Titleist being Titleist

Titleist has the corporate policy that they don't like much information getting out about their upcoming products. Ping is much the same way. Other companies, such as Taylor Made, like to build up anticipation to the release by making it known that they have a new product in the pipeline. Its just two different schools of thought.

Besides.....we already have pictures of most of the new Titleist stuff, and some of the stuff that won't be coming out.....

-Thomas

I don't understand, when I hear companies are releasing new clubs, I am more likely to wait to buy the product

if they don't tell me anything, I'll go out and buy some other club instead!

anybody else hear me on this one?

Because the other 99% of golfers have no clue that a 905R will be out in a few months ... so they are still buying the T and S. They are protecting their accounts from having dust collectors on the shelves.

golow

I agree that it's frustrating but think about this. A few years ago before the web really took off there were no golf boards so we never saw these "prototype" clubs before they came to retail. Now, a new club pops up on tour and we are all over it and wondering when it's coming out in retail. The prototype to retail cycle is still the same time frame, maybe even faster than a few years ago, we just see things much sooner than we used to. It's probably better for them to keep quite than make false promises and get everyone pissed off.

Because the other 99% of golfers have no clue that a 905R will be out in a few months ... so they are still buying the T and S. They are protecting their accounts from having dust collectors on the shelves.

 

golow

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Around here the T and S have been the biggest bust since the C4. The original ERC Fusions sold more around here. Titleist should do nothing but push their new products, they're going to have to clearout a bunch of drivers anyway.

I would appreciate, by exemple, to know if Titleist will release the 503 i in the spring...

JGalls i think were all looking for something along the lines of this...

 

marshalls- I didnt know how to quote only the 1 pic i wanted so i saved to my pics folder then uploaded it back onto this post.  just wanted to let u know. no harm meant

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Because the other 99% of golfers have no clue that a 905R will be out in a few months ... so they are still buying the T and S. They are protecting their accounts from having dust collectors on the shelves.

 

golow

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Around here the T and S have been the biggest bust since the C4. The original ERC Fusions sold more around here. Titleist should do nothing but push their new products, they're going to have to clearout a bunch of drivers anyway.

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I dissagree with the T or S being a bust seeing as almost evry man & lady on my golf team has one as well as most kids on other teams we play....theyve been great sellers around my area at least

And while i am at it......before i found these sites i would just wait and wait for new titleist stuff...now being able to see the Protos is killing me and need them quicker...man i wish titleist was sooooo slow with releasing stuff....but they do give their products a chance to grab some market share before upgrading to new equipment unlike TM who has a new driver every 3 months....which seems to work for them though.

JGalls i think were all looking for something along the lines of this...

 

marshalls- I didnt know how to quote only the 1 pic i wanted so i saved to my pics folder then uploaded it back onto this post.  just wanted to let u know. no harm meant

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Because the other 99% of golfers have no clue that a 905R will be out in a few months ... so they are still buying the T and S. They are protecting their accounts from having dust collectors on the shelves.

 

golow

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Around here the T and S have been the biggest bust since the C4. The original ERC Fusions sold more around here. Titleist should do nothing but push their new products, they're going to have to clearout a bunch of drivers anyway.

55595[/snapback]

 

I dissagree with the T or S being a bust seeing as almost evry man & lady on my golf team has one as well as most kids on other teams we play....theyve been great sellers around my area at least

 

 

And while i am at it......before i found these sites i would just wait and wait for new titleist stuff...now being able to see the Protos is killing me and need them quicker...man i wish titleist was sooooo slow with releasing stuff....but they do give their products a chance to grab some market share before upgrading to new equipment unlike TM who has a new driver every 3 months....which seems to work for them though.

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the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch.

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history.  They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least).  A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch.

