Thoughts on why people are walking away from the game...

[bobcat]

Those who would walk away because "the game is too hard" are openly admitting they aren't up for the challenge! That's pretty lame in my book and it indicates both a lack of confidence and a lack of courage.

 

Rise up,Man up, and Step up!...You can do this! Furthermore, learning to be successful through courage, work ethic, and perseverance will serve you well in many other life endeavors too! Don't just walk away from something just because you find it to be difficult...instead, learn to embrace and persevere your way through whatever challenges you face in life and soon you'll be a much stronger and better man for having done so!

 

:golfer:

[wrmiller]

Golf is expensive, takes a long time to play, and is difficult. But all those things have always been true. People talk about golf declining, but I don't see it in real life. Courses are jam-packed every evening and weekend, weather permitting.

I think golf had a bubble from the early 2000's that needed to burst to get back to normal capacity.

One thing that I've noticed, is that kids don't seem to play golf recreationally. They either don't play or compete. I feel that may be problematic. When I was a kid (I didn't play golf, but lived near a course and several friends played), people played for fun. Kids playing with parents, kids playing with other kids. Messing around stuff. Now it's camps, formal instruction, structured practice, tournament play, etc. Golf seemed like it was more of an activity that a lot of people and kids just did for fun, than a sport to be focused upon.

 

I remember all sports being played by kids for fun. I did. Then the damn parents ruined everything. Helicopter parents living vicariously through their children. Screaming, yelling, getting into fights with other parents or the coaches. Really?!?!

 

Desperately hoping their kids will become professionals so they will support them later in life or some such nonsense. Whatever.

 

Kinda like forcing kids into structured learning at earlier and earlier ages, only to have them graduate HS and/or college dumber than graduates of 40-50 years ago.

 

Our education system was destroyed decades ago. Why should our children's sports be any different?

 

I'll get off my soapbox now and go get another cup of coffee... ;)

[Nard_S]

Truth is if your kid just wants to play varsity ball in high school, he has to start developing for it at 9-10 years of age at the latest. You can blame parents I guess but that's the reality, dreams of D1 or not. The whole "structured play" thing goes way beyond sports and for good reasons. Inner city/urban kids need it stay off the streets, middle class suburban do too and in some cases just to build a network of friends and avoid,"X-bot in the basement" syndrome" Some of the worst offenders of parents living vicariously through their kids that I've seen are at the golf range. I do come across a few delusional parents banking on the $5K they spend a year will get their kid a free ride in college, but most are just trying to raise well adjusted kid, who get on in the world just fine.

[2putttom]

5 hour rounds.

Ha ! I'll take 5 hours of laughing and or piece and quit over 5 hours of the wife nagging about shyt I still haven't done.

[cwglum]

The golf industry is suffering from lack of interest due to over-promising and under-delivering..ridiculous rules, lack of course management by marshall's, and idiotic marketing..

 

 

 

Bingo - can't be stated much better.

 

Additionally, Golf is not welcoming to new participants. Most golfers have their heads on a swivel and are within 2-holes of exploding if someone in front of them holds them up.

[heavy_hitter]

People go into business to make money. Your post sucks.

[MrJones]

A lot more people these days work way more than 40 hours a week. Extra time on the job means less time at home or taking care of other things.

 

Many people make their kids their life priority. I'm not saying that's everyone or even a bad thing. But if you choose to be a sport parent where your child plays year round "travel ball" and spend every other hour at the ball field, gymnastics class, or game, you don't really have much time for a lot else. Especially a game that on average will take up at least 4.5 hours of your day (people forget about travel and getting ready).

 

Golf has gotten really expensive to get started. If you're not sure you even want to get into the game, buying clubs-even used- will cost you a bit. Heck even the old Walmart style box sets are over 200 dollars.

 

For a lot of people it's about hanging out and having fun. Once the game stops being fun for whatever reason, it's easy to quit.

[FourTops]

How do we get more people to quit? Darn courses are too crowded, and this may help with the slow pace of play. Or not.

