Jump to content

R5 TP dual


Recommended Posts

retail vs. tour issue
question for the TaylorMade fans (I'm a titleist guy and plead the 5th)...is the R5 Dual TP version that is available via retail a different head than the tour issued R5 Dual TP? I realize there are big differences w/ the tour issue in the other TM heads, but was never sure of the "TP" designation on the retail models. Is this the same head? :idhitit:
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 38
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

question for the TaylorMade fans (I'm a titleist guy and plead the 5th)...is the R5 Dual TP version that is available via retail a different head than the tour issued R5 Dual TP?  I realize there are big differences w/ the tour issue in the other TM heads, but was never sure of the "TP" designation on the retail models.  Is this the same head?  :idhitit:

46448[/snapback]

 

The TP and Tour issue should be the same. The tour issue might get adjucted according to the tour players.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

According the the usga's new conforming list, there's only one r5 tour/TP that's conforming, so it's safe to gather a guess that they're the same heads. That's not to say they'll feel or look different as CB pointed out, due to headweighting, face angles, etc., but they come from the factory the same.

Aerojet LS 

STG   

Pro Fli Hi 

223 4-P 

T5 50

T22 56 & 60   

004

Link to comment
Share on other sites

According the the usga's new conforming list, there's only one r5 tour/TP that's conforming, so it's safe to gather a guess that they're the same heads.  That's not to say they'll feel or look different as CB pointed out, due to headweighting, face angles, etc., but they come from the factory the same.

47853[/snapback]

Ever since the establishment of the "Conforming Driver List," I have been waiting for information like that. How did you get a chance to see the list? Has the USGA posted it? Is the list conclusive and all-inclusive, like the ball list? Because I had understood that the manufacturers could, if they chose, ask for certain models to be not listed. Still, if that were the case, I would think that they'd require some small distinguishing mark, as with golf balls in development. (For example, the variations on Nike Ones and Titleist Pro-V's, in which there are "x", "=", "+", "Gold", "Silver", "Platinum", etc., versions, just to provide distinctions for testing identification.) And you don't see that on Taylor Made tour drivers, with the notable exception of Tour serial numbers.

 

Not that tour drivers have ever been thought to be non-conforming as a whole. (Forget about exceptional cases.)

 

So, tickyboy's point is well taken. The USGA Conforming Driver List could be the beginning of the end of the "Tour versus TP" debate.

 

I'd really like to see more vigorous and informed discussion of this.

 

Tickyboy, where did you see that "conforming" listing for the R5 TP? The more you think about it, the more this becomes an argument in a vacuum, sort of like proving a negative. We KNOW the retail R5 TP is a conforming driver. And we also know that, serial numbers aside, a tour-van R5 with TP markings is identical in basic appearance to the retail club. So, does that prove that they are functionally the same club for testing purposes?

 

Maybe!

48139[/snapback]

 

The list is on their website. It only lists the r5 N and D, and an r5 tour as conforming in RH. It's interesting to see that they list different versions of other clubs (300 tour and r7) but not r5. Must be the same then.

Aerojet LS 

STG   

Pro Fli Hi 

223 4-P 

T5 50

T22 56 & 60   

004

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's not what other board owners/moderators say.  How do you handle such situations?  Nothing like a good tour v. Retail debate to get the blood flowing.

49257[/snapback]

 

This should not get into what another person on another board says "debate". The question was asked and answered by a TM Official. People will have opinions and the Manufacturer will state what the company standpoint is. We can have a civil discussion without stirring the mud.

 

Are their Tour only models?

Have their been limited number of protos of a particular model made?

In general is the TP line the same as its Tour counterpart.

 

Unless actual evidence is produce to contradict the manufacturer's statements, why wouldn't you believe them? Now that we have photos of most Tour only equipment, we can talk about those particular differences. I don't think you could prove or disprove material properties though.

 

Take a look at this thread that quoted Tom Wishon>>>Here

 

Gunmetal: (poster's name)

 

Some of this is true and some of it is the writer being susceptible to believing what he hears with no personal real experience to substantiate it. Also, there is no way you can assume this to be true with all the companies who work with tour players to play their clubs. Each pro is different in their needs and desires and the golf companies most definitely have to pattern what they do for each individual player to make them happy in the end, which means confident with the clubs.

