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Fitting Tall Golfers With NO Chart or Preconceived Ideas!


rybo

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Do women's heads have a lower weight that might work?

 

Yes sometimes Womens heads are lighter.

Mizuno is the only company which is consistent with head weight (light/heavy).

 

I am pretty sure Ping has a keen idea too but their method is unclear to me.

Still, I've seen Ping sets at plus 1,5'' over length with a swing weight of E4 for the wedges With MOI close to 3000. Good luck with those clubs.

Other companies are a bit vague. I' ve seen women clubs with lighter heads from Titleist. But also without.

Boutique brands only have 1 head weight .

 

The weight port (invented by Tom Wishon who else) for Golfsmith is very usefull for adjustment once but unfortunately it is awkward to get the weights out

Irons with external weight plugs (like Ping or PXG) are what I like for proper assembly.

 

Over the years OEMs showed progress with micro-improvements for irons which work.

OEMs hardly care for exchangability of heads and shafts which is backward acting and short term thinking.

Where a modern quality head has the technical lifetime of +10 years; the marketing lifetime is less than two.

If there is a crisis in the industry; this constraint is one of the main causes.

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Do women's heads have a lower weight that might work?

 

Yes sometimes Womens heads are lighter.

Mizuno is the only company which is consistent with head weight (light/heavy).

 

I am pretty sure Ping has a keen idea too but their method is unclear to me.

Still, I've seen Ping sets at plus 1,5'' over length with a swing weight of E4 for the wedges With MOI close to 3000. Good luck with those clubs.

Other companies are a bit vague. I' ve seen women clubs with lighter heads from Titleist. But also without.

Boutique brands only have 1 head weight .

 

The weight port (invented by Tom Wishon who else) for Golfsmith is very usefull for adjustment once but unfortunately it is awkward to get the weights out

Irons with external weight plugs (like Ping or PXG) are what I like for proper assembly.

 

Over the years OEMs showed progress with micro-improvements for irons which work.

OEMs hardly care for exchangability of heads and shafts which is backward acting and short term thinking.

Where a modern quality head has the technical lifetime of +10 years; the marketing lifetime is less than two.

If there is a crisis in the industry; this constraint is one of the main causes.

Do the TM TP range from 6 or 7 years ago that had the weight port on the back start out light enough? I remember hitting them and enjoyed them but never pulled the trigger. I'm sure these could be picked up fairly cheap now.

SIM2 9.0 - Black Tie 8M3 X
16.5* TS3 - Tensei Blue 70X
SIM2 Max hyrbid  21*- Tensei Blue 70X
Srixon Z745 4-P Modus 3 130x
MG2 50, 54 and 58 hi toe
Machine Fat Back 38"
TP5X

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Do women's heads have a lower weight that might work?

 

Yes sometimes Womens heads are lighter.

Mizuno is the only company which is consistent with head weight (light/heavy).

 

I am pretty sure Ping has a keen idea too but their method is unclear to me.

Still, I've seen Ping sets at plus 1,5'' over length with a swing weight of E4 for the wedges With MOI close to 3000. Good luck with those clubs.

Other companies are a bit vague. I' ve seen women clubs with lighter heads from Titleist. But also without.

Boutique brands only have 1 head weight .

 

The weight port (invented by Tom Wishon who else) for Golfsmith is very usefull for adjustment once but unfortunately it is awkward to get the weights out

Irons with external weight plugs (like Ping or PXG) are what I like for proper assembly.

 

Over the years OEMs showed progress with micro-improvements for irons which work.

OEMs hardly care for exchangability of heads and shafts which is backward acting and short term thinking.

Where a modern quality head has the technical lifetime of +10 years; the marketing lifetime is less than two.

If there is a crisis in the industry; this constraint is one of the main causes.

Do the TM TP range from 6 or 7 years ago that had the weight port on the back start out light enough? I remember hitting them and enjoyed them but never pulled the trigger. I'm sure these could be picked up fairly cheap now.

 

Hah I literally just sold those a few months ago. Never tried removing that weight though.

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When you change the lie of a club, aren't you trying to match it to your swing? Not the other way around.

 

If a club is playing at the correct lie angle for me, and I bend it more upright because it's too short, that isn't going to suddenly change my swing path. Isn't the club just going to be too upright for me?

 

No, not necessarily. This is why it doesn't make sense to talk in absolute, as it really doesn't exist. We have been changing lie angles for decades to help with ball flight, and that doesn't necessarily mean to keep the scoring lines parallel at impact. Tilting one way or another, can be done on purpose to help manipulate flight to a desired outcome.

 

Right, to help with ball flight. But it's not going to fix a length issue.

 

Read back through the thread...

 

My original question wasn't directed toward you

 

I was making the point that a lie adjustment wasn't going to fix a length issue. Although every fitter I've ever talked to assumed I needed upright irons without ever seeing more swing a club. lol

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When you change the lie of a club, aren't you trying to match it to your swing? Not the other way around.