 

(I'll show myself out... ;) )

 

 

Bingo. For what ever reason there is this "We have to grow the game of golf" going on. What happens? You end up with people on the golf course on a Saturday afternoon that don't know what a gold club is let alone what to do with it, an you wonder why a round is taking over 5 hours.

 

Oh, you mean the drunks that have more beer cans in their bag than clubs? ;)

 

For me, the clubs sit in the basket behind the seats...and the bag is insulated and has cavities for red and white wine, and a separate compartment for IPA's of various local selections.

[Gautama]

I'm always a little puzzled when everyone always goes straight to the 5 hour rounds narrative. I've been playing for about 35 years now and honestly I just don't recall a time when golf was any quicker. People are a lot more uptight out there about it, but I genuinely have not seen a change in pace of play.

 

I did see an explosion of sorts in the early 2000s in the numbers of people on the course who soon seemed to realize "damn this is hard," but honestly not much else has changed about the typical Saturday round. Ball goes farther, straighter, but that's really about it. And when I talk with the guys I play with they all see it the same...but on here it seems everyone has a different experience than my own. Anyone else feel that way?

[Bigsetzee]

I'm always a little puzzled when everyone always goes straight to the 5 hour rounds narrative. I've been playing for about 35 years now and honestly I just don't recall a time when golf was any quicker.

 

Time + Expectations =

 

I'm in a professional job where I get a lot of down time so I'm a little more able than my friends to get out on the course in that I don't work 9-5...

...but sheesh if I did I seriously doubt with having two children that the wife would let me out to spend 5hrs on a golf course on a Saturday, let alone play/practice once a week midweek.

 

Expectations in the home have changed, where as my mother probably kicked my Dad out the house each weekend to go play golf a lot of significant others these days expect a little bit more from their husbands in terms of family time.

 

I know a couple of my mates are really struggling with this, I'm just glad I'm in a position where it doesn't cause too much grief.

[Bigsetzee]

I'm always a little puzzled when everyone always goes straight to the 5 hour rounds narrative. I've been playing for about 35 years now and honestly I just don't recall a time when golf was any quicker.

 

Time + Expectations =

I'm in a professional job where I get a lot of down time so I'm a little more able than my friends to get out on the course in that I don't work 9-5...

...but sheesh if I did I seriously doubt with having two children that the wife would let me out to spend 5hrs on a golf course on a Saturday, let alone play/practice once a week midweek.

 

Expectations in the home have changed, where as my mother probably kicked my Dad out the house each weekend to go play golf a lot of significant others these days expect a little bit more from their husbands in terms of family time.

 

I know a couple of my mates are really struggling with this, I'm just glad I'm in a position where it doesn't cause too much grief.

[DLYskes1976]

Besides the money I've spent on building a nice Titleist mb set, the irons I am using now I bought off eBay in 2013 for 200$, ( titleist 735cm) and they work just fine... the bag I bought was in 2008... usually the golf equipment I buy every year is golf balls....

 

Kinda hard to play a round without that.... the driver I have is a Nike Covert 2.0 that I got from a dunhams when it was 110$ in 2014....

 

If anything is keeping people away from the course it's working 2 jobs, just to make ends meet, kids, new wifey, stuff like that....

 

I don't think the cost of a round has changed much in the last 10 years... the price of everything else has

[Reasonability]

Can't help saying this whole recurring theme of "golf is dying" has hair on it. Not even sure why it's a "thing" so worthy of repeated attention but then again, if I personally don't "get it" and it keeps coming up repeatedly, then it must be me and not the masses which are truly in question.

 

BUT - at least in this case the OP advanced specific ideas on WHY as opposed to simply opening the usual Pandora's box about white belts, slow play, riding vs waling and other stuff that spurs commentary that never universally resonates.

 

Seems much of the OP was about capitalism and the costs attendant to the latest marketing promises to grant us more yardage and fail-proof accuracy.

