Could Ben Hogan Use a 1-iron?

 two stroke ·  
two stroketwo stroke Members  41WRX Points: 0Posts: 41
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I wonder if Ben Hogan could stroke a 1-iron?



The secret's in the dirt. Bah.



The secret is behind you.



In the sky.
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  • LYGLYG Members  1028WRX Points: 66Posts: 1,028 Platinum Tees
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    Not sure the intent of original post...but he hit one of the most famous 1 iron shots in golf, Merion, 72nd hole of the 1950 US Open, as we all know.



    (I guess Jack's one iron at Baltustrol, 72nd hole of US Open was quite famous also. (1967, I think).
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  • two stroketwo stroke Members  41WRX Points: 0Posts: 41
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    LYG wrote:


    Not sure the intent of original post...but he hit one of the most famous 1 iron shots in golf, Merion, 72nd hole of the 1950 US Open, as we all know.



    (I guess Jack's one iron at Baltustrol, 72nd hole of US Open was quite famous also. (1967, I think).






    LYG,



    Thank you for the response regarding Merion. I will google that. Honestly, I don't know that much about Hogan's playing history.



    Sorry if the intent of the original post was unclear.



    It just seems that nowadays no one carries a 1-iron. I was sipping my coffee this morning and wondered if Ben Hogan carried one, used one effectively. If he did, then I question what went wrong after Five Lessons - The Modern Fundamentals of Golf was published? It seems that modern instruction concentrates on 2 things - deciphering Hogan's book & hitting down on the ball in an effort to create a divot from the earth at one's feet. When I try to hit down on the ball with a 1-iron, the results are worthless.



    Ultimately, I was wondering if any of the Hogan's Heroes carry 1-irons and could shed a little light on this very dark subject.
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  • Not YogiNot Yogi Spam  47WRX Points: 0Posts: 47
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    Yes..Ben said that shot at Merion was a breeze...he'd "been practicing that very shot since he was twelve". I never had one, but bought one last year. I still don't carry it, but it was part of one of Sir Squish's drills. He wrote that if you really want to trace the travel of the clubface...get a one iron to practice your swing. I did and highly recommend one for your swing drills. You can "feel" the clubhead much more than with a lofted club.
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  • svsvincenzosvsvincenzo Members  1822WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,822
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    A 1-iron back then has more loft than today's 1-iron. Plus if you believe Hogan did add loft to the club via his post-secret swing (aside from opening the clubface by several degrees), you wouldn't think it's impossible to hit by tour players. But due to competition and prize money, you would find ways to hit that 1-iron distance with an easier but not an embarrassing club, such as a fairway wood, right?
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  • two stroketwo stroke Members  41WRX Points: 0Posts: 41
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    A 1-iron back then has more loft than today's 1-iron. Plus if you believe Hogan did add loft to the club via his post-secret swing (aside from opening the clubface by several degrees), you wouldn't think it's impossible to hit by tour players. But due to competition and prize money, you would find ways to hit that 1-iron distance with an easier but not an embarrassing club, such as a fairway wood, right?




    hogangolf101,



    An elderly gentleman shuffled up to me a few weeks ago on the driving range and handed me an old golf club. His instructions were simple, but left me a little dumbfounded. "Re-grip this club. Then learn how to hit it."



    I looked down at the chrome clubhead and stared at the number one. The gentleman mumbled something about casting the iron toward the sky above the parking lot and then mentioned the importance of letting my hands fall off of my arms during the downswing.



    Took me a few weeks to re-grip it. Now I'm trying to learn how to hit it. I googled "how to cast the golf club" and came up with this:



    [url="http://video.answers.com/how-to-cast-the-golf-club-151780375"]http://video.answers...-club-151780375[/url]



    I couldn't help but notice the funny wrist action exhibited at 4:50. The wrist action reminded me of Hogan's wrists.



    I read a little about Hogan's 1-iron shot at Merion. A very interesting story.



    I haven't seen the elderly gentleman since he gave me the club. The 1 iron isn't the easiest thing to hit, but I'm working on it.



    The whole thing is a work in progress. I don't even own a fairway wood.
    Posted:
  • TingtingTingting Members  740WRX Points: 156Posts: 740 Golden Tee
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    read the august 2011 last pages of golf digest of how someone borrowed hogan's 1 iron. Its the last page. pretty interesting
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  • svsvincenzosvsvincenzo Members  1822WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,822
    Joined:  edited Jul 22, 2011 #8
    two stroke wrote:






    hogangolf101,



    An elderly gentleman shuffled up to me a few weeks ago on the driving range and handed me an old golf club. His instructions were simple, but left me a little dumbfounded. "Re-grip this club. Then learn how to hit it."



