What to look at when in a greenside bunker?

[cardoustie]

David your original wording of steep thru guys off. We're trying to say the same thing. Nobody has said swing shallow, we are saying shallow divot .. which you did say in your first post

I've always been a huge Seve guy when I give bunker lessons. Low low hands, squat on a horse, club waaaay open etc etc

Look just come North and we can hit bunker shots for cash

PS I do disagree with your new comments on shaft lean

[Scottbox]

You're really very close to hitting good shots. A few things to look for if you're hitting too heavy:

1. Be sure you're not dropping your rear shoulder to "help" the ball up.

2. Be sure you're not too low with your body. You can overdo it.

3. Let the club release earlier. It's really a flop shot that goes under the ball. Feel like you're adding loft. Whenever I take too much sand, I like to do trail arm only swings where I feel like the head is gonna speed up and go past the my hands at impact. It's one of the few shots where feeling like you "flip" helps you, in the sense that you expose the bounce and shallow out the shot. Another great way to practice is to hit actual flop shots in deep grass where you slide the club under the ball doing the above. The big difference between grass and sand is the amount of resistance. That's where speed helps you.

[DavePelz4]

> @cardoustie said:

> Entry spot

> If I had to guess, your issue may involve not being shallow enough

 

Mrs. Pelz never says I'm not shallow enough.

[golfingnut300]

Thanks for all the help! You guys are amazing ?. I do believe it is right shoulder lower at setup because I am also working on the reverse ‘K’ in setup on my full swing, which I think is creeping into my bunker game. Also i think I have a more U shaped swing thinking it would give me a shallow divot. More V swing with shoulders level or shoulders even a little tilted forward is going to be what I work on.

[b.mattay]

> @cardoustie said:

> The same guys that struggle in traps can't hit flop shots greenside

> The releasing the hands and clubhead are a foreign concept

 

IMO I don’t think this holds true. I’ve played with pretty good players who hit flops as a wipey cut with a strong grip but struggle massively in bunkers due to the same technique (generally gets them too steep). I do agree that you need to learn an aggressive release for bunker shots though :)

 

 

[David C]

> @cardoustie said:

> David your original wording of steep thru guys off. We're trying to say the same thing. Nobody has said swing shallow, we are saying shallow divot .. which you did say in your first post

> I've always been a huge Seve guy when I give bunker lessons. Low low hands, squat on a horse, club waaaay open etc etc

> Look just come North and we can hit bunker shots for cash

> PS I do disagree with your new comments on shaft lean

 

I think it did throw people off but I think important not to think ‘shallow shallow shallow’ which some comments can lead you in that direction.

 

I think the thing with shaft lean is the intent v reality. If you look at say, Stan Utley, who talks about no shaft lean; he has shaft lean. Clear to see on video. No decent golf shot is hit without shaft lean to some swing path or other. Even driver - it’s just shaft lean occurring on an upwards tilt.

 

I think the feel or intent of ‘no shaft lean’ or clubhead ‘pass the hands’ causes a correct release, but there is in reality shaft lean at the point the club strikes the sand (on a good shot).

 

Now, the intent for more shaft lean might be disastrous.

 

I think people need to understand reality and what works i.e. just yesterday saw someone skulling and fatting shots because they thought they needed to be shallow and have the club past the hands. A better thought for them was shaft is leaning but the club is in the process of *passing* the hands. Or rather, get that as the concept then translate into a feel.

 

 

[harolease]

> @golfingnut300 said:

> Just wanted to know what you guys look at when in a green side bunker? Do you look at the ball or look behind the ball, or a grain a sand behind the ball?

> I have a lot of problems with entering it sand at a consistent point. Either I catch it clean and send it over the green or fat and leave it in the bunker. I’ve worked on stop swaying, ball position and keeping my weight a little left. I just wondered who looks at the ball and who looks at the sand behind the ball.

 

> @golfingnut300 said:

> Thanks, but do you look at the ball or the sand behind it??

>

> My fat ones do have a big divot, and I do have a steep swing.

>

> > @cardoustie said:

> > Entry spot

> > If I had to guess, your issue may involve not being shallow enough

>

>

Neither . I look for a spot on the green to land the ball then my eyes looks at general area around the ball and I try to splash that amount of sand to my target.

I don’t look at specific spot otherwise my eyes get too locked in I think you need to have the eyeballs continue to move sideways to the target.

 

[baudi]

With the mind's eye I 'look' at the bottom of the ball. I either splash or sweep this away. Depending on the shot.

[GolfTurkey]

> @golfingnut300 said:

> > @Scottbox said:

> > A lot of where you enter the sand has to do with the way your torso is positioned. You can have wide legs, low hands, weight slightly forward, and all that good setup stuff, but if your torso is tilted back too much, you'll hit the sand too far behind the ball. So you may just need to adjust your sternum further forward (so it feels tilted a bit towards the target). That will move the bottom of the arc forward a bit.

>

>

> Practice session today and wow was it bad!! Tried lower hands, lower stance, hinge, unhinge and all I seemed to do was hit WAY too far behind the ball, fat and deep. Tomorrow I will make sure my torso is more tilted forward. Just seems to me with lowering legs and hands, that you would hit it fat, which I do a lot today. I definitely was not opening the club enough before, today I had it wide open but I was hitting it 4 to 6 inches behind the ball. Do you guys choke up on the club much?

>

> I haven’t tried just getting in the bunker with no ball and just trying to make shallow divots. The course was busy today and was unable the just swing away. Also have to find a good practice bunker near by and not leave till I get this **** down.

> I will figure it out, or just pay the money and get a lesson where he can see what I am doing wrong.

>

How are you opening the club? Are you taking your normal grip and then maneuvering yourself so that the club is open or are you spinning the club open in your hands and then taking your normal grip? If it's the former then it would explain a lot of the problems.

 

Open the club, take your normal grip, align square and swing at the target.

[TryAgainPls]

I look at the ball. I also use the bounce a LOT in bunkers.