How coming from money helps guys reach the tour..

1356710

Comments

  • Roadking2003Roadking2003 AustinMembers Posts: 5,717 ✭✭
    gvogel wrote:


    If you think that lots of money is involved with becoming a tour pro, and you lament that fact, I leave you with this:



    If the golf ball were rolled back and 6,400 yard courses again became a very difficult test for up and coming golfers, and if drivers were rolled back to "plain and simple" (no artificial intelligence faces or faces designed to be too hot, and then modified), then golf equipment would become a commodity. Good golf equipment would be be much more widely accessible to all, because it would be less expensive.



    I envision going back to steel for drivers and fairway wood heads - leave titanium to the aerospace industry. Driver heads could be 230 cc, with face COR of .80, or even less. Such drivers could be easily made by many companies. Of course, there wouldn't be enough mark up to pay professionals, or advertise on TV. But the same level of quality would be accessible to a wide range of golfers.



    We could do the same with the golf ball. Make it go 10% shorter. Limit construction to two pieces - core and cover.



    Now I guess that this is heresy on a site where the readers can't wait for next year's driver, and discuss the merits of 4-piece and 5-piece golf balls. We love talking about equipment as much as playing the game.



    But commodity golf balls and clubs would definitely make the game less expensive.




    But why stop there? Why not go back to hickory shafts and gutta percha balls? It would be really cheap then.
  • Roadking2003Roadking2003 AustinMembers Posts: 5,717 ✭✭
    jmkenn0 wrote:


    Also, exposure, which you could equate to money, is also a big thing. How many people had a basketball goal in their backyard or driveway growing up? Now how many people had a driving range or putting green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />?




    And how many had a baseball diamond in their back yard? or a soccer field? or a tennis court?
  • BrianMcGBrianMcG Members Posts: 2,345 ✭✭
    edited Mar 11, 2019 11:39am #64
    jmkenn0 wrote:


    Yeah especially in the US with the rise of kids specializing in sports, money matters more and more. People have mentioned several really expensive sports to break into like auto-racing, tennis, hockey, etc. Golf is right up there with them. You can play football, basketball, even tennis on a "free" court at parks everywhere. Golf? Not so much. You need a special place to practice, special equipment, and god-forbid you lose a ball. The barrier to entry is very high relative to the other sports, and it takes a long time to play.



    Also, exposure, which you could equate to money, is also a big thing. How many people had a basketball goal in their backyard or driveway growing up? Now how many people had a driving range or putting green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />?




    I had a net in my backyard, and practiced wedges at the junior high across the street from my house. The putting green at my local public course was free.



    The idea that someone just can't make it because they aren't a member of a fancy country club, or that it's just too expensive is crazy.



    Seve Ballesteros spent the first few years golfing with only a 3 iron.



    Golf can be as expensive or as cheap as you want.
    Walter: Tell me Bobby, why do you play this game?
    Bobby: I play because I love it.
    Walter: Well I play for the money. I have to win. That is why every time we face each other I will always beat you.
  • SilverBulletsSilverBullets BMW Members Posts: 5,907 ✭✭
    Man_O_War wrote:


    for every wealthy guy, i will show you 20 on tour from very humble beginnings : Tiger, Bubba, Couples...so so many...public courses was where they got their starts. Maybe that's impossible now..money always helps..and it is not indicator of how hungry a player would be. Nicklaus arguably came from some resources...and he fought with talent given just as hard as a Trevino. Still have an issue with that Nicklaus Trevino early era and all the caucasian only clauses denying others a livelihood..the hussle should always be the hustle..open to all.




    Jack certainly had resources. While not necessarily 'wealthy' his family was def. well above average. He grew up in the most affluent neighborhood of Columbus, was a member at what was the most exclusive club in the city at the time (and was probably a top 20 course in the entire country at the time), and lived on the most notable road in Columbus. The house Jack grew up in would sell for around $1m in today's economy even without Jack's name being attached to it.



    But to address the OP's question, money helps most situations. Is money alone going to make you a pro? Absolutely not. Does it make it easier? Yes. 90% of making it is going to be talent, work ethic, desire, etc. Where money comes into play is opportunity. You can spend more resources to have potentially better coaching, better training, etc. If you don't have to work on the side to make ends meet, you can dedicate even more time to training and development.



    The biggest benefit to having money is ultimately the additional practice and training time it buys. Whether that means it gives the person more time to actually spend playing, training, practicing or if it simply gives the person more time to rest/relax because they don't have to make ends meet with a job, either way, it's a positive benefit.



