Cheating

[wildcatden]

When you get past US Kids, most of the parents walk so you don't have the problems like these. Most of the parents also move forward down the fairways to where the ball is more than likely going to land. Imagine your parents are staring down every single shot evaluating you. Golf is so expensive, cutting out cart fees can result in anywhere between $500 and $1000 a year in expenses. Only time we rent a cart is if the weather looks really bad. Otherwise we pack up a backpack, bring some headphones, and enjoy the day.

 

Yeah cart fees are a killer. We utilize our push cart at nearly all events. Last weekend, I had been getting over a cold so was a bit tired and this particular course had 3 long walks between a few holes. The cart rental for 9-holes for me and my kid (who couldn't ride during the hole as you know) was $30!! The guy said it was $15/rider and I mentioned the "no ride" policy for my kid during holes and still no dice. And this is just a run-of-the-mill public course that was in average to poor condition at best. We'll be walking there next year for sure.

[j.b.newton]

Although she has no real business doing so, I guess she can question your son's score, but calling him a cheater is flat out disgusting. There is a reason parents aren't allowed to spectate these events. It is the player's responsibility to officiate and score themselves.

 

Personally, I would let it blow over this time, but if it happens again the mom definitely needs to be put in check. During our IMG tournament a few weeks ago, I could not believe the amount of arguing among golf parents. A few of the arguments almost escalated and got physical. It was not only the dads either. The Mom's were very feisty.

 

Rumor has it there was a fight in the parking lot between dads at The Future Master's.

 

Really? Would love to hear more of this story!

[heavy_hitter]

When you get past US Kids, most of the parents walk so you don't have the problems like these. Most of the parents also move forward down the fairways to where the ball is more than likely going to land. Imagine your parents are staring down every single shot evaluating you. Golf is so expensive, cutting out cart fees can result in anywhere between $500 and $1000 a year in expenses. Only time we rent a cart is if the weather looks really bad. Otherwise we pack up a backpack, bring some headphones, and enjoy the day.

 

Yeah cart fees are a killer. We utilize our push cart at nearly all events. Last weekend, I had been getting over a cold so was a bit tired and this particular course had 3 long walks between a few holes. The cart rental for 9-holes for me and my kid (who couldn't ride during the hole as you know) was $30!! The guy said it was $15/rider and I mentioned the "no ride" policy for my kid during holes and still no dice. And this is just a run-of-the-mill public course that was in average to poor condition at best. We'll be walking there next year for sure.

 

$30.00 cart fee for 9 holes? Ghee-sh. You should have asked him how to much to play 9 holes.

[heavy_hitter]

Although she has no real business doing so, I guess she can question your son's score, but calling him a cheater is flat out disgusting. There is a reason parents aren't allowed to spectate these events. It is the player's responsibility to officiate and score themselves.

 

Personally, I would let it blow over this time, but if it happens again the mom definitely needs to be put in check. During our IMG tournament a few weeks ago, I could not believe the amount of arguing among golf parents. A few of the arguments almost escalated and got physical. It was not only the dads either. The Mom's were very feisty.

 

Rumor has it there was a fight in the parking lot between dads at The Future Master's.

 

Really? Would love to hear more of this story!

 

Not on a public forum from me. Maybe the person who called me and told me the story last night will chime in.

[j.b.newton]

Although she has no real business doing so, I guess she can question your son's score, but calling him a cheater is flat out disgusting. There is a reason parents aren't allowed to spectate these events. It is the player's responsibility to officiate and score themselves.

 

Personally, I would let it blow over this time, but if it happens again the mom definitely needs to be put in check. During our IMG tournament a few weeks ago, I could not believe the amount of arguing among golf parents. A few of the arguments almost escalated and got physical. It was not only the dads either. The Mom's were very feisty.

 

Rumor has it there was a fight in the parking lot between dads at The Future Master's.

 

Really? Would love to hear more of this story!

 

Not on a public forum from me. Maybe the person who called me and told me the story last night will chime in.

 

Fair enough. Im from about 30 min away and was there. I love parent drama - always makes me chuckle!

[kekoa]

Although she has no real business doing so, I guess she can question your son's score, but calling him a cheater is flat out disgusting. There is a reason parents aren't allowed to spectate these events. It is the player's responsibility to officiate and score themselves.

 

Personally, I would let it blow over this time, but if it happens again the mom definitely needs to be put in check. During our IMG tournament a few weeks ago, I could not believe the amount of arguing among golf parents. A few of the arguments almost escalated and got physical. It was not only the dads either. The Mom's were very feisty.

 

Rumor has it there was a fight in the parking lot between dads at The Future Master's.

 

Really? Would love to hear more of this story!