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I've owned both the G2, G5, Cleve Comp 460, Miz Mp001 460 comp, R5 Tp, R5 Dual and also the 905T - and I really don't see what all this fuss is about :clapping:

To me the 905T driver works great, it's long, straight and a bit more forgiving than the 983K - just a great driver. As in all drivers, you need the right shaft in the driver for it to perform well, but I think the 905T is an awesome performing driver - the best, most forgiving, longest and strightest from Titleist ever - so I don't get why it hasn't sold more out in the stores :drinks:

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch.

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been :drinks: i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

mcca

I've been a Titleist Ho since I started playing golf....the Miz in my sig are the first non Tity irons I've ever owned.

For the folks who are claiming the 905's are the biggest flop in Titleist history....do you remember the Howitzer? How about the Starships?

As far as performance is concerned. They perform as well or better as anything else out there. BUT they retail in most places for $100 more, so unless your a Titleist ho, you're probably not bucking up the extra 100 large. Heck I wouldn't have one now if it wasn't for Ebay.

Titleist's buisness practices are pretty damn sound....frustrating for all of us combing the golf forums for tour and proto stuff, but sound non the less. Think about it...how much buzz is out there for the 905R, F03-5, 503i (and don't get me started about the irons!)? When this stuff hits the market it'll fly off the shelves! Besides, how sound a business decision is it to release new drivers, FW, and utility iron 6 months after you released it all? What does that say about the companies' confidence in their products? Oh and one more thing...when any company develops a product, they project a product lifecycle. They have developement $'s, marketing $, etc tied up in it...all for the purpose of generating revenue...so until revenue=expenditures; we all probably won't see squat.

So Tity Ho's unite and keep snapping pics and posting...cuz I need my fix!

I'm going to have to agree that Titleist's marketing practices are probably the most intelligent from a pure business prospective.

Taylormade hypes their stuff months before release, that bites into their present clubs sales, and also forces them to lower the costs on clubs as soon as the new stuff comes out.

If you know that a company is coming out with an updated version of a driver you want to buy in a month, most will wait till then to buy the new one, or get the one they planned on buying at a huge discount, that's just going to canabalize your profit margins and makes you put a larger prices premium on your newer products to make up that lost revenue.

I actually think Titleist has a great market strategy.

They keep Titleist as a "player's club" and use Cobra for the game improvement market (but make no mistake, Cobra makes some great equipment)

This way they don't dillute their brand as Callaway has done.

When you think of Callaway, you hardly think "player's clubs" even though their equipment is great in some areas (Woods specifically) but most players don't look at them that way, they're seen as "forgiving" or "game improvement".

So as far as I'm concerned Titleist can keep doing what they're doing because it works well, their clubs almost always hold a great ressale value, and initial value.

Just look at the 980F series of fairway woods, their prices are still not the cheapest (lowest I've seen is $159.99 w/ graphite) and just about a month or so ago they were still at $189.99.

Just my opinion, and I'm sure I'll get flamed for this stuff :drinks:

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch.

 

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been  :drinks: i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

 

mcca

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HAHAHA! Yeah, I'm just guessing here....Oh wait, no I'm not. I actually sent back 25 drivers for full credit. My bad. I guess your friends do know better....As for their supposed "huge" golf shops, I laugh out loud at them! :clapping:

Check the sales figs big guy---flop. Period. No matter what your friends try to tell you.

My simple requests have been the hats. You can't find the good Titleist hats that they have on their website anywhere and they won't tell you where to get them at?

Just don't get it.

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch. 

 

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been  i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

 

mcca

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I'd like to know where these shops are so we can send our stock to be sold. We have sold 12 G2's, 4 G5's, 4 R7's, 6 R5's, 5 Miz and even 5 FT3's and that is only in the last four months (we are a small muni course). We haven't sold any 905's. This year was the first time in a few years that I didn't have a Titleist driver in my bag. I tried the 905 and absolutely hated it. The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it. So much for using the aluminum hosel to redistribute weight in the head. They should have just made a bigger version of the 983, which IMO was one of the best drivers in recent memory.