    That's also something which isn't limited to golf. That's all sports. I don't come from a super wealthy family but certainly a family which is above average (I grew up in the same community as Jack). My sister played college soccer for a ranked PAC 12 school. She was super small and not nearly as physically gifted as basically everyone else on the team. However, my parents were able to afford personal one on one coaching with a renowned coach. They were able to afford a personal trainer to work with her multiple times a week to ensure she was incredibly fit. Her making it to a starting role at a PAC 12 school took a ridiculous amount of focus, determination, and hard work. She had the work ethic but not natural tools. All of the personal coaching/training she was able to do (which cost $$$$) paired with her ridiculous work ethic helped close the gap on the genetic lottery.



    So yeah, money helps. Like everything else in life, money can buy more opportunity. It's not going to be lone factor in whether you make it in the sports world or not (except auto racing, but that's a whole different discussion)... but if you have the physical tools, the work ethic and the drive, money can certainly be an aspect which pushes you across the goal because it can buy you more opportunity, more coaching, more training and ultimately more time to simply focus on your sport.
    Taylormade M6 10.5* - HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.5
    Taylormade '16 M2 15*
    Titleist 816h 21*
    Callaway Apex 4i thru PW - Nippon Modus 125 Tour X
    Vokey SM6 50*, 54*, 58*
    Scotty Cameron Circa 62 No. 2 - Scotty Custom Shop
  • ShilgyShilgy PhoenixMembers Posts: 11,684 ✭✭


    I can only lend my personal experience to this discussion. At age 25, I started playing really well, winning several local amateur events and shooting sub-par regularly. Quit my job to work on my game full time. Cashed out my savings, had a "sponsor" who would give me $100/week for expenses. We're not talking big money, here. Anywho, scraped my last thousand bucks together to travel and Monday qualify for a mini-tour event. Qualified, and missed the cut by one (double bogey on the 35th hole arghhh!) Had I made the cut, I would have been in the next event and had enough money to continue. Had I not been broke, I would have tried to qualify at the next tourney. Had plenty of drive, hunger, and confidence in my game. But the money ran out. Had to go back, get a job, and the rest is history. Obviously, there's no substitute for game, but there's also none for $$$$ either. Skill=score Money=opportunity. My .02.
    There is no guarantee that with more money you would have made it either though. It would have given you the opportunity to keep going perhaps. With the low mini tour paycut had you made the cut and finished low you still do not have enough dough to go to the next event.
    WITB
    Tools for the job!

    To paraphrase Dr Seuss: Don't cry because the round of golf is over-smile because it happened . :)

    Game is recovering from total ankle replacement. Getting there and glad to be pain free!
  • SilverBulletsSilverBullets BMW Members Posts: 5,907 ✭✭
    ctsgolf wrote:


    I'm 26 years old and I can't name one person that could take one year off work, let alone 5-15 years, and just focus on golf instead.




    This is the biggest benefit that money brings to the table. Money buys you more time to work and perfect your craft. Perfecting that craft takes talent, it takes hard work, it takes determination, etc. Money simply buys you more time to focus all of your energy on that.
    Taylormade M6 10.5* - HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.5
    Taylormade '16 M2 15*
    Titleist 816h 21*
    Callaway Apex 4i thru PW - Nippon Modus 125 Tour X
    Vokey SM6 50*, 54*, 58*
    Scotty Cameron Circa 62 No. 2 - Scotty Custom Shop
  • HankshankHankshank Members Posts: 1,651 ✭✭
    edited Mar 11, 2019 11:49am #68
    Think what I have to say is pretty universal even though I have only scandinavian experience:



    To succeed in stuff, its good to have

    -Talent

    -Financial fundings, if what you want to do requires equipment and travelling.

    For sure. But maybe even more - confidence. And if what you want to do is not what people normally do nine-to-five it takes a heck of confidence to pursue that. And that is, maybe more than money, what a Sun Computer background gives you. The message from everyone around you being ”what do you want to do with your life” instead of ”get a job”. You can also, like Spieth be member of a sporting family.

    And you might come from skid row and see the sport as the way out of misery, but those guys seldom chooses golf.



