Mario Mendoza was better than you think!

I have never heard anyone say, "Mario Mendoza was a better hitter than his average would indicate".

I have never heard anyone say that an NHL Goalie was "way better than his Goals Against Average would suggest".

Or a Slalom Skier is way better than his times indicate.

Why do so many golfers seem to think they're better golfers than they are? Or get insulted that they're considered a "high handicapper", when they're a 17?

A 15 handicap, is light years away from a 5.

A 5 is galaxy away from a Scratch.

Most Scratch players aren't in the same universe as a PGA Tour Pro.

Yet most every day there's a thread started by someone who's insulted that someone characterized their golfing, based on their handicap or scores. What else would you use to quantify someone's golf game, their haircuts? If they wear their sunglasses on the back of their hat?

" By height"- Ty Webb

BTW, Kwame Brown is a much better player than his NBA stats indicate

Mario Mendoza? Was he the drug dealer in Miami Vice?

That guy could deal drugs man.

I mean he moved like 50M bucks in Coke into Miami....but guys who moved 1M were probably just as good as him

Why are you obsessed with how others behave and keep starting threads you [b]know [/b]are going to deteriorate???

"Why do so many golfers seem to think they're better golfers than they are?"

I have no illusions...or delusions...when it comes to my golf game Brian. Whether it's distance off the tee, scoring, or what have you. Frankly, I don't consider myself very good at all, despite all the practice/lessons I put into the game. Perhaps it's because I didn't pick up the game until I was 50, or perhaps it's because I don't have the necessary skills, or a combination of both.

Despite that, I still love the game and will continue to work at it. However, you won't find me playing the tips. You won't find me trying to carry a 210 yard hazard. And, you won't find me bragging about anything. :-)

Maybe I'm looking in different sub forums, but I never see any threads started by people who are insulted that someone characterized their ability.

At least, if those threads happen, then they aren't in Tour Talk, so why is this thread here again?

[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392780518' post='8699195']
Why are you obsessed with how others behave and keep starting threads you [b]know [/b]are going to deteriorate???
[/quote]

I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?

Most recently, there was a prominent and very talented German NHL goaltender and this was said about him quite a bit. Reason being is that his team's defense stunk, so maybe that's not the best comparison.

Save % might have been better, but even then, it's off the mark.

I'm with you Brian. I have no idea why those imposters keep at it!

For example, my Dad is a 32 handicap but somehow he thinks he's decent and can maybe get good enough to play on the 'Super Senior Tour' in 2016 when they kick it off.

You know, the 70+ Senior Tour everyone's been yammering about.

Anyway, I keep telling him to hang it up, find another sport or activity 'because you will NEVER, EVER make it on any Tour' and you don't even belong on the course!

But gosh darn it, he's a trooper and says he will never quit because he can do better next time and that his handicap is too high for what his [i]real[/i] abilities are.

Man, he is determined, I'll give hime that.

I can't wait for him to get down into the teens with his handicap so he can become only a 'High Handicap' player instead of the 'Nose Bleed Handicap' that he is now.

Someday...

Keep up the good posting Brian.

Ah! the old Mendoza line. No Mario couldn't hit, but maybe he had other attributes that made him a somewhat valuable hitter.

I will tell you how good I am, according to the USGA I am a 6.7. I know I am better than most who play the game but I know plenty of people who are better than me and they are no where near tour quality. I have no illusions of much better than that but I do possess some skills at a level that are much better than some scratch level players.

For example I am fighting some physical problems that have sapped my power, compared to what most claim on this site I am woefully short, but I would put my short game against most. In fact I know scratch players whom I wouldn't swap short games with. When I am on I truly believe I can get up and down from anywhere, do I all the time....of course not, but I know how, I believe I can and if I have time to practice a bit I do more often than not.

The lowest my handicap has ever been is around 5, the highest in the last 15 years or so is 8, my best score is 68, twice on a pretty easy course, but hey I did it. I am a student of the game, my course management is strong and I don't mind giving advice to those who ask but I find it pretty hard to be offended unless someone is saying for a fact I am wrong if I know I am not.

The problem I have on this site with some is that they state things as fact when in fact when it comes to golf there are rarely ever any absolutes. Nothing ever wrong with some good debate however.