I think its the price tag. People are cheap. That is what it boils down to when it comes to buying drivers. $400 is too much for a driver. We don't make anything off of them because they cost us too much and besides you can get the G5, R5, Clev Ti06 cheaper and I think the perform just as well or better. Im not biased about any particular company, but I have noticed in our store we have about 45 drivers in all different shaft options and we might sell 2 a month. Not that we don't try, but from a retailers point of view there is no reason because u make your %20 margin and right now we are selling them at $379 because of competition in charlotte. For some reason we have been doing more price matching with titleist products lately, and i dont know why because the cost is one of the highest in the industry. In our market the 905 has been a bust, but it may do great in other markets.

The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it...sounds like a swing flaw to me.

The 905 had the lowest spin numbers of any driver I've tried.

JGalls i think were all looking for something along the lines of this...

 

marshalls- I didnt know how to quote only the 1 pic i wanted so i saved to my pics folder then uploaded it back onto this post.  just wanted to let u know. no harm meant

54338[/snapback]

 

 

Because the other 99% of golfers have no clue that a 905R will be out in a few months ... so they are still buying the T and S. They are protecting their accounts from having dust collectors on the shelves.

 

golow

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Around here the T and S have been the biggest bust since the C4. The original ERC Fusions sold more around here. Titleist should do nothing but push their new products, they're going to have to clearout a bunch of drivers anyway.

55595[/snapback]

 

I dissagree with the T or S being a bust seeing as almost evry man & lady on my golf team has one as well as most kids on other teams we play....theyve been great sellers around my area at least

 

 

And while i am at it......before i found these sites i would just wait and wait for new titleist stuff...now being able to see the Protos is killing me and need them quicker...man i wish titleist was sooooo slow with releasing stuff....but they do give their products a chance to grab some market share before upgrading to new equipment unlike TM who has a new driver every 3 months....which seems to work for them though.

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That's a cult thing or "who's cool". I remember having a titleist driver was the big thing back in high school. Not trying to knock you teammates, but having the cool silver and black headcover could be a big reason behind having them.

Around here I've maybe seen 4 of them in play, the local nevada bobs has their full rack of original shipment, maybe sold 2. That's considered a flop when they've almost sold out of ft-3s which were released partway through the season.

The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it...sounds like a swing flaw to me.

 

The 905 had the lowest spin numbers of any driver I've tried.

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Yeah it must be the 120 mph swingspeed or the 175 mph ball speed. The Callaway FT3 brought my spin down with the same shaft and the J33 460 performs well also so yeah it must be my swing...

Those of you who say that the 905 line is a flop aren't far from the truth. Titleist is very unhappy with sales, that's why the 905R made it to retail (March). It''l be a band-aid until 2007.

As far as the market practice goes, Titleist is just different than TM. TM hypes the horizon and Titleist promotes the here and now. Titleist's business practice allows for accounts to clear inventory without getting stuck ... assuming sales are steady. Not the case with this line of drivers.

These threads always bring out a post here and there that says "we can't keep them in stock". This is because there are definately hot spots for sales in North America. Across the board sales is another story.

BTW- I love my 905S .. and my R7TP

golow

The 905 series was poorly thought out from a marketing standpoint. Let's take a look at the drivers prior:

975D - nobody will doubt this driver was the most revolutionary since the Big Bertha.

975J - a nice upgrade in size and sold pretty well IIRC

975JVS/LFE. I don't think the LFE sold well and the JVS may have appealed to better players despite its draw bias.

983K/E - these things flew off the shelves. Plasma welding, beta titanium, .83 COR. I just upgraded from J to E.

905T/S - What's the point of this thing? It's bigger? Why not buy a Launcher? Why not buy an R5/R7?

The 905 came at a time when the market was saturated with comparable performing drivers at much lower price points, but the club itself is poor. When I had the D, I wanted to upgrade to the J. When I had the J, I wanted to upgrade to the K/E. Now that I have the E, I have no desire to upgrade to a 905. None.