 

The part about a different titanium on the faces can be true because you have some tour players who have a very high swing speed while others don;t. Since driver heads have moved to a much larger size, and with it, larger face areas, most all of the stock OEM Ti drivers today are made with 6/4 Titanium for the face because it is possible to get to an 0.830 COR with that grade of Ti. Also, 6/4 is cheaper than the higher grade Ti alloys like SP700, 10-2-3 Ti so for a production head, if you can make the COR 0.830 with a lower priced Ti alloy for the face, why spend the extra money to duplicate the Ti with what would be a thicker face made from one of the high grade Ti alloys.

 

It can happen where a tour player with a very high swing speed could hit so many balls with his driver that he "fatigues" the face - here would be one reason to use one of the higher grade Ti alloys in the face of the tour player's driver. On the other hand, they could always just give him another driver when one happens to start fatiguing. So there is no rule of thumb here. As long as the player's driver has to be 0.830 COR or lower, to get to that COR with a higher strength Ti alloy face like SP or 10-2-3 you have to make the face thicker than you would if you use 6/4 Ti. Thus the thickness increase of the higher grade ti allows for more hits before the face could begin to fatigue.

 

IT is common for the heads used by the tour players to have a different CG position than the heads made to be sold as stock clubs to the public. Remember, when a company signs a tour player they most definitely want him/her using their clubs. So if the player does not like something about the heads the company uses in the clubs, the company will go back to work to make up whatever the player wants. If they don;t, the player will just go play with something else. AND if that happens to be a different driver, well, that's a pretty marquee club in the bag so companies usually will make whatever they have to in order to get a head with their name on it in the player's bag.

 

If a company has been paying tour players to use their stuff for many years, they will begin to get a feel for what has to be changed in a head for what type of player demand, swing, etc. But yes, in the back rooms of the big OEMs are tons of different variations of this or that model which all have been made for this or that tour player's individual little desires for looks, flight, feel, you name it. These players can be really picky and since there is big competition for the name players between the big moneyed golf companies, most definitely if the tour player asks, the company does it to keep them happy.

 

On the groove thing, I have no personal experience with this on a tour level as I do with the ti and driver matter. I know that some of the companies will experiment with groove configurations because some of the tour players are nuts about that and the companies are always interested in trying to gain some edge over the competition. Again, none of this gets experimented with unless the player himself starts to bring it up. The word "no" does not exist when it comes to the OEMs who have extensive tour endorsement programs so there are many little R&D projects that go on behind the scenes all the time with these companies and some of the players they pay.

 

You have to first remember what causes spin and what causes more spin. Plain and simple three things - 1) the more friction between the ball and face, the higher the spin, 2) the higher the swing speed the greater the spin, 3) the less "foreign material" between the face and the ball, the greater the spin. Now you have to look at how this all shakes out for the tour player.

 

1) While it is now known that the edges of the lines are a contributor to friction between ball and face, the surface in between the lines is more important because it comprises a far greater area that comes in contact with the ball. So rougher blasting of the face, AND keeping that surface freshly blasted to be right at the USGA limit for face roughness is a must for maxing out spin. yes, there can be experiments made with the shape of the edges of the lines to add to this.

 

2) remember the tour players all have much higher swing speeds than the majority of regular golfers. And this remains so all the way through the bag. So a pro hitting a SW into a green will likely have a higher swing speed to hit that shot than you or I will. ANd more speed = more spin.

 

3) the fairway mowing of the tour courses is so much shorter than yours or my golf course that there is no way you or I will hit a shot that has no "foreign material" (namely, grass) that gets in between the ball and the face. I think I heard them say at the Masters this year that they mowed the fairways to 3/8" - go ask your greenskeeper what height he mows your fairways to and I would be shocked if that number was less than 3/4". The grass on regular courses cannot survive if mowed to 1/2" or less every day of the playing season so we all get more grass in between the ball and the face than the tour players ever do. This too is also where the precision of the tour player's swing plays a part - I would bet that every single tour player's divot starts well in front of the ball so this type of more steep descending blow also promotes getting less grass between the face and the ball.

 

As to a different production foundry for the tour player's heads than the ones sold in stores, I doubt that. It may have happened a few times because the big OEMs do keep relationships with many production foundries and could call on the one that will do things faster when they need something special made quickly. Not all foundries have separate small custom production departments, some do. Making something quick and with a totally different set of specs or grind or face treatment, etc is very hard to do as a foundry if you do not have a mini-production line set up just for that purpose. In addition, some of this may be done at the OEM, if over the years they have invested in setting up their own in house prototype production department. Again, each one is a little different in how they handle the "one off" requests they get from their tour players.