    I looked down at the chrome clubhead and stared at the number one. The gentleman mumbled something about casting the iron toward the sky above the parking lot and then mentioned the importance of letting my hands fall off of my arms during the downswing.



    Took me a few weeks to re-grip it. Now I'm trying to learn how to hit it. I googled "how to cast the golf club" and came up with this:



    [url="http://video.answers.com/how-to-cast-the-golf-club-151780375"]http://video.answers...-club-151780375[/url]



    I couldn't help but notice the funny wrist action exhibited at 4:50. The wrist action reminded me of Hogan's wrists.



    I read a little about Hogan's 1-iron shot at Merion. A very interesting story.



    I haven't seen the elderly gentleman since he gave me the club. The 1 iron isn't the easiest thing to hit, but I'm working on it.



    The whole thing is a work in progress. I don't even own a fairway wood.




    Thanks Mr. Squish. Can't open the file. What's it about?
    Posted:
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  • GuiaGuia Members  8696WRX Points: 167Posts: 8,696 Titanium Tees
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    What does it mean? The secret is behind you in the sky! Lost me.
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  • dlygrissedlygrisse KansasMembers  13875WRX Points: 1,437Handicap: 8-ishPosts: 13,875 Titanium Tees
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    Can a surgeon use a scalpel?
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  • Tee_PartyTee_Party Members  130WRX Points: 0Posts: 130
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #11
    two stroke wrote:


    I wonder if Ben Hogan could stroke a 1-iron?



    The secret's in the dirt. Bah.



    The secret is behind you.



    In the sky.




    You sir, are either biggest fool on this board or the biggest interloper.
    Posted:
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • GuiaGuia Members  8696WRX Points: 167Posts: 8,696 Titanium Tees
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    I still don't know what that statement means. Anyone?
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  • GatorNate11GatorNate11 Members  3932WRX Points: 62Posts: 3,932 Titanium Tees
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    Here comes the classic WRX let me try to look cool with an insult or "I don't understand what you mean lolz" posts. He was asking if Hogan hit a 1 iron, he didn't know, so he asked a forum of people who do. Everyone was able to tell him yes and about his famous 1 iron shot. Pretty sure it was all covered at that point.



    To the OP, like someone else mentioned, read about the guy using Hogan's 1 iron, funny story.
    Posted:
  • JOEGOLFWRXJOEGOLFWRX Members  1126WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,126
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #14
    tell us the story gatornate11.



    re: the op, the old ball spun more = curved more + rose more. the new balls is straighter = if you want to optimize ball flight with a 1 iron now you got to hit it vary hard to spin it up, its an option for high swing speeds, for lower swing speeds the recovery wood makes more sense, (more loft and weight low and back).



    it was fairway woods hogan had trouble with when he went down a path of playing greater and greater over draws as his stock shot, pre-secret, of course he might of been taking divots with those woods too, dig the ball out of the older fairways.
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  • SquishSquish Members  944WRX Points: 55Posts: 944 Golden Tee
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #15
    At 77 years old here is Austin nuking a 1 iron at a clinic.

    A guy asks is it true one should the let the club head do the work.



    In another part of the clinic Mike swings it one handed both left and right.



    At the end, listen as the three whooshes get higher in frequency as he swings, adding speed with each swing.



    Won't see no divots here.



    [media]
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  • SquishSquish Members  944WRX Points: 55Posts: 944 Golden Tee
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #16
    Guia wrote:


    What does it mean? The secret is behind you in the sky! Lost me.




    Guia,



    That is the back toss.

    It is mentioned in the Colman video, when Ben's friend says; "See how he gets that club behind him, that's all I practice".

    That is the beginning of the release of the clubhead from the top to get the shaft to line up with the left arm at impact.

    The left hand goes into palmar flexion as a result of this action. Both forearms are supinating.

    The pivot is so quick that the release must start at the top with a clockwise rotation of the right forearm for the shaft to catch up to the left arm.

    The clubhead will release with ulna deviation through impact. But the start of that process was the backtoss or throwing of the club from the top.



    It is not casting as they state in the previous video..

    Casting is a premature unflexing of the right elbow.







    The reason a 1iron; The cleek or driving iron, is so hard to hit, is that one cannot be early or late at impact.

    One simply cannot drag a 1 or 2 iron through impact, one must release the clubhead with a flick.

    I feel that flick at the base of the right forefinger of the right hand.

    The left shoulder arm and club must be in a perfect line at impact.

    Optimally the left hand is ahead of the center of the ball only 1/2 inch at impact.

