Rors: the modern era's Hogan?

You have to admit, he's on a 'roll'. His swing is pretty flawless, aside from his post-impact goat-hump/release. I do see a similar forward press to Hogan's swing. I think everyone can benefit from that f.press regardless of swing theory. Like a 'meeting ground' for both sides(arms) of the swing.

What 'Hogan' feautures do you guys see in Rory's swing?

Not even are there hats similar.

They are both right handed and wear nice slacks.

[quote name='aceyducey' timestamp='1347336443' post='5621307']
They are both right handed and wear nice slacks.
[/quote]

FAIL, HOGAN WAS LEFT-HANDED. TRY AGAIN

Actually Hogan was right handed. The first golf club he ever got was given to him by one of the members he caddied for I think. It was a left handed club. It's all he had at first. Eventually he got a right handed club and the rest is history!

For long term consistency, I'd like to see Rory stop stalling his hips and stop flipping his wrists. It's hard to mess with a successful tour player's swing though. Jbomb, your swing looks more like Hogan's than McIlroy's. BTW, which island are you on?

[quote name='JBOMB808' timestamp='1347336889' post='5621337']
[quote name='aceyducey' timestamp='1347336443' post='5621307']
They are both right handed and wear nice slacks.
[/quote]

FAIL, HOGAN WAS LEFT-HANDED. TRY AGAIN
[/quote]

Hogan was right-handed.

You're posts are always fascinating sprawling wacked out messes and I mean that in the best way.

Yes I suppose I can see your point. But does he measure up to Moe Norman?

[quote name='chiva' timestamp='1347343720' post='5621639']
For long term consistency, I'd like to see Rory stop stalling his hips and stop flipping his wrists. It's hard to mess with a successful tour player's swing though. Jbomb, your swing looks more like Hogan's than McIlroy's. BTW, which island are you on?
[/quote]

Thanks chiva! Means to a lot for someone, let alone anyone to see even a hint of Hogan in my swing. I'm just chiming in on Rory being on top and with a swing that is 'supposedly' the -best swing in modern golf-.

~Oahu ftw!~

[quote name='SurfinTurf' timestamp='1347345313' post='5621685']
You're posts are always fascinating sprawling wacked out messes and I mean that in the best way.

Yes I suppose I can see your point. But does he measure up to Moe Norman?
[/quote]

Yup, I always like to stir the pot and get the convo/contro going, but come on......the kid won ANOTHER major AND 2 tournaments in a row, with Tiger and the best of the best playing! There's got to be a reason for this type of consistency.

As far as Moe surfinturf, that's tough, because as stated numerous times before, Moe never won a PGA tournament.

Rory won 2 majors and is [i]younger[/i] than Tiger when Tiger got 2 under his belt. A big IF - Rory were to make one small tweak to JUST his release, we'd see a lot more Hogan and maybe even [u]more[/u] winning.

At least Rory is still part of this set of players I use to show for impact

Thanks TeeAce! I was going to show a picture, but you beat me to it.

[quote name='chiva' timestamp='1347343469' post='5621623']
Actually Hogan was right handed. The first golf club he ever got was given to him by one of the members he caddied for I think. It was a left handed club. It's all he had at first. Eventually he got a right handed club and the rest is history!
[/quote]

I could of sworn 5L says it, I can't quote a specific page, but wiki states...
[color=#000000][size=3]
Many believed that although he played right-handed as an adult, Hogan was actually left-handed. In his book "Five Lessons," in the chapter entitled "The Grip," Hogan said "I was born left-handed -- that was the normal way for me to do things. I was switched over to doing things right-handed when I was a boy but I started golf as a left-hander because the first club I ever came into possession of, an old five-iron, was a left-handed stick." This belief also seemed to be corroborated by Hogan himself in his earlier book "Power Golf." However, some mystery still remains about this since Hogan in subsequent interviews said that the belief of him being left-handed was actually a myth (noted in what was probably his last video interview and in his 1987 [i]Golf Magazine[/i] interview).[/size][/color]

[quote name='JBOMB808' timestamp='1347348163' post='5621729']
[quote name='chiva' timestamp='1347343469' post='5621623']
Actually Hogan was right handed. The first golf club he ever got was given to him by one of the members he caddied for I think. It was a left handed club. It's all he had at first. Eventually he got a right handed club and the rest is history!
[/quote]

I could of sworn 5L says it, I can't quote a specific page, but wiki states...