 

If a club is playing at the correct lie angle for me, and I bend it more upright because it's too short, that isn't going to suddenly change my swing path. Isn't the club just going to be too upright for me?

 

No, not necessarily. This is why it doesn't make sense to talk in absolute, as it really doesn't exist. We have been changing lie angles for decades to help with ball flight, and that doesn't necessarily mean to keep the scoring lines parallel at impact. Tilting one way or another, can be done on purpose to help manipulate flight to a desired outcome.

 

Right, to help with ball flight. But it's not going to fix a length issue.

 

Read back through the thread...

 

My original question wasn't directed toward you

 

I was making the point that a lie adjustment wasn't going to fix a length issue. Although every fitter I've ever talked to assumed I needed upright irons without ever seeing more swing a club. lol

 

Those people aren't fitters. They may want to call themselves that, but that doesn't make them one.

2024 Building In-progress

Qi10 Core Head 9* w/ AD-DI 6S  (I heart you AD DI and will never sway from you again)
Qi10 Tour 3W with shaft TBD
Callaway UW 17* with shaft TBD

Titleist TS2 19* Hybrid at 20* w/ PX Evenflow Blue 85 6.0

4-PW Srixon ZX7s w/ DG AMT White S300s
MG2 TW Grind 56/60 at 54/58
Spider Tour X3

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One thing I'd like to throw in for us tall guys -- the height of your shoes matters!

 

When your wedges are too short/borderline too short, every eighth or quarter of an inch counts. A shoe heel that is a quarter inch taller than another shoe's heel just made your wedge a quarter inch shorter. I've seen some golf shoes that have a heel a solid half-inch higher than other models available. I avoid those like the plague, and those are a lot of the golf shoes on the market. All of my shoes are flat-heeled athletic-like shoes -- Nike or New Balance (also have to be available somewhere between a 13W and a 14W). My flattest golf shoe (New Balance Minimus) is a half inch lower to the ground (inside the hell) than my Asics Gel jogging shoes I normally wear as tennis shoes. If I wear tennis shoes to the range or in a golf store to hit balls I can't hit anything but the long clubs with them on.

 

I have a thin-soled "old" gap wedge (same length as current one) in my office at work that I take a few short shots with every day (aim for bouncing it off, or occasionally when aggressive, dropping it in, the trash can 10-12 feet away off of hard office carpet). With full-heeled dress shoes on, it is sure hard to crouch down low enough to not blade it. It's not hard in my lower golf shoes though.

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Here's a problem short wedges causes tall people: The pivot angle of your shoulders is too vertical. What this causes is thin/fat issues with wedges. What I notice is that even with my +2.25" sand wedge, I still have a steep pivot on my shoulders. Therefore, when I begin my backswing, my lead (left) shoulder actually starts moving steeply toward the ground first. That brings my club closer to the ground. Now, I manage that by going back with it, but on short shots with a short backswing, when I then begin the foreswing "early" my club is too close to the ground and the pivot angle of my shoulders is just driving it closer to the ground. Can you say Boom-Chunka-Chunk-Chunk? Maybe I even overcompensate for the problem and blade it a bit sometimes? If I could shallow out my shoulder turn like I can with an 8 or 9 iron, that problem is greatly reduced, and then my hit down on the ball with a short iron ability really becomes an asset. As it is, it's hit and miss. I'm really starting to think that the 38" 9 iron in my bag is really my minimum length for consistent great contact. I'm 6'5" with a wrist to floor between 38" and 39" (in my golf shoes!).

 

Heck, today on short par 3, I had to hit a full swing PW off of a tee. Sure enough, I bladed it. I could have teed it a quarter inch higher but that would have seemed weird for a pitching wedge -- I tee everything low but my driver. Same hole with tees further back/wind not at my back, and I never blade my normal 9 iron. I've bladed the PW under similar set up conditions many times though.

 

Oh, and note, on the club lengths in my signature, I measure them the "Ping way" -- ignore the grip cap, so by the measurement method many use my clubs are really ~3/16" longer than what is actually in my signature.

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On playing the driver "longer":

 

I play it to what feels comfortable. I'm 6'5" with a wrist to floor between 38" and 39" (in my golf shoes!). I've been between 47.25" and 45" with various drivers over the last few years. What I've found is 45.75" to 46.25" is what lets me find the center of the club face the best. Shorter gets me toe hits. Longer gets me more erratic hits -- but I can swing the long club fine; it doesn't feel unnatural or anything. What I do like about the "moderate" length I'm most comfortable with as a tall golfer is that I've recently found I can set up tall, upright and still swing a little vertical at the ball. This is good, because that vertical setup goes straight. Think about it -- does a vertical wedge set up go big left or big right? No. Neither does a vertical set up with any other club. Put a lot of room between you and the ball, and you can go in to out, out to in, depending on ball position, you can have your arms too far away from, chicken-wing your right (trailing) arm, and you even lose your "frame of reference" accuracy for the center of the face (same reason why it's good to have your eye above the ball when putting).