    With standard modern teaching we are taught to palmar flex the left and hold it through impact.

    That does not work for the long irons as there is not enough enough loft to play with.
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  • GatorNate11GatorNate11 Members  3932WRX Points: 62Posts: 3,932 Titanium Tees
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    JOEGOLFWRX wrote:


    tell us the story gatornate11.



    re: the op, the old ball spun more = curved more + rose more. the new balls is straighter = if you want to optimize ball flight with a 1 iron now you got to hit it vary hard to spin it up, its an option for high swing speeds, for lower swing speeds the recovery wood makes more sense, (more loft and weight low and back).



    it was fairway woods hogan had trouble with when he went down a path of playing greater and greater over draws as his stock shot, pre-secret, of course he might of been taking divots with those woods too, dig the ball out of the older fairways.




    Not sure if it was intended as a wisecrack, but I'll post it never the less. The basic version is: A guy was working at I believe the USGA Museum. The 1 iron had to be taken to an event where they were having an on site mini museum set up. He met one of his buddies at a bar and began to tell him how he had Hogan's 1 iron, so that night they took it out to an old field, making sure it was clean of rocks, took some balls and began hitting the 1 iron. He then went in and cleaned it with a toothbrush in a way that would have made every WRX'er proud. The end. For the full story, check GD as it is on the last page.
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  • PKMillerJrPKMillerJr Members  841WRX Points: 0Posts: 841
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    Hogan's 1 iron was stolen. He eventually got it back. They were able to identify it by the consstent circular wear spot on one place on the face. One of the magazines did an article on it years ago.
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  • SquishSquish Members  944WRX Points: 55Posts: 944 Golden Tee
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #19
    Two stroke,



    If you want to hit the 0ne iron, pay close attention to the right elbow, keep it low into impact.

    Let the right humerus move with the torso, let the forearm work the club.

    Follow the clubhead.

    If you try to keep up with the clubhead or get ahead of it; your dead.
    Posted:
  • JOEGOLFWRXJOEGOLFWRX Members  1126WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,126
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    cheers, gator.
    Posted:
  • dapdap Members  2618WRX Points: 185Posts: 2,618 Titanium Tees
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    The question should be whether Hogan could hit a 1 iron that flies high enough to stop quickly on a fast green.He was not a high ball hitter so that would be debatable.Using it as a driving iron is totally different.



    Most pros today would be able to hit a 1 iron but why would you if you get better results with a hybrid?



    Tiger at his best could hit a 2 iron that soars 240+ yards and stop on a dime.His 2 iron would have the same loft as Hogan's 1 iron.I remember Tiger hiting his 2 iron past Nick Faldo's driver.
    Posted:
  • SquishSquish Members  944WRX Points: 55Posts: 944 Golden Tee
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    dap wrote:


    The question should be whether Hogan could hit a 1 iron that flies high enough to stop quickly on a fast green.He was not a high ball hitter so that would be debatable.Using it as a driving iron is totally different.



    Most pros today would be able to hit a 1 iron but why would you if you get better results with a hybrid?



    Tiger at his best could hit a 2 iron that soars 240+ yards and stop on a dime.His 2 iron would have the same loft as Hogan's 1 iron.I remember Tiger hiting his 2 iron past Nick Faldo's driver.




    I think Hogan could hit high or low, don't forget he was a shot maker and some say the best.



    I can hit the 2 iron high by keeping my swing the same, and playing the ball forward without changing my hands relative to the left hip position at address.

    This adds loft.

    I hit a 7* square face X stiff Long fiber driver, not because it's hard to, but because I out drive most of my competition sometimes 30 40 yards with the roll I get.

    When you out distance someone, they feel they have been beaten and try to swing harder and balloon those 9.5 10* whippy drivers.

    Plus it keeps me under the wind.



    A one iron is a good barometer for measuring how efficient ones swing is.



    As for Hogan; he released the head of the club, he was not holding it, unless he wanted to run one to the target delofting.
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  • GuiaGuia Members  8696WRX Points: 167Posts: 8,696 Titanium Tees
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    Squish: Thank you for the reply. I have never heard this statement before. +1 for your kind reply.
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  • StafferStaffer Members  325WRX Points: 0Posts: 325
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    I dont carry my ping 1 iron any more. In the last 2 years I have needed it in one round, but in that round it would have saved me 4-5 shots. There is nothing like a 1 iron when the wind is strong in you face or when you need a long cut into storm from the right.
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  • Pinsplitter59Pinsplitter59 Members  976WRX Points: 3Posts: 976 Golden Tee
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    my dearly beloved Tommy Armour 845 1 iron now rests in the garage.

    here in Aus back in the 70-80's many pros carried a Ping Eye 1 iron,

    they were very easy to hit but went too high for my liking.

    at the Aus Masters one year Greg Norman was warming up and some wag said "hey Greg show us a draw with a 1 iron".