 

Hope this helps,

TOM

Before sending me a message for help, please look at the website support section:
Have a Ad/BST question, first look and post here:
BST AD Help
If you have a general help question, post here:
GolfWRX Website Help Desk

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still, I would beg TMaG to settle the "TP versus tour" debate once and for all...

49908[/snapback]

 

I don't know if it could ever be settled permanently. Nonetheless, I am looking into the best way to get out more detailed information. Stay tuned...

49928[/snapback]

 

No worries, just answer truthfully. If I had confidence (which I don't) that I could buy a tour issue Y-cutter wedge for example, with the exact same grooves, grinds and specs demanded by the tour players (with no modifications required) via a retail outlet, I would purchase it via retail outlet and save myself the hassle of having to hunt around to find one in a back alley somewhere...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still, I would beg TMaG to settle the "TP versus tour" debate once and for all...

49908[/snapback]

 

I don't know if it could ever be settled permanently. Nonetheless, I am looking into the best way to get out more detailed information. Stay tuned...

49928[/snapback]

 

No worries, just answer truthfully. If I had confidence (which I don't) that I could buy a tour issue Y-cutter wedge for example, with the exact same grooves, grinds and specs demanded by the tour players (with no modifications required) via a retail outlet, I would purchase it via retail outlet and save myself the hassle of having to hunt around to find one in a back alley somewhere...

53023[/snapback]

 

Speaking of which, can we put the Y-Cutter debate to rest too? Is it a special groove pattern, or is it a wedge made with a different cutting tool?

 

TMAG, we appreciate the efforts and it will be cool to get a "more" authoritative/definitive statement as sometimes requested. Personally, I was already convinced when the the TP line was announced/released. But I gave up fighting the uphill battle convincing others when their wallets got in the way of their better judgements.

 

Having a "tour issue" club once belonging to a PGA Tour member has its appeal, it just sounds cool. But what is even cooler is that TM raised the bar and created at entire premium line of products just like you find on tour. Other OEMs claim there is no need to do this as the products are the same, but very few can pull off that trick. (Maybe Bridgestone/Tourstage?). At least someone put their money where their mouth is and embraces the concept rather than hide. Good job!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still, I would beg TMaG to settle the "TP versus tour" debate once and for all...

49908[/snapback]

 

I don't know if it could ever be settled permanently. Nonetheless, I am looking into the best way to get out more detailed information. Stay tuned...

49928[/snapback]

 

No worries, just answer truthfully. If I had confidence (which I don't) that I could buy a tour issue Y-cutter wedge for example, with the exact same grooves, grinds and specs demanded by the tour players (with no modifications required) via a retail outlet, I would purchase it via retail outlet and save myself the hassle of having to hunt around to find one in a back alley somewhere...

53023[/snapback]

 

Well then, I would recommend you find your local TaylorMade retailer and pick up a new rac TP Black wedge.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still, I would beg TMaG to settle the "TP versus tour" debate once and for all...

49908[/snapback]

 

I don't know if it could ever be settled permanently. Nonetheless, I am looking into the best way to get out more detailed information. Stay tuned...

49928[/snapback]

 

No worries, just answer truthfully. If I had confidence (which I don't) that I could buy a tour issue Y-cutter wedge for example, with the exact same grooves, grinds and specs demanded by the tour players (with no modifications required) via a retail outlet, I would purchase it via retail outlet and save myself the hassle of having to hunt around to find one in a back alley somewhere...

53023[/snapback]

 

Speaking of which, can we put the Y-Cutter debate to rest too? Is it a special groove pattern, or is it a wedge made with a different cutting tool?

 

TMAG, we appreciate the efforts and it will be cool to get a "more" authoritative/definitive statement as sometimes requested. Personally, I was already convinced when the the TP line was announced/released. But I gave up fighting the uphill battle convincing others when their wallets got in the way of their better judgements.

 

Having a "tour issue" club once belonging to a PGA Tour member has its appeal, it just sounds cool. But what is even cooler is that TM raised the bar and created at entire premium line of products just like you find on tour. Other OEMs claim there is no need to do this as the products are the same, but very few can pull off that trick. (Maybe Bridgestone/Tourstage?). At least someone put their money where their mouth is and embraces the concept rather than hide. Good job!

53079[/snapback]

 

The Y Groove is a specific type of groove -- iteriation "Y" in as we tried new grooves.