 

Same with a 3-wood. Mine is at 43.875" (again, Ping measurement method ignoring the 3/16" grip cap). If I need to, I can even choke up about a half inch (same as I can do with my driver), to be sure I hit it the way I want. That tall, upright set up is great. I bet my driver, wood and hybrid are the only clubs in my bag I can choke up any and hit it right on flat ground.

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Where do you hit the ball on the club face?

 

If it's not in the center, then 80% of the time it's on the toe if you're playing clubs too short.

 

The shorter my club, the more likely it's on the toe, and the more likely I've missed the center and hit the toe.

 

This is just my estimate, but I'd bet that 35% of my wedge shots are a half inch or more toward the toe, 25% of my 8-9 iron shots are a half inch (occasionally more) toward the toe, 15% of my 6-7 iron shots are a half inch (but rarely more toward the toe), and by the time I've gotten to a 3-5 iron only about 5% of my shots have reached as far as a half inch toward the toe. This is because those clubs I miss toward the toe more often are "too short" for me, even at their way over standard lengths. Find the clubs you rarely miss out on the toe on, and that's a good indication of the length that fits you well. It's also why I will always play a club with great forgiveness for toe misses, no matter how low my handicap goes. Even if I get to scratch in years future, I'm still going to play G-level clubs from a forgiveness perspective.

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I think it was about 2002 and I was at a tournament and there was a photographer taking pictures of players DTL hitting their drives off the 10th tee. He gave me a few of my pictures and the first thing I noticed was that the 45 inch long driver looked to short. At that point I started experimenting with drivers up to 48 inches. I have always been a little wild with the driver but even more so at 48. Finally settled on around 46 inches as the best fit I could get.

 

BTW- my wrist to floor is 41.75 inches with golf shoes on. Any other guys have a wrist to floor in that range?

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I think it was about 2002 and I was at a tournament and there was a photographer taking pictures of players DTL hitting their drives off the 10th tee. He gave me a few of my pictures and the first thing I noticed was that the 45 inch long driver looked to short. At that point I started experimenting with drivers up to 48 inches. I have always been a little wild with the driver but even more so at 48. Finally settled on around 46 inches as the best fit I could get.

 

BTW- my wrist to floor is 41.75 inches with golf shoes on. Any other guys have a wrist to floor in that range?

 

Yeah, the guy in the black shirt on the right.

265efe6554b5d7e9274eebeb2baa823f_crop_exact.jpg?w=1500&h=1500&q=85

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Really enjoying following this. It's too bad the other thread got shut down. I know it's made myself look at the reality of the clubs I'm using.

 

I have no chance of physically keeping that posture angle, and expect to play this game without lower back problems.

 

So i have a math problem for you guys:)...

 

I want to build a set of ping eye 2 at 2 inches over standard, and around a standard lie.

 

Here is my understanding in this process to create this club...

1. Get heads of the flattest color dot.

2. Find a lighter xstiff shaft.

3. Find a larger grip that can help offset the weight.

 

Am I in the ballpark here? My mind is always in the instruction area of the website. I really don't know much about swing weights and lie angles. Any help would be greatly appreciated and keep this thread going! Don't let it turn sideways like my thread. A lot of great information from instructors and fitters that have been dealing with this for over 30 years was lost forever.

"Patience without understanding"

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Really enjoying following this. It's too bad the other thread got shut down. I know it's made myself look at the reality of the clubs I'm using.

 

I have no chance of physically keeping that posture angle, and expect to play this game without lower back problems.

 

So i have a math problem for you guys:)...

 

I want to build a set of ping eye 2 at 2 inches over standard, and around a standard lie.

 

Here is my understanding in this process to create this club...

1. Get heads of the flattest color dot.

2. Find a lighter xstiff shaft.

3. Find a larger grip that can help offset the weight.

 

Am I in the ballpark here? My mind is always in the instruction area of the website. I really don't know much about swing weights and lie angles. Any help would be greatly appreciated and keep this thread going! Don't let it turn sideways like my thread. A lot of great information from instructors and fitters that have been dealing with this for over 30 years was lost forever.

 

If you're set on 2" over and a standard lie then build them that way. I would suggest determining your low length limit at a 64* lie angle and build the set from this point. This way you will know for sure if you have enough length for the shortest clubs.

 

1. NO, start from standard lie, determine length you need for your body proportions then adjust lie angle to your swing. Using flatter clubs will require additional length to make the clubs work.

