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Breaking 90 - the "easiest" way?


Z1ggy16

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I broke 80 before with drives averaging 160 yards. lol

160 is usually my 7 or 6 iron, so if I follow that logic, I should be able to break 90 easily.

I was duck hooking it all day long. I never lost a golf ball from the tee but they were surely short.

My short game was on fire that day and my irons were solid.

I realized then and there that I don't need long drives to break 80 at a 6000-6400 yard course.

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  • 3 months later...
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After watching some very good seniors play great golf I’m not ready to play safe golf to get my handicap down a couple of numbers. There is no satisfaction in avoiding clubs you can’t hit very well. A conservative poor golfer is still a poor golfer. Like people who play off short tees you’re only cheating yourself.

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After rereading this thread, Ziggy, you've misrepresented my video you're referring to in a grossly dishonest way.

How do you expect any meaningful discussion if you don't link to the video nor state what's in it even remotely accurately?

...

Too many people are looking at these things in black and white.

...

 

Did OP actually mention which video he was referring to? Quite a long discussion in this thread and you decided to bash OP who was questioning the validity of the idea. Someone really sees this in black and white.

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Matt,

 

You don't need to take my posts as offensive or an attack against you. I'm a subscriber to your channel and I do enjoy your content. I'll gladly post your original video in my original post if you'd like. I was inviting this forum to an open debate on your advice and yes, I had some criticism of it because it relies on high cappers to have not just an okay short game, but a pretty good one b/c theoretically they'd almost never be able to 3 putt since a majority of their 3rd shots would be little chips and pitches. According to statistics, 20+ cappers 3putt almost 25% of the time. Now is that because they aren't using your approach? Maybe.

 

Since you posted these videos I have adopted your strategy and it does work. I don't think it's as cut and dry as you say though... That's just my opinion. On the whole, I do 100% agree with you that less skilled golfers could benefit from hitting shorter clubs off the tee. I personally rarely take driver out of the bag and most of the time that's beneficial to me.

 

 

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I have found in my experience the key to breaking 90 is to keep the ball in play off the tee and be cute around the greens.

A guy i play with who is a former scratch golfer told me that if a high handicapper can give himself a par putt on every hole he wont go too far wrong.

Even when im not striking the ball at my best , I always make sure to give myself a putt for par and ensure a bogey at the very worst

If you can pick up a few pars then on the par 3s and the easier holes you will break 90!!!

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Matt,

 

You don't need to take my posts as offensive or an attack against you. I'm a subscriber to your channel and I do enjoy your content. I'll gladly post your original video in my original post if you'd like. I was inviting this forum to an open debate on your advice and yes, I had some criticism of it because it relies on high cappers to have not just an okay short game, but a pretty good one b/c theoretically they'd almost never be able to 3 putt since a majority of their 3rd shots would be little chips and pitches. According to statistics, 20+ cappers 3putt almost 25% of the time. Now is that because they aren't using your approach? Maybe.

 

Since you posted these videos I have adopted your strategy and it does work. I don't think it's as cut and dry as you say though... That's just my opinion. On the whole, I do 100% agree with you that less skilled golfers could benefit from hitting shorter clubs off the tee. I personally rarely take driver out of the bag and most of the time that's beneficial to me.

 

I was really just curious as to why the suggestions put forward from the video, weren't the actual suggestions I made in the video?

But I did laugh when I read further posts and you started doing the actual tip.

At the time, that was what I recalled from memory and my interpretation of what you suggested. Seemed like it was along the lines of [mid] iron off the tee, lay up to some sort of short pitching yardage, pitch on as close you can, putt (putt?), rinse and repeat.

 

I also enjoyed your recent video where you shot 80 only using 4 clubs...proves a decent point.

 

 

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I think the majority of folks who cant break 90 would best beneift from the following:

 

#1) Stop Duffing it: STOP Hitting irons heavy. Thats a big one. That and stop thinning wedges over the green. Thin your irons, Fat your wedges.

#2) Putting speed. Dont hit the ball all over the green. Roll it so it stops near the hole. Closer and closer if you must.

#3) Stop losing balls. Off the tee mostly, but in general: Review every shot, with the primary objective of not losing the ball.

#4) Learn how to get out of a bunker in one stroke every time.

#5) Use the driver less. Ask yourself if the hole would be easier without a driver. Many times a well placed, accurate Fairway or hybrid is far more valuable than a moderately accurate bomb. Put yourself on flat land, with an unobstructed approach shot.