[color=#000000][size=3]Many believed that although he played right-handed as an adult, Hogan was actually left-handed. In his book "Five Lessons," in the chapter entitled "The Grip," Hogan said "I was born left-handed -- that was the normal way for me to do things. I was switched over to doing things right-handed when I was a boy but I started golf as a left-hander because the first club I ever came into possession of, an old five-iron, was a left-handed stick." This belief also seemed to be corroborated by Hogan himself in his earlier book "Power Golf." However, some mystery still remains about this since Hogan in subsequent interviews said that the belief of him being left-handed was actually a myth (noted in what was probably his last video interview and in his 1987 [i]Golf Magazine[/i] interview).[/size][/color]
[/quote]

I remember older people told that at least in my country being left-handed was kind of "fault" at that era. I remember my grandmom told me that she was born left-handed, but when she went to school they just pushed her to use her right for writing etc. so they really changed that and learned to be right-handed. I don't know if this was the case in US or if that was the case with Hogan, but can be one explanation for opposite informations. At least there is so many photos of him using his right hand for writing and many other things like that, that it proves something.

Hogan was right handed.

That description is just another fact that Herb Wind messed up... like the 2-iron at Merion, Hogan writing notes after the round, etc.

Nobody knew the series in SI to help folks break 80 would be the best selling golf book of all time and be dissected for 60+ years thereafter.

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1347371813' post='5622609']
Hogan was right handed.

That description is just another fact that Herb Wind messed up... like the 2-iron at Merion, Hogan writing notes after the round, etc.

Nobody knew the series in SI to help folks break 80 would be the best selling golf book of all time and be dissected for 60+ years thereafter.
[/quote]

I think I was right with my post. He really says he was born left handed, (just like my grandmom) He continues: I was switched over to doing things right-handed when I was a boy....

So I think it was global thing that being left-handed was not acceptable and they twisted everyone to that model. That's why he wrote notes etc. with his right hand as an adult.

I stand corrected.

Rory flips too much to be like hogan...among other things.

Tapio - you might be reading too much into the mistake by Wind. Really.

[color=#000000][left][background=#ffffff]
[b]GOLF:[/b] You were a natural left-hander who took up the game right-handed, weren't you?

[b]HOGAN:[/b] [b]No, that's one of those things that's always been written, but it's an absolute myth.[/b] The truth is, the first golf club I owned was an old left-handed, wooden-shafted, rib-faced mashie that a fellow gave me, and that's the club I was weaned on. During the mornings we caddies would bang the ball up and down the practice field until the members arrived and it was time to go to work. So I did all that formative practice left-handed. But [b]I'm a natural right-hander.[/b]

Golf Magazine, September 1987.[/background][/left][/color]

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1347382084' post='5623587']
Tapio - you might be reading too much into the mistake by Wind. Really.

[left]
[b]GOLF:[/b] You were a natural left-hander who took up the game right-handed, weren't you?

[b]HOGAN:[/b] [b]No, that's one of those things that's always been written, but it's an absolute myth.[/b] The truth is, the first golf club I owned was an old left-handed, wooden-shafted, rib-faced mashie that a fellow gave me, and that's the club I was weaned on. During the mornings we caddies would bang the ball up and down the practice field until the members arrived and it was time to go to work. So I did all that formative practice left-handed. But [b]I'm a natural right-hander.[/b]

Golf Magazine, September 1987.[/left]

[/quote]


Right-handed in golf and right-handed person can be totally different case. Most of the left-handed people I know play right-handed.

I dont see any paradox between those two claims, just different meaning for "handed"

Come on, man.

[url="http://images.google.com/hosted/life/d7c988235fae51b9.html"]http://images.google.com/hosted/life/d7c988235fae51b9.html[/url]

1. The only similarity I see between Hogan and McIlroy is that they are both "body-swingers"...beyond that, not much else.

2. McIlroy's swing isn't "perfect". He has a tendency to "slot" the club (hands drop vertically) on the downswing. A move that introduces an element of timing into his swing, that can cause him to hit the ball left when he's off his game. This quirk helped lead to the meltdown at the Master, and is part of the reason why he's a bit of a streaky player.