 

And I am always working to get more information on the whats and whys of our tour players' clubs. I am putting together a plan for next year to get that kind of detail on a regular basis.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Y Groove is a specific type of groove -- iteriation "Y" in as we tried new grooves.

 

And I am always working to get more information on the whats and whys of our tour players' clubs. I am putting together a plan for next year to get that kind of detail on a regular basis.

53092[/snapback]

 

Tmag...I'm sure you can understand that serious golfers want access to the best equipment in the world too, but have to weed through marketing hype and consumer red-tape on a daily basis. We look forward to continuing this thread. :drinks:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hope I'm not thread jacking here. I thought these questions are in the neighborhood of what the thread was about.

 

TMag,

I have a question regarding tolerances between head lofts and degrees open or closed. One, How often are heads actually the same lofts as designated on the head? Are there times when a 10.5 might be at a 10 or a 9.5 at a 10? With that answered, I would like to know the differences between the R5 N and the R5tp also with the R7 and the R7TP. Is it possible to find a R5N with an actual square face? Could there be TP's with slightly closed faces? Thanks, G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hope I'm not thread jacking here.  I thought these questions are in the neighborhood of what the thread was about. 

 

TMag,

I have a question regarding tolerances between head lofts and degrees open or closed.  One, How often are heads actually the same lofts as designated on the head?  Are there times when a 10.5 might be at a 10 or a 9.5 at a 10?  With that answered, I would like to know the differences between the R5 N and the R5tp also with the R7 and the R7TP.  Is it possible to find a R5N with an actual square face?  Could there be TP's with slightly closed faces?  Thanks,  G

53496[/snapback]

 

Yes, it is possible that a 10.5 head won't be axactly 10.5 degrees of loft, and that a r5 N or TP will not have exactly a 0* face angle. I do not have the details on what the exact variation is that we allow in manufacturing, but it isn't very large. I hope this answers your question.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

they are "exactly" the same. the only difference between all the tour stuff i have gotten from Taylor Made & my buddies retail TP versions was my heads were 3* open as i requested & heavier heads, other than that i noticed no difference except the serial#'s on mine.

𝗦ᴜɴ𝗧ʀᴜsᴛ 𝗧ᴀᴍᴘᴀ 𝗕ᴀʏ 𝗣ʀᴏ/𝗔ᴍ 𝗣ʀᴏғᴇssɪᴏɴᴀʟ 𝗖ʜᴀᴍᴘɪᴏɴ (-𝟭𝟮/𝟮𝟬𝟭)

68A7239E-AAC2-4873-AAB4-79AB07381822.png.1162e21eb149e0d7ca8526c3ec552f4c.png

DRIVER: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ 𝗤𝗶𝟭𝟬 𝗟𝗦 𝟴° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗚𝗞 𝗫𝗫

3 WOOD: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ 𝗤𝗶𝟭𝟬 𝟭𝟰.𝟱° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗙𝗪 𝗦ᴇᴠᴇɴ 𝗫

5 WOOD: 𝗖ᴏʙʀᴀ 𝗥ᴀᴅ𝗦ᴘᴇᴇᴅ 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝟭𝟵° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗙𝗪 𝗦ᴇᴠᴇɴ 𝗫

IRONS: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ ᴘ𝟳𝟱𝟬 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏ 𝟯ɪ 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗛ʏʙʀɪᴅ 𝟭𝟬𝟬 𝗫,𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ ᴘ𝟳𝟱𝟬 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏ 𝟰ɪ/ᴘ𝟳ᴛᴡ 𝟱ɪ-𝗣𝗪 𝗡ɪᴘᴘᴏɴ 𝗡.𝗦. 𝗣ʀᴏ 𝗠ᴏᴅᴜs 𝟭𝟬𝟱 𝗫

WEDGES: 𝗧ɪᴛʟᴇɪsᴛ 𝗩ᴏᴋᴇʏ 𝗦𝗠𝟭𝟬 𝟱𝟰°𝗙 𝗥ᴀᴡ/𝗧ɪᴛʟᴇɪsᴛ 𝗩ᴏᴋᴇʏ 𝗦𝗠𝟵 𝟱𝟴°𝗩 𝗥ᴀᴡ 𝗡ɪᴘᴘᴏɴ 𝗡.𝗦. 𝗣ʀᴏ 𝗠ᴏᴅᴜs 𝟭𝟮𝟬 𝗫