    I come from a simpler white collar background myself but have found myself now being among doctors, lawyers and guys that run companies. And you can safely say that expectations are higher where I am now. Guys where I grew up lived in families that could well afford driving a kid aroun to golf tournaments. But WORK with a hobby activity? Forget it!
  • Rosco1216Rosco1216 Members Posts: 2,976 ✭✭
    I’ll reiterate my post..having world class instruction and unlimited access to top of the line facilities throughout childhood makes it much more likely that someone will reach his or her full golf potential.
    Tour Issue M3 8.5*(7.4* @ 3.4* open) - Diamana DF 70tx
    FW - who knows
    P790 UDI 17* - PX 7.0
    Miura CB 1008(4-P) - PX 7.0
    Bridgestone TourB XW1 50/55//60* - X100
    Piretti Matera 2 Limited Release


    https://www.instagram.com/rc_nova
  • bscinstnctbscinstnct Members Posts: 26,895 ✭✭

    bscinstnct wrote:


    A kid can play basketball for free, just the cost of sneakers, until he goes to college.



    In golf, the cost is many, many thousands to get to that point.




    Not true at all. Many of us never saw a private course until we were adults.



    Student green fees are $13 or less at many courses. And if you play in High School, range balls and green fees are often free.



    Yes, golf costs more than basketball.



    No, golf doesn't cost "many, many thousands".




    Good points.



    But, practically, between clubs, balls, instruction, the cost of getting back and forth to golf courses/the range for practice, the possible necessity of a car, or a family where one parent does not work and can take the kid around to the range/course. Even the right attire may be beyond the means of poor kids who don't have those issues in other sports and can excel.



    We talking thousands and golf being being more practical for people of certain means. Not saying the family has to be incredibly well off.



    Baseball and basketball and soccer are for more accessible for a kid to play and practice as long as they want for free and with minimal equipment costs.



    You have highly impoverished areas that produce top athletes in those sports because not matter how poor a kid is, he has access to his game for basically free. You're not going to see that with golf.
  • mankumanku Members Posts: 759 ✭✭
    I always think of equestrian sports when I think of money...I read somewhere that Bill Gates bought a huge estate in Florida so that his daughter could train.



    Do any non millionaires participate in that sport?



    As for Maverick, I recall reading an article about how his dad wanted his kids humble growing up, so he made his sons share bedrooms...thought it was a really nice story, and pictured a relatively modest home for their family. Then their house came on the market...sharing a bedroom wouldn't be so tough if the rest of your house looked like this:



    https://brobible.com/success/article/dad-golfer-maverick-mcnealy-selling-estate/
  • LlortamaiseyLlortamaisey Members Posts: 5,982 ✭✭
    Rosco1216 wrote:
    I’ll reiterate my post..having world class instruction and unlimited access to top of the line facilities throughout childhood makes it much more likely that someone will reach his or her full golf potential.




    I agree with all of this. These are just facts of athletics in this day and age. There’s a reason Alabama puts so many college football players into the NFL, world class coaching and unlimited access to top of the line facilities. These athletes have a distinct advantage based on the funding of these institutions when compared to others. Golf is only slightly different in the sense that funding comes mostly from family or sponsors, not schools or teams. This is probably because golf is not a team sport at the professional level and there is no draft. Plus, it’s not a money maker at the collegiate level.
  • golfer07840golfer07840 Smart ass from Northwest NJMembers Posts: 1,722 ✭✭



    And that will be on full display at the Drive, chip and putt event the Sunday morning prior to The Masters. Most of those kids (I know, there are exceptions), come from money.




    How do you know that?




    Because every time they introduce a kid they talk about what their parents do and what country club they are part of. I can't tell you how many of these parents are Doctors, Lawyers, etc.

    Opinions are my own and are never to be taken seriously.
    and for God's sake, if you're going to whine about Jim Nantz, have the respect to spell his name correctly.
    WITTB:
    Driver: Callaway XHot Pro 9* Stiff
    3W: Tour Edge Exotics 13* Stiff
    3-4 HY: Callaway Rogue Stiff
    5-PW: Callaway Rogue Stiff steel, True Temper
    48* Titleist, 52* Callaway
    Putter: Nike Method
    Ball: ProV1 -- or whatever I find in the woods while looking for my ProV1

  • golfer07840golfer07840 Smart ass from Northwest NJMembers Posts: 1,722 ✭✭
    bscinstnct wrote:


    bscinstnct wrote:


    A kid can play basketball for free, just the cost of sneakers, until he goes to college.



    In golf, the cost is many, many thousands to get to that point.




    Not true at all. Many of us never saw a private course until we were adults.



    Student green fees are $13 or less at many courses. And if you play in High School, range balls and green fees are often free.



    Yes, golf costs more than basketball.



    No, golf doesn't cost "many, many thousands".




