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Titleist golf ball study; Finally, some facts added to the debate


Roadking2003

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I haven't read anyone saying the USGA should not regulate the ball. We all agree they should and do.

Titleist TSR4 9° Tensei AV White 65

Titleist TSi3 strong 3w 13.5° Tensei AV White 70

Titleist TS3 19°  hybrid Tensei Blue/Titleist TSR3 24° Diamana Ahina

Titleist T150 5-pw Nippon Pro Modus 125

Vokey SM8 50° F & 56° M SM9 60°M

Cameron Newport w/ flow neck by Lamont/ Cameron Del Mar

 



 

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^^Tex

I hope you're wrong. Any change that would result in only one group getting penalized is wrong wrong wrong. If the player hitting it 300 is now at 270 and the 240 is still at 240 how is that a solution?

You threw in the ball as well. We were discussing just club head size. But any change that disproportionately affects just one group of players cannot be tolerated.

Which is also imo went the so called "Masters ball" is a terrible idea. Telling players they have to play a certain ball only suits certain players. Some like a softer ball, some spinnier, some firmer. And it would be a disaster as no player would be comfortable playing a ball they do not know the characteristics of on all shots.

 

Here's why I don't think what I described is a problem. In my opinion, the modern ball and the driver club head size gives the faster swing player or longer hitter an advantage over the slower swinger player or shorter hitter. In my mind, what I describe "rectifies" a current imbalance. Of course, my wife would probably tell you that "in my mind" just means I'm probably wrong more often than I'm right. I know it seems that way when she and I are having "discussion", lol.

 

You are wrong, and should rather spend more time with your wife, or try to improve your game - without looking at others: ;)

 

 

 

...this is just to show you, that it is possible to make good contact at higher speed, but still missing fairways.

 

-

 

The advantage higher swing speed players have, is that they can also swing slower...

 

...but a slow swing speed player can not go faster (at least without losing control).

 

Thus, a bigger sized club head, a hotter club face, and a longer travelling ball is helping more the slow swing speed player, than the fast swing speed player.

 

There is a reason why (oversized) game improvement stuff is meant to help the slow amateur.

 

-

 

If all is said and done, the farther the ball travels, the more accurate one has to be.

 

The farther the ball goes, the more it shows the weaknesses of a player - and real talent!

 

A even further restricted ball, would cover the weaknesses more, than a unrestricted ball.

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^^Tex

I hope you're wrong. Any change that would result in only one group getting penalized is wrong wrong wrong. If the player hitting it 300 is now at 270 and the 240 is still at 240 how is that a solution?

You threw in the ball as well. We were discussing just club head size. But any change that disproportionately affects just one group of players cannot be tolerated.

Which is also imo went the so called "Masters ball" is a terrible idea. Telling players they have to play a certain ball only suits certain players. Some like a softer ball, some spinnier, some firmer. And it would be a disaster as no player would be comfortable playing a ball they do not know the characteristics of on all shots.

 

Here's why I don't think what I described is a problem. In my opinion, the modern ball and the driver club head size gives the faster swing player or longer hitter an advantage over the slower swinger player or shorter hitter. In my mind, what I describe "rectifies" a current imbalance. Of course, my wife would probably tell you that "in my mind" just means I'm probably wrong more often than I'm right. I know it seems that way when she and I are having "discussion", lol.

 

You are wrong, and should rather spend more time with your wife, or try to improve your game - without looking at others: ;)

 

 

 

...this is just to show you, that it is possible to make good contact at higher speed, but still missing fairways.

 

-

 

The advantage higher swing speed players have, is that they can also swing slower...

 

...but a slow swing speed player can not go faster (at least without losing control).

 

Thus, a bigger sized club head, a hotter club face, and a longer travelling ball is helping more the slow swing speed player, than the fast swing speed player.

 

There is a reason why (oversized) game improvement stuff is meant to help the slow amateur.

 

-

 

If all is said and done, the farther the ball travels, the more accurate one has to be.

 

The farther the ball goes, the more it shows the weaknesses of a player - and real talent!

 

A even further restricted ball, would cover the weaknesses more, than a unrestricted ball.

 

I have definitely been wrong before. :swoon:

The wife just retired (I was already retired) so we are spending more time together. :taunt:

She has won the ladies club championship twice in the last 5 years which is two more times than I have won it. So yes, I need to improve my game. But, hey, my handicap index is lower than hers right now, which is not always the case.