[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392781801' post='8699369']
I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?
[/quote]

Always the diplomat Sean... and that isn't a bad thing.

His recent post history strongly suggests otherwise.

The questions were:

[quote][b]Why do so many golfers seem to think they're better golfers than they are? Or get insulted that they're considered a "high handicapper", when they're a 17?[/b][/quote]

First off, who cares what [b]anyone [/b]else thinks about their own golf game?

Second, why does he frequently target higher handicaps? You don't see these posts as condescending?

Maybe I'll start a thread on single digit bunters that struggle with GIR's and carry a vanity cap that won't transfer to a longer, more difficult course that requires target golf?

See what I did there?

[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392782980' post='8699507']
[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392781801' post='8699369']
I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?
[/quote]

Always the diplomat Sean... and that isn't a bad thing.

His recent post history strongly suggests otherwise.

The questions were:

[quote][b]Why do so many golfers seem to think they're better golfers than they are? Or get insulted that they're considered a "high handicapper", when they're a 17?[/b][/quote]

First off, who cares what [b]anyone [/b]else thinks about their own golf game?

Second, why does he frequently target higher handicaps? You don't see these posts as condescending?

Maybe I'll start a thread on single digit bunters that struggle with GIR's and carry a vanity cap that won't transfer to a longer, more difficult course that requires target golf?

See what I did there?
[/quote]

Ha! I do.

However, I think Brian is an equal opportunity poster and used the "17" as an example. I know some low single digits at my home course that are, ahem, not really low single digits.

And, I think a lot of golfers care what others think about their golf games. If not, why would they talk about how far they hit a drive, or what they shot, or what have you, after their rounds, i.e., the bragging...passive or otherwise. :-)

Many people are insecure and they crave validation. They will seek it where ever they can...and that includes the golf course. I mean how many times have you been subjected to, or over heard "that" guy give a blow by blow of his round and how "great" it was. :-)

Or, the guy you meet on the first tee who is a great golfer, but after a few holes, just "doesn't have today".

[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392783797' post='8699571']
[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392782980' post='8699507']
[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392781801' post='8699369']
I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?
[/quote]

Always the diplomat Sean... and that isn't a bad thing.

His recent post history strongly suggests otherwise.

The questions were:

[quote][b]Why do so many golfers seem to think they're better golfers than they are? Or get insulted that they're considered a "high handicapper", when they're a 17?[/b][/quote]

First off, who cares what [b]anyone [/b]else thinks about their own golf game?

Second, why does he frequently target higher handicaps? You don't see these posts as condescending?

Maybe I'll start a thread on single digit bunters that struggle with GIR's and carry a vanity cap that won't transfer to a longer, more difficult course that requires target golf?

See what I did there?
[/quote]

Ha! I do.

However, I think Brian is an equal opportunity poster and used the "17" as an example. I know some low single digits at my home course that are, ahem, not really low single digits.

And, I think a lot of golfers care what others think about their golf games. If not, why would they talk about how far they hit a drive, or what they shot, or what have you, after their rounds, i.e., the bragging...passive or otherwise. :-)

Many people are insecure and they crave validation. They will seek it where ever they can...and that includes the golf course. I mean how many times have you been subjected to, or over heard "that" guy give a blow by blow of his round and how "great" it was. :-)

Or, the guy you meet on the first tee who is a great golfer, but after a few holes, just "doesn't have today".
[/quote]I think we have all met that guy, and of course we all have bad rounds. But honestly I rarely have more than one round a year where I don't think I am not playing like crap while I am doing it.

Two types of braggarts in golf the way I see it.
1. The guy you meet at a cocktail party who knows he will never actually end up actually playing golf with you.
2. The guy behind a keyboard with a WiFi connection and a user account on GolfWRX who knows he will never actually play with anyone else on the forum. Most of these are big into the passive brag, but honestly most people on this site I think are pretty honest. It's just the idiots you always remember because they get under your skin.

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1392779716' post='8699057']
Mario Mendoza? Was he the drug dealer in Miami Vice?

That guy could deal drugs man.

I mean he moved like 50M bucks in Coke into Miami....but guys who moved 1M were probably just as good as him
[/quote]

How many keys did he move? That's what I remember about Miami Vice. Moving keys of coke.