I find the 905T to be very good performance, and I did find that with the r5 I hit the ball well, but if found that with the look of the club at address scared me into hitting lots of pushes and snap hooks when I tricked myself into really swinging. The 905 really looked square and allowed me to swing for the fences. The new shaft in the 905 also added 20+ yards because the blue was ballooning.

Ok, I went to my local golf shop, hit the R7 TP w/ SIX, R5 TP w/ Diamana 63, g2 w/ NV 65, and 905T w/ NV. The 905 was head and shoulders above the rest, im talking like 15 yards in the air. It may be just me, but these drivers don't suck thats for sure. My dad also hit this one much better than the others.

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch. 

 

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been  i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

 

mcca

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I'd like to know where these shops are so we can send our stock to be sold. We have sold 12 G2's, 4 G5's, 4 R7's, 6 R5's, 5 Miz and even 5 FT3's and that is only in the last four months (we are a small muni course). We haven't sold any 905's. This year was the first time in a few years that I didn't have a Titleist driver in my bag. I tried the 905 and absolutely hated it. The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it. So much for using the aluminum hosel to redistribute weight in the head. They should have just made a bigger version of the 983, which IMO was one of the best drivers in recent memory.

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Your reply speaks volumns as to what Titleist is about as a company: PLAYERS play Titleist. Forgive me if this doesn't come across right but what do really expect to sell more of at a muni, a Titleist club that is geared towards the single digit golfer, or a g2 that johnny with an 18 handicap thinks will straighten his slice out? Look at what the pros and the top ams or college kids are playing before you make a judgement on an entire line of clubs based on what sells at a muni.

The problem with the s and t not selling like the ping drivers is that the people who buy the ping driver look at a titleist and know that they can't hit it. At adress it looks like a serious players club that you need to be able to swing properly to put to good use - and that is exactly what it is.

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch. 

 

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been  i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

 

mcca

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I'd like to know where these shops are so we can send our stock to be sold. We have sold 12 G2's, 4 G5's, 4 R7's, 6 R5's, 5 Miz and even 5 FT3's and that is only in the last four months (we are a small muni course). We haven't sold any 905's. This year was the first time in a few years that I didn't have a Titleist driver in my bag. I tried the 905 and absolutely hated it. The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it. So much for using the aluminum hosel to redistribute weight in the head. They should have just made a bigger version of the 983, which IMO was one of the best drivers in recent memory.

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Your reply speaks volumns as to what Titleist is about as a company: PLAYERS play Titleist. Forgive me if this doesn't come across right but what do really expect to sell more of at a muni, a Titleist club that is geared towards the single digit golfer, or a g2 that johnny with an 18 handicap thinks will straighten his slice out? Look at what the pros and the top ams or college kids are playing before you make a judgement on an entire line of clubs based on what sells at a muni.

 

The problem with the s and t not selling like the ping drivers is that the people who buy the ping driver look at a titleist and know that they can't hit it. At adress it looks like a serious players club that you need to be able to swing properly to put to good use - and that is exactly what it is.

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wow, condescension at it's finest. Most of the top am's are still playing the E and K, to answer your smart-assed question, so I guess even they are in agreement as to what is better. At the US Am this year, there were as many D's as T's. What's that tell you? As for the T and S being geared for the "good" player while the hack likes the G2, since the G2 is significantly less hook-faced than either of the offerings that Titleist has right now, I'd say the better player swarmed the G2, that's why it was the number 1 selling driver in the country. Those of us "good" players didn't get an option from Titleist this year. I promise you I am more in tune to what the buying public thinks than you are. The T ans S are flops, period, and it has nothing to do with it being a "players" club--it has to do with the E and K being better for MOST players. Now, of course, there will be those cool guys rushing in here to say "I hit my T 40 yards longer than the K, so that isn't true!!" That's why I said, and even capped, MOST.