And I'm not quite sure what you mean by "without looking at others". But there are a lot of things I'm not sure of.

 

All that being said, I don't agree with the rest of your post. But that's okay.

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^^Tex

I hope you're wrong. Any change that would result in only one group getting penalized is wrong wrong wrong. If the player hitting it 300 is now at 270 and the 240 is still at 240 how is that a solution?

You threw in the ball as well. We were discussing just club head size. But any change that disproportionately affects just one group of players cannot be tolerated.

Which is also imo went the so called "Masters ball" is a terrible idea. Telling players they have to play a certain ball only suits certain players. Some like a softer ball, some spinnier, some firmer. And it would be a disaster as no player would be comfortable playing a ball they do not know the characteristics of on all shots.

 

Here's why I don't think what I described is a problem. In my opinion, the modern ball and the driver club head size gives the faster swing player or longer hitter an advantage over the slower swinger player or shorter hitter. In my mind, what I describe "rectifies" a current imbalance. Of course, my wife would probably tell you that "in my mind" just means I'm probably wrong more often than I'm right. I know it seems that way when she and I are having "discussion", lol.

 

You are wrong, and should rather spend more time with your wife, or try to improve your game - without looking at others: ;)

 

 

 

...this is just to show you, that it is possible to make good contact at higher speed, but still missing fairways.

 

-

 

The advantage higher swing speed players have, is that they can also swing slower...

 

...but a slow swing speed player can not go faster (at least without losing control).

 

Thus, a bigger sized club head, a hotter club face, and a longer travelling ball is helping more the slow swing speed player, than the fast swing speed player.

 

There is a reason why (oversized) game improvement stuff is meant to help the slow amateur.

 

-

 

If all is said and done, the farther the ball travels, the more accurate one has to be.

 

The farther the ball goes, the more it shows the weaknesses of a player - and real talent!

 

A even further restricted ball, would cover the weaknesses more, than a unrestricted ball.

 

I have definitely been wrong before. :swoon:

The wife just retired (I was already retired) so we are spending more time together. :taunt:

She has won the ladies club championship twice in the last 5 years which is two more times than I have won it. So yes, I need to improve my game. But, hey, my handicap index is lower than hers right now, which is not always the case.

And I'm not quite sure what you mean by "without looking at others". But there are a lot of things I'm not sure of.

 

All that being said, I don't agree with the rest of your post. But that's okay.

 

LOL, you made my day!

 

I try to be a nice guy, and don´t wish you to win the ladies club championship... :derisive:

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^^Tex

I hope you're wrong. Any change that would result in only one group getting penalized is wrong wrong wrong. If the player hitting it 300 is now at 270 and the 240 is still at 240 how is that a solution?

You threw in the ball as well. We were discussing just club head size. But any change that disproportionately affects just one group of players cannot be tolerated.

Which is also imo went the so called "Masters ball" is a terrible idea. Telling players they have to play a certain ball only suits certain players. Some like a softer ball, some spinnier, some firmer. And it would be a disaster as no player would be comfortable playing a ball they do not know the characteristics of on all shots.

 

Here's why I don't think what I described is a problem. In my opinion, the modern ball and the driver club head size gives the faster swing player or longer hitter an advantage over the slower swinger player or shorter hitter. In my mind, what I describe "rectifies" a current imbalance. Of course, my wife would probably tell you that "in my mind" just means I'm probably wrong more often than I'm right. I know it seems that way when she and I are having "discussion", lol.

 

You are wrong, and should rather spend more time with your wife, or try to improve your game - without looking at others: ;)

 

 

 

...this is just to show you, that it is possible to make good contact at higher speed, but still missing fairways.

 

-

 

The advantage higher swing speed players have, is that they can also swing slower...

 

...but a slow swing speed player can not go faster (at least without losing control).

 

Thus, a bigger sized club head, a hotter club face, and a longer travelling ball is helping more the slow swing speed player, than the fast swing speed player.

 

There is a reason why (oversized) game improvement stuff is meant to help the slow amateur.

 

-

 

If all is said and done, the farther the ball travels, the more accurate one has to be.

 

The farther the ball goes, the more it shows the weaknesses of a player - and real talent!

 

A even further restricted ball, would cover the weaknesses more, than a unrestricted ball.

 

I have definitely been wrong before. :swoon:

The wife just retired (I was already retired) so we are spending more time together. :taunt:

She has won the ladies club championship twice in the last 5 years which is two more times than I have won it. So yes, I need to improve my game. But, hey, my handicap index is lower than hers right now, which is not always the case.