[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392783797' post='8699571']
Ha! I do.

However, I think Brian is an equal opportunity poster and used the "17" as an example. I know some low single digits at my home course that are, ahem, not really low single digits.

And, I think a lot of golfers care what others think about their golf games. If not, why would they talk about how far they hit a drive, or what they shot, or what have you, after their rounds, i.e., the bragging...passive or otherwise. :-)

Many people are insecure and they crave validation. They will seek it where ever they can...and that includes the golf course. I mean how many times have you been subjected to, or over heard "that" guy give a blow by blow of his round and how "great" it was. :-)

Or, the guy you meet on the first tee who is a great golfer, but after a few holes, just "doesn't have today".
[/quote]

So again I ask the question, why does it matter at all what another player thinks about their golf game? All of your scenarios exist. Do you change how you play if around someone you describe? Do you play worse? Do you call them out and take away their little moment of happiness?

I don't understand why it is important in the slightest or why it is thread worthy?

Speaking of passive brags. I don't suppose pointing out that you're willing to post your name, your picture, your handicap and screen captures of your stats falls under that category?

See what I did again.

[quote name='Vindog' timestamp='1392782096' post='8699415']
Most recently, there was a prominent and very talented German NHL goaltender and this was said about him quite a bit. Reason being is that his team's defense stunk, so maybe that's not the best comparison.

Save % might have been better, but even then, it's off the mark.
[/quote]

So the exact opposite of Patrick Roy.

[quote name='Snufles' timestamp='1392784882' post='8699679']
[quote name='Vindog' timestamp='1392782096' post='8699415']
Most recently, there was a prominent and very talented German NHL goaltender and this was said about him quite a bit. Reason being is that his team's defense stunk, so maybe that's not the best comparison.

Save % might have been better, but even then, it's off the mark.
[/quote]

So the exact opposite of Patrick Roy.
[/quote]

I'm assuming he's talking about Kolzig.

Anyone who uses the ignore function shouldn't be considered "equal opportunity."

[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392784544' post='8699645']
[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392783797' post='8699571']
Ha! I do.

However, I think Brian is an equal opportunity poster and used the "17" as an example. I know some low single digits at my home course that are, ahem, not really low single digits.

And, I think a lot of golfers care what others think about their golf games. If not, why would they talk about how far they hit a drive, or what they shot, or what have you, after their rounds, i.e., the bragging...passive or otherwise. :-)

Many people are insecure and they crave validation. They will seek it where ever they can...and that includes the golf course. I mean how many times have you been subjected to, or over heard "that" guy give a blow by blow of his round and how "great" it was. :-)

Or, the guy you meet on the first tee who is a great golfer, but after a few holes, just "doesn't have today".
[/quote]

So again I ask the question, why does it matter at all what another player thinks about their golf game? All of your scenarios exist. Do you change how you play if around someone you describe? Do you play worse? Do you call them out and take away their little moment of happiness?

I don't understand why it is important in the slightest or why it is thread worthy?

Speaking of passive brags. I don't suppose pointing out that you're willing to post your name, your picture, your handicap and screen captures of your stats falls under that category?

See what I did again.
[/quote]

Please review post #5...see what I did. :-)

What another person thinks about their golf game? To quote George Thorogood: that don't confront me. :-)

I

It's because some of us are grinding away, and will outwork those that are content.

I would like to add that a 15 HC is not really light years away from a 5. If you are an athlete and a good putter you could be a 5 in less than 6 months with a lot of effort. I do agree that most scratch players are not even close to the same Universe as a Tour pro, but they could be one day if they can drive it long and putt!

[quote name='golfdude300' timestamp='1392786079' post='8699811']
I would like to add that a 15 HC is not really light years away from a 5. If you are an athlete and a good putter you could be a 5 in less than 6 months with a lot of effort. I do agree that most scratch players are not even close to the same Universe as a Tour pro, but they could be one day if they can drive it long and putt!
[/quote]

No offense, but anyone who's ever gone from 15 to 5 will probably say differently.

For many years, Golf Digest posted a compilation of each state's "most improved golfer", based on GHIN/USGA records. If someone's handicap ever dropped from 15 to 9 in a year, he would have been the USA winner of the "Most Improved" trophy.

