KBS 610 Wedge Shaft

[AThompson_3]

Thinking about picking up one to throw in my 60* to test before throwing them in all of the wedges. How are these working out for you all so far?

[jas904]

As others have mentioned, they don't feel great and I might have lost a little spin around the greens (if so not much) but on half to full shots, they shine. The dreaded zip back off of the green is now gone. For that reason I have stuck with them.

[AThompson_3]

As others have mentioned, they don't feel great and I might have lost a little spin around the greens (if so not much) but on half to full shots, they shine. The dreaded zip back off of the green is now gone. For that reason I have stuck with them.

What does the flight look like? I love to hit some low spinners with my 60 but it tends to balloon at times and I get some inconsistent carry distances.

[Golf4lifer]

I have the S+ in my 55* and 59* wedges and I love the shaft in all facets of my short game. Great spin on chips and pitches, but also able to handle the occasional full shot. If anything I noticed an increase in spin on those delicate shots around the greens. I am able to flight them high or low, depending on what shot I need to play.

[AThompson_3]

I have the S+ in my 55* and 59* wedges and I love the shaft in all facets of my short game. Great spin on chips and pitches, but also able to handle the occasional full shot. If anything I noticed an increase in spin on those delicate shots around the greens. I am able to flight them high or low, depending on what shot I need to play.

I play lots of full shots with my wedges. Would they be fine in this aspect?

[Golf4lifer]

I have the S+ in my 55* and 59* wedges and I love the shaft in all facets of my short game. Great spin on chips and pitches, but also able to handle the occasional full shot. If anything I noticed an increase in spin on those delicate shots around the greens. I am able to flight them high or low, depending on what shot I need to play.

I play lots of full shots with my wedges. Would they be fine in this aspect?

 

I hit plenty of full shots with mine as the courses I play always has a par 3 at or under 120 yards or I am at that yardage. They hold up well and feel great to me. IMO this is a great all around wedge shaft.

[jas904]

As others have mentioned, they don't feel great and I might have lost a little spin around the greens (if so not much) but on half to full shots, they shine. The dreaded zip back off of the green is now gone. For that reason I have stuck with them.

What does the flight look like? I love to hit some low spinners with my 60 but it tends to balloon at times and I get some inconsistent carry distances.

Definitely less ballooning than anything else I've tried.

[DTown3011]

Any update on the 610s?

[bdubs3316]

Any update on the 610s?

 

Still LOVING my 610 125s...won't be going back to s400, x100 or anything else

[Golf4lifer]

Still love mine too! I have no complaints about them. I will use them as long as they are available.

[rpalmer109]

Can anyone shed some light on if there would be a difference between the 610’s vs. KBS tour 120?

 

I play Tour 120 in my irons and in my 54*. I’m assuming the difference would be minimal, but just wanted to see if anyone has tried both and has any insight?

[mattTHEkatt]

Can anyone shed some light on if there would be a difference between the 610’s vs. KBS tour 120?

 

I play Tour 120 in my irons and in my 54*. I’m assuming the difference would be minimal, but just wanted to see if anyone has tried both and has any insight?

 

 

I play the KBS FLT series in my irons and the 610's in my wedges. the 610's don't have that rip back effect on full shots but more of a 1 hop stop maybe a foot or 2 of back up. I have ripped back more pitching wedge shots than I have with my 52 or 56 full shots.

 

I really like the ability to flight the ball down and never worry about a balloon ball, but I don't notice any loss of spin around the green with chip or pitch shots. Like the others have stated, it is a very versatile and all around great wedge shaft.

[Wdwfreak]

Does everyone that plays these play them with other KBS shafts in their irons? I'm back to project x 7.0s after playing with C-tapers and im stuck on the wedges, may go back to project x 6.5 in the wedges... Or something different?? Right now I have a project x 6.5 in my 52 degree and kbs 610 in my 60 and pulled out an old 64 degree with an s300, got three different wedge shafts right now haha. honestly feel really similar and see (without a launch monitor) the same Ballflight with the 6.5 and kbs 610 (I don't hit many full swing 64 degrees) but I feel conflicted about what to play.

[SirHoselRocket]

The 610 has a larger butt diameter compared to the tour. It also maintains its stiffness down that shaft longer. So it doesn’t have the smooth feel of KBS Tour. It’s feels firmer. Plays stiffer.

 

 

 

Can anyone shed some light on if there would be a difference between the 610’s vs. KBS tour 120?

 

I play Tour 120 in my irons and in my 54*. I’m assuming the difference would be minimal, but just wanted to see if anyone has tried both and has any insight?

[pcs11]

I just put the 610 115 R+ in my gap wedge for a test run. Might be my favorite wedge shaft ever. I also like the numerous weight options KBS offers.

[pavlam05]

So the more I read, the more convinced I am that I want to give the 610's a go in the new Vokeys I am about to order. My next question is flex. I have KBS Tour 130x in my 850 forged 4-GW, and would wonder what flex to go with in the 610s. I am a high spin player and have had more than my fair share of sand wedges (stock vokey wedge flex, s200) that look good when the land, only to end up having to chip with the sand wedge again.

