Bernhard Langer's new putting stroke (Merged)

[Don L]

I was watching the Senior tournament yesterday. How is Langer's putting style not found to still be anchored?

[Vindog]

I haven't seen but describe it for me. What part of the club/hand is anchored his body?

[Vindog]

So I found a highlight, and this method is expressly allowed under the new rule. What they are disallowing is the creation of an anchor point to the body of the club, hand or forearm.

[starsail85]

Cheat

[Vindog]

Cheat

 

Care to elaborate?

[MelloYello]

At the end of the day it's the Champion's Tour so nobody is really going to care that much. Let's remember that first and foremost.

 

That said, I'm in favor of more traditional putting methods, in fact I think traditional putting methods are superior. Therefore any conversation on whether or not to allow alternative styles on the PGA Tour has to acknowledge that at most you're talking about a few wins here or there and the possibility of a major or two for someone who's ball-striking is top notch (i.e. Adam Scott, Sergio Garcia).

 

At the end of the day, the traditional method of putting is still superior across the board and is not really being threatened.

[MelloYello]

Cheat

 

Care to elaborate?

 

Langer found a loophole that allows him to get around the rule while still using the same equipment and virtually the same stroke. Legally it's alright only because his left hand has moved 1/2" from where it original was. I suspect that according to most people it'd probably constitute an infringement on the spirit of the rule. Then again, maybe it doesn't since technically he's not "anchored" at any point.

 

It's really a grey area.

 

Let's avoid that moral debate though. There are thousands of things in life wherein we do and don't violate the spirit of rules/laws while still staying legal. That's between a person and themselves.

[Vindog]

Cheat

 

Care to elaborate?

 

Langer found a loophole that allows him to get around the rule while still using the same equipment and virtually the same stroke. Legally it's alright only because his left hand has moved 1/2" from where it original was. I suspect that according to most people it'd probably constitute an infringement on the spirit of the rule. Then again, maybe it doesn't since technically he's not "anchored" at any point.

 

It's really a grey area.

 

Let's avoid that moral debate though. There are thousands of things in life wherein we do and don't violate the spirit of rules/laws while still staying legal. That's between a person and themselves.

 

The highlight I saw showed him using an arm lock style like he used in the past and not an un-anchored broomstick. :dntknw:

 

Also there is no "loophole". An un-anchored stroke is EXPRESSLY ALLOWED from the infographic. So if he found a loophole, then the way was pointed out to him lol

[KevCarter]

How is it a loophole or against the spirit of the rule when it's expressly allowed?

 

 

[MelloYello]

And that's the reaction I expected.

 

You both just argued that's it's legal and therefore not a loophole.

 

But that's what loopholes are; things which allow you to do what some might consider wrong while still staying legal.

 

 

 

Many folks are going to feel as though being "legal" is simply the bare minimum that society establishes so we can all coexist. There's a whole conversation about the value of shame as a governance in grey areas but this is not the place I'm going to have that discussion.

[Don L]

Well a trip to the USGA website would have answered my question. I still think what he is doing should not be allowed. Matt Kuchar's style is as close to "anchored" as I would have allowed. But they didn't ask me: ).

 

[KevCarter]

A loophole is an ambiguity or inadequacy in a system, such as a law or security, which can be used to circumvent or otherwise avoid the intent, implied or explicitly stated, of the system. Loopholes are searched for and used strategically in a variety of circumstances, including taxes, elections, politics, the criminal justice system, or in breaches of security, or a response to one's civil liberties. Loopholes are distinct from lacunae, although the two terms are often used interchangeably.

 

I see nothing ambiguous or inadequate about either procedure, long putter away from his body or grip resting on his forearm. He is using something expressly stated as legal, not circumventing anything, and following the intent of the rule to the letter. You and others simply don't like the way it looks. Others calling him a cheater are simply ill informed...

[Vindog]

And that's the reaction I expected.

 

You both just argued that's it's legal and therefore not a loophole.

 

But that's what loopholes are; things which allow you to do what some might consider wrong while still staying legal.

 

 

 

Many folks are going to feel as though being "legal" is simply the bare minimum that society establishes so we can all coexist. There's a whole conversation about the value of shame as a governance in grey areas but this is not the place I'm going to have that discussion.

 

Jesus man. Lets not make this something that it isn't.

[KevCarter]

And that's the reaction I expected.

 

You both just argued that's it's legal and therefore not a loophole.

 

But that's what loopholes are; things which allow you to do what some might consider wrong while still staying legal.

 

Many folks are going to feel as though being "legal" is simply the bare minimum that society establishes so we can all coexist. There's a whole conversation about the value of shame as a governance in grey areas but this is not the place I'm going to have that discussion.

 

Nice edit. Even sillier. Where is the grey area? The USGA provided pictures of what is legal and what isn't. Either it's anchored providing a fulcrum point, or it isn't.