PUTTER: 𝗕ʏʀᴏɴ 𝗠ᴏʀɢᴀɴ 𝗗𝗛𝟴𝟵 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗪ᴇʟᴅᴇᴅ 𝗙ʟᴏᴡ 𝗡ᴇᴄᴋ 𝟯𝘅 𝗕ʟᴀᴄᴋ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I ask because I dont think there is a difference with any of the R5 or R7's except for face angle. Obviously the R5's dont have removable weights like the R5TP but other than that I see no difference. I have heard the tollerances are around +/- .4 degrees but I have a retail R5 9.5 that sets up 1 degree open and is at 9 degrees of loft. I think TM should have a retail tour department that club pros could order specific loft and face angles for any of their members for a nominal fee. Just a thought. I also want to add that playing a club that is 1 degree open has opened my eyes to another factor in club purchases. I always thought it was funny how 2 visually identical clubs can play so different. .2 or .3 degrees open significantly changes a clubs performance. Peace, G :drinks:

 

P.S. Whats up Jonny Hom? You been playin much? Grant

Link to comment
Share on other sites

CBWrxr, I agree with what your saying. My whole theory here is that any club head can be made to perform like anything else. The only difficult change would be loft and face closure. Sure each can be manipulated, but wont one effect the other. As far as head weight, cog and heel and toe weighting are concerned each can be played with to get whatever weight is requested. The bottom line is that all the R7 and R5 heads are almost identical, stock or TP. The only difference is face angle and lofts, oh and a pretty flag on the toe. OK, now I fell better. :drinks: Good topic here! G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good conversation. :clapping: In my generalization of TM clubs, I meant stock as the non TP clubs, R7 quad and HT, R5D or R5N. I am more familiar with TM's brands and logos than 99.9% of the people on this board. My whole goal isn't to bash TM, hell no. :clapping: I am trying to say that all the clubs are the same. Difference being face angles. I know you had listed hosel size as a major difference but I would have to politely disagree. Yes, they are different but playing characteristics could change with whatever shaft is installed. IMHO the R5N and D are identical to the TP once the stationary weights are removed, I have done it. COG can be changed by adding rat glue to different areas of the head. A person can have the face angles changed to most anything they want if need be. Hypothetically, If I wanted a R5 with a square face and a Fuji rombax. I could simply find a square R5N and shim a Fuji into it. It could also be done with a TP except now you have 899.00 into the club compared to 599.00.

What I do have a bit of a gripe about is tolerances. I know for a fact (I cant say how I know) a person can get a R5N that is square or even open (I have one) and have a TP that is slightly closed. People are putting to much stock in the badge clubs come with. Yes, for the majority of "stock" TP heads, faces will be closer to square but you still have no absolute of getting one unless you measure each on the rack. Mail order you get what you get. You mentioned shafts. TP Shafts definitely increase the cost of the club and do separate themselves from stock shaft offerings but how many people are swapping them out for something else? All in all I'm a firm believer that one head is the same as the other. If it comes out with close to a square face its a TP If its slightly closed its an N and if its really closed it becomes a D. Theres lots of in betweens. I would say it probably depends more on how close the person on the line is to a lunch break. :drinks:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

CB, I have never noticed much difference with the N and the D and I deal with them more than I care to admit. :clapping: You could be correct on the different shapes. I'm kind of embarrassed :clapping: I have never looked. lol I have a couple of friends on some of the... Well lets say if a TM tech van is around, they may or may not, depending which van you catch, have a driver head bending machine in them. If you smooth talk some of the guys they may tweak a head for you to specs you want. You didn't here it from me. :yahoo:

Oh, and what do you think of having a custom order done on a club? Exact lofts and face angles? I know its being done on other websites but I'm wondering if it couldn't be offered from TM. Maybe through special accounts or current PGA club professionals. That way a person can get exactly what they want without having to search through racks and racks to find a certain club. Future clubs could be ordered the same. Again we are a very small percent of demanding golfers here on these sites, but what the heck, it would be a good idea. So often people try shafts at demo events and always think its the shaft when in reality it could be the clubhead being more closed or open. :drinks: Just thinking out loud again. Nice discussion. Thanks, G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

CB, I have never noticed much difference with the N and the D and I deal with them more than I care to admit.  :crazy:  You could be correct on the different shapes.  I'm kind of embarrassed  :D I have never looked. lol   I have a couple of friends on some of the... Well lets say if a TM tech van is around, they may or may not, depending which van you catch, have a driver head bending machine in them.  If you smooth talk some of the guys they may tweak a head for you to specs you want.  You didn't here it from me. ;)

