TW vs Spieth @ 100 tour starts.

[hdr_ric]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

That is a pretty good guess. I doubt it will be more than that. I said in an old thread year or so ago that he'd do very well to have a Tom Watson like career (40 and 8 I think).

 

I'd guess 30-35 wins including 4-7 majors.

 

I think Rory will end up with more majors and more wins than Jordan. (Though maybe not more PGA tour wins if Jordan keeps on playing 26 events a year).

[Roadking2003]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

That is a pretty good guess. I doubt it will be more than that. I said in an old thread year or so ago that he'd do very well to have a Tom Watson like career (40 and 8 I think).

 

I'd guess 30-35 wins including 4-7 majors.

 

I think Rory will end up with more majors and more wins than Jordan. (Though maybe not more PGA tour wins if Jordan keeps on playing 26 events a year).

 

I agree on Spieth. I predict a Phil or Watson level career.

 

But Rory has some commitment and attitude issues and I'm not sure I would forecast him to be any better over the long haul.

 

BTW, Spieth has only played 26 events in one year. He played 21 PGA events last year and Rory played 18.

[mwkbmw]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

He would probably take that in a heartbeat if you offered it to him. I think he has a good chance to reach those numbers.

 

I don't think he would take it. I believe his goals and expectations are higher than that. I think he would take his chances on being able to achieve them as opposed to settling for anything.

[whr]

Good thing Curtis Strange tried to set him (Tiger) straight and tell him to temper his expectations.

https://www.youtube....h?v=iEesh2lJdgE

 

Shooter McGavin's character was based on Curtis Strange.

[playa]

I don't agree. Tiger was a mental warrior the likes of which are seen once in a generation. If that. If he was in his prime he would do exactly what he did before. The current guys won't say it but I'm sure when alone with their thoughts they believe they are the best ever. Fine. That's a great attitude. But the truth is none of them have ever faced the real deal. They would be roadkill just like the best of the rest were 15 years ago.

The only guy I see right now with that kind of potential is Speith. He is young enough and doesn't seem to be comfortable enough to lose his focus. Jason Day is great but physically fragile. Rory has all the tools but honestly I don't see him even golfing 5 years from now. I think life will soon be pulling him away from the circus.

Yep. Tiger would still be playing shots nobody else can play. He would still be making clutch putts nobody else can make. He would still shoot the same scores he did (if not lower). He would still be out course managing everybody else in the field. The halve his wins comment is really quite absurd. He was so far ahead of everybody else it wouldn't matter how much time has passed or how much the game has moved on. Anyone who doesn't think Tiger would curb stomp the current crop of top players should go back and watch what tiger could do with a golf club and ball 15 years ago, then try to imagine how good that tiger would be now with modern equipment.

[redfirebird08]

Yep. Tiger would still be playing shots nobody else can play. He would still be making clutch putts nobody else can make. He would still be out course managimg everybody else in the field. The halve his wins comment is really quite absurd. He was so far ahead of everybody else it wouldn't matter how much time has passed or how much the game has moved on. Anyone who doesn't think Tiger would curb stomp the current crop of top players should go back and watch what tiger could do with a golf club and ball 15 years ago, then try to imagine how good that tiger would be now with modern equipment.

 

People seem to have very short memories. I don't understand how you can watch a post-scandal, surgeries out the wazoo version of Tiger win 5 times on Tour in 2013 (including THE deepest tournament in golf) against the same guys everyone is drooling over today and think, "Gee, yeah I think 1997-2008 Tiger without all the physical and mental baggage would get his butt kicked today."

 

Now I do believe fields get better and deeper every year. That's just common sense. But then again Tiger won 8 of 15 starts on Tour in 2006, the highest win percentage for a full season in his career (including the legendary 2000 season). In theory he should have been winning a lower percentage of tournaments in 2006 than he was in the late 1990's or early 2000's.

 

When you get right down to it, everything about his career defies logic. This includes his incredible accomplishments on the course and the mistakes with his golf swing, training, personal life, etc.

[Dave230]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

That is a pretty good guess. I doubt it will be more than that. I said in an old thread year or so ago that he'd do very well to have a Tom Watson like career (40 and 8 I think).

 

I'd guess 30-35 wins including 4-7 majors.