    Good points.



    But, practically, between clubs, balls, instruction, the cost of getting back and forth to golf courses/the range for practice, the possible necessity of a car, or a family where one parent does not work and can take the kid around to the range/course. Even the right attire may be beyond the means of poor kids who don't have those issues in other sports and can excel.



    We talking thousands and golf being being more practical for people of certain means. Not saying the family has to be incredibly well off.



    Baseball and basketball and soccer are for more accessible for a kid to play and practice as long as they want for free and with minimal equipment costs.



    You have highly impoverished areas that produce top athletes in those sports because not matter how poor a kid is, he has access to his game for basically free. You're not going to see that with golf.




    Same with hockey. We can include that in the list of sports that really are for people with money. Harvard and Yale are good at hockey, year in and year out for a reason.

    Opinions are my own and are never to be taken seriously.
    and for God's sake, if you're going to whine about Jim Nantz, have the respect to spell his name correctly.
    WITTB:
    Driver: Callaway XHot Pro 9* Stiff
    3W: Tour Edge Exotics 13* Stiff
    3-4 HY: Callaway Rogue Stiff
    5-PW: Callaway Rogue Stiff steel, True Temper
    48* Titleist, 52* Callaway
    Putter: Nike Method
    Ball: ProV1 -- or whatever I find in the woods while looking for my ProV1

  • jmkenn0jmkenn0 Members Posts: 723 ✭✭
    BrianMcG wrote:

    jmkenn0 wrote:


    Yeah especially in the US with the rise of kids specializing in sports, money matters more and more. People have mentioned several really expensive sports to break into like auto-racing, tennis, hockey, etc. Golf is right up there with them. You can play football, basketball, even tennis on a "free" court at parks everywhere. Golf? Not so much. You need a special place to practice, special equipment, and god-forbid you lose a ball. The barrier to entry is very high relative to the other sports, and it takes a long time to play.



    Also, exposure, which you could equate to money, is also a big thing. How many people had a basketball goal in their backyard or driveway growing up? Now how many people had a driving range or putting green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />?




    I had a net in my backyard, and practiced wedges at the junior high across the street from my house. The putting green at my local public course was free.



    The idea that someone just can't make it because they aren't a member of a fancy country club, or that it's just too expensive is crazy.



    Seve Ballesteros spent the first few years golfing with only a 3 iron.



    Golf can be as expensive or as cheap as you want.




    Please point out where I said you couldn't make it if you weren't a member of a fancy club? But since we are doing extremes and don't have room for nuisance, how many PGA tour players grew up playing a country club where a parent was a member or a golf course that a parent was a professional at? Now how many didn't? Now transpose that into how many people are country club members or golf professionals, and the rest of the population.



    jmkenn0 wrote:


    Also, exposure, which you could equate to money, is also a big thing. How many people had a basketball goal in their backyard or driveway growing up? Now how many people had a driving range or putting green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />?




    And how many had a baseball diamond in their back yard? or a soccer field? or a tennis court?




    Well you don't need a soccer field to play soccer, or a diamond to toss around a ball. How many places in your town are suitable to play soccer in? How many baseball diamonds, or places you can throw? How many tennis courts? Now how many publically accessible golf courses? How much does it cost to play golf on these courses, versus a tennis court or baseball diamond?



    Yes, there is Tiger, and Serena, and Bubba, and a handful of other stories out there. Then there is everyone else. Its always easier to do something if you have more resources, why would golf be different? If it was actually different, the makeup of the professionals would be like soccer/football/basketball, and not tennis/horse jumping/swimming.
  • playar32playar32 Members Posts: 292 ✭✭


    I can only lend my personal experience to this discussion. At age 25, I started playing really well, winning several local amateur events and shooting sub-par regularly. Quit my job to work on my game full time. Cashed out my savings, had a "sponsor" who would give me $100/week for expenses. We're not talking big money, here. Anywho, scraped my last thousand bucks together to travel and Monday qualify for a mini-tour event. Qualified, and missed the cut by one (double bogey on the 35th hole arghhh!) Had I made the cut, I would have been in the next event and had enough money to continue. Had I not been broke, I would have tried to qualify at the next tourney. Had plenty of drive, hunger, and confidence in my game. But the money ran out. Had to go back, get a job, and the rest is history. Obviously, there's no substitute for game, but there's also none for $$$$ either. Skill=score Money=opportunity. My .02.




    It's as they say, money gives you opportunity it doesn't give you ability. In your example, if you had more backing, you could have had more opportunities, not to mention probably better accomodations and food.



