Putter lie question

 rrkman ·  
rrkmanrrkman Members  1182WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,182
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Kenny Perry's putter
I was watching the Sony over the weekend and on Saturday, Kenny Perry was putting and they showed that ground level, behind the putter view. Well, the toe of his putter must have been about 10* off the ground....and I've read so much stuff lately about putter fitting and proper lie angle, etc....that this has been bothering me since. Is this just the way the craz-E is made or his putting style....any info would help get this out of my mind.



Thanks.
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  • sdremsdrem Members  498WRX Points: 0Posts: 498
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    The most common theory on putting is to be looking straight down over the ball and to have the lie angle of the putter be perfectly flat at address and at impact. Obviously not everyone putts that way. There is an article in Feb. Golf Digest about putting myths: #2 Set your eyes over the ball. This is by Pat O'Brien of Lakewood Country Club. I Think Dave Pelz would disagree with him. He advocates having the eyes directly over the aim line (from Dave Pelz's putting Bible). I see a lot of Pros who have the toe of their putter up, but Perry's is more extreme than most. Evidently it works for him, but I don't think you would want to teach that to the average golfer. If the lie is wrong at impact and there is loft at impact, the ball will be thrown left if the toe is up and to the right if the toe is down.
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  • VegasSharkVegasShark Members  38WRX Points: 0Posts: 38
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    Typically by having the toe up it is suppose to help you rotate throught the ball or follow the correct swing plane. Unless you are putting straight back, straight through you should have the toe slightly off the ground. Now I don't believe you need to do it to the extreme that Kenny does it, but this is the reason why he does it. I would guess he would miss a lot of putts to the right if he had the putter alligned flat to the ground.
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  • myndcraftmyndcraft Members  425WRX Points: 55Posts: 425 Greens
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    Hmm, I've always been told (and have read) that my eyes should be inside the ball. Thats also the way I was fit for my putter when I went to Studio B. Incidentally the toe of my putter is toe up (and I was fit for lie angle) although not to the extreme of Kenny Perry.
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  • rrkmanrrkman Members  1182WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,182
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    Thanks for the info....so, for him, does he aim right? Seems like an odd formula for a successful pro?.....but it seems to work.



    Plus, the more I think about toe up, I recall reading something about the Studio Select having a slightly raised toe because it is a more appealing look to pros. This isn't a quote or anything...just what I remember reading somewhere.



    This was all just really confusing to me because I remember seeing numerous articles in the past about proper fitting and based on the loft and having the toe up a certain amount would cause you to miss a putt so many inches to the left. I'll have to find the article so I can put actual number in here.



    Thanks again.
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  • rrkmanrrkman Members  1182WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,182
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    Here is an example of the numbers....from FAQs on Ralph Malby .com



    Is My Putter Lie Angle Correct And Does It Really Matter?

    The next time you are putting you should check to see if you have the correct lie angle on your putter. Look to see if your putter head is parallel to the ground (the putters toe is not pointed up in the air or pointed downward toward the green). Because a putter’s face has a loft angle (usually 3º to 4 ½º), the lie angle of your putter must be correct or you will induce a pull or a push into your putt at impact. For instance, if the toe of your putter is up in the air (say 3º too upright for your particular stance and stroke), then you will pull the ball approximately 1 5/8” left of the target on a 25 foot putt. You will miss the putt! This is a built-in equipment error that a proper putter lie angle fitting will eliminate. Any putter can be easily altered to fit any length to any golfer. Why make this game any harder than it is when you can easily do something about it?





    I guess the numbers aren't as large as I thought....if I can miss a 25' putt by less than 2", I should be happy.
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  • PuttingDoctorPuttingDoctor The Putting Doctor Members  2119WRX Points: 1Posts: 2,119 Platinum Tees
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    Proper fit of the lie angle will help you avoid trouble on the mis-hits and the occasional brush of the surface of the green. This is more prevalent as handicaps increase but we all do the 'chillidip' from time to time.



    A putter with a perfectly horizontal lie angle will not open or close if inadvertently scrubbed in the forward stroke.



    As far as eyes over the line the farther away from being eyes on the line the more your brain has to calculate the converging angle of aim from your eye vs aim of the putter face. Try aiming a handgun from the waist and see if you can hit much.



    Harvey P. said, "Take Dead Aim."
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  • rrkmanrrkman Members  1182WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,182
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    PuttingDoctor wrote on Jan 19 2009, 03:00 PM:
    Proper fit of the lie angle will help you avoid trouble on the mis-hits and the occasional brush of the surface of the green. This is more prevalent as handicaps increase but we all do the 'chillidip' from time to time.



    A putter with a perfectly horizontal lie angle will not open or close if inadvertently scrubbed in the forward stroke.



    As far as eyes over the line the farther away from being eyes on the line the more your brain has to calculate the converging angle of aim from your eye vs aim of the putter face. Try aiming a handgun from the waist and see if you can hit much.



    Harvey P. said, "Take Dead Aim."




    Thanks and that certainly makes sense....I never thought about that part of it. And, come to think of it, when I do 'drag' my putter, it tends to close slightly meaning that if my putter was adjust 'flatter', this might not happen as much, right? (the closing, not the drag image/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' /> )



    But, what I was thinking about is the angle of the putter head and the effect of the loft. Similar to hitting a wedge when the ball is above your feet. I know that these are the exact opposite as far as extremes (with a putter having only a few degrees of loft vs say 50* of a wedge) but wouldn't the toe up (say 10*) have atleast cause some 'pull' of the putt to the left? Or, is his putter adjusted somehow to offset that?
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  • walts00walts00 Members  1068WRX Points: 0Posts: 1,068
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    PuttingDoctor wrote on Jan 19 2009, 03:00 PM:
    Proper fit of the lie angle will help you avoid trouble on the mis-hits and the occasional brush of the surface of the green. This is more prevalent as handicaps increase but we all do the 'chillidip' from time to time.



    A putter with a perfectly horizontal lie angle will not open or close if inadvertently scrubbed in the forward stroke.



    As far as eyes over the line the farther away from being eyes on the line the more your brain has to calculate the converging angle of aim from your eye vs aim of the putter face. Try aiming a handgun from the waist and see if you can hit much.



    Harvey P. said, "Take Dead Aim."




    Oh man, the 'chillidip' with the putter. BY FAR the most embarrassing shot in golf. Could anything be worse? I have nightmares about taking a stroke and feeling that drag against the ground only to see my putt coast slowly off to the left. Everyone is always at a loss for words when something like this happens in my group. "ohh...uhhh...well...just a little short there!" image/cheesy.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':cheesy:' />
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  • sdremsdrem Members  498WRX Points: 0Posts: 498
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    If Kenny's putter would have 0* loft at impact (either by forward pressing his hands to deloft it or if he had it adjusted to 0* loft purposely) then the toe being up would not effect the line of the putt. Since Kenny likes to hook all of his other shots, maybe he aims everything to the right and lets the putter pull everything back to the left. It appears that his eye line is well inside of the target line.
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