 

I think Rory will end up with more majors and more wins than Jordan. (Though maybe not more PGA tour wins if Jordan keeps on playing 26 events a year).

 

Yeah Spieth will have more PGA Tour wins than McIlroy because he'll play more but I think McIlroy will have more if you combine European Tour and PGA Tour.

 

I really hope that Tiger doesn't ruin all future comparisons because if Spieth had a Tom Watson career, that's still one of the best of all-time.

 

Watson's weakest stat is probably the 39 PGA Tour wins but that's because he only won three times after 35. But PGA Player of the Year six times, three Vardon Trophies, eight majors (five Opens in particular marking him out as maybe the best links player ever), beating Nicklaus in majors, then you have him nearly winning the Open in his late 50s. My worry is that some people would still call that 'not being Tiger'.

[BillyZ2]

Tiger's anger probably shortened his career.

 

[playa]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

That is a pretty good guess. I doubt it will be more than that. I said in an old thread year or so ago that he'd do very well to have a Tom Watson like career (40 and 8 I think).

 

I'd guess 30-35 wins including 4-7 majors.

 

I think Rory will end up with more majors and more wins than Jordan. (Though maybe not more PGA tour wins if Jordan keeps on playing 26 events a year).

 

Yeah Spieth will have more PGA Tour wins than McIlroy because he'll play more but I think McIlroy will have more if you combine European Tour and PGA Tour.

 

I really hope that Tiger doesn't ruin all future comparisons because if Spieth had a Tom Watson career, that's still one of the best of all-time.

 

Watson's weakest stat is probably the 39 PGA Tour wins but that's because he only won three times after 35. But PGA Player of the Year six times, three Vardon Trophies, eight majors (five Opens in particular marking him out as maybe the best links player ever), beating Nicklaus in majors, then you have him nearly winning the Open in his late 50s. My worry is that some people would still call that 'not being Tiger'.

Yeah I had to laugh at the Tom Watson comparison, almost implying that that would be a solod but not spectacular career. I still rate Seve as the second best player of the last 40 years, but Watson's career is arguably bettet and certainly not one you would use in the same conversation as Spieth at this early stage.

[Roadking2003]

Yeah I had to laugh at the Tom Watson comparison, almost implying that that would be a solod but not spectacular career. I still rate Seve as the second best player of the last 40 years, but Watson's career is arguably bettet and certainly not one you would use in the same conversation as Spieth at this early stage.

 

I would rank Watson somewhere around the 7th or 8th best career ever. Quite spectacular.

 

The odds are good that neither Spieth, Rory nor Day will achieve that level.

[Redman]

I don't agree. Tiger was a mental warrior the likes of which are seen once in a generation. If that. If he was in his prime he would do exactly what he did before. The current guys won't say it but I'm sure when alone with their thoughts they believe they are the best ever. Fine. That's a great attitude. But the truth is none of them have ever faced the real deal. They would be roadkill just like the best of the rest were 15 years ago.

The only guy I see right now with that kind of potential is Speith. He is young enough and doesn't seem to be comfortable enough to lose his focus. Jason Day is great but physically fragile. Rory has all the tools but honestly I don't see him even golfing 5 years from now. I think life will soon be pulling him away from the circus.

Yep. Tiger would still be playing shots nobody else can play. He would still be making clutch putts nobody else can make. He would still shoot the same scores he did (if not lower). He would still be out course managing everybody else in the field. The halve his wins comment is really quite absurd. He was so far ahead of everybody else it wouldn't matter how much time has passed or how much the game has moved on. Anyone who doesn't think Tiger would curb stomp the current crop of top players should go back and watch what tiger could do with a golf club and ball 15 years ago, then try to imagine how good that tiger would be now with modern equipment.

 

This! 100%. Tiger would have most likely won more, which is absolutely crazy to think, if not for equipment helping so many more players. Tiger had so much better control over moving that old spinny ball than everyone else. When the ball began to stay straight it brought a lot more competition. I can't believe I've actually seen people say he would have won half as much, haha. That is just plain nuts. It has to be so much hate for Tiger that it's impossible to even be realistic. As others have stated, look at scoring average. And look at 2013. He was a shell of himself with a terrible golf swing and won 5 times, haha. It's a damn shame we won't get to see him finish his career healthy. I too struggle with a bad back (disk issues) so I empathize with the guy.