 

Not on a public forum from me. Maybe the person who called me and told me the story last night will chime in.

 

Imagine if the dads ended up in jail. They can tell their buddies it was over a contested score in their Kid's golf tournament. :to_become_senile:

[j.b.newton]

Although she has no real business doing so, I guess she can question your son's score, but calling him a cheater is flat out disgusting. There is a reason parents aren't allowed to spectate these events. It is the player's responsibility to officiate and score themselves.

 

Personally, I would let it blow over this time, but if it happens again the mom definitely needs to be put in check. During our IMG tournament a few weeks ago, I could not believe the amount of arguing among golf parents. A few of the arguments almost escalated and got physical. It was not only the dads either. The Mom's were very feisty.

 

Rumor has it there was a fight in the parking lot between dads at The Future Master's.

 

Really? Would love to hear more of this story!

 

Not on a public forum from me. Maybe the person who called me and told me the story last night will chime in.

 

Imagine if the dads ended up in jail. They can tell their buddies it was over a contested score in their Kid's golf tournament. :to_become_senile:

 

Can you imagine the how bad the wives would be cussing their husbands over martini's while the kid is sulking under the table in embarrassment?

[BertGA]

NCAA is different.

 

The rule is there for several reasons in junior golf. The main two are to stop the coaching and to stop the talking from the parent to the kid. I think the biggest reason is when an official sees a parent chattering away at their kids they have something to fall back on when approaching the parent. From 50 yards away you can't whisper when coaching. You aren't going to get, I don't think, a parent talking to their kid at a NCAA Golf tournament.

 

USKG doesn't list a yardage to stay away. Only that spectators must stay on cart path and behind the group. http://www.uskidsgolf.com/tournaments/player-info/uskg-policies/cart-policy

 

Anyway, I've never had a problem with spectators at a USKG event, but we are young and there is still plenty of time (fingers crossed)!! :hunter:

 

There is plenty of time. Only been at it a little more than a season, and at one event had spectators in front cross the fairway on the cart path as my daughter was teeing off, well within her range.

 

Same round, different spectator turned his cart around to drive back into our group the second time a tee shot rolled up on his grandaughter. Proceeded to berate our group, players included, about hitting into them. That argument carried over to the scoring table.

 

Wasn’t my daughter hitting into them, but she caught the wrath as she was teed up at the time.

[Bob Cat]

If you're in a cart, please apply the brake even if you think you're on level ground. If that cart rolls backwards, many times the reverse alarm will sound and usually in the most inopportune time.

If you're in a gas cart, you'll need to be more aware of kids hitting on adjacent holes.

[LeoLeo99]

Time to learn there are jerks in this world and how to deal with them. Usually, direct and blunt is the best way:

 

 

"I don't appreciate you questioning the honesty of my kid..."

[ousuxndallas]

Who in the world enters their kid in a tournament before the age of 7? Is that for real?

 

Holy cow, get a grip people.

 

As for the OP, I would just talk to your son and explain you have his back. That's the most important lesson/takeaway for him. If you openly confront the other parent or officials, you may win the battle but lose the war.

[hangontight]

Who in the world enters their kid in a tournament before the age of 7? Is that for real?

 

Holy cow, get a grip people.

 

As for the OP, I would just talk to your son and explain you have his back. That's the most important lesson/takeaway for him. If you openly confront the other parent or officials, you may win the battle but lose the war.

 

Welcome to the forum. Lots of people in the world enter their kids in golf tournaments before the age of 7. Lots of people enter their kids into soccer, t ball, flag football, swimming, piano; dance, etc......before the age of 7. This thread isn’t about that and no need to get off track , but just thought I would post an answer to your question.

[mrshinsa]

Played in a local last week where the dad was laying a club down as alignment parallel to the ball for every shot (putts included). The kids are 7. I asked him after the round if he was going to be taking his kid to any USKG Regionals this year. He said "yes". I then gently reminded him that it was illegal to use the club for alignment and that he would definitely get called on it at a regional/state/worlds event. We'll see what happens at this weeks local.

 

So this issue came up at a local tournament before. and while it's perplexing, it's perfectly legal.

The ruling by the official was that alignment stick(or a club) can be used to align, but must be removed prior to swing.

 

 

8-2. Indicating Line of Play

a. Other Than on Putting Green

Except on the putting green, a player may have the line of play indicated to him by anyone, but no one may be positioned by the player for that purpose on or close to the line or an extension of the line beyond the hole while the stroke is being made. Any mark placed by the player or with his knowledge, for the purpose of indicating the line of play, must be removed before the stroke is made.