 

We're gullible consumers by and large. We retool automotive plants each year so the grill or side mirrors or something not so dramatic signals to the neighbors we just bought a new car while theirs are aging out. We whip out equipment with a twisted face and adjustable hosel thinking it too signals our ability to buy and play the "best of the best with the latest bells and whistles."

 

Last time I checked, the courses are still taking golfers. Fewer of them? Probably so. I know I still need to make a tee time so the course isn't this desolate empty world... at least around here that's the case. Are there cars with the latest tail lights In the lot - that carried golfers to the course who pulled the "latest" technology out of the trunk to play? Sure. We as a people seem to need to impress ourselves and no doubt others with such preening. But I can't say I blame the going concern business models who product clubs, cars, cloths, or ballpoint pens for our lack of ability to grow confidence based on owning "stuff". We pay for it and they keep making it, and the cycle never ends.

 

Golf itself has ZERO chance of dying. It has a 100% chance of swelling up and down over time, and it's a lock that consumers will (as often as not)... internalize a likelihood of success and swag based on WITB. For better or worse, that will NEVER go away, anymore than golf will.

 

Smoke'em if you've got'em. Pay for whatever floats your boat. Support the economy and put on your swag if that makes your happy. It's your money. Eventually golf's importance won't be attached to such stuff but it's a lesson learned over time. Just look around at the seasoned golfers and you'll soon figure out they've generally come to see golf in a very different light. (And they too generally went through the same thing and have closets full of the latest stashed away at home.) It's not just their ego that tempered over the years, it's their entire philosophy (for the most part).

 

Have never commented on the "state of golf and why it's decaying" stuff. Again, I personally don't get the whole fascination behind the question. Maybe cause I'm in that category of golfers who outgrew the whole fascination with the ad man's latest promises??? That's probably it. I dunno.

 

Carry on gents. Have fun out there. You're all still here so at least those of us left standing represent the fact golf isn't going anywhere even though consumers will continue to be more than a little gullible.

[Under2hours]

Besides the money I've spent on building a nice Titleist mb set, the irons I am using now I bought off eBay in 2013 for 200$, ( titleist 735cm) and they work just fine... the bag I bought was in 2008... usually the golf equipment I buy every year is golf balls....

 

Kinda hard to play a round without that.... the driver I have is a Nike Covert 2.0 that I got from a dunhams when it was 110$ in 2014....

 

If anything is keeping people away from the course it's working 2 jobs, just to make ends meet, kids, new wifey, stuff like that....

 

I don't think the cost of a round has changed much in the last 10 years... the price of everything else has

 

Actually golf is cheaper in many ways today if you are ready to travel and use all the options for cheap play available.

 

Clubs bought used off many options available all, balls too available as low as $1/ball brand new.

 

The problem with that is driving 1 hour+ each way from a metropolitan area for a $40 green fee and then being at the whim of POP and frankly, who has the time.

[Gautama]

 

The problem with that is driving 1 hour+ each way from a metropolitan area for a $40 green fee and then being at the whim of POP and frankly, who has the time.

 

I think this sort of hits the nail on the head. Golfers have time...and we've always been an odd, somewhat selfish lot with an amazing capacity for suffering and self-abuse. That normal people try the game and decide they're not into it is neither new nor surprising, lol :D

[EKELLY]

The problem is not people quitting golf, but people not strarting to play golf anymore.

Here in Italy I see a lot of people quitting but not so many starting to play.

The reason, in my opinion, is not at all the price of the equipment.

It's the cost of playing golf, as if you want to play a good course you have to spend at least 50€, and to be member of a GC (here's compulsory, even if you can affiliate an online GC for 150€ more or less) costs from 1.000 to 5.000 euros a year (a good GC: 1500/2000).

Then, it's time.

You have to spend the whole day at golf and not everyone can afford it.

But I think you can deal with it.

I played 9 holes alone, with the cart at 18.00 pm, found 2 groups in front of me that let me pass and it took 40 minutes to play.

As for the price of equipment (used stuff etc.) I think you can find a solution even for a quick golf round.