As for basing what sells, at a muni, call Titleist and ask if they are happy with sales ANYWHERE. The answer is NO. Flop. almost as bad as the C4. In fact, the sales figs for the first 6 months of availability are pretty equal between the C4 and the S-T. Did players like the C4, too? Is that why Cally and Titleist admit failure and take back unsold product, while offering apologies to retailers all over the country? Because players like them?

the T and S are the biggest flops in Titleist history. They are selling so badly that Titleist is doing the unheard of move of taking them back from retailers at full credit (unheard of from Titleist, at least). A HUGE admission of failure and lack of sales punch. 

 

Dude where are you getting your data from have you been  i have 2 friends that both own huge golf shops and have never heard of that every Titleist 905 that has come into there stores have been sold even some custom orders with shaft upgrades.

 

mcca

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I'd like to know where these shops are so we can send our stock to be sold. We have sold 12 G2's, 4 G5's, 4 R7's, 6 R5's, 5 Miz and even 5 FT3's and that is only in the last four months (we are a small muni course). We haven't sold any 905's. This year was the first time in a few years that I didn't have a Titleist driver in my bag. I tried the 905 and absolutely hated it. The ball came off with way to much spin no matter what shaft I put in it. So much for using the aluminum hosel to redistribute weight in the head. They should have just made a bigger version of the 983, which IMO was one of the best drivers in recent memory.

56424[/snapback]

 

Your reply speaks volumns as to what Titleist is about as a company: PLAYERS play Titleist. Forgive me if this doesn't come across right but what do really expect to sell more of at a muni, a Titleist club that is geared towards the single digit golfer, or a g2 that johnny with an 18 handicap thinks will straighten his slice out? Look at what the pros and the top ams or college kids are playing before you make a judgement on an entire line of clubs based on what sells at a muni.

 

The problem with the s and t not selling like the ping drivers is that the people who buy the ping driver look at a titleist and know that they can't hit it. At adress it looks like a serious players club that you need to be able to swing properly to put to good use - and that is exactly what it is.

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If Titleist drivers are for players only then why did the D and K do so well? Trust me, there were plenty of hacks using the D and K when they came out. When a driver is good people buy it - regardless of handicap. Your theory applies to irons but drivers are not seen the same way. I am sure that the guy from the muni sold plenty of D's and K's when they were out. Unless you own stock in Fortune Brands (parent company of Acushnet) or work for Titleist, it's OK that they released a dog.

Titleist makes great gear and I don't know why the S and T haven't sold, but they do like to keep the consumer in the dark. I've been a beloved Tity ho until this year when I have tried some of this tour issued items from TM which is definitely alot easier to get your hands on than Tity's tour issued items? Some people like Hanes some like boxers and those who don't get the ball to the hole let their thong's tighten up! Just a little different perspective.

There is not much exaggeration going on here, the sales figures of the S and T and at best diappointing. The definition of flop is pretty open to interpretation. I would not fault anyone for calling the 905s a flop in sales, but on the other hand, no one at Titleist is getting fired.

Think of Acushnet as a bigger version of your typical small golf retailer. They both carry a wide selection to appeal to everyone's needs, but it's the small things that make the big margins - balls, shoes, gloves, shirts. The clubs get people in the door and to keep that going you have to spend big marketing dollars. While Acushnet is not going to be happy with break even performance when it comes to the sales performance of clubs, they are not going to go crazy trying to remedy any issues, it's just not their priority and it never will be. To them, it's all about the golf ball. One month of golf ball profits dwarf anything else they do.

Even the vaunted Scotty Cameron is not all that profitable. In fact, if you spun off SC into his own company, he would lose money if he tried to maintain the same marketing and other strategies.

Although I have not seen many 905s in bags at my club this year, I was a the US Amateur in August and noticed that a majority of the players I saw had a 905 in the bag, which really surprised me. Of course, I would say most of these guys were college golfers who probably did not pay for their driver...