And I'm not quite sure what you mean by "without looking at others". But there are a lot of things I'm not sure of.

 

All that being said, I don't agree with the rest of your post. But that's okay.

 

LOL, you made my day!

 

I try to be a nice guy, and don´t wish you to win the ladies club championship... :derisive:

 

Well, I might have a better chance. Or not, lol.

 

And hey, you are definitely a nice guy for not wishing I would win the ladies club championship. Thanks.

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Henrik Stenson averages what, about 305 with his 220cc fairway wood?

 

 

Stenson is a stud. Would only be a couple who could match that. And his fairway wood is essentially this small Driver that’s being mentioned. It’s around 11 degrees and is playing at 44 inches. That’s not a 3 wood.

The point is the size of the head that some think is a cure all. Watch video some time of Jack, Miller or Arnie swinging driver and tell me they are holding something back because of the size of the club head.

 

No it’s a combo. It must all be rolled back.

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srixon zx 19* elements 9F5T 

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Why is Titleist responding to an argument nobody is having? Who has said the absolute longest players are winning at the highest clip? Isn't the argument (regardless of your opinion) that the relative length of the field has changed the way the game is played thus making skills such as long and mid-iron play, and shot making less relevant than they used to be (as well as some classic golf courses)?

 

In my opinion Titleist made a overview, which helps to look at the theme from different angles - if someone is willing to...

 

The argument is, that nothing has changed, distance wise, since the last 15 years - neither the long hitter, nor the field has changed since more than a decade (in terms of carry distances).

 

 

Shot making becomes more difficult, the farther the ball travels - no matter which number is written on the golf club...

 

...the evidence can be found in the numbers the OP mentioned.

 

 

Btw...

 

...remember, that nowadays a 6 iron has about the same loft, as a 4 iron had in the past.

 

Would you be more satisfied, if they simply change the numbers, to make it easier for those who don´t realize that the same numbers represent a different loft nowadays?

 

Not that I don't agree with you, but does that my blade 3 iron is as easy to hit as a GI 5 iron? Hm....

Callaway Paradym TD 10* Ventus Red TR 5S

Titleist TSR3 13.5* 3 Wood Tour AD-IZ 6S

Titleist TSR3 19* hybrid Modus GOST S

Titleist TSR2 24* hybrid Modus GOST S

Callaway Paradym Hybrid 27* Ventus non Velocore S

Titleist T100 2023 6-PW KBS Tour V S

Titleist SM8 50, 56, 60

Scotty Cameron X7.5 CS

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Why is Titleist responding to an argument nobody is having? Who has said the absolute longest players are winning at the highest clip? Isn't the argument (regardless of your opinion) that the relative length of the field has changed the way the game is played thus making skills such as long and mid-iron play, and shot making less relevant than they used to be (as well as some classic golf courses)?

 

In my opinion Titleist made a overview, which helps to look at the theme from different angles - if someone is willing to...

 

The argument is, that nothing has changed, distance wise, since the last 15 years - neither the long hitter, nor the field has changed since more than a decade (in terms of carry distances).

 

 

Shot making becomes more difficult, the farther the ball travels - no matter which number is written on the golf club...

 

...the evidence can be found in the numbers the OP mentioned.

 

 

Btw...

 

...remember, that nowadays a 6 iron has about the same loft, as a 4 iron had in the past.

 

Would you be more satisfied, if they simply change the numbers, to make it easier for those who don´t realize that the same numbers represent a different loft nowadays?

 

Not that I don't agree with you, but does that my blade 3 iron is as easy to hit as a GI 5 iron? Hm....

 

Do you think, that one shouldn't allow hybrids for professional golf?

 

Or what is your point?

 

Why should a pro use a long iron for the second shot on a par 4, instead of a hybrid, or a 7 wood - if he can not reach the green with a short iron?

 

-

 

If true shot-making is restricted to the use of long blades, then you have to dump all the GI stuff (at least for professional golf).

 

You can be sure, that professionals would use less long irons, and more GI hybrids etc. if they would have to play in a tournament with a even more restricted ball.

 

-

 

The idea, that a even more restricted ball would help the game golf is either short sighted, or a fraud.