[BertGA]

Played in a local last week where the dad was laying a club down as alignment parallel to the ball for every shot (putts included). The kids are 7. I asked him after the round if he was going to be taking his kid to any USKG Regionals this year. He said "yes". I then gently reminded him that it was illegal to use the club for alignment and that he would definitely get called on it at a regional/state/worlds event. We'll see what happens at this weeks local.

 

So this issue came up at a local tournament before. and while it's perplexing, it's perfectly legal.

The ruling by the official was that alignment stick(or a club) can be used to align, but must be removed prior to swing.

 

 

8-2. Indicating Line of Play

a. Other Than on Putting Green

Except on the putting green, a player may have the line of play indicated to him by anyone, but no one may be positioned by the player for that purpose on or close to the line or an extension of the line beyond the hole while the stroke is being made. Any mark placed by the player or with his knowledge, for the purpose of indicating the line of play, must be removed before the stroke is made.

 

I assumed from his story that the stick was left there. I have begun teaching my daughter to lay the driver down before she sets her feet, as she is often wildly off in her setup. After she sets her feet, she picks up the club, takes a couple practice swings, steps into the shot and fires.

 

Haven’t used it in a tournament, but I’ve got no problem doing so if it helps her line up,

[tiger1873]

Who in the world enters their kid in a tournament before the age of 7? Is that for real?

 

Holy cow, get a grip people.

 

As for the OP, I would just talk to your son and explain you have his back. That's the most important lesson/takeaway for him. If you openly confront the other parent or officials, you may win the battle but lose the war.

 

Lots of people enter kids before 7 in tournaments and there is nothing wrong with it unless they take it too seriously.

 

My youngest daughter did tournaments at 6 not to win but be like her big sister. Usually there is no one else’s to compete most of the time and even when there is they all get a medal.

 

If she didn’t have a bigger sister playing I wouldn’t bother but it fun for the younger kids to experience play even though they may do 50 or 60 for 9 holes. It even fun for the parents at this age to see them walk 9 holes and be dedicated.

 

The only time is it a problem when you decide to quit you job and train them to be the next greatest golfer on Earth at that age.

[wildcatden]

Played in a local last week where the dad was laying a club down as alignment parallel to the ball for every shot (putts included). The kids are 7. I asked him after the round if he was going to be taking his kid to any USKG Regionals this year. He said "yes". I then gently reminded him that it was illegal to use the club for alignment and that he would definitely get called on it at a regional/state/worlds event. We'll see what happens at this weeks local.

 

So this issue came up at a local tournament before. and while it's perplexing, it's perfectly legal.

The ruling by the official was that alignment stick(or a club) can be used to align, but must be removed prior to swing.

 

 

8-2. Indicating Line of Play

a. Other Than on Putting Green

Except on the putting green, a player may have the line of play indicated to him by anyone, but no one may be positioned by the player for that purpose on or close to the line or an extension of the line beyond the hole while the stroke is being made. Any mark placed by the player or with his knowledge, for the purpose of indicating the line of play, must be removed before the stroke is made.

 

I thought it was all strokes not just putting green. Well, in that case, he's all good except for the times that it was done on the putting green. Note, they did pickup the alignment stick (club in this case) prior to every shot off and on the green. IMHO, a bad crutch habit to develop.

[LeoLeo99]

Who in the world enters their kid in a tournament before the age of 7? Is that for real?

 

Holy cow, get a grip people.

 

As for the OP, I would just talk to your son and explain you have his back. That's the most important lesson/takeaway for him. If you openly confront the other parent or officials, you may win the battle but lose the war.

 

You don't confront officials. You assume they are honest and doing their job. I don't understand what war you lose by sticking up for you kid and showing them how to deal with bullies in an adult manner. Bullies hope you don't confront them.

[Kenny Lee Puckett]

The scores were not changed because the players and scorekeeper all agreed on the score my son recorded. He did,indeed, place in first.

 

This was not a USKG tournament but one run by our section's PGA. There are no caddies and no spectators. She was breaking the rules by spectating.

and this is were you leave it. scores are kept and verified by all parties involved in the event. not some parent standing around waiting to pick up their kid (who just happens to be somebody looking to meddle into things). you seeking even further discussion (meaning: you directly confronting her) about any of this is a rabbit hole you do not want to go down. trust in Reagan's old expression here ~ "If you're explaining, you're losing."

 

don't go anywhere near this person, period. and tell your son to stay the hell away from her son. apples never fall too far from the tree.

 

and in the future if reality sets in? the woman may/should come and apologize to you.... but I wouldn't hold my breath.

[MuniPukeLife]

I'd straight up say that your a person of integrity, and what the mom thinks doesn't matter. The only person your son has to please is himself. The only time he should be concerned is if he has a problem, not someone else.

