rating and slope accuracy

For the courses you play, how accurate do you think the rating and slope are? For example. the 2 courses I mainly play are:

Oakland Metropolitan

6,529 yards

71.8 / 128

TPC Harding Park

6,405 yards

71.1 / 122

I consistently score better (4-6 strokes) at Metro even though base on the rating and slope I should be scoring better at Harding. I don't think it's a matter of one layout fitting my eye better or my shot shape better. Metro has softer, more receptive greens and virtually no rough, so I can't understand how it's rated more difficult. I also think Harding actually plays longer than Metro because of the cold, damp conditions.

I've heard it costs golf courses $$$ to have the USGA do rating/slope, so maybe these figures are just out of date? Base on the courses you play, do you think ratings and slopes are accurate (relative to each other)?

Most of the time i think the courses i play are fairly accurate. Sometimes it just comes down to personal preference. There's a course around here that i like to call the handicap reducer. It's a 136 slope or something and plays 7000yds, but all of the trouble is on the right (my miss is left) and the fairways are fairly big and the greens fairly flat. I can shoot 76 there in my sleep. For some people it would be really tough because of the length or because they miss right

sometimes a course just fits you better

I moved three years ago and immediately thought they rated the courses wrong in my new location as they play much harder than there rating so I did a little digging and found how the process works, dig around on USGA website and read how it all works. Being a bogie golfer I believe some of standards used leave it open to some pretty big variables if you don't play to the standards they use for the average bogie golfer. I now understand why the new to me courses play much harder for me than the slope would indicate. Definitely not a perfect system but not sure improvement is possible with out a lot more expense. My handicap has risen even though I have improved playing more golf in my new home, definitely score much better when I go back for visits to my old home area, overall my handicap travels much better so.

I have seen the paperwork they use for determining slope and rating for golf courses. There is a ton that goes into it (4 pages if i remember correctly). Goes from carries off of tees, to how wide the landing areas are. To ob/bunkers. What your visuals are off the tee. From the approach to the green side. IT is nuts.

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1355105297' post='6044215']
Most of the time i think the courses i play are fairly accurate. Sometimes it just comes down to personal preference. There's a course around here that i like to call the handicap reducer. It's a 136 slope or something and plays 7000yds, but all of the trouble is on the right (my miss is left) and the fairways are fairly big and the greens fairly flat. I can shoot 76 there in my sleep. For some people it would be really tough because of the length or because they miss right

sometimes a course just fits you better
[/quote]

I agree, long wide open courses play to my strengh, but on very tight, short, "hallways" lined with OB's, my wife will beat met. But the CR / Slope does take into account length.

I think the system works as well as any system possibly could. I also think a course that is consistently mucky-wet versus one that often plays firmer is a total blind-spot in the rating process. I doubt they have an explicit set of adjustment factors in their formulas and I also doubt that the rating panels include very many guys who generally hit the ball 210 yards off the tee including 40 yards of rollout.

My home course plays fairly true to its ratings except for the fact that there's a certain distance off the tee where at least half the Par 4 and Par 5 fairways have big ridges running across them just past where I can hit my tee shot (from the normal men's tees). In firm conditions a good drive will bounce up and over the ridges quite often. During the winter when it is wet, those holes just play ridiculously long. Someone who hits their drives 15 yards farther than me has a half-shot advantage on those holes.

There's no way a rating system can capture that kind of "mis-fit" between conditions and your game. But I can only imagine if we played 12 months a year in the kind of mucky conditions that are normal in February. My handicap from the white tees would go up three or four strokes, easily.

[quote name='jdhallissey' timestamp='1355105725' post='6044265']
I have seen the paperwork they use for determining slope and rating for golf courses. There is a ton that goes into it (4 pages if i remember correctly). Goes from carries off of tees, to how wide the landing areas are. To ob/bunkers. What your visuals are off the tee. From the approach to the green side. IT is nuts.
[/quote] Management has to close the course being rated as they go through the "process". Last year I agreed to go out with the "Assessors" and that was the longest round I ever played.

Do they factor weather like wind into the calculation? I've played Kiawah, for example, with no wind and with 40 mph wind. Could be worth 10 strokes but not sure how that could be taken into account.

Its done by your local state golf associations not directly by the usga and not much cost involved.

See here is some info regarding ratings: http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Rule-13/

Here is a taste:

b. Yardage Rating

Yardage rating is the evaluation of the playing difficulty of a course based on effective playing length.

c. Obstacle Factors

Obstacle factors are hazards, natural features, vegetation, and playing conditions found on the golf course that make play harder or easier than a standard course with the same effective playing length.

d. Effective Playing Length

Effective playing length is the measured length of the golf course adjusted by factors such as unusual roll, elevation changes, dogleg/forced lay up, prevailing wind, and altitude above sea level that make the course play longer or shorter than its measured length. For example, when forced lay ups result in a course playing effectively longer for the scratch golfer, the rating team modifies the yardage rating upward to arrive at the USGA Course Rating.

I do know that they have made adjustments to the formula in the past.

Courses are usually re-rated every few years or if significant changes have been made.

Some associations charge for the service, for others it is included. (The assoc. money comes in fees paid by the courses and through individuals via the handicap service charge.)

There are a few courses in the vegas area that the rating/slope is too high for the course. The only reason its rated so high is because of the yardage being more than 7000. Spending the summer in colorado most courses were 73 rating from the back and played the same difficulty as the courses in vegas rated 75/76.

There is a course I frequent that is ~67/70 slope 110. Few hazards but the rough will kill you. It is fairway straight to this nasty step on the ball type rough.In the spring, I lose and find several balls per round not a foot off the fairway. I wonder if the course is rated under these conditions.

My wife actually rates courses for the USGA. It is a part time, unpaid activity for a given region (at least for the volunteers), but she does get some free golf. She has plenty of binders describing the process steps etc and it seems to be a rather thorough, time consuming activity. I have never bothered to look at the binders but maybe I will now. If I ask her directly, I lose my credibility as a know it all.....