    It's similar to when a "child" has to go to court and there family can afford a lawyer or not. Money gives the the best opporunity.
  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,075 ClubWRX
    edited Mar 11, 2019 1:49pm #77


    Jack certainly had resources. While not necessarily 'wealthy' his family was def. well above average. He grew up in the most affluent neighborhood of Columbus, was a member at what was the most exclusive club in the city at the time (and was probably a top 20 course in the entire country at the time), and lived on the most notable road in Columbus. The house Jack grew up in would sell for around $1m in today's economy even without Jack's name being attached to it.




    It's interesting how often this is overstated.



    Jack's dad was an incredibly hard worker growing up and took a risk (heavily leveraged) and opened his first pharmacy in 1942 when Jack was 2 years old after being a regional salesman for Johnson and Johnson for several years, so there wasn't money to burn in the household Jack and his sister grew up in. By the time Jack was 20 his dad owned four pharmacies, so he did well for sure over those 18 years, and yep, bought a nice looking house about the same time he borrowed to open his first drugstore. Not any air of privilege, but definitely middle class turning into upper middle class while Jack was growing up. No idea when Charlie joined Scioto, but Jack started lessons with Jack Grout at age 11.



    By the time Jack got married in July of 1960, he was selling insurance, and still attending college, and had a full 1961 season of amateur golf which he paid for himself - didn't take a dime from his dad from the day he got married forward. He was still not certain about turning pro well into the fall of 1961 when he already had his first child and was still selling insurance and supporting himself and his family. He funded his amateur career himself for a year and one-half after getting married.



    Pretty well grounded and hardly a silver spoon growing up or that kind of attitude when he got older.



    Just adding this for some context.



    No question he had some opportunities - Jack Grout was a match made in heaven and Jack developed as a golfer as he became more into golf and less into his other sports, but even in the fall of 1961 it was almost as likely Jack would have remained an am selling insurance vs. becoming a pro golfer until some opportunities and individuals made him decide to take the plunge.
  • Hawkeye77Hawkeye77 Countdown to The Open Championship! IowaClubWRX Posts: 18,075 ClubWRX




    And that will be on full display at the Drive, chip and putt event the Sunday morning prior to The Masters. Most of those kids (I know, there are exceptions), come from money.




    How do you know that?




    Because every time they introduce a kid they talk about what their parents do and what country club they are part of. I can't tell you how many of these parents are Doctors, Lawyers, etc.




    LOL, the wealthiest people I encounter are usually self-made small business owners vs. doctors and lawyers, but whatever.
  • playar32playar32 Members Posts: 292 ✭✭


    Talent is overall winner here.



    However, money helps.



    And that will be on full display at the Drive, chip and putt event the Sunday morning prior to The Masters. Most of those kids (I know, there are exceptions), come from money.




    I agree, but I think there are a lot of factors right. Typically, if your parents have money you have more opportunity/exposure, not just in sports but also for a job. If you go to most lower class areas and asked them how to get rich, they would probably know about actors, sports, lottery, or things like that. Probably won't be a lot of lawyers, doctors or accountants coming out of that area, typically because parents don't know how to get into those careers, making it more difficult for the child to get into those careers.





    Also, remember, professional golf is a lifestyle more than anything else. You might have one home tournament a year, maybe two. All other sports they get to sleep in their bed half the season. Also, the game is more about size and speed. Some kid in Drive Chip and Putt might be the best at 11, but might stop growing out 12. If your maxing out at ~250yds per drive, kinda hard to win/get on tour. Also, limited number of spots. How many cards do they give out every year, like 200? You can be really, really, really good at pro golf, but factor in travel, missing cuts by just a stroke every tournament, dedication, it takes time.



    A good example would be Stewart Hagestad. He definitely has the game to play on tour, but he appears rather polished (well spoken, works on wall street). Dunno if his family has money or not, but he might look at that lifestyle and think not for him. I remember one time Mickelson mentioned some of the guys he practices with/played at Arizona with had the game for the tour but didn't want the lifestyle.



    Another example could be Phillip Franics (or Ty Tyron). Phillip was the #1 ranked junior for 65 weeks in a row, and also won 4 junior worlds in a row (beating Tiger's record). Just hasn't worked out for him so far.
  • ByeBye EnglandMembers Posts: 1,320 ✭✭
    They still have to put a score together over 4 days, but it can be understated how big an advantage it is. It costs a lot to play full time let alone paying to live as well.