[Frankensteins Monster]

And that's the reaction I expected.

 

You both just argued that's it's legal and therefore not a loophole.

 

But that's what loopholes are; things which allow you to do what some might consider wrong while still staying legal.

 

 

 

Many folks are going to feel as though being "legal" is simply the bare minimum that society establishes so we can all coexist. There's a whole conversation about the value of shame as a governance in grey areas but this is not the place I'm going to have that discussion.

 

Can't be a loophole when it has an explicit picture of said style stating its legality.

[Jasonic]

Debating the value of shame as a governance on an anchored putter question? You must be fun at parties.

[Night train]

If it's legal and helps more people enjoy the game..........I'm all for it

[starsail85]

The putter is anchored in the left hand, it hinges on a fixed point. Can't believe what another balls up with a rule decision

 

The rule in golf should be both hands should be within 2" of each other on the grip and no anchored point

[wobgon]

Loophole.........Something that is legal, but "some" folks do not think should be.

[wobgon]

The putter is anchored in the left hand, it hinges on a fixed point. Can't believe what another balls up with a rule decision

 

The rule in golf should be both hands should be within 2" of each other on the grip and no anchored point

The rules of golf should be no graphite shafts allowed......The rules of golf should be, no range finders allowed.....The rules of golf sould be only 12 clubs allowed.....Oh, sorry, I guess those are only opinions.

[KevCarter]

The putter is anchored in the left hand, it hinges on a fixed point. Can't believe what another balls up with a rule decision

 

The rule in golf should be both hands should be within 2" of each other on the grip and no anchored point

 

So, Langer should change because you don't like the current rule?

 

I have no idea what your sentence in bold means?

[golfandfishing]

The putter is anchored in the left hand, it hinges on a fixed point. Can't believe what another balls up with a rule decision

 

The rule in golf should be both hands should be within 2" of each other on the grip and no anchored point

 

Why 2"? Why not 3? Why not 1? Why not touching? What if I want to use 1 hand to putt?

[2putttom]

At the end of the day it's the Champion's Tour so nobody is really going to care that much. Let's remember that first and foremost.

 

That said, I'm in favor of more traditional putting methods, in fact I think traditional putting methods are superior. Therefore any conversation on whether or not to allow alternative styles on the PGA Tour has to acknowledge that at most you're talking about a few wins here or there and the possibility of a major or two for someone who's ball-striking is top notch (i.e. Adam Scott, Sergio Garcia).

 

At the end of the day, the traditional method of putting is still superior across the board and is not really being threatened.

Geez.... who pissed in your cheerios?

[iBanesto]

Cheat

 

Care to elaborate?

 

Langer found a loophole that allows him to get around the rule while still using the same equipment and virtually the same stroke. Legally it's alright only because his left hand has moved 1/2" from where it original was. I suspect that according to most people it'd probably constitute an infringement on the spirit of the rule. Then again, maybe it doesn't since technically he's not "anchored" at any point.

 

It's really a grey area.

 

Let's avoid that moral debate though. There are thousands of things in life wherein we do and don't violate the spirit of rules/laws while still staying legal. That's between a person and themselves.

 

The highlight I saw showed him using an arm lock style like he used in the past and not an un-anchored broomstick. :dntknw:

 

Also there is no "loophole". An un-anchored stroke is EXPRESSLY ALLOWED from the infographic. So if he found a loophole, then the way was pointed out to him lol

 

He was using the broomstick last week. What is he using this week?

[Edaw68]

[gets popcorn and puts feet up to watch] This should be amusing.

[Vindog]

Cheat

 

Care to elaborate?

 

Langer found a loophole that allows him to get around the rule while still using the same equipment and virtually the same stroke. Legally it's alright only because his left hand has moved 1/2" from where it original was. I suspect that according to most people it'd probably constitute an infringement on the spirit of the rule. Then again, maybe it doesn't since technically he's not "anchored" at any point.

 

It's really a grey area.

 

Let's avoid that moral debate though. There are thousands of things in life wherein we do and don't violate the spirit of rules/laws while still staying legal. That's between a person and themselves.

 

The highlight I saw showed him using an arm lock style like he used in the past and not an un-anchored broomstick. :dntknw:

 

Also there is no "loophole". An un-anchored stroke is EXPRESSLY ALLOWED from the infographic. So if he found a loophole, then the way was pointed out to him lol

 

He was using the broomstick last week. What is he using this week?

 

From this week's highlight I found on pga tour dotcom he was using the "kuchar" style

[iBanesto]

[xxio]

If it's the one above pictured, he's used that way before so I'm sure the USGA has considered it and has not banned it.

[starsail85]

Make the putter max length 39"

 

Swinging the club from a fixed point should be illegal

[Langlands]

 

This picture is quite a few years old