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I think the majority of folks who cant break 90 would best beneift from the following:

 

#1) Stop Duffing it: STOP Hitting irons heavy. Thats a big one. That and stop thinning wedges over the green. Thin your irons, Fat your wedges.

#2) Putting speed. Dont hit the ball all over the green. Roll it so it stops near the hole. Closer and closer if you must.

#3) Stop losing balls. Off the tee mostly, but in general: Review every shot, with the primary objective of not losing the ball.

#4) Learn how to get out of a bunker in one stroke every time.

#5) Use the driver less. Ask yourself if the hole would be easier without a driver. Many times a well placed, accurate Fairway or hybrid is far more valuable than a moderately accurate bomb. Put yourself on flat land, with an unobstructed approach shot.

 

Translation: be a better golfer.

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I think the majority of folks who cant break 90 would best beneift from the following:

 

#1) Stop Duffing it: STOP Hitting irons heavy. Thats a big one. That and stop thinning wedges over the green. Thin your irons, Fat your wedges.

#2) Putting speed. Dont hit the ball all over the green. Roll it so it stops near the hole. Closer and closer if you must.

#3) Stop losing balls. Off the tee mostly, but in general: Review every shot, with the primary objective of not losing the ball.

#4) Learn how to get out of a bunker in one stroke every time.

#5) Use the driver less. Ask yourself if the hole would be easier without a driver. Many times a well placed, accurate Fairway or hybrid is far more valuable than a moderately accurate bomb. Put yourself on flat land, with an unobstructed approach shot.

 

Translation: be a better golfer.

 

Its true, easier said than done. But you might be surprised. For many people playing poor golf (100+ scores), just identifying these issues can help to shave strokes. For example, when I introduced a girlfriend of mine to the game, she had a decent iron game: short and straight. But when she got on the greens she was hitting the ball all over the green, choosing the right line, but blowing it past the hole 5 feet or 5 feet short. I (carefully) suggested that she focus on speed, try to roll the ball right up to the hole, no further, no shorter. Simply identifying a simple issue shaved 5-8 strokes off her score!

 

Many people playing poor golf make the same simple mistakes over and over. Simply focusing on hitting the ground in front of the ball instead fo behind it will likelty turn every occasional 5 yard duff into a 150 yard worm burner at the worst. This puts the ball closer to the green and gives the opportinity for a lower score.

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  • 1 month later...

it has been a while since being mid teen hcp golfer ranging from 13 to 16. to a point, i thought it was what it was. But I don't wanna give up. I wanna be better.

 

Currently, my hcp is 16 and average score from past 20 rounds is 94.5. 9 out of 20 was below 95. 4 out of 20 was in 80s. my home course (71.5/130) is narrow, hilly and undulated. In other word, very unforgiving. I usually end up losing handful of balls.

 

I have somewhat been successful with 70% rule and nothing on mind rule but I tend to choke in tournament. Currently working on 30 yds or less chip shots and consistency in driving with driver, 3w and hybrids.

 

any other advise for me?

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It just works... sending hands right of target line flattens out swing and creates much less stress on lower back. 75% effort reduces stress on back. Drives will be in fairway 80% of max drive distance. It's a trade off of distance for accuracy and its an easy way to get lower scores. Maximizing ones potential might need another strategy, but if you struggle at getting it in play then do this until you learn to wack it 300 yards down the pipe every time

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It just works... sending hands right of target line flattens out swing and creates much less stress on lower back. 75% effort reduces stress on back. Drives will be in fairway 80% of max drive distance. It's a trade off of distance for accuracy and its an easy way to get lower scores. Maximizing ones potential might need another strategy, but if you struggle at getting it in play then do this until you learn to wack it 300 yards down the pipe every time

I'd rather take a proper swing with a higher lofted club than to take some sort of weird hip restricted swing-to-the-opposite-field motion with my driver. No coach has ever told me to do this. Agree to disagree.

 

 

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You nailed it honestly. If it was a proper swing then we wouldn't be having this discussion. Open stance isn't the key, you can do a closed stance. The key is not to come ott and the hands going to right of the target instills the relationship of where your hands end and hitting draws and fades which is crucial for taking one side of the fairway out of play

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It just works... sending hands right of target line flattens out swing and creates much less stress on lower back. 75% effort reduces stress on back. Drives will be in fairway 80% of max drive distance. It's a trade off of distance for accuracy and its an easy way to get lower scores. Maximizing ones potential might need another strategy, but if you struggle at getting it in play then do this until you learn to wack it 300 yards down the pipe every time

I'd rather take a proper swing with a higher lofted club than to take some sort of weird hip restricted swing-to-the-opposite-field motion with my driver. No coach has ever told me to do this. Agree to disagree.