    Being able to travel to warmer places to play and compete all year round is one of the biggest advantages.



    Taylormade 2017 M1 10.5 - Aldila Rogue Silver 70X - 44.5 inches
    Callaway Rogue 3 Wood - Aldila Rogue Silver 70X
    Titleist 816 H2 20 degrees - Aldila Rogue Black 85X
    Titleist 716CB 4-9 - X100
    Vokey 46.08, 50.08 - X100
    Vokey 56S, 60M - S300
    Scotty Cameron Studio Stainless Newport 2.5
    Titleist Pro V1X
  • BarfolomewBarfolomew #worstWRXer Members Posts: 1,401 ✭✭
    edited Mar 11, 2019 4:12pm #81
    Money relationships are different for everyone..... Can have opposite effects.



    Rich kid plays better because zero money pressures and appreciates that and focuses more on technique and playing free etc...



    Rich kid mailing it in cause doesn't need to win to put food on table in his beach house...





    BUT...I started a similar type thread before about how many strokes is the professional package worth (including everything they get) vs a full time working stiff scratch golfer. It is worth a bunch of strokes!
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    G30 LST
    3 wood M2 HL
    OnOffOnAgain Kuros 4-P
    Cleveland Blob
    SeeMore Butts
  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,546 ✭✭

    bscinstnct wrote:


    bscinstnct wrote:


    A kid can play basketball for free, just the cost of sneakers, until he goes to college.



    In golf, the cost is many, many thousands to get to that point.




    Not true at all. Many of us never saw a private course until we were adults.



    Student green fees are $13 or less at many courses. And if you play in High School, range balls and green fees are often free.



    Yes, golf costs more than basketball.



    No, golf doesn't cost "many, many thousands".




    Good points.



    But, practically, between clubs, balls, instruction, the cost of getting back and forth to golf courses/the range for practice, the possible necessity of a car, or a family where one parent does not work and can take the kid around to the range/course. Even the right attire may be beyond the means of poor kids who don't have those issues in other sports and can excel.



    We talking thousands and golf being being more practical for people of certain means. Not saying the family has to be incredibly well off.



    Baseball and basketball and soccer are for more accessible for a kid to play and practice as long as they want for free and with minimal equipment costs.



    You have highly impoverished areas that produce top athletes in those sports because not matter how poor a kid is, he has access to his game for basically free. You're not going to see that with golf.




    Same with hockey. We can include that in the list of sports that really are for people with money. Harvard and Yale are good at hockey, year in and year out for a reason.




    but not as good as Minnesota Duluth or St Cloud University.
    Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing-glove.  P.G. Wodehouse
  • gvogelgvogel Members Posts: 7,546 ✭✭

    gvogel wrote:


    If you think that lots of money is involved with becoming a tour pro, and you lament that fact, I leave you with this:



    If the golf ball were rolled back and 6,400 yard courses again became a very difficult test for up and coming golfers, and if drivers were rolled back to "plain and simple" (no artificial intelligence faces or faces designed to be too hot, and then modified), then golf equipment would become a commodity. Good golf equipment would be be much more widely accessible to all, because it would be less expensive.



    I envision going back to steel for drivers and fairway wood heads - leave titanium to the aerospace industry. Driver heads could be 230 cc, with face COR of .80, or even less. Such drivers could be easily made by many companies. Of course, there wouldn't be enough mark up to pay professionals, or advertise on TV. But the same level of quality would be accessible to a wide range of golfers.



    We could do the same with the golf ball. Make it go 10% shorter. Limit construction to two pieces - core and cover.



    Now I guess that this is heresy on a site where the readers can't wait for next year's driver, and discuss the merits of 4-piece and 5-piece golf balls. We love talking about equipment as much as playing the game.



    But commodity golf balls and clubs would definitely make the game less expensive.




    But why stop there? Why not go back to hickory shafts and gutta percha balls? It would be really cheap then.




    Not so. And not as widely accessible. IT is tough to get good hickory shaft; they vary widely. Steel is much more user friendly, and graphite even more so.



    If everyone played gutta percha, then gutties would work. But I have a hunch that rubber cored balls would be cheaper at this point.
    Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing-glove.  P.G. Wodehouse
  • buckeye440buckeye440 Members Posts: 316 ✭✭
    jmkenn0 wrote:


    Yeah especially in the US with the rise of kids specializing in sports, money matters more and more. People have mentioned several really expensive sports to break into like auto-racing, tennis, hockey, etc. Golf is right up there with them. You can play football, basketball, even tennis on a "free" court at parks everywhere. Golf? Not so much. You need a special place to practice, special equipment, and god-forbid you lose a ball. The barrier to entry is very high relative to the other sports, and it takes a long time to play.