 

I love the idea of going weaker in my wedges, but I wonder of the S+ 610 would be different enough to notice, or if I should go S, at least in the lob wedge. I certainly hit more full shots with my sand wedge than the lob wedge, but I hit plenty of 1/2-3/4 shots with both.

[Golf4lifer]

I play the PX 7.0 in my irons and pw and the 610 S+ in my gw, sw, lw. For me the 610's can handle a full swing or a chip shot. These are a very versatile shafts and fit well with my swing. I would stay in the same flex for each wedge.

[DTown3011]

So the more I read, the more convinced I am that I want to give the 610's a go in the new Vokeys I am about to order. My next question is flex. I have KBS Tour 130x in my 850 forged 4-GW, and would wonder what flex to go with in the 610s. I am a high spin player and have had more than my fair share of sand wedges (stock vokey wedge flex, s200) that look good when the land, only to end up having to chip with the sand wedge again.

 

I love the idea of going weaker in my wedges, but I wonder of the S+ 610 would be different enough to notice, or if I should go S, at least in the lob wedge. I certainly hit more full shots with my sand wedge than the lob wedge, but I hit plenty of 1/2-3/4 shots with both.

 

I would do the 125g S+ for sure if you are in 130x in the irons.

[pavlam05]

So the more I read, the more convinced I am that I want to give the 610's a go in the new Vokeys I am about to order. My next question is flex. I have KBS Tour 130x in my 850 forged 4-GW, and would wonder what flex to go with in the 610s. I am a high spin player and have had more than my fair share of sand wedges (stock vokey wedge flex, s200) that look good when the land, only to end up having to chip with the sand wedge again.

 

I love the idea of going weaker in my wedges, but I wonder of the S+ 610 would be different enough to notice, or if I should go S, at least in the lob wedge. I certainly hit more full shots with my sand wedge than the lob wedge, but I hit plenty of 1/2-3/4 shots with both.

 

I would do the 125g S+ for sure if you are in 130x in the irons.

 

Yeah, I guess that is what I was figuring I would do. When I got fit for my irons, I was actually fit into the Tour S+ (125g), but the pro recommended going with the 130x since my irons are 1/2" over standard. I can't say I would complain at all. I broke par on 9 and 18 holes for the first time with this set of irons. I never thought in my life that I would be looking to shoot in the 60's, but I'm hoping some laser accurate wedge shots will get me there. It's a lot easier to make 3-footers for birdie than 20-footers.

[pavlam05]

Are the KBS 610 wedge shafts counterbalanced or high balance point shafts?

 

I got my new sm7 wedges with these shafts in an S Plus Flex, 125 grams. I just had the swing weights checked, and they came in at around a D7. Wondering how much weight I should add to the butt end to get them down to the stock D5 range?

[Valtiel]

Are the KBS 610 wedge shafts counterbalanced or high balance point shafts?

 

I got my new sm7 wedges with these shafts in an S Plus Flex, 125 grams. I just had the swing weights checked, and they came in at around a D7. Wondering how much weight I should add to the butt end to get them down to the stock D5 range?

 

A counterbalanced shaft would cause a lower swing weight reading, not higher. Are they standard length? If the wedges feel good to you then don't worry about the number. If they feel too heavy then your only options are to shorten shaft length and decrease head weight via porting.

[pavlam05]

Sorry...should have been more clear. They are 1/2" over standard length, as all my irons are. I would rather add a few grams to the butt than port the head.

 

I figured the shaft must not be counterbalanced. The reason for the question was to clarify. I measured my 6 iron and PW at the same time, and those came in at D2 and D3 respectively.

[Valtiel]

Sorry...should have been more clear. They are 1/2" over standard length, as all my irons are. I would rather add a few grams to the butt than port the head.

 

I figured the shaft must not be counterbalanced. The reason for the question was to clarify. I measured my 6 iron and PW at the same time, and those came in at D2 and D3 respectively.

 

Ah gotcha, yeah 1/2 over explains the heavier swing weight. The problem is, adding weight to the butt won't solve your problem. What you want is for the club to be lighter, adding counter weight changes the reading using parameters that were not intended in the design and function of the swing weight scale which gives you a different result. Its easy to imagine that shortening the lever and removing shaft is going to feel different than adding weight to the club. They both may measure D5 in the end but one D5 will be heavier than the other. If you want to experiment for yourself it would take somewhere around 10-12g of counter weight to get the scale to read D5. If that feels good to you then great! If it still feels to heavy though then removing head weight or shortening the shaft is the only answer.

[pavlam05]

12 grams is less than half an ounce. I would hardly think that would make the club noticeably heavier. To the contrary, I belive it would FEEL lighter due to the swing weight change. I'm not afraid of a small static weight change. To me, swing weight is more important.