It sounds great in theory, but in 40 years of playing golf, the only time I've ever heard of someone going from a 15 to even a 9 in a year's time, is on WRX.

I think your post is an example of what I'm talking about. A lot of golfers don't seem to acknowledge how difficult the game is.

"Hey guys should I play blades? I'm a 16hc but my ball striking is like a 4, its only because my putting and short game."

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1392779716' post='8699057']
Mario Mendoza? Was he the drug dealer in Miami Vice?

That guy could deal drugs man.

I mean he moved like 50M bucks in Coke into Miami....but guys who moved 1M were probably just as good as him
[/quote]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1zzrt_glenn-frey-smuggler-s-blues_music

[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392780518' post='8699195']
Why are you obsessed with how others behave and keep starting threads you [b]know [/b]are going to deteriorate???
[/quote]

When I see a thread on WRX that was started by someone who's opinion I'm not interested in, I simply don't read the thread.

[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392781801' post='8699369']
[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392780518' post='8699195']
Why are you obsessed with how others behave and keep starting threads you [b]know [/b]are going to deteriorate???
[/quote]

I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?
[/quote]

There was a thread started yesterday, by a golfer who was insulted because a Salesperson at a golf shop, quantified his golf game based on his 15 handicap (or whatever it was).

In a subsequent post, the OP claimed to play only 10-15 rounds year, which should qualify him as better golfer than the 15 HC who plays 50 times a year. It's not only that people seem to believe they're better than they are, they want other golfers to acknowledge that.

It almost always seems that it's golfers in the 12 HC to 18 HC who hold that opinion. Guys that are in single digits or better, usually seem better able to understand or acknowledge how difficult the game is and how hard it is to get to the next level.

I have never once seen a 1 or a 2 handicapper on WRX, claim he could probably be on the PGA Tour or a + handicap, if he could only putt decently ... or hit it longer ... or chip better.

I see a raft of 12's, suggesting they'll be Scratch by next year.

Hey look everybody, I played 40 years of golf and I've seen everything!!!!!

Or, why does the same person continually start the same thread about handicaps under different titles? OP thinks advice is worthless unless it's from a low handicap, high handicappers' opinions about club performance is tainted, high handicappers shouldn't bother to get fit and average golfers are"hacks". No wonder they feel insulted. This is just bizarre.

[quote name='Hawkeye77' timestamp='1392815270' post='8700677']
Or, why does the same person continually start the same thread about handicaps under different titles? OP thinks advice is worthless unless it's from a low handicap, high handicappers' opinions about club performance is tainted, high handicappers shouldn't bother to get fit and average golfers are"hacks". No wonder they feel insulted. This is just bizarre.
[/quote]

There certainly does appear to be a theme doesn't there?

[quote name='BrianL99' timestamp='1392807258' post='8700345']
[quote name='Sean2' timestamp='1392781801' post='8699369']
[quote name='cdnrockies' timestamp='1392780518' post='8699195']
Why are you obsessed with how others behave and keep starting threads you [b]know [/b]are going to deteriorate???
[/quote]

I may be wrong, but I don't think that's Brian's intent. Perhaps a little honesty/reality in one's golfing life is not such a bad thing?
[/quote]

There was a thread started yesterday, by a golfer who was insulted because a Salesperson at a golf shop, quantified his golf game based on his 15 handicap (or whatever it was).

In a subsequent post, the OP claimed to play only 10-15 rounds year, which should qualify him as better golfer than the 15 HC who plays 50 times a year. It's not only that people seem to believe they're better than they are, they want other golfers to acknowledge that.

It almost always seems that it's golfers in the 12 HC to 18 HC who hold that opinion. Guys that are in single digits or better, usually seem better able to understand or acknowledge how difficult the game is and how hard it is to get to the next level.

I have never once seen a 1 or a 2 handicapper on WRX, claim he could probably be on the PGA Tour or a + handicap, if he could only putt decently ... or hit it longer ... or chip better.

I see a raft of 12's, suggesting they'll be Scratch by next year.
[/quote]

Not sure which is worse:

a - those that aspire to be better

or

b - that it bothers you so much

I'll have to put my thinking cap on and be back in touch...