    Also, exposure, which you could equate to money, is also a big thing. How many people had a basketball goal in their backyard or driveway growing up? Now how many people had a driving range or putting green image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />?




    We built a putting green in my backyard and I still sucked.
  • 3whacker3whacker Members Posts: 423 ✭✭
    look at the Korda sisters, Dad won a Grand Slam event in Tennis, I would guess by looking at their golf swings, both had excellent instruction at an early age, little brother looks like he might end up being a world class tennis player too...good gene pool helps too
  • augustgolfaugustgolf Golf with dignity Coastal NCMembers Posts: 3,907 ✭✭
    BottleCap wrote:


    Hitting balls at the range isn't cheap for kids



    Say a kid wants to hit balls every day that's gotta be 300 a month, that's a lot of money for a non wealthy family




    Or, that kid can go to the pro or whoever runs the range, and ask to work in exchange for hitting balls. Offer to do whatever jobs need to be done.



    It is a foot in the door, and can offer both the prospective kid golfer, as well as the range operator, with what both want - a win win situation
    Pings from the beginning

    OGA member 1415
    or is it 1514...
    I don't remember exactly
  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,970 ✭✭
    Mike Reid's father was in the Air Force or Navy - certainly not loaded.

    Chances are good he did not belong to a private club.

    Maybe he got free rounds at the Camp David 9-holer? I don't know.



    He had 9 professional wins.
  • MidwestGolfBumMidwestGolfBum Corporate Golfer Extraordinaire MSN/MKE/DSMMembers Posts: 1,358 ✭✭
    bscinstnct wrote:


    bscinstnct wrote:


    A kid can play basketball for free, just the cost of sneakers, until he goes to college.



    In golf, the cost is many, many thousands to get to that point.




    Not true at all. Many of us never saw a private course until we were adults.



    Student green fees are $13 or less at many courses. And if you play in High School, range balls and green fees are often free.



    Yes, golf costs more than basketball.



    No, golf doesn't cost "many, many thousands".




    Good points.



    But, practically, between clubs, balls, instruction, the cost of getting back and forth to golf courses/the range for practice, the possible necessity of a car, or a family where one parent does not work and can take the kid around to the range/course. Even the right attire may be beyond the means of poor kids who don't have those issues in other sports and can excel.



    We talking thousands and golf being being more practical for people of certain means. Not saying the family has to be incredibly well off.



    Baseball and basketball and soccer are for more accessible for a kid to play and practice as long as they want for free and with minimal equipment costs.



    You have highly impoverished areas that produce top athletes in those sports because not matter how poor a kid is, he has access to his game for basically free. You're not going to see that with golf.




    Speaking only to soccer, as that's that I grew up with and played for many of my years on this earth. Yes, it CAN be inexpensive to play and practice the game. I can tell you right now that if you want to get to the point that you may be able to make it to the highest levels of the sport, it's going to be insanely expensive. You aren't making the World Cup team without shelling out many, many, many thousands of dollars before being deemed good enough to even get to try out for that team.



    To be able to get to the top ranks in soccer, at least in the parts of the country where you can't play outside, it's FAR from cheap. Sure, you can go play outside with you buddies, get some ball handling skills, etc., but you don't get to compete against top talent without paying large sums of money for training, teams, travel, etc..



    This is something I grew up with, being on a state level, traveling team. Sure, we had some sponsorship money, but beyond that, our parents or other people who would donate were on the hook for the rest of it. I had offers to several D1 schools across the country, had the opportunity to play with some of the developmental programs for teams in Europe, and tried out for the US U-18 MNT. None of those things were free and given what it took to compete at those levels and the training it took to stay there, there was no time for me to work to even start to help pay for some of the expenses that were incurred. In the end, all it got me was a broken ankle with pins in it, 4 knee surgeries, and hip problems at 30.



    The same thing goes for basketball when you start to look at things like AAU. Not a whole lot different in tennis, baseball, or any other sport that you may be able to get access to because there are community options that cost you nothing.



    Nothing at the highest level of sports is cheap. You can only get so far off of the abilities that you may have been blessed with until you need to start to test that against others who are at or above your level. Many times the best out there aren't going to be anywhere near you, which many times means you now have to be part of a team, which costs money, travel, which costs money, and so on, and so forth.



