What courses should be thrown out of the Top 100?

[Andrew Bond of Glencoe]

To be fair, I have not played Seth Ryanor’s Mountain Lake. I am a huge Raynor fan- just played his first solo design, Westhampton CC which was amazing.

 

I will stick with my take.

[Andrew Bond of Glencoe]

I have NEVER heard anyone with the opinion that Naples National is a better course than Calusa, heck even Golf Week listed Calusa Pines in the Top 25 Modern Golf Courses.

 

Mind you I am not disparaging Naples National. It’s a fine course and club. It’s just not in the same league IMO.

[jerebear21]

ML >>> CP

[1b!ggolfnut]

Harbor Town is the one that pops into my head

[TadWPJ]

I've played Moraine in the Spring, summer, and fall (3 times) I have enough plays under my belt and the staff is great. Couldn't disagree more with you more regarding tie ins, redundant. What greens have slope, 18? I think Moraine is top 100 and top 3 or 4 in Ohio, but there are just as many people who think its overrated as the ones that gush over it. I don't know why Doak's name came up, the greens aren't anywhere near as good as Canterbury or Inverness. The rough is cut tall fescue, the native is fine fescue.

 

All the greens have slope. Alot of it is from back to front and one side or the other but to say the greens are flat and have no slope is ridiculous. Off the top of my head,

1 slopes back to front and left to right (just like the land) and has a great fall off tight mown chipping area to the left.

2 slopes very severely from back to front and a little right to left like the Eden green that inspired it.

3 slopes back to front and left to right with a severe spine running through the middle vertically. Miss left and no chance to stop your ball.

4 slopes back to front and left to right

5 slopes back to front and has a little diagnal ridge in it.

6 is a little flatter and perched up on a hill but has another diagnal edge running through it.

7 slopes left to right and back to front off the hill

8 has a ton of internal contour, 3 tiers a little like a double plateau

9 has high edges and a low middle with a really cool raised back left portion

10 is an extension of the fairway in front but slopes right to left and has an extremely cool and unique surround feature all the way around

11 slopes back to front and right to left especially on the left side

12 slopes hard back to front and has decent internal contour

13 slopes hard back to front and left to right

14 falls off front and back but generally slopes hard back to front and left to right with a really cool short grass chipping area left built into the hill

15 slopes back to front and has a spine running through it horizontally

16 is small and perched up and slopes back to front and a little right to left

17 is also small and pierced up but slopes hard left to right

18 has a high left and high right with a low front right and low middle.

 

Definitely not the most contoured greens I've played but very very far from flat. Also you have to remember the course is built on very extreme (and amazing) land and most of the greens are built into the side or on top of hills and basically follow the natural fall of the land. They would be close to unplayable with much more slope and any speed as there is so much gravity in play there.

 

Also don't understand your comments on the tie ins there fantastic there are ways to run your ball onto most of the greens, the bunkering is great and fits with the scale and the greens very well and the short grass walk offs to the next tees on alot of the holes are old school charming and awesome imo. Not something you see much anymore.

 

Lastly the rough is a blend of blue grass and turf type fescue.

 

We are going to agree to disagree. A few of the greens were softened, I believe it was the a few false fronts but not positive. There are no serve slopes on those greens and Kirtland has even more severe land then Moraine and they have more tilt/movement then those greens. Tie ins encompass more then just run up options to the greens and bunker/green tie ins. It encompasses the whole green area. Again, great course, it's just isn't the full package to me.

[Andrew Bond of Glencoe]

ML >>> CP

 

Have yet to play there, but have heard great things. Played Raynor’s Westhampton last week during the Open, playing Blue Mound and Fisher’s later this year.

 

[PThomas]

ML >>> CP

 

Have yet to play there, but have heard great things. Played Raynor's Westhampton last week during the Open, playing Blue Mound and Fisher's later this year.

 

Been trying to get on Westhampton for a while. Have seen enough of the course from the road(s) to tell it is something special. Just gets overshadowed by the neighbors in the area.

[oregongolf]

I'd immediately throw out Sahalee. I've played it a fair amount and I think it's a nice club to play and it would make you a better player, but it's one of the most overrated courses I've ever played. The Preserve is such a pure track too (the exclusivity must help?), but I'd switch it with Pasatiempo.

 

Was surprised to see Cal Club not in the top 100, honestly. I almost like it as much as SFGC and I think it's more "fun" than Olympic Lake.

[joeplus2]

It's like Detroit, when people think of it, they think Oakland Hills S, it's the 5th or 6th best track in SE MI imo.

I could not agree more. SE Mich is PACKED with top 100 candidates that go totally unmentioned

[youraway2]

TPC Stadium Course