    Norman got it out and hit the most pure 1 iron with a little draw you could ever wish to see.

    and his was a genuine blade and his woods were persimmon at that time.

    so if Norman could do it so easily why couldn't Hogan,

    and don't forget Nicklaus he had one too.
    Posted:
  • two stroketwo stroke Members  41WRX Points: 0Posts: 41
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2011 #26
    Squish wrote:

    Guia wrote:


    What does it mean? The secret is behind you in the sky! Lost me.




    Guia,



    That is the back toss.

    It is mentioned in the Colman video, when Ben's friend says; "See how he gets that club behind him, that's all I practice".

    That is the beginning of the release of the clubhead from the top to get the shaft to line up with the left arm at impact.

    The left hand goes into palmar flexion as a result of this action. Both forearms are supinating.

    The pivot is so quick that the release must start at the top with a clockwise rotation of the right forearm for the shaft to catch up to the left arm.

    The clubhead will release with ulna deviation through impact. But the start of that process was the backtoss or throwing of the club from the top.



    It is not casting as they state in the previous video..

    Casting is a premature unflexing of the right elbow.







    The reason a 1iron; The cleek or driving iron, is so hard to hit, is that one cannot be early or late at impact.

    One simply cannot drag a 1 or 2 iron through impact, one must release the clubhead with a flick.

    I feel that flick at the base of the right forefinger of the right hand.

    The left shoulder arm and club must be in a perfect line at impact.

    Optimally the left hand is ahead of the center of the ball only 1/2 inch at impact.

    With standard modern teaching we are taught to palmar flex the left and hold it through impact.

    That does not work for the long irons as there is not enough enough loft to play with.








    Sir Squish,



    Regarding Ben Hogan's technique, you mentioned "the Colman video." Would you be so kind as to elaborate on the whereabouts of this video?



    Based on the previous video link of Mike Austin in the skeleton leotard, one thing is for sure - Mike Austin can use a 1-iron.
    Posted:
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • hoganfan924hoganfan924 Members  5185WRX Points: 55Posts: 5,185 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  edited Jul 21, 2011 #27
    Coleman video:

    <iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/34GOeyjr0Uw?rel=0&quot; frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



    Some funny/interesting things in this video:



    When George Coleman tells Hogan "those shafts might be a little stiff for you." lol

    If you watch carefully, you can see the balls splash into the ocean

    George Coleman's back yard looks like it was a putting green (complete with holes)

    George's wife sounds sauced!

    Hogan's super slow motion swing (and the differences to his actual full speed move) and the fact that he actually did super slow motion training decades before it became popular.

    The grip part is the best part IMO (especially the part about lag pressure and the pressure points in the hands).
    Posted:
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  • SquishSquish Members  944WRX Points: 55Posts: 944 Golden Tee
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    Check this out, pretty good quality in full screen.





    http://www.thoughtequity.com/video/clip/3312663338_****.do?keywords=golf
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  • eightironeightiron Banned  3136WRX Points: 0Posts: 3,136
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    two stroke wrote:


    I wonder if Ben Hogan could stroke a 1-iron?



    The secret's in the dirt. Bah.



    The secret is behind you.



    In the sky.




    Short answer would be No , the secret is not behind him with the back tosser move , if anything this was a move Hogan eliminated from his earlier career . This move is another mike austin component more compatible with austins across the line shaft at top and his backing out move , maybe some goat hump with a flip to square the face more ( aka the back toss)
    Posted:
  • JD3JD3 Members  5055WRX Points: 402Posts: 5,055 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  edited Jul 22, 2011 #30
    More like salad tosser. It's to the point I cringe every time someone posts an Austin swing. His handsy/flippy/stally/early extension motion seriously makes me ill. He hung his whole career on a high elevation / near hurricane downwind tee shot that cut the dog leg. come on folks, seriously now
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  • sgcoelnfd1sgcoelnfd1 Members  291WRX Points: 0Posts: 291
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    A friend gave me a Hogan Medallion 1 iron with a #4 shaft and original grip. The club itself dates to 1971, which means it is similar to the one Hogan played at Merion, except his would have had a #5 (x-stiff shaft). Even the #4 shaft is quite stiff. The club is almost impossible to miss left and even with v-grooves it spins pretty well. A modern 3 iron would probably fly as far but the pleasure of hitting the modern club couldn't possibly measure up. image/man_in_love.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':man_in_love:' />
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