[Roadking2003]

This! 100%. Tiger would have most likely won more, which is absolutely crazy to think, if not for equipment helping so many more players. Tiger had so much better control over moving that old spinny ball than everyone else. When the ball began to stay straight it brought a lot more competition. I can't believe I've actually seen people say he would have won half as much, haha. That is just plain nuts. It has to be so much hate for Tiger that it's impossible to even be realistic. As others have stated, look at scoring average. And look at 2013. He was a shell of himself with a terrible golf swing and won 5 times, haha. It's a damn shame we won't get to see him finish his career healthy. I too struggle with a bad back (disk issues) so I empathize with the guy.

 

So, if somebody disagrees with your Tiger assessment they are a hater?

[Chazb]

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

If I remember correctly Tiger had five wins in 2012 or 2013 on tour and was player of the year.

[Shilgy]

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

If I remember correctly Tiger had five wins in 2012 or 2013 on tour and was player of the year.

There ya go I guess that proves it. At his peak against the riffraff he played against he was winning 8-9 events a year. So 5 is about right. :)

[hdr_ric]

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

Tiger definitely changed the game, especially at the fitness level. Tiger had the advantage over the field every week physically and mentally. My question is would Tiger still dominate today at his prime with the level of competition today? I think his win total would be cut in half

If I remember correctly Tiger had five wins in 2012 or 2013 on tour and was player of the year.

There ya go I guess that proves it. At his peak against the riffraff he played against he was winning 8-9 events a year. So 5 is about right. :)

 

I think his point was that if a clearly severely diminished tiger could win 3 times in 2012 and 5 times in 2013, then the "good" tiger of 2000-2009 would be expected to win a heck of a lot more against the "deeper" fields.

 

However, the counter argument some will use is that the fields didn't get magically "better and deeper" until 2014 and onwards (when tiger was essentially on the shelf hurt).

[Shilgy]

^^ I'll work on n making my sarcasm clearer.

 

As to the fields they seemed to have been strongest in the 50's through the 70's. Starting right after ww2 when other sports were harmed by attrition. Then continued to get stronger through 1996 at which point the following year all the good players went home and the next 20 years were Tiger against a bunch of scrubs. Then, as you pointed out, Woods got hurt which made fields better again.

[cdnglf]

^^ I'll work on n making my sarcasm clearer.

 

As to the fields they seemed to have been strongest in the 50's through the 70's. Starting right after ww2 when other sports were harmed by attrition. Then continued to get stronger through 1996 at which point the following year all the good players went home and the next 20 years were Tiger against a bunch of scrubs. Then, as you pointed out, Woods got hurt which made fields better again.

 

They were also really good in 1998 and 2004.

[lowheel]

We can piss and moan all your want but I think we are all saying basically the same thing. JS is better than most but he won't reach a Tiger level dominance. So let's give our best predictions on how his career stats will look. I'll go first:

 

Wins=35 PGA tour

Majors=7

 

That is a pretty good guess. I doubt it will be more than that. I said in an old thread year or so ago that he'd do very well to have a Tom Watson like career (40 and 8 I think).

 

I'd guess 30-35 wins including 4-7 majors.

 

I think Rory will end up with more majors and more wins than Jordan. (Though maybe not more PGA tour wins if Jordan keeps on playing 26 events a year).

 

Yeah Spieth will have more PGA Tour wins than McIlroy because he'll play more but I think McIlroy will have more if you combine European Tour and PGA Tour.

 

I really hope that Tiger doesn't ruin all future comparisons because if Spieth had a Tom Watson career, that's still one of the best of all-time.

 

Watson's weakest stat is probably the 39 PGA Tour wins but that's because he only won three times after 35. But PGA Player of the Year six times, three Vardon Trophies, eight majors (five Opens in particular marking him out as maybe the best links player ever), beating Nicklaus in majors, then you have him nearly winning the Open in his late 50s. My worry is that some people would still call that 'not being Tiger'.

Yeah I had to laugh at the Tom Watson comparison, almost implying that that would be a solod but not spectacular career. I still rate Seve as the second best player of the last 40 years, but Watson's career is arguably bettet and certainly not one you would use in the same conversation as Spieth at this early stage.

 

Wow you have Seve ahead of Watson?