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

Taylormade Sim 2 Max - 10.5 Ventus Blue 6X
Titleist TSR3 - @15.75 Tensei 1K Black 75X
Titleist TSR3 Hybrid - @20 Tensei 1K Black 85X

Titleist 620 CB  - 4 iron - Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100

Titleist 620 MB - 5-pw - Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100

Vokey SM9 - 52.08, 56S  & 60M Dynamic Gold Tour Issue S400
Taylormade Spider Tour X - X3
Titleist - Pro V1

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Set the courses up so that there is a correlation between driving ACCURACY and scoring . The whole point in golf should be that if you hit fairways you should have advantages . Making a par 4 530 just asks you to drive as close to the green as possible

 

Please grow real rough and real width fairways at 6800 yards , keep courses that way and report back to me in 15 years when the NATURE of the game has evolved to a precision skilled sport from a smash and score sport

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Mizuno MP18 3-Pw/ PX 6.0
Mizuno S18 5310+5812/PX 6.0
Ping TR Anser 1966/ 34”

Ball - pro v1x
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Lofts 18 , 21.5, 25, 29, 33, 37, 41, 45, 49, 53, 58

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

 

Nostalgia can be a b**ch. I am sure many pro-rollbackers would find shorter balls and smaller, less forgiving clubs to be less fun than they remember...

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The whole point in golf should be that if you hit fairways you should have advantages . Making a par 4 530 just asks you to drive as close to the green as possible

 

Huh?

 

Hit your tee shot into the woods on a 530-yard hole and tell me accuracy doesn't matter and you wouldn’t have an advantage being in the fairway.

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The whole point in golf should be that if you hit fairways you should have advantages . Making a par 4 530 just asks you to drive as close to the green as possible

 

Huh?

 

Hit your tee shot into the woods on a 530-yard hole and tell me accuracy doesn't matter and you wouldn’t have an advantage being in the fairway.

 

Accuracy doesn’t matter right now

 

It’s better to be hitting a 9 iron from the “primary rough” precision mown at 2” than a 5 iron from the fairway

 

All the tree lined courses on tour (what are there half a dozen each year tops ?) and the big hitters are nowhere to be seen (or don’t enter)

Mizuno ST190G atmos 6s
Mizuno MP18 2fh / PX 6.0
Mizuno MP18 3-Pw/ PX 6.0
Mizuno S18 5310+5812/PX 6.0
Ping TR Anser 1966/ 34”

Ball - pro v1x
Grips - Crossline cord

Lofts 18 , 21.5, 25, 29, 33, 37, 41, 45, 49, 53, 58

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Oh, so you mean it doesn’t “matter” enough to make someone steer the ball around scared spitless of being in the rough. If you make the ball go 50 yards shorter, why would someone fear the rough more?

 

If someone isn’t scared of their 320-yard tee shot going in the rough, why would they be scared of a 270-yard tee shot going in the rough?

 

And surely you realize that hitting it 320 requires far more “accuracy” than hitting it 270. The longer, inaccurate shot will go much farther offline.

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The pros do play courses with trees, they just don't hit into them. And rough is the norm compared to what we all play every day. Watch carefully an event on television. 4" or so is the primary rough on tour. It seems some posts think the only reason the guys on your can score well is because of no rough and wide open runways. Couldn't be further from the truth.

But these guys are good is true.

Titleist TSR4 9° Tensei AV White 65

Titleist TSi3 strong 3w 13.5° Tensei AV White 70

Titleist TS3 19°  hybrid Tensei Blue/Titleist TSR3 24° Diamana Ahina

Titleist T150 5-pw Nippon Pro Modus 125

Vokey SM8 50° F & 56° M SM9 60°M

Cameron Newport w/ flow neck by Lamont/ Cameron Del Mar

 



 

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Why is Titleist responding to an argument nobody is having? Who has said the absolute longest players are winning at the highest clip? Isn't the argument (regardless of your opinion) that the relative length of the field has changed the way the game is played thus making skills such as long and mid-iron play, and shot making less relevant than they used to be (as well as some classic golf courses)?

 

In my opinion Titleist made a overview, which helps to look at the theme from different angles - if someone is willing to...

 

The argument is, that nothing has changed, distance wise, since the last 15 years - neither the long hitter, nor the field has changed since more than a decade (in terms of carry distances).

 

 

Shot making becomes more difficult, the farther the ball travels - no matter which number is written on the golf club...

 

...the evidence can be found in the numbers the OP mentioned.

 

 

Btw...

 

...remember, that nowadays a 6 iron has about the same loft, as a 4 iron had in the past.