3. McIlroy's game reminds me more of the one David Duval had at the height of HIS game. Like McIlroy, Duval (ca. 1999) was a very accurate, body-swinging power-player who had the ability to absolutely demolish a golf course when he was playing well. When he shot that 59 at the Bob Hope in '99, (IIRC), he didn't have to make a putt longer than about 15ft. the whole day.

I anticipate that McIlroy will go on to have the kind of career that people hoped to have seen from Duval.

[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1347383965' post='5623759']
Come on, man.

[url="http://images.google.com/hosted/life/d7c988235fae51b9.html"]http://images.google...235fae51b9.html[/url]
[/quote]

Did you read at all what I told you? All left-handed kids turned to be right handed at school here at beginning of 20th century. They had to learn to write and do other things by their right hand as being left-handed was not accepted.

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1347388296' post='5624113']
[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1347383965' post='5623759']
Come on, man.

[url="http://images.google.com/hosted/life/d7c988235fae51b9.html"]http://images.google...235fae51b9.html[/url]
[/quote]

Did you read at all what I told you? All left-handed kids turned to be right handed at school here at beginning of 20th century. They had to learn to write and do other things by their right hand as being left-handed was not accepted.
[/quote]

Hogan was from Finland?

Yep, and had 4D video analysis even though electricity hadnt reached his area yet

[quote name='kellygreen' timestamp='1347384005' post='5623761']
1. The only similarity I see between Hogan and McIlroy is that they are both "body-swingers"...beyond that, not much else.

2. McIlroy's swing isn't "perfect". He has a tendency to "slot" the club (hands drop vertically) on the downswing. A move that introduces an element of timing into his swing, that can cause him to hit the ball left when he's off his game. This quirk helped lead to the meltdown at the Master, and is part of the reason why he's a bit of a streaky player.

3. McIlroy's game reminds me more of the one David Duval had at the height of HIS game. Like McIlroy, Duval (ca. 1999) was a very accurate, body-swinging power-player who had the ability to absolutely demolish a golf course when he was playing well. When he shot that 59 at the Bob Hope in '99, (IIRC), he didn't have to make a putt longer than about 15ft. the whole day.

I anticipate that McIlroy will go on to have the kind of career that people hoped to have seen from Duval.
[/quote]
Provided he doesn't lose interest in being great like Duval did. I don't see it, but we said the same about Duval as well.

[quote name='kellygreen' timestamp='1347384005' post='5623761']
1. The only similarity I see between Hogan and McIlroy is that they are both "body-swingers"...beyond that, not much else.

2. McIlroy's swing isn't "perfect". He has a tendency to "slot" the club (hands drop vertically) on the downswing. A move that introduces an element of timing into his swing, that can cause him to hit the ball left when he's off his game. This quirk helped lead to the meltdown at the Master, and is part of the reason why he's a bit of a streaky player.

3. McIlroy's game reminds me more of the one David Duval had at the height of HIS game. Like McIlroy, Duval (ca. 1999) was a very accurate, body-swinging power-player who had the ability to absolutely demolish a golf course when he was playing well. When he shot that 59 at the Bob Hope in '99, (IIRC), he didn't have to make a putt longer than about 15ft. the whole day.

I anticipate that McIlroy will go on to have the kind of career that people hoped to have seen from Duval.
[/quote]

I like the comparison to Duval. The 'body swinging' I think is the most important aspect though. It really allows Rory to dial in distances especially with his wedges. Hogan called his wedge the 'equalizer'. With Rory bombing it off the tee, the wedge is his #1 weapon. Watch his wedge swing and you see a different release.

[quote name='KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE' timestamp='1347388801' post='5624157']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1347388296' post='5624113']
[quote name='drewspin' timestamp='1347383965' post='5623759']
Come on, man.

[url="http://images.google.com/hosted/life/d7c988235fae51b9.html"]http://images.google...235fae51b9.html[/url]
[/quote]

Did you read at all what I told you? All left-handed kids turned to be right handed at school here at beginning of 20th century. They had to learn to write and do other things by their right hand as being left-handed was not accepted.
[/quote]

Hogan was from Finland?
[/quote]N

Nope, as well these people are not

http://www.anythinglefthanded.co.uk/changing-left-to-right.html

Somehow in 5L he says just what I wrote here and I think that's pretty logical explanation

[quote name='kellygreen' timestamp='1347384005' post='5623761']
1. The only similarity I see between Hogan and McIlroy is that they are both "body-swingers"...beyond that, not much else.