[Valtiel]

12 grams is less than half an ounce. I would hardly think that would make the club noticeably heavier. To the contrary, I belive it would FEEL lighter due to the swing weight change. I'm not afraid of a small static weight change. To me, swing weight is more important.

 

I understand what you're focused on here as I used to be the same way, but i'm telling you're not properly understanding swing weight in the context it was meant to be used if all you're looking for is a scale to tell you a number because that number was only meant to be significant within the context of a set of clubs with known static weights. Yes 12 grams is only 1/2 an ounce but by that logic the difference between D7 and D5 is only 4 grams of head weight, 1/14th of an ounce.

 

I had this same exact problem once with my 4-iron; it was 2 swing weight points heavier than I wanted it to be and I could definitely feel it. I experimented with 12 and 16 grams of counterweight and they both lowered the measured swing weight but they both felt worse. The sensation of the head had diminished a little (which is what swing weight intends to measure) but the overall club felt heavier as the actual MOI was increased. This is why swing weight needs to be taken with a heavy pinch of salt when you start deviating from its intended parameters. You could add 100g of weight to the head and 260g of weight to the butt and you could get D5 and the club would feel like a training aide.

 

My point is that if you actually feel like the club is too heavy right now, counter weighting can make that worse and I want to save you that aggravation if I can. The sensation of the head will decrease very slightly (swing weight) but the static weight will increase making the whole club feel slightly heavier. I look at the different sensations like this; swing weight is felt in the wrists and static weight is felt in the arms, shoulders, and body. With my 4 iron it was not a swing weight problem, it was a static weight problem and I needed a lighter shaft to fix the issue. A club that previously felt too heavy at D4 now felt slightly lighter and just right at D5 with a 15g shaft weight decrease. Wedges are big time feel clubs so I don't want that thrown off by chasing a number just because its a number.

 

Now with the said, if you have no real problem with how the club feels now and you just want it to read D5 for the sake of matching with your other clubs then by all means go ahead, no harm done. I just wanted to make sure you understood what all this stuff actually translates to with regards to feel so you don't apply the same solution later on and make the same mistake I did.

[Jagpilotohio]

I second what Valtiel Said. I don't have much to add.

 

Counterweighting irons under the grip to reach a particular swingweight does not do exactly what you are looking for....to lighten the feel of the head.

 

Adding a very significant amount of weight to the butt end of a shaft to “trick” a swingweight scale is probably not going to accomplish what you think it will from a feel standpoint.

[DTown3011]

I pulled my 610 120S out after reading this thread again and have really been enjoying it. The problem with many of these wedge specific shafts is they suck on full swings but really shine on less than full shots and touch shots around the green. However, the 120S really flights it nicely. I'm really wanting to try a 125S+ but don't want it to be TOO stiff. Has anyone tried both side by side?

[pavlam05]

I haven't had a ton of swings with them yet, but I have been impressed so far. The description from KBS seems quite accurate.

 

As to the conversation about swing weight... "Swing Weight Defined. In simple terms, swing weight is how heavy the club head feels when you swing it."

 

Nowhere in any of my previous comments did I say that my wedges felt too heavy. For me, they feel slightly HEAD HEAVY...meaning the center of gravity is too low, too close to the head, which is what swing weight is measuring. I posted the question with a perfect understanding that static weight and swing weight are two different things. My main concern was the characteristics of this particular shaft and whether it would affect the amount of weight needed to make a swing weight change.

 

Maybe I would care if I was at an E3, but as it is, I could give a rip if I add a few grams of static weight if the end result is a feel of balance where I want it. I don't want to start a big war here, but I love when there is a presumed lack of knowledge behind someone's question.

[DTown3011]

I was able to give the 610 120S a good run through today and really put it through the paces on the course vs S400. I have played S400 for as long as I can remember to be honest - never played another wedge shaft. The 610 provides a lot more “feel” as it’s smoother than S400 and really has a nice stable load without feeling loose. I wouldn’t say it hit massively lower than I’m used to but the accuracy was crazy - I just felt like I could throw darts at the hole and not have them suck back. High, low, pitches, chips all were great. I think I’m sold on these and switching all my wedges to them.

[Poolparty]

I was able to give the 610 120S a good run through today and really put it through the paces on the course vs S400. I have played S400 for as long as I can remember to be honest - never played another wedge shaft. The 610 provides a lot more "feel" as it's smoother than S400 and really has a nice stable load without feeling loose. I wouldn't say it hit massively lower than I'm used to but the accuracy was crazy - I just felt like I could throw darts at the hole and not have them suck back. High, low, pitches, chips all were great. I think I'm sold on these and switching all my wedges to them.

 

Yeah I found them a bit hard to describe too -- you did a better job than me, but I don't know -- the just felt oddly good and everything comes out in the right window right at the hole. I sold my 610 set because I had the wrong bounce/grind, but putting 610s in my new set is probably happening eventually. Just have to decide if I should try the PXlzs I already bought or not first.