Where I play, some guys seem to be aging out. Some guys have quit due to health problems. Some guys have quit because their quality of play has declined, and they can't handle not being as good as they used to be. These are probably things that have always happened, but I don't see much of an influx of young guys to take their place.

That is EXACTLY right. Young kids ARE taking up the game, but not as many as we're losing annually....

[billh17]

I'm always a little puzzled when everyone always goes straight to the 5 hour rounds narrative. I've been playing for about 35 years now and honestly I just don't recall a time when golf was any quicker. People are a lot more uptight out there about it, but I genuinely have not seen a change in pace of play.

 

I did see an explosion of sorts in the early 2000s in the numbers of people on the course who soon seemed to realize "damn this is hard," but honestly not much else has changed about the typical Saturday round. Ball goes farther, straighter, but that's really about it. And when I talk with the guys I play with they all see it the same...but on here it seems everyone has a different experience than my own. Anyone else feel that way?

yep. I have been playing since the 70's. The time it takes to play a round really is just about the same now as it was then. There were not

as many golfers back then,but there were a lot fewer courses,so it has stayed sorta balanced out . The 5 hour round is not something I really

ever complain about,because i simply don't experience it. I play late afternoon/evening on the weekends and late afternoon during the week.

I leave the prime time to the guys who have no option. I think price is a factor,and i also think the generation coming up are just not into

spending drive time plus playing time to play a sport they need to play a lot to get decent at. The gratification timeline doesn't fit their

idea of fun. Golf is not easy., Most people on this website put a lot of time and practice into learning each club,and how to use the wedges. . I have been irritated more by the speed demons than the slow pacers,and my groups normal time is 3:50 to 4:05.

We are all in our 70's and we all grew up together. We enjoy the time together,but we also enjoy the golf,and the day,but we dont dwaddle !

[FourTops]

One guy I used to play with didn't walk away...he took the cart and rode away. He smoked tire off the course on #14 and never came back.

[TollBros]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed, and both resent the other. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

[FourTops]

Slow rounds + beer = great day. Otherwise 5 hour rounds on public courses have been the norm for 40 years. The ONLY way around it is joining a private CC and "paying" for convenience.

[nsxguy]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed, and both resent the other. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

 

Nonsense. 50 years (at least) and counting. Their #1 reason for you has been their #1 reason "forever".

 

Of course it takes too much time for them to play - they've got to get back to their i-phones, x-boxes and streaming games and movies.

 

Kids have always had the attention span of a gnat,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and nowadays it's that much worse,,,,,,,,,,,,

[billh17]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

You are correct on the two groups resenting each other. Though i don't know any older guys who move at half speed,I do know the younger

groups do seem to have become obsessed with playing in less than 3 hours. Everyone is supposed to get out of their way,and the world

just doesn't work that way. It sounds as though you are saying that everyone else is supposed to change the way things have been done

for decades upon decades just because the younger group have an attention span issue.. Maybe..just maybe, some of the younger

people are just needing a different sport to play. Lots of older guys resent being pushed,and feel that the golf course wouldn't be there

if it wasn't for them,and they resent being told to get out of the way.There is nothing wrong with golf. If people need to change the way

it is played in order to take part,then those are the folks who need to move on,not your people who have paid green fees for the last 50 years.

We will respectfully have to agree to disagree. Count me in the group who do not go along with all of the "Grow the Game" marketing dreamed

up by the OEM's and golf course operators.

[TollBros]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed, and both resent the other. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

 

Nonsense. 50 years (at least) and counting. Their #1 reason for you has been their #1 reason "forever".

 

Of course it takes too much time for them to play - they've got to get back to their i-phones, x-boxes and streaming games and movies.