Oh, and what do you think of having a custom order done on a club?  Exact lofts and face angles?  I know its being done on other websites but I'm wondering if it couldn't be offered from TM.  Maybe through special accounts or current PGA club professionals.  That way a person can get exactly what they want without having to search through racks and racks to find a certain club.  Future clubs could be ordered the same.   Again we are a very small percent of demanding golfers here on these sites,  but what the heck, it would be a good idea.  So often people try shafts at demo events and always think its the shaft when in reality it could be the clubhead being more closed or open.    :pimp: Just thinking out loud again.  Nice discussion.  Thanks,  G

55896[/snapback]

Well, I know that the service is available, through another website. I won't get into detail about another website; just say that I think the service is a truly great idea.

Now, we have to realize that there are VERY few people right now who would demonstrate any interst in face angle and lie adjustments on any metal woods, much less hard and brittle big titanium driver heads. But with more websites getting more and more into golf quipment and what tour pros use, I think the idea will grow. I think it should grow; it's a great idea and if anybody could name three places in the world that offer tour-van style bending and hot-melting services to the public, I'll be very surprised.

Should the manufacturers get involved in this kind of work? I'll leave that up to them. What I would be seeking is somebody who was a knowledgable and good clubfitter, who had good equipment for measuring, bending and other general club-work, and who knew how to build and re-build clubs. It would be a personal kind of service; I don't know if the OEM's are really good at that...

55901[/snapback]

 

Does Joe Kwok do driver heads? I have spoke to Joe several times and Im still amazed at the knowledge he holds. I would say from the few people I know who actually work hard to fit people, Joe is tops!

I think metal wood heads are tough for anyone. There's no guarantee on if they snap or not but if certain face angles were available this would be a non issue. Hopefully OEM's will come around. G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Yogi for nice gesture!

 

Anyway! It's a very good idea setting up a club for specific need and order for a customers. I'm up for opening an acct w/ any OEM to get all the parts only. In fact I was having some idea of what i call Golf Boutique Store w/ private fitting room ( for JLO :pimp: ). Off course this type of store will be pretty limited number to make sure it'll retain the exclusivity for the NUTS or celebrities who need a privacy.

 

If only this dream can come true. You'll see my store in Manhattan/New York, Chicago, LA, and SF.

 

Any request? :crazy:

 

Joe :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Joey,

that is exactly what should be done.....set up a shop and open an account with all of the major manufacturers to allow you as a club builder to purchase only the parts you "need" to set up the club perfectly for each individual. Sounds like a match made in heaven to me!!!! I would be the first to sign up with a new driver coming in from each company!!!! You have my vote and support on this one!!!! Manufacturers turn your hearing aids up.....ALL THE WAY UP!!! :pimp: :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Medalist,

First, anyone can build a vice for these heads. I have looked at them extensively and its nothing too exotic. Its just a press with a foam insert. Second, why wouldn't companies hand pick a few heads? If theres no market for the service, then they wouldn't have much to worry about, easy job. Its only when people become educated about the concept of face angles would their become more of an interest.

 

 

Why are all these requests out of line? (I'm not directing this at anyone just thinking out loud again) :pimp: The whole thing is about change and no OEM likes it. It has to show immediate returns or they want no part of it. My feelings are positive about future OEM club fitting. I think as consumers become more and more educated about why clubs do the things they do, they will start requesting the very things we are discussing here. It all starts someplace. Until then we are stuck dealing with flukes;( Identical clubs that play completely different).

As for now, how long does it take to measure a club head? 3 minutes tops. It isn't necessary to measure every head. Just enough to find the measurements that someone is looking for. If someone knows exactly what they want, charge them an extra 50.00 and build it. Its really not that hard. You also brought up another web site that has this very offering and said "So who is capable of reproducing identical drivers? Please don't tell me you think some web forum." I am not sure how they do it, or how accurate their system is but I will guarantee that its not that hard to do. A person would hardly have to bend anything, just have access to enough heads. I know of several OEM's whos tolerances are quite bad. Sooner or later your going to find what measurements have been requested.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I ask because I dont think there is a difference with any of the R5 or R7's except for face angle.  Obviously the R5's dont have removable weights like the R5TP but other than that I see no difference.  I have heard the tollerances are around +/- .4 degrees but I have a retail R5 9.5 that sets up 1 degree open and is at 9 degrees of loft.  I think TM should have a retail tour department that club pros could order specific loft and face angles for any of their members for a nominal fee.  Just a thought.  I also want to add that playing a club that is 1 degree open has opened my eyes to another factor in club purchases.  I always thought it was funny how 2 visually identical clubs can play so different.  .2 or .3 degrees open significantly changes a clubs performance.  Peace,  G  :pimp:

 

P.S. Whats up Jonny Hom?  You been playin much?    Grant

54529[/snapback]

 

Grant what's up my man, yeah I've been getting out as much as possible since the knee surgery! a lot has changed since we talked, we'll in the bag atleast. I have crossed line's.... you working with TM & all!!!