 

Would you be more satisfied, if they simply change the numbers, to make it easier for those who don´t realize that the same numbers represent a different loft nowadays?

 

Not that I don't agree with you, but does that my blade 3 iron is as easy to hit as a GI 5 iron? Hm....

 

Do you think, that one shouldn't allow hybrids for professional golf?

 

Or what is your point?

 

Why should a pro use a long iron for the second shot on a par 4, instead of a hybrid, or a 7 wood - if he can not reach the green with a short iron?

 

-

 

If true shot-making is restricted to the use of long blades, then you have to dump all the GI stuff (at least for professional golf).

 

You can be sure, that professionals would use less long irons, and more GI hybrids etc. if they would have to play in a tournament with a even more restricted ball.

 

-

 

The idea, that a even more restricted ball would help the game golf is either short sighted, or a fraud.

 

Here's a guy who understands unintended consequences. Plenty of ways to counter a higher-spinning ball.

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

1979...dec.... so almost 1980....

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srixon zx 19* elements 9F5T 

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TM p7mc 5-pw Mmt125tx 

Mizuno T22 raw 52-56-60 s400

LAB Mezz Max armlock 

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Oh, so you mean it doesn’t “matter” enough to make someone steer the ball around scared spitless of being in the rough. If you make the ball go 50 yards shorter, why would someone fear the rough more?

 

If someone isn’t scared of their 320-yard tee shot going in the rough, why would they be scared of a 270-yard tee shot going in the rough?

 

And surely you realize that hitting it 320 requires far more “accuracy” than hitting it 270. The longer, inaccurate shot will go much farther offline.

 

I don’t think the ball needs rolling back

 

I think the player needs rolling back

 

Your 320/270 point confirms exactly the point in trying to make . IF the courses were set up so you had to hit the fairway to be able to compete , players wouldn’t be trying to hit it 320 . Accuracy would have a far bigger part to play and players would actually try and work on hitting the fairways . When you can win your events hitting it 330 into the rough, then wedge up for easy birdie , where is the incentive to hit it straight ?

 

Courses like Hilton Head , Southern Hills, Valderama etc protect themselves easily

 

The rough really isn’t an issue on most tour stops , whereas in my opinion it should be long and thick enough to require a hack back out to the fairway .

 

Stop playing “bomber” courses and start playing real golf courses , and the type of player that is successful on tour will begin to change , and driving distance will start to fall (on average)

Mizuno ST190G atmos 6s
Mizuno MP18 2fh / PX 6.0
Mizuno MP18 3-Pw/ PX 6.0
Mizuno S18 5310+5812/PX 6.0
Ping TR Anser 1966/ 34”

Ball - pro v1x
Grips - Crossline cord

Lofts 18 , 21.5, 25, 29, 33, 37, 41, 45, 49, 53, 58

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

 

Nostalgia can be a b**ch. I am sure many pro-rollbackers would find shorter balls and smaller, less forgiving clubs to be less fun than they remember...

 

You guys do realize nostalgia and wanting to protect records has absolutely zero to do with this debate don't you? As in zero, zip, nada.

 

People who think that really, really can't see the forest for the trees.

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Yeah, it’s so that every golf course in the country will be bulldozed and rebuilt at 80% scale to suit s rolled back ball, thereby saving billions of dollars.

 

Or was it so rich guys won’t keep building more and more expensive courses in an effort to prove theirs is longer than the other rich guy’s?

 

At least the nostalgia argument would be based on an honest emotion rather than silly, counterfactual, wishful thinking.

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

 

Nostalgia can be a b**ch. I am sure many pro-rollbackers would find shorter balls and smaller, less forgiving clubs to be less fun than they remember...

 

You guys do realize nostalgia and wanting to protect records has absolutely zero to do with this debate don't you? As in zero, zip, nada.

 

People who think that really, really can't see the forest for the trees.

 

Then what is the point?

 

I asked the question on the first page, and the only answer has been: "I liked golf better when guys had to move the ball both ways and it looked more challenging for them".

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

 

Nostalgia can be a b**ch. I am sure many pro-rollbackers would find shorter balls and smaller, less forgiving clubs to be less fun than they remember...

 

You guys do realize nostalgia and wanting to protect records has absolutely zero to do with this debate don't you? As in zero, zip, nada.

 

People who think that really, really can't see the forest for the trees.

 

Then what is the point?