 

Kids have always had the attention span of a gnat,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and nowadays it's that much worse,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

I don't disagree with you, however, if we don't get today's youth interested in the game, it's going to eventually go the way of bowling in terms of interest. I know we all want to resist and say it's not the game but the people that need to change, but that's a death sentence for the game long term. I'm not that old, early 30's, however I see and know what causes everyone my age and younger to not be interested in the game. It's the amount of sitting around doing nothing while "playing" the game. I don't know what the solution is to this issue exactly, but I do know that whenever anyone threatens the status quo, the traditionalists jump right in with all the negative shoot down commentary they can muster. This won't solve the issue of young people just not having any interest in the game because of the time it takes to play it. As I've said, I teach kids every week and hear what they have to say constantly. When I was a kid, that's not the way we thought, however it's a different world today, and if SOME changes aren't made, we are going to start losing courses, practice facilities, etc...and golf is going to become Top Golf to the next generation.

[nix]

Golf is expensive, takes a long time to play, and is difficult. But all those things have always been true. People talk about golf declining, but I don't see it in real life. Courses are jam-packed every evening and weekend, weather permitting.

I think golf had a bubble from the early 2000's that needed to burst to get back to normal capacity.

One thing that I've noticed, is that kids don't seem to play golf recreationally. They either don't play or compete. I feel that may be problematic. When I was a kid (I didn't play golf, but lived near a course and several friends played), people played for fun. Kids playing with parents, kids playing with other kids. Messing around stuff. Now it's camps, formal instruction, structured practice, tournament play, etc. Golf seemed like it was more of an activity that a lot of people and kids just did for fun, than a sport to be focused upon.

 

I remember all sports being played by kids for fun. I did. Then the damn parents ruined everything. Helicopter parents living vicariously through their children. Screaming, yelling, getting into fights with other parents or the coaches. Really?!?!

 

Desperately hoping their kids will become professionals so they will support them later in life or some such nonsense. Whatever.

 

Kinda like forcing kids into structured learning at earlier and earlier ages, only to have them graduate HS and/or college dumber than graduates of 40-50 years ago.

 

Our education system was destroyed decades ago. Why should our children's sports be any different?

 

I'll get off my soapbox now and go get another cup of coffee... ;)

 

Athletes are better than they ever were and people are significantly more educated and intelligent than they ever were. Just saying.

[Nard_S]

Golf is expensive, takes a long time to play, and is difficult. But all those things have always been true. People talk about golf declining, but I don't see it in real life. Courses are jam-packed every evening and weekend, weather permitting.

I think golf had a bubble from the early 2000's that needed to burst to get back to normal capacity.

One thing that I've noticed, is that kids don't seem to play golf recreationally. They either don't play or compete. I feel that may be problematic. When I was a kid (I didn't play golf, but lived near a course and several friends played), people played for fun. Kids playing with parents, kids playing with other kids. Messing around stuff. Now it's camps, formal instruction, structured practice, tournament play, etc. Golf seemed like it was more of an activity that a lot of people and kids just did for fun, than a sport to be focused upon.

 

I remember all sports being played by kids for fun. I did. Then the damn parents ruined everything. Helicopter parents living vicariously through their children. Screaming, yelling, getting into fights with other parents or the coaches. Really?!?!

 

Desperately hoping their kids will become professionals so they will support them later in life or some such nonsense. Whatever.

 

Kinda like forcing kids into structured learning at earlier and earlier ages, only to have them graduate HS and/or college dumber than graduates of 40-50 years ago.

 

Our education system was destroyed decades ago. Why should our children's sports be any different?

 

I'll get off my soapbox now and go get another cup of coffee... ;)

 

Athletes are better than they ever were and people are significantly more educated and intelligent than they ever were. Just saying.

 

That's highly debatable........just saying.

[nsxguy]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed, and both resent the other. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

 

Nonsense. 50 years (at least) and counting. Their #1 reason for you has been their #1 reason "forever".

 

Of course it takes too much time for them to play - they've got to get back to their i-phones, x-boxes and streaming games and movies.