 

For me, it does make sense. My recent preshot routine is to rotate my hip left as impact position and swing straight line. It creates sensation of "sending hand right of target line." trajectory usually straight or slight fade. the problem is that I often forget to do it on course. From reading this, I am willing to cut few yards for consistency and better score. at least I am trying.

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  • 2 weeks later...

It just works... sending hands right of target line flattens out swing and creates much less stress on lower back. 75% effort reduces stress on back. Drives will be in fairway 80% of max drive distance. It's a trade off of distance for accuracy and its an easy way to get lower scores. Maximizing ones potential might need another strategy, but if you struggle at getting it in play then do this until you learn to wack it 300 yards down the pipe every time

 

I tried your recommendation on course and range. It did work. Surprisingly, it felt easy and natural to swing with slight open stance as I am natural drawer. some shots were faded but mostly straight. Thanx.

 

Past 2 rounds, I shot 94 and 90; when I shot 94, I made 4 straight double bogeys in the last 4 holes. Now I try to make 4 GIRs, 4 Pars or better and 4 Up & Downs. Road to 85 is near.

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Breaking 90 the easiest way is to get your ball striking to the point where you can mostly eliminate blow up holes. In order to eliminate blow up holes that means minimizing penalties off the tee and wasted shots (shanks, duffs, flubbed chips, leaving balls in bunkers, 3-putts, etc)

 

When you do get off line-take your medicine and just get the ball back in play.

When you have a large carry over a hazard, lay up

When you short side yourself, dont play the hero shot, play the high percentage shot to get the ball on the green

On par 5s, only play the club you can confidently hit off the deck on second shots

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I've been hovering around the low 90's all year. This is my second or third year of what I consider taking the game "seriously," as in I actually think about what I'm doing swing wise and strategy wise. I was starting to get really frustrated that I was not showing much improvement despite marked improvement in my swing and ball striking.

 

Then two things happened that shot me into the 80's with room to spare:

 

(1) I figured out my driver. This was the big one. I've hit my irons, hybrids, and fairway woods totally fine all year but my driver? Utter nightmare. My okay miss, which was probably 30% of the time, was an ugly duck hook. My really bad miss, which was probably 40% of the time, was a worm burner that went maybe 50 yards. Then it was 10% total blocks to the right and 10% good drives. 10% meh. Now that I'm hitting my driver well, even if I hit a not-great drive I'm still advancing the ball to a playable spot. This has been huuuuuge.

 

(2) The other one is that I played a couple easier courses. My usual course is not particularly long (6200ish from the whites) but it is tight, hilly, heavily wooded, and features lots of thick greenside rough. Oh and it's almost always wet. Decent shots that are just a little off can quite often become penalty strokes. You will not find your ball in the woods. I recently played a course that was a little flatter and a lot more open and shot my career best score (84). And I didn't even feel like I played any better, it was just an easier course.

 

I guess my takeaways are to minimize your big misses and avoid disaster. For me, my tee shots were putting me in a position where bogey was the most I could possibly ask for. Once par becomes more reasonable, scoring is way easier.

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For me to break into the 80's and stay there is/was/always will be grinding on my game..

 

This is what I do and YMMV:

 

18 lessons, twice a week for the last 3 months, with a very good coach

 

and

 

3-4 practice sessions/per week of...

---50-100 balls at the range, focusing on technique (this alternated between wedge work of the 7-9-11 swings, regular clubs and ball flight)

---50 balls at the range, focusing on situational shot selection

---10-15 minutes focused on green-side chipping (bump and run, 50/54/58 work and when to choose each)

---20-30 minutes focused on putting (some lag, but living in the 3-10 ft range pretty heavily)

 

Started this in Apr/May 2018 timeframe (was previously shooting 110-120) and now 4 of my last 7 rounds were in the 80's and just shot an 80 (gross) in a local tourney (with 3 birdies, 2 OB's, 4-5 pars, with far too many lip out bogeys). I regularly play with a buddy who shoots off a solid 4. We haven't played in the last 2 months and he was at a loss for words at how well I play now (his words).

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Watched a video last night on YT where a guy prescribed the easiest way to break 90 is by taking the par 4 yards, cutting it in half, and then playing that club x2, then working on short game to chip on (he assumes high caps won't hit greens) and then 2 putting. Same thing for a par 5, split it in 3, hit that club 3 times, chip on, 2 putt. For par 3, he suggested clubbing up once and then taking a very smooth relaxed swing and repeating the chip on and 2 putt process.