 

I asked the question on the first page, and the only answer has been: "I liked golf better when guys had to move the ball both ways and it looked more challenging for them".

 

Sounds like nostalgia to me :)

 

I agree that most pro-rollback responses lack identification of what the perceived "problem" even is and seem to be based more on feeling than fact.

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Is there anyone pro-rollback that was born after 1970? It would be interesting to see the age demographics of this debate.

 

Me, 1979.

 

Having said that I bought my kids a old games consol for Christmas to introduce them to gaming. It's not quite as good as I remember.

 

Nostalgia can be a b**ch. I am sure many pro-rollbackers would find shorter balls and smaller, less forgiving clubs to be less fun than they remember...

 

You guys do realize nostalgia and wanting to protect records has absolutely zero to do with this debate don't you? As in zero, zip, nada.

 

People who think that really, really can't see the forest for the trees.

 

This statement is ironic considering that most pro-rollback posts seem to be more focused on the clubs players are using on certain shots than the final score they are signing which is in reality is the real big picture.

 

Also, saying that nostalgia has zero to do with this argument is disingenuous.

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it isnt nostalgia for me... i only started playing this game competitively in 2014.. i have no real memories of balata and persimmon.. i was around the game working at a course.. but didnt really play..

Callaway epic max LS 9* GD-M9003 7x 

TM Sim2 max tour  16* GD  ADHD 8x 

srixon zx 19* elements 9F5T 

Cobra king SZ 25.5* KBS TD cat 5 70 

TM p7mc 5-pw Mmt125tx 

Mizuno T22 raw 52-56-60 s400

LAB Mezz Max armlock 

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it isnt nostalgia for me... i only started playing this game competitively in 2014.. i have no real memories of balata and persimmon.. i was around the game working at a course.. but didnt really play..

 

Well, then I would assume, that you have seen things like that:

 

 

...to come to the conclusion, that driving distance is very depending on the course conditions.

 

 

Balls bouncing and running more than 50 yards, adding to the average driving distance.

 

 

Or you may have read, that since 1980, the average swing speed on tour has increased from 104 mph to 113 mph in 2016. :read:

 

If you assume roughly 2.5 yards additional distance per mph, you get a distance gain from noticeably over 20 yards - solely based on the athletes capabilities to swing it faster...

...which is completely independent from the ball.

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it isnt nostalgia for me... i only started playing this game competitively in 2014.. i have no real memories of balata and persimmon.. i was around the game working at a course.. but didnt really play..

 

Well, then I would assume, that you have seen things like that:

 

 

...to come to the conclusion, that driving distance is very depending on the course conditions.

 

 

Balls bouncing and running more than 50 yards, adding to the average driving distance.

 

 

Or you may have read, that since 1980, the average driving speed on tour has increased from 104 mph to 113 mph in 2016. :read:

 

If you assume roughly 2.5 yards additional distance per mph, you get a distance gain from noticeably over 20 yards - solely based on the athletes capabilities to swing it faster...

...which is completely independent from the ball.

 

Average swing speed is a massive massive deal .

 

Now the courses are set up so you can’t compete at 104mph so the average will continue to rise due to player characteristics eg power dictating success on Tour

 

 

Mizuno ST190G atmos 6s
Mizuno MP18 2fh / PX 6.0
Mizuno MP18 3-Pw/ PX 6.0
Mizuno S18 5310+5812/PX 6.0
Ping TR Anser 1966/ 34”

Ball - pro v1x
Grips - Crossline cord

Lofts 18 , 21.5, 25, 29, 33, 37, 41, 45, 49, 53, 58

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Sounds like nostalgia to me :)

 

I agree that most pro-rollback responses lack identification of what the perceived "problem" even is and seem to be based more on feeling than fact.

 

Scores have stabilized so there is no reason to change the equipment rules. I do support the idea that courses should make wayward drives more penal. That would add an element of drama that has diminished.

 

If you look at the PGA Tour stats, driving accuracy is almost totally meaningless (none of the top players are accurate off the tee). The easiest way to change that is with deeper rough and narrow fairways.

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The top players are VERY accurate off the tee. They just hit it in the rough sometimes. “Fairways Hit” is a junk statistic. Keeping the ball in play consistently while driving it 300+ yards requires great directional control.

 

P.S. Setting up a course to try to force a correlation between a junk statistic and scoring is a fool’s errand. It can’t possibly be accomplished without creating a pathologically warped version of the game.

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