 

back to the subject... retail R7 & R5TP drivers i believer are the same as tour-issued TP R7 &R5 drivers except for specs. being with TM for 2 years & still with them in the driver department ive had a few "retail" TP R7's that they threw a tour serial # on, they were made exactly to my specs 3*open 8*, there was no difference from my tour R7's & the retail/tour ones they made for me. i don't know about the R5 because ive never had a retail one but im sure they're the same. yogi is a TM guy he'll tell you, obviously the specs on clubs i would get are going to be different to a retail TP, how many guys can play a driver 3* open at 8*? they make them to whatever us guys on tour want, because if not we'll find a company that will, whats in a pro's hands determines what a lot of people will buy. playing in a CGT pro/am i was warming up on the range & guys were asking me & all the other pro's what there playing blah blah blah. i cant tell you how many retail Launcher Comps were sold, they company wants their clubs in your bag so they dont care what it takes to get in a pro's bag before he looks else where.

𝗦ᴜɴ𝗧ʀᴜsᴛ 𝗧ᴀᴍᴘᴀ 𝗕ᴀʏ 𝗣ʀᴏ/𝗔ᴍ 𝗣ʀᴏғᴇssɪᴏɴᴀʟ 𝗖ʜᴀᴍᴘɪᴏɴ (-𝟭𝟮/𝟮𝟬𝟭)

68A7239E-AAC2-4873-AAB4-79AB07381822.png.1162e21eb149e0d7ca8526c3ec552f4c.png

DRIVER: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ 𝗤𝗶𝟭𝟬 𝗟𝗦 𝟴° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗚𝗞 𝗫𝗫

3 WOOD: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ 𝗤𝗶𝟭𝟬 𝟭𝟰.𝟱° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗙𝗪 𝗦ᴇᴠᴇɴ 𝗫

5 WOOD: 𝗖ᴏʙʀᴀ 𝗥ᴀᴅ𝗦ᴘᴇᴇᴅ 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝟭𝟵° 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗙𝗪 𝗦ᴇᴠᴇɴ 𝗫

IRONS: 𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ ᴘ𝟳𝟱𝟬 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏ 𝟯ɪ 𝗟ᴏᴏᴘ 𝗛ʏʙʀɪᴅ 𝟭𝟬𝟬 𝗫,𝗧ᴀʏʟᴏʀ𝗠ᴀᴅᴇ ᴘ𝟳𝟱𝟬 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏ 𝟰ɪ/ᴘ𝟳ᴛᴡ 𝟱ɪ-𝗣𝗪 𝗡ɪᴘᴘᴏɴ 𝗡.𝗦. 𝗣ʀᴏ 𝗠ᴏᴅᴜs 𝟭𝟬𝟱 𝗫

WEDGES: 𝗧ɪᴛʟᴇɪsᴛ 𝗩ᴏᴋᴇʏ 𝗦𝗠𝟭𝟬 𝟱𝟰°𝗙 𝗥ᴀᴡ/𝗧ɪᴛʟᴇɪsᴛ 𝗩ᴏᴋᴇʏ 𝗦𝗠𝟵 𝟱𝟴°𝗩 𝗥ᴀᴡ 𝗡ɪᴘᴘᴏɴ 𝗡.𝗦. 𝗣ʀᴏ 𝗠ᴏᴅᴜs 𝟭𝟮𝟬 𝗫

PUTTER: 𝗕ʏʀᴏɴ 𝗠ᴏʀɢᴀɴ 𝗗𝗛𝟴𝟵 𝗧ᴏᴜʀ 𝗣ʀᴏᴛᴏᴛʏᴘᴇ 𝗪ᴇʟᴅᴇᴅ 𝗙ʟᴏᴡ 𝗡ᴇᴄᴋ 𝟯𝘅 𝗕ʟᴀᴄᴋ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

yogi

I agree completely with every word you're saying, from club specs to the market oppty for OEMs to offer custom-ordered clubs for a fee. I ordered my 704.cb's from Titleist to the exact specs I wanted - loft, lie, length, shaft and swingweight. Why can't I do that for a driver from any major OEM? It's a service I'd gladly pay for.

