a "duff" when following at the Open.
[/quote]

Exactly what I meant, guy's idea of a mishit would be trying to hit a 5 yard punch draw that only draws 4.5 yards, so using him as an example of pro's missing hitting the ball is pretty shaky

Just look at the stats on tour. These guys play at the highest level of the game and they mis-hit full shots enough to hit 60 or 70 percent of greens and fairways during a typical round. The short game and putting is where they really stand out against most of the best amateurs.

Saw a couple of mishits in the match play this morning.

[quote name='NPVWhiz' timestamp='1298733496' post='3010366']
Just look at the stats on tour. These guys play at the highest level of the game and they mis-hit full shots enough to hit 60 or 70 percent of greens and fairways during a typical round. The short game and putting is where they really stand out against most of the best amateurs.
[/quote]

Exactly...

The tour average number for GIR is 66.67%, or 12 greens per round

So, you don't need to be Einstein to work out that [b]t[/b][b]hey miss one out of every 3 greens[/b] on average throughout the season

Just watched Kuchar top a shot nowhere, hilarious.

Jason Day topped his tee shot not too long ago........it only went about 100 yards. To his credit, he hit an amazing 2nd shot and scrambled out a par.

[quote name='NPVWhiz' timestamp='1298733496' post='3010366']
Just look at the stats on tour. These guys play at the highest level of the game and they mis-hit full shots enough to hit 60 or 70 percent of greens and fairways during a typical round. The short game and putting is where they really stand out against most of the best amateurs.
[/quote]

Well, I think you're mixing in a "mishit" with other swing faults. I think a mishit to most of us is a player not hitting the ball on the center of the face.

You can hit the center of the face and still miss the green. Club can be way open or close, swing path can be off, alignment wrong....

[quote name='larrybud' timestamp='1298759388' post='3011201']
[quote name='NPVWhiz' timestamp='1298733496' post='3010366']
Just look at the stats on tour. These guys play at the highest level of the game and they mis-hit full shots enough to hit 60 or 70 percent of greens and fairways during a typical round. The short game and putting is where they really stand out against most of the best amateurs.
[/quote]

Well, I think you're mixing in a "mishit" with other swing faults. I think a mishit to most of us is a player not hitting the ball on the center of the face.

You can hit the center of the face and still miss the green. Club can be way open or close, swing path can be off, alignment wrong....
[/quote]

I thought about that aspect, but once you move away from the simple assumptions, you get out in the weeds and can't really make much of a statement.

There are really only two classes of approach shots: shots that finish on the putting surface and shots that don't, and clearly you can have perfectly struck shots fly long right over the top of the stick, and you can have shots hit high on the face with too much club end up pin high.

This is one of those hard to quantify questions, but I think one can conclude that the variety of misses, statistically, probably isn't all that far off from your average single digit player. Statistically, many single digit players have comparable driving accuracy and approach from fairway stats as tour players (and you have to give the tour players some credit for generating those stats in the heat of competition). But, the comparison is more about scoring potential.

Where they diverge dramatically is around the green on certainly on the putting surface. I've spent the last two years tracking my stats comprehensively, and I've finally come to the conclusion, based on the data, that my aspirations for ball striking are unreasonably high, and my putting and short game are 80% of the difference between my shooting 78 and 71. I knew this, I think, all along, but a good solid data set works wonders for changing practice routines/behaviors.

[quote name='SpinMill75' timestamp='1298751784' post='3010904']
Jason Day topped his tee shot not too long ago........it only went about 100 yards. To his credit, he hit an amazing 2nd shot and scrambled out a par.
[/quote]

i remember this, i remember in the byron nelson last year he topped a shot into the water, and the person he was playing in the playoff topped it as well. Both ended up making high numbers on that hole.

I have been thinking that this year I have seen more mishits than ever on tour while watching TV.
I saw Bubba hit one off the bottom edge of his driver at the match play, which was probably not on purpose.
Tigers sprays balls like crazy and still manages to put up better scores than I could shoot on those course.

Just look at the GIR and Fairways hit stats....besides having the wrong club in your hand...I personally think that most missed fairways and greens are the results of mis-hits....and then there are the shots left in the bunkers and bunker shots that fly the greens...they are not all because of bad lies...

I feel like I am a better than average (but not good) golfer and legit I actually hit about 10 shots per round that do [b]exactly[/b] what I want them tp do. I shot some rounds in the 70's last year hit about 5-6 fairways...all due to mishits...

I have seen rounds on TV where some tour pro only hit 4 fairways and shot under par....

Golf is not a game about how good your good shot are, its about how bad are your misses. I play to a plus handicap and you learn that its not that you need to hit shots to 10 inches to the hole to make birdie, its that you need to miss the ball on target and keep them playable. A great example of this (and mainly when I learned it) was when I was playing junior tournament at a course playing to about a 3 over par rating. The first day I hit all but 3 greens and shot 80 because I put the ball in bad places on the greens. The next day I think I hit 6 greens and shot 75. It's all about how you miss the ball.

[quote name='Fort Worth Pro' timestamp='1298513143' post='3004040']
I play with a couple fairly regularly. They very rarely mishit a shot. I will say this though, I hit it just as well from 100-200 yards and off the tee. Its from inside 100 and between 200-250 they beat me. that is where they make their money. wedges and not hitting it in trouble when they have long irons.
[/quote]

+1. Their ability to scramble is uncanny. They don't really put themselves in position to post really high numbers.

I don't miss the sweet spot very often, I have hit some flush power hooks out of bounds tho

Missing the sweet spot and club face angle at impact are different things. Golf is all about how good your bad shots are, those at the top, hit the least penalizing bad shots.

I've had a chance to play with Bob May and caddie around for him at the Corona event in Mexico when he was teamed up with his friend David Branshaw ( I caddied for him at the Something Fresh event last year during his practice rounds) Those guys are out of this league.. no joke.. I saw Bob hit the pin at least 6 times out of his 10 shots at 115 yards... When I went on to watch him play a round at his home course in Vegas he shot a 66, no "real" mishits. and had multiple eagle chances... granted it was his home course so he was very comfortable playing. But these guys are in a whole different league with short game. Even the worst shortgame players on tour are better than 99% of this board.. Bob used to be big on the PGA tour, now struggling with Nationwide after all his surgeries.. But still a beast and hitting it ridiculous amounts

I've played with one and when you say mishit that needs a little explanation. If it means that the ball did not perform as intended, ie. a fade swing where the ball went straight, he did that about 5 times during the rounds. But if you say that he muffed it ie., topped it, shanked it, hit it fat or thin, maybe once a round and then many times there were no muffs.

I saw Johnny Miller play in a tournament where he probably hit 3 shots thin during the round but two of them turned out to be ok, as in on the green, and the other one was way short. Nice guy.