2. [color=#b22222][b]McIlroy's swing isn't "perfect". He has a tendency to "slot" the club (hands drop vertically) on the downswing. A move that introduces an element of timing into his swing, that can cause him to hit the ball left when he's off his game. This quirk helped lead to the meltdown at the Master, and is part of the reason why he's a bit of a streaky player.[/b][/color]

3. McIlroy's game reminds me more of the one David Duval had at the height of HIS game. Like McIlroy, Duval (ca. 1999) was a very accurate, body-swinging power-player who had the ability to absolutely demolish a golf course when he was playing well. When he shot that 59 at the Bob Hope in '99, (IIRC), he didn't have to make a putt longer than about 15ft. the whole day.

I anticipate that McIlroy will go on to have the kind of career that people hoped to have seen from Duval.
[/quote]

Kelly, I usually agree with you on discussions about the golf swing, but I'm not so sure I agree with the statement bolded in red above. I don't think it is the Rory's slotting that causes his issues. Granted, I do think that when he gets screwed up it is mostly timing related, but I think that is due more to his unique hip counter-rotation move than it is the slotting. Rory turns really hard then kind of pauses his pivot, gathers everything up as he counter rotates his hips, then fires all the way through again to the end. I think this is where the timing issues arise, but the move is unique to him and I wouldn't change it, as I think it contributes to his speed/power.

Let's face it, all swings require an element of timing. I think that once a player has a down swing "slotting-move" grooved, it's no harder to re-produce than a player who re-traces his BS plane on the DS. In fact, I think for some it actually helps them in transition as they feel the shallowing drop as a trigger. Players who stall their pivot or who do not have their arm swing synched-up with their core pivot tend to have issues with timing their release, which can lead to inconsistency.

Back on topic, I think Rory, like Hogan, has a powerful rotatry element to his swing, but does not release the club like Hogan on anything but some short iron shots.

In the video of Rory above, check out his belt buckle at around 45-47 and you will see the hip stall, counter-rotation, then the re-acceleration. Nothing like Hogan, or Duval for that matter. Those guys burned all the way through to the end aggressively without ever stalling out.

[quote name='dpb5031' timestamp='1347391941' post='5624465']
Kelly, I usually agree with you on discussions about the golf swing, but I'm not so sure I agree with the statement bolded in red above. I don't think it is the Rory's slotting that causes his issues. Granted, I do think that when he gets screwed up it is mostly timing related, but I think that is due more to his unique hip counter-rotation move than it is the slotting. Rory turns really hard then kind of pauses his pivot, gathers everything up as he counter rotates his hips, then fires all the way through again to the end. I think this is where the timing issues arise, but the move is unique to him and I wouldn't change it, as I think it contributes to his speed/power.

Let's face it, all swings require an element of timing. I think that once a player has a down swing "slotting-move" grooved, it's no harder to re-produce than a player who re-traces his BS plane on the DS. In fact, I think for some it actually helps them in transition as they feel the shallowing drop as a trigger. Players who stall their pivot or who do not have their arm swing synched-up with their core pivot tend to have issues with timing their release, which can lead to inconsistency.

Back on topic, I think Rory, like Hogan, has a powerful rotatry element to his swing, but does not release the club like Hogan on anything but some short iron shots.
[/quote]

Six of one, half-a-dozen of another....

We're both talking about the same move. I'm pointing out the beginning of it...and you are pointing out what it results in through the hitting area.

Bottomline is that Rory shouldn't really have either of these in his swing. As result he gets the club slightly "stuck" behind him on the downswing, and then has to slow his pivot slightly through the hitting area in order to allow his arms to release past his body in order to square the clubface.

It's a slight mistake, and he's a good enough athlete that it doesn't cause major directional problems. But the fact that its there reduces his level of consistency.

As far as the slotting move goes not being harder to reproduce, imo, that depends on where the "motor of the swing" is for a particular player. If the player is more of a "hand-and-arm"/two-plane swinger like a Fred Couples or Phil Mickelson, I agree. But for a body-rotation swinger that slotting move can cause real directional problems when the player's timing is off. If you look at David Duval's swing from when he was playing his best golf...to today when he struggles to make cuts....one of the big differences is a (much bigger than McIlroy's) slotting move that has crept into his swing.