 

Kids have always had the attention span of a gnat,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and nowadays it's that much worse,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

I don't disagree with you, however, if we don't get today's youth interested in the game, it's going to eventually go the way of bowling in terms of interest. I know we all want to resist and say it's not the game but the people that need to change, but that's a death sentence for the game long term. I'm not that old, early 30's, however I see and know what causes everyone my age and younger to not be interested in the game. It's the amount of sitting around doing nothing while "playing" the game. I don't know what the solution is to this issue exactly, but I do know that whenever anyone threatens the status quo, the traditionalists jump right in with all the negative shoot down commentary they can muster. This won't solve the issue of young people just not having any interest in the game because of the time it takes to play it. As I've said, I teach kids every week and hear what they have to say constantly. When I was a kid, that's not the way we thought, however it's a different world today, and if SOME changes aren't made, we are going to start losing courses, practice facilities, etc...and golf is going to become Top Golf to the next generation.

 

I know this isn't what you want to hear but,,,,,,, that's life.

 

We get new courses, and we lose "old" courses. It has always and will always ebb and flow. There will most likely be enough room for everyone and when there aren't enough players to support a course the course will die.

 

This is how it always was and how it will always be sans benefactors with disposable income in the millions (and millions) that want to see the game survive and thrive on their OWN dimes.

 

Just like how you run your own business.

[nix]

Golf is expensive, takes a long time to play, and is difficult. But all those things have always been true. People talk about golf declining, but I don't see it in real life. Courses are jam-packed every evening and weekend, weather permitting.

I think golf had a bubble from the early 2000's that needed to burst to get back to normal capacity.

One thing that I've noticed, is that kids don't seem to play golf recreationally. They either don't play or compete. I feel that may be problematic. When I was a kid (I didn't play golf, but lived near a course and several friends played), people played for fun. Kids playing with parents, kids playing with other kids. Messing around stuff. Now it's camps, formal instruction, structured practice, tournament play, etc. Golf seemed like it was more of an activity that a lot of people and kids just did for fun, than a sport to be focused upon.

 

I remember all sports being played by kids for fun. I did. Then the damn parents ruined everything. Helicopter parents living vicariously through their children. Screaming, yelling, getting into fights with other parents or the coaches. Really?!?!

 

Desperately hoping their kids will become professionals so they will support them later in life or some such nonsense. Whatever.

 

Kinda like forcing kids into structured learning at earlier and earlier ages, only to have them graduate HS and/or college dumber than graduates of 40-50 years ago.

 

Our education system was destroyed decades ago. Why should our children's sports be any different?

 

I'll get off my soapbox now and go get another cup of coffee... ;)

 

Athletes are better than they ever were and people are significantly more educated and intelligent than they ever were. Just saying.

 

That's highly debatable........just saying.

 

No it's not. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect

[BIG STU]

I'm always a little puzzled when everyone always goes straight to the 5 hour rounds narrative. I've been playing for about 35 years now and honestly I just don't recall a time when golf was any quicker. People are a lot more uptight out there about it, but I genuinely have not seen a change in pace of play.

 

I did see an explosion of sorts in the early 2000s in the numbers of people on the course who soon seemed to realize "damn this is hard," but honestly not much else has changed about the typical Saturday round. Ball goes farther, straighter, but that's really about it. And when I talk with the guys I play with they all see it the same...but on here it seems everyone has a different experience than my own. Anyone else feel that way?

A lot of it depends on what part of the country you are in and the time of the year. The Florida guys can relate exactly to what I am about to say. I live in the Grand Strand area of SC which is the self proclaimed "Golf Capital of the World". During the Spring and Fall tourist golf seasons 5 hr rounds are a norm IF a local can get a tee time and if even you are a member at a semi private club. Part of it is the course's fault because they tend to over book Part of it is most of the tourist golfers bad attitudes. In other words they are on a golf package vacation and they will do as they darn well please. Rangers what a joke they are told "do not piss off the tourists". Thank God it has gotten hot and humid and so most of them have went home so 3 hr rounds will be the norm again. Yep this heat and humidity do not bother us Southern born and bred boys a bit.

[BIG STU]

5 hour rounds.