 

And straight up, if the tournament officials are stupid enough to listen to parents who have a biased agenda, they're a disgrace. Not to mention, 99% of golfing parents are not qualified to say a word about what happens on a golf course in a tournament.

 

That is said without offense to many parents out there that know about the game, but also respect how much they DON'T know.

 

I'd also say that if your son goes out and gets some more Ws and places well, that will silence all the garbage from other parties, or make it obviously seem like the garbage that it really is.

 

Just my 0.02 . . . .

 

Best of luck to your son, hope he keeps up the good play!

[wildcatden]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

[BertGA]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

At this point it’s almost become an issue of pace of play, from what you describe. All that coaching ticks time off the clock,

 

Have you discussed any of this with the director? At the very least, I thought through 2018 caddies were not allowed to indicate line of putts by touching the green.

[leezer99]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

This is ridiculous. If they are this controlling during a junior golf tournament I can only imagine what they are like at home.

[wildcatden]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

At this point it's almost become an issue of pace of play, from what you describe. All that coaching ticks time off the clock,

 

Have you discussed any of this with the director? At the very least, I thought through 2018 caddies were not allowed to indicate line of putts by touching the green.

 

Surprisingly, we are able to keep up with the group in front of us. We were a 3-some today and a 3-some in front and behind. I will grant them that they are pretty quick about it.

[wildcatden]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

This is ridiculous. If they are this controlling during a junior golf tournament I can only imagine what they are like at home.

 

Hilariously, the kid sometimes (especially later in the round), rolls his eyes when his dad is doing the putter line up thing. Sort of a "just stop it look" and they tend to bicker more later in the round.

[mrshinsa]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

For #2, I would VERY politely let the dad know that it's illegal to place any object on the putting green for the sole purpose of lining up the player.

8-2. Indicating Line of Play

b. On the Putting Green

When the player's ball is on the putting green, the line of putt may be indicated before, but not during, the stroke by the player, his partner or either of their caddies; in doing so the putting green must not be touched. A mark must not be placed anywhere for the purpose of indicating a line of putt.

 

For #3, It depends if he touched the green or not. If he did not touch the green, the I would just shake it off and ignore the whole ordeal as a mildly amusing spectacle. If he did touch the green, then I would again VERY politely let him know that it's illegal to touch the green to indicate the line of play.

16-1. General

a. Touching Line of Putt

The line of puttmust not be touched except:

loose impediments, provided he does not press anything down;

addressing it, provided he does not press anything down;

18-6;

16-1b;

(vi)in repairing old hole plugs or ball marks on the putting green - Rule 16-1c; and

obstructions - Rule 24-1.

 

 

The key here is to be VERY polite, perhaps after the hole has been played out. You're going to be seeing this Dad perhaps every other Sunday so try not to make enemies if you know what I mean.

[wildcatden]

Here's a new wrinkle to the caddie alignment issue at the USKG Local today.

 

#1. Still placing club to align their player at tee or shots from the fairway/rough as allowed under rule 8-2.

#2. Still placing the club to align on the putting green. Illegal as far as I know (2-stroke penalty per infraction on the green).

 

....and the new one....

 

#3. After lining up the player to putt on the green, kneeling directly in front of the player and parallel to his line, he would place his forefinger from each hand at the point backwards and forwards he felt the player should swing the putter....essentially the "length" of the putting stroke with the backward part probably being more important.

 

No idea on #3 if that is illegal.

 

For #2, I would VERY politely let the dad know that it's illegal to place any object on the putting green for the sole purpose of lining up the player.

8-2. Indicating Line of Play

b. On the Putting Green

When the player's ball is on the putting green, the line of putt may be indicated before, but not during, the stroke by the player, his partner or either of their caddies; in doing so the putting green must not be touched. A mark must not be placed anywhere for the purpose of indicating a line of putt.

 

For #3, It depends if he touched the green or not. If he did not touch the green, the I would just shake it off and ignore the whole ordeal as a mildly amusing spectacle. If he did touch the green, then I would again VERY politely let him know that it's illegal to touch the green to indicate the line of play.

16-1. General

a. Touching Line of Putt

The line of puttmust not be touched except:

loose impediments, provided he does not press anything down;

addressing it, provided he does not press anything down;

18-6;

16-1b;

(vi)in repairing old hole plugs or ball marks on the putting green - Rule 16-1c; and

obstructions - Rule 24-1.

 

 

The key here is to be VERY polite, perhaps after the hole has been played out. You're going to be seeing this Dad perhaps every other Sunday so try not to make enemies if you know what I mean.

 

Yeah get your point on the polite part. As far as #3, he is not touching the line of the putt. Right handed putter, build two tracks (one for feet and one for ball), he is on a 3rd track parallel to the other two...as if where the feet would be if the kid was a left handed putter.