2. Yes, Steelfiber i95 X's are pretty stout! Built a PW and 4 iron for a quick demo yesterday and now I'm thinking of softstepping them. UST Recoil Prototype's have the thickest walls I have ever seen on a golf shaft, the tips are nearly solid. My cutoff saw was laboring a bit cutting the butt ends, incredibly strong material!

3. Generally yes, a grip is the only thing a golfer actually touches and some people are quite sensitive to both size and feel of their grips. The extra weight of midsize and oversized will help with the overall balance of the club.

 

The other thread was great! The info is not lost just harder to find then it should be.

 

EDIT:

 

2. Shaft weight - while a lighter shaft will lower the overall heft, a heavier shaft may work better for some, especially when matched with a heavier oversized grip. This has to be fitted to the golfer.

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BTW- my wrist to floor is 41.75 inches with golf shoes on. Any other guys have a wrist to floor in that range?

 

I feel kind of stupid saying this but I don't think I even know what my WTF is with golf shoes on? Measured the other day when this thread popped up but I was in the house in bare feet! 40"....Might be 40.5" or so with shoes on?

Ping G425 10.5
Ping G25 15/18
Srixon ZX7 4-PW
Vokey SM6 Raw 50,54,58
Odyssey 11 Tour Lined CS
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BTW- my wrist to floor is 41.75 inches with golf shoes on. Any other guys have a wrist to floor in that range?

 

I feel kind of stupid saying this but I don't think I even know what my WTF is with golf shoes on? Measured the other day when this thread popped up but I was in the house in bare feet! 40"....Might be 40.5" or so with shoes on?

 

I don't know that I measured mine with golf shoes. Depending on the model I wear, as someone stated earlier, I may be more like a 40.5" or 41" WTF. Yay... :russian_roulette:

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One thing I'd like to throw in for us tall guys -- the height of your shoes matters!

 

When your wedges are too short/borderline too short, every eighth or quarter of an inch counts. A shoe heel that is a quarter inch taller than another shoe's heel just made your wedge a quarter inch shorter. I've seen some golf shoes that have a heel a solid half-inch higher than other models available. I avoid those like the plague, and those are a lot of the golf shoes on the market. All of my shoes are flat-heeled athletic-like shoes -- Nike or New Balance (also have to be available somewhere between a 13W and a 14W). My flattest golf shoe (New Balance Minimus) is a half inch lower to the ground (inside the hell) than my Asics Gel jogging shoes I normally wear as tennis shoes. If I wear tennis shoes to the range or in a golf store to hit balls I can't hit anything but the long clubs with them on.

 

I have a thin-soled "old" gap wedge (same length as current one) in my office at work that I take a few short shots with every day (aim for bouncing it off, or occasionally when aggressive, dropping it in, the trash can 10-12 feet away off of hard office carpet). With full-heeled dress shoes on, it is sure hard to crouch down low enough to not blade it. It's not hard in my lower golf shoes though.

 

Lol at how spot on this is. My golf shoes have thinner soles than my sneakers. I blade everything I look at with a standard wedge wearing sneakers. A wedge at +1 is ok half the time in golf shoes, and at +2 I can hit it in sneakers.

 

The folks at the golf store chuckled sometimes when I demoed clubs and brought my golf shoes. No way they can relate. I agree... Have them go stand on a box and see how they fare.

 

Love the thread. I'll post more as I get time, as I'm also going down this path.

 

SLDR 9.5 w/ Speeder 757
Titleist 904f 4W w/ S300
Ping G20 17* w/ Aldila RIP Alpha 85 2.0
Ping S56 5-9 w/ KBS Tour Stiff
Vokey 46, 52, 56 & 60
Ping WACK-E putter

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Fun birthday read.... I have played and hit 1000's of balls with rybo. Today I can honestly say he hit the purest shots I've seen him hit. He hit it pretty pure prior to this. His setup was as natural as could be and the swing was free. I'm a midget compared to him but I hit 1/2" longer clubs due to a spinal fusion. Once he gets this all dialed in I see no chance for the poor other members in the club!

 

Take it to the bank he is on to something good for sasquatch sized golfers!!!

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Fun birthday read.... I have played and hit 1000's of balls with rybo. Today I can honestly say he hit the purest shots I've seen him hit. He hit it pretty pure prior to this. His setup was as natural as could be and the swing was free. I'm a midget compared to him but I hit 1/2" longer clubs due to a spinal fusion. Once he gets this all dialed in I see no chance for the poor other members in the club!

 

Take it to the bank he is on to something good for sasquatch sized golfers!!!

 

Sweet!!

 

Enjoy the lobster and steak!!

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Haha, I like it! Could us this one too...

 

Good stuff since my nickname is Squatch! It started when I was leaving noticeable foot prints in the greens in the summer when they are real soft from the daily rains! I think Hyrprymate was the one who first said it many years ago when we were members at the same club.

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