 

As for the R5 Type N, TP and tour issue. I have owned and hit all three. My first R5 was a retail N w/ a 757 (modified to make the weights removable), then I bought a TP w/ a Diamana, then I bit the bullet and got a tour issue R5. All were 9.5*. The TP was about a .5* closed, the tour issue was 1* open, and the N was dead square. The N is/was my favorite of the three because it sits square. I sold the tour issue, and I keep the TP around in a second bag. Anyway, from my experience, these heads are all basically the same. Basically the same weights with the shaft removed. I hit all of them with 757 speeders installed, and they all performed the same for me except for the face angle (and resulting loft differences).

 

I realize that's just my unscientific experiences with this one driver, so take it for what it's worth. YMMV etc etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Our picks

    • 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Discussion and links to Photos
      Please put any questions or Comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Monday #1
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Monday #2
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #1
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #2
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #3
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Thorbjorn Olesen - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Ben Silverman - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jesse Droemer - SoTX PGA Section POY - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      David Lipsky - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Martin Trainer - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Zac Blair - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jacob Bridgeman - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Trace Crowe - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jimmy Walker - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Daniel Berger - WITB(very mini) - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Chesson Hadley - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Callum McNeill - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Rhein Gibson - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Patrick Fishburn - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Peter Malnati - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Raul Pereda - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Gary Woodland WITB (New driver, iron shafts) – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Padraig Harrington WITB – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      Tom Hoge's custom Cameron - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Piretti putters - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Ping putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Kevin Dougherty's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Bettinardi putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Erik Barnes testing an all-black Axis1 putter – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Tony Finau's new driver shaft – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
       
       
       
       
       
      • 7 replies
    • 2024 Valspar Championship WITB Photos (Thanks to bvmagic)- Discussion & Links to Photos
      This weeks WITB Pics are from member bvmagic (Brian). Brian's first event for WRX was in 2008 at Bayhill while in college. Thanks so much bv.
       
      Please put your comments or question on this thread. Links to all the threads are below...
       
       
       
       
        • Like
      • 31 replies
    • 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #1
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #2
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #3
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Matt (LFG) Every - WITB - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Sahith Theegala - WITB - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Cameron putters (and new "LD" grip) - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      New Bettinardi MB & CB irons - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Custom Bettinardi API putter cover - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Custom Swag API covers - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      New Golf Pride Reverse Taper grips - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
        • Like
      • 15 replies
    • 2024 Cognizant Classic - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #1
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #2
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #3
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #4
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Brandt Snedeker - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Max Greyserman - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Eric Cole - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Carl Yuan - WITb - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Russell Henley - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Justin Sun - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Alex Noren - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Shane Lowry - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Taylor Montgomery - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Jake Knapp (KnappTime_ltd) - WITB - - 2024 Cognizant Classic
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Super Stoke Pistol Lock 1.0 & 2.0 grips - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      LA Golf new insert putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      New Garsen Quad Tour 15 grip - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      New Swag covers - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Jacob Bridgeman's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Bud Cauley's custom Cameron putters - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Ryo Hisatsune's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Chris Kirk - new black Callaway Apex CB irons and a few Odyssey putters - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Alejandro Tosti's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
        • Like
      • 2 replies
    • 2024 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Monday #1
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Monday #2
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #1
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #2
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #3
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #4
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Rory McIlroy - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Sepp Straka - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Patrick Rodgers - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Brendon Todd - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Denny McCarthy - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Corey Conners - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Chase Johnson - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tommy Fleetwood - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Matt Fitzpatrick - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Si Woo Kim - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Viktor Hovland - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Wyndham Clark - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Cam Davis - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Nick Taylor - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Ben Baller WITB update (New putter, driver, hybrid and shafts) – 2024 Genesis Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Vortex Golf rangefinder - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      New Fujikura Ventus shaft - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods & TaylorMade "Sun Day Red" apparel launch event, product photos – 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods Sun Day Red golf shoes - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Aretera shafts - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      New Toulon putters - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods' new white "Sun Day Red" golf shoe prototypes – 2024 Genesis Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      • 22 replies

×
×
  • Create New...