 

In a nutshell, yes. Golf just takes entirely too much time for most people with young families or for the attention span of the youth, and the old guys just keep dying off every year with nobody to really replace them. You just have too much of an issue pacing a group of 25 year old guys and a group of 75 year old guys. One moves at half speed, and both resent the other. I teach juniors each week and the #1 reason many don't come back or end up quitting is that it just takes too much time to play. Keep rounds around 3 hours or so and I keep the kids engaged and interested. Make them have to start waiting on groups in front or start creeping up on 4 hours and I lose them mentally. Bottom line, the game needs to speed up.

 

Nonsense. 50 years (at least) and counting. Their #1 reason for you has been their #1 reason "forever".

 

Of course it takes too much time for them to play - they've got to get back to their i-phones, x-boxes and streaming games and movies.

 

Kids have always had the attention span of a gnat,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and nowadays it's that much worse,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

I don't disagree with you, however, if we don't get today's youth interested in the game, it's going to eventually go the way of bowling in terms of interest. I know we all want to resist and say it's not the game but the people that need to change, but that's a death sentence for the game long term. I'm not that old, early 30's, however I see and know what causes everyone my age and younger to not be interested in the game. It's the amount of sitting around doing nothing while "playing" the game. I don't know what the solution is to this issue exactly, but I do know that whenever anyone threatens the status quo, the traditionalists jump right in with all the negative shoot down commentary they can muster. This won't solve the issue of young people just not having any interest in the game because of the time it takes to play it. As I've said, I teach kids every week and hear what they have to say constantly. When I was a kid, that's not the way we thought, however it's a different world today, and if SOME changes aren't made, we are going to start losing courses, practice facilities, etc...and golf is going to become Top Golf to the next generation.

I can actually see what you are talking about in the last few sentences--- We have a Top Golf going up as I type right now in the middle of Myrtle Beach--- I can see what little I know about Top Golf of it becoming a major youth attraction. Actually I think it will do good in the summer with the visiting families with kids etc. Do not know how it will do in the winter. Most of the Snowbirds that winter here are like me a traditionalist and will play real golf.

[Nard_S]

Golf is expensive, takes a long time to play, and is difficult. But all those things have always been true. People talk about golf declining, but I don't see it in real life. Courses are jam-packed every evening and weekend, weather permitting.

I think golf had a bubble from the early 2000's that needed to burst to get back to normal capacity.

One thing that I've noticed, is that kids don't seem to play golf recreationally. They either don't play or compete. I feel that may be problematic. When I was a kid (I didn't play golf, but lived near a course and several friends played), people played for fun. Kids playing with parents, kids playing with other kids. Messing around stuff. Now it's camps, formal instruction, structured practice, tournament play, etc. Golf seemed like it was more of an activity that a lot of people and kids just did for fun, than a sport to be focused upon.

 

I remember all sports being played by kids for fun. I did. Then the damn parents ruined everything. Helicopter parents living vicariously through their children. Screaming, yelling, getting into fights with other parents or the coaches. Really?!?!

 

Desperately hoping their kids will become professionals so they will support them later in life or some such nonsense. Whatever.

 

Kinda like forcing kids into structured learning at earlier and earlier ages, only to have them graduate HS and/or college dumber than graduates of 40-50 years ago.

 

Our education system was destroyed decades ago. Why should our children's sports be any different?

 

I'll get off my soapbox now and go get another cup of coffee... ;)

 

Athletes are better than they ever were and people are significantly more educated and intelligent than they ever were. Just saying.

 

That's highly debatable........just saying.

 

No it's not. https://en.wikipedia...ki/Flynn_effect

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Folks are better test takers than before (and it's peaked). Are they really more intelligent? Are people really deeper thinkers and more literate than folks back in the day?

 

Btw, how do you measure the intelligence of a Duke Ellington or even a James Brown? Or a Picasso? All genius, no doubt. Where are today's genius in art and science?

 

Who's the new Tesla or Einstein? Or Charlie Parker?