 

I think one major flaw is that it requires every single shot to at least go toward target and that high cappers can chip effectively enough from the rough. It doesn't happen often on a full iron for me but every now and again I'll severely fat one, or tug it by 20 yards. I'm also known to fat chips or leave them really short. It also assumes that a high capper can effectively get out of a bunker which isn't always the case. I think the biggest flaw of all though is that high cappers can lag putt effectively. Per my other recent thread... Above all else, I struggle lag putting.

 

Lastly... Good luck taking your 6i out on every tee when you're playing with others, especially strangers. If you're not hitting the ball on fairways and reaching near the green in regulation every hole, you'll slow down the pace a bunch probably and make your fellow playing partners a little triggered.

 

Do you all agree this is the easiest way to break 90?

 

 

If I were pressed to give a simple approach to breaking 90, swing advice aside, I'd say this:

 

FORGET ABOUT SCORE, INSTEAD FOCUS ON THESE:

 

1) Use the easiest clubs in your bag to get a GIR

2) Use the easiest clubs in your bag to get an Up and Down

3) Putting: Forget about finding the perfect line. Instead put most of your effort on distance control: Trying to roll it close enough to the hole for a gimme. Pre imagine the feel of the stroke needed to roll it up to the hole, not past it, not short of it.

 

 

 

The Swing:

- Always have the same Grip ,stance, alignment and ball position. Repeating these is easy. Doing so breeds consistency. Its so easy to do its like cheating.

- Move around less in the swing. Try to swing in your address position. Your hips will move toward the target and you will rotate etc, but the less you deviate, the easier it is to make good contact.

- Follow through and make pure contact on the way. All poor golfers have two things in common: They lack a nice long balanced follow through and they dont even try to use the sweet spot.

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Watched a video last night on YT where a guy prescribed the easiest way to break 90 is by taking the par 4 yards, cutting it in half, and then playing that club x2, then working on short game to chip on (he assumes high caps won't hit greens) and then 2 putting. Same thing for a par 5, split it in 3, hit that club 3 times, chip on, 2 putt. For par 3, he suggested clubbing up once and then taking a very smooth relaxed swing and repeating the chip on and 2 putt process.

 

I think one major flaw is that it requires every single shot to at least go toward target and that high cappers can chip effectively enough from the rough. It doesn't happen often on a full iron for me but every now and again I'll severely fat one, or tug it by 20 yards. I'm also known to fat chips or leave them really short. It also assumes that a high capper can effectively get out of a bunker which isn't always the case. I think the biggest flaw of all though is that high cappers can lag putt effectively. Per my other recent thread... Above all else, I struggle lag putting.

 

Lastly... Good luck taking your 6i out on every tee when you're playing with others, especially strangers. If you're not hitting the ball on fairways and reaching near the green in regulation every hole, you'll slow down the pace a bunch probably and make your fellow playing partners a little triggered.

 

Do you all agree this is the easiest way to break 90?

 

 

If I were pressed to give a simple approach to breaking 90, swing advice aside, I'd say this:

 

FORGET ABOUT SCORE, INSTEAD FOCUS ON THESE:

 

1) Use the easiest clubs in your bag to get a GIR

2) Use the easiest clubs in your bag to get an Up and Down

3) Putting: Forget about finding the perfect line. Instead put most of your effort on distance control: Trying to roll it close enough to the hole for a gimme. Pre imagine the feel of the stroke needed to roll it up to the hole, not past it, not short of it.

 

 

 

The Swing:

- Always have the same Grip ,stance, alignment and ball position.

- Move around less in the swing. Try to swing in your address position. Your hips will move laterally and you will rotate etc, but the less you deviate, the easier it is to make good contact.

- Follow through and make pure contact on the way.

 

If I can add one more,

 

commitment, commitment, commitment

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#1 reason why I broke 90 today was putting, and basically I did as you said. I wasn't so focused on the perfect line to drain every putt. I tried to focus on the right speed to get the ball really close. I only had one 3 putt the whole round, and I almost holed a 40 footer not even trying to make it.

 

Didn't really do too much special honestly. Been working on the swing and kept every tee shot except 2 in play. My swing fault (dip rear shoulder) came out and I pushed both into hazard. My biggest weakness by far coming up to today was losing tee shots and 3 putts. Yes short game needs work to get under 80, but it wasn't really costing me shots.

 

I downloaded TheGrint and I think it tracks SG18 stats, so it will be helpful to give me areas to really focus on.

 

 

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