    Having talent may help you get exposure to those who have the money to get you to the next level, but there is going to have to be some point, at some time, that any person who is going to get to the next level in any sport is going to need some kind of financial backer. Sometimes that colleges who give them a scholarship, sometimes you happen to meet the right person at the right time who is willing to give you a shot, and sometimes you are born in the right crib.
    Titleist TS3 9.5* Mitsubishi Tensei White 70TX
    Titleist 917F3 15* Graphite Design AD-DI 7X black
    Titleist T-MB 2i Graphite Design AD-95X Utility/Driving iron
    Titleist 714 MB 4-9 True Temper TI X100 or Cally RazrX MB 4-9 True Temper TI X100
    Vokey SM7, 52.08, 56.10, 60.08 True Temper TI S400
    Byron DH89 or Piretti Proto

    The bag is always a work in progress.
  • Dr. BlockDr. Block Members Posts: 611 ✭✭
    edited Mar 11, 2019 4:53pm #89
    As a junior player Money will get you on the road for the summer tournament schedule (AJGA, etc..). That will help you gain the visibility and experience to get into the premier collegiate golf programs. Money helps you grind your way through the mini tours, q school qualifiers, monday qualifiers, etc... without having to worry where your next meal will come from or where you will sleep and how you will pay the next steep entry fee. In turn unburdening your mind so you can play your best golf.



    Coming from money helps the most on the road to college golf, but it certainly doesn't hurt when you're grinding on the lower rungs of professional golf as well.



    Bottom line - coming from money or having access to it in some form or arrangement is pivotal



    Anybody who says otherwise on this thread doesn't understand just how much of a closed society the world of professional golf is. There are no tryouts, no scouting combines where your raw physical skills are put on display. You start and end your journey as an independent contractor, and you **** well need capital to gain access to the opportunities to ply your trade.
  • straightshot7straightshot7 Members Posts: 3,089 ✭✭
    bscinstnct wrote:

    Man_O_War wrote:

    herdman wrote:


    Football and basketball are the two sports where it takes less money. In football you can't teach size and speed. Basketball you can play on a local court or gym somewhere. That is why there so many minorities at the highest levels in both. Many from very humble or very poor beginnings. In the USA, baseball now takes money for travel leagues. Same for hockey and some others. Golf still takes some money because at some point you are going to have to pay for green fees and likely lessons.






    had to laugh a little....playing at a local court or gym somewhere...isn't that equivalent to playing golf at a public/muni course? if most of these players were ending up in the NFL/NBA from playing around on local grounds only, every one would be doing it... indeed, they are minorities mainly but most go through the college path, where the colleges pour a ton of money into the athletes for them to manifest their size and speed.....then they end up in the NFL/NBA...far from cheap...even relatively.




    A kid can play basketball for free, just the cost of sneakers, until he goes to college.



    In golf, the cost is many, many thousands to get to that point.



    If those same kids who played elite youth basketball had the same money and access to golf from childhood



    The PGA tour would be at a far superior level. Courses be like 9000 yards and youd see guys hole out from all around the green with



    Nothing but cup



    On a regular basis ; )





    ,




    I don't know if it's so much money and access as it is that those kids just don't dream about being a PGA Tour player. Tiger may have changed that a little, but their heroes are still more likely NFL, MLB and NBA players. Those sports are deeply ingrained in the culture, and golf is not.



    Also, I played on my high school and college golf teams and neither myself nor my parents paid thousands and thousands of dollars for golf.



    High school and college teams typically pay for all greens fees and travel. I started out in high school with hand me down clubs and spent basically nothing.



    Now if you want to enter fancy tournaments outside of school, and get really expensive lessons, maybe it can run you into the thousands.



    But, truly I don't think it's a lack of money. It's a lack of desire. Many kids are just more attracted to other sports. Accessibility such as having a court nearby or hoop in backyard could play a factor. There is lower practical barrier to entry to play football or basketball or baseball. It's also easier to learn those sports.
  • Big BenBig Ben Members Posts: 9,066 ✭✭
    Catty wrote:


    I’m living proof of the theory. I didn’t come from money and I play like crap.
    Hahaha! That’s great 😃
    Irons: 19' Cobra CB's
    Drivers: Titleist TS3 & Cobra F9
    Fairway: Titleist 917F2
    Hybrid: A-Grind
    2 iron: Ping Rapture
    Wedges: Ping Gorge 2.0 Stealth's
    Putter: Evnroll 9.1
    Balls